Posted April 20, 2013 Nice derailing.. Lol. I'm not of the EU (thank GOD).. Not only Americans should get the break from the VAT price raises. EVERY country not forced to this tax should not be paying for it.I don't live in the EU, why am I paying for their taxes? Cause we need money to support you guys in the next war you start...But seriously - it may take a lot of resources to track and store data about each account in almost "real time", cause accounts change owners all the time. We have some nasty bureaucrats in our United States of Europe so it's much safer for Rolf if all of you pay european taxes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Regardless of where you live i still think Rolf has to pay the tax on the money even if your from another country. Its about where he lives not where you live, i could be mistaken but most places tax you on goods and services bought in the area it originates and in his case that's Europe.FYI, Taxes suck no matter where you live. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Cause we need money to support you guys in the next war you start...Your right about the wars, we should just pull all our troops back home and let the world fight it out again. No sense in paying to protect every other country that hates us..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Pfft that's what the various propaganda (example - US Navy: A Global Force For Good) would like you to think. As an entity the US cares little about the well-being of other countries, it is far more focused on its own self interests. In our defense, its true for most other countries as well to varying degrees.We fully supported and turned a blind eye to dictators of the worst stripe when it served our agendas, and that's not the least of it. Just one example from our history: Revolutions were backed and governments toppled just so we could build a Pacific-Atlantic canal.Global deployment of military personnel has more to do with defending our own interests and preserving the status quo.Now its debatable if such by itself is good or bad; however, the historical beginning of true evil has always been in trying to whitewash one's actions into some kind of Morale-Champion-of-All-That-Is-Good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 If I start paying for the EUs taxes, does this mean next time I pay for prem I get the benefits a citizen of the EU gets??I hear they have that socialized medicine over there, bet they do not have that in Texas. And you dont have to call that leafy herb for your back aches your 'medicine', they actually serve it up at your local shop and its called WEMP! For realz I read it on the internetz. And all the women make snow angels naked, saw that on the internetz too. So I think you will enjoy your 'Tea Earl Grey, Hot' being a new EU citizen and all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Hello! I would like people to chime in (Rolf, you too if ya would) on how one can prove they're not from the EU. I don't know why it is so difficult for people to understand that its not YOU that have to prove it to Rolf, its Rolf that has to prove it to the swedish bureaucrats, and probably to be able to do that properly he would need to hire a full time employee just for that task and premium would have to go up by 80% just so you can avoid paying 20% more? No thanks. Also if it is so easy to check where people are from, how come for example Netflix gets cheated by hundreds of thousands of people on a daily basis that subscribe to their american-only service, paying with credit cards and PayPal accounts clearly showing them to be from outside the US? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Your right about the wars, we should just pull all our troops back home and let the world fight it out again. No sense in paying to protect every other country that hates us.....I'm glad you agree. War in name of Peace is like sexual intercourse (as would Sheldon said) in the name of virginity. I know it's cheap slogan, but still true. There's a reason why Muslims hates USA/EU and it's not caused by religion (I know some Muslims and they're very peaceful people, but noone murdered their families or destroyed their countries).We have so many topics about premium prices so I'm pretty sure is little pointless to disscuss it anymore. Rolf will do what he have to do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 wow i cannot believe how a price rise is causing a community to fall apart like this wurm is all about community is it not ? the price rise is not good for many in many different ways, i for one just cannot afford to play anymore because of it, me and my husband don't have enough money to do so, its a really good game and its a shame but come on people fight it together not start arguing with each other 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 I can somewhat understand that some folks do not want to pay taxes to a country/continent (forgive my lack of proper description) in which they do not live, but that's just how it's going to work. The game/company is based out of Europe and therefore subject to it's taxes. Bumping the price appears to be a necessary evil, to my understanding, and will allow for future development of the game. I do hate to see the community falling apart as well, seeings as how everyone seemed to get along despite where on this planet they live. . This thread has pretty much turned into an international poo-flinging contest :I 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 You are paying for the extra cost that Rolf has, now that he must pay VAT on every purchase of services from his business. He is merely passing the costs on to the consumer like any sensible business would do. What is so difficult to comprehend? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 If I start paying for the EUs taxes, does this mean next time I pay for prem I get the benefits a citizen of the EU gets??No one forces you to pay the price. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 (edited) I don't know why it is so difficult for people to understand that its not YOU that have to prove it to Rolf, its Rolf that has to prove it to the swedish bureaucrats, and probably to be able to do that properly he would need to hire a full time employee just for that task and premium would have to go up by 80% just so you can avoid paying 20% more? No thanks. Also if it is so easy to check where people are from, how come for example Netflix gets cheated by hundreds of thousands of people on a daily basis that subscribe to their american-only service, paying with credit cards and PayPal accounts clearly showing them to be from outside the US?Speculative response I'd say. As a european business each time you make a bill for someone you need to write the VAT separately. As an american you take that bill to your accountant each year and he sends a 'tax recovery form' back to Sweden. The Swedish government credits that and charges Onetoofree AB with the respective amount. So Rolf will loose the VAT either NOW or at the end of every fiscal year.Now if Rolf decides not to give VAT bills for his services but he tells us that part of the increase is for that reason then ANY person, EU or not, can report him for avoiding taxes and cutting bills under the hand- that is jail time as per european law and account freezing (the term is called money laundering).Either way, non EU citizens WILL not pay VAT.Sources: I own a company that does a lot of trading. Inter- and intra-community.PS. besides, why should Rolf care if he charges or not VAT, he doesn't keep the tax, it is passed along. So he has no stake into making people pay the VAT when they don't have to. Edited April 20, 2013 by Thorakkanath Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Nice derailing.. Lol. I'm not of the EU (thank GOD).. Not only Americans should get the break from the VAT price raises. EVERY country not forced to this tax should not be paying for it.I don't live in the EU, why am I paying for their taxes?Becuase Rolf wants you to. You don't have to, just stop paying premium. Bye o/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Hello! I would like people to chime in (Rolf, you too if ya would) on how one can prove they're not from the EU.As far as I know, Rolf can see our Paypal accounts info (address).. So why is he assuming we are all of the EU? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Its easy to tell who is a usa citizen, whoever bought the tale that the price increase is exclusively due to taxes. and that the desicion could be reverted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 I am not trying to whine, but those not of the EU should by no means pay the EU's taxes.Stayed out of all these discussions so far ... but let me turn the tables on this point ......When a Non- US citizen pays for a game (let's say the MMO Ultima Online) which is from US origin, I am pretty sure that in the monthly fee there is some form of US VAT or other tax included whether or not it is displayed.Why should a Non US player pay for it, if we follow your logic/moan/rant?Further more, there are games which are based in the US where as a EU player you have to pay of the monthly fee (which includes US taxes) with on top of it an EU tax ..... So nothing different now, just the tables turned on this occasion.....Do we moan? No cause we all know there are 2 things in life that you have to do no matter what:1.At the end of life you die2.You got to pay tax whether you like it or not. (or at least that's according to my late grandfather) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 *luke scream* NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 (edited) Wurm Online is a hobby, and if you're in such a tight economical pinch that you cannot afford it when paying a few bucks more each month you should really take a deep breath and think about why you're paying for it at all.To those that use PayPal as an argument:Blah blaha blagahuu. You don't even have to enter a valid address when creating a PayPal account. They never check the validity of your address. "Why?" you might ask, and the answer is as simple as it is obvious: They don't care. Sure they have access to your account information and can tell from that which country your bank is in but you don't have to be living in that country. Also, wouldn't PayPal lose quite a lot of customers if they started handing out private information? Statistical information with anonymous numbers is one thing, but handing out information for specific accounts... Just no. Edited April 20, 2013 by Aeris 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 Aeris, they do check where you are from, I know because some specific laws of my country didnt allow transactions above a certain limit with foreign currency, and another time I had trouble purchasing products from a virtual marketplace that was exclusive for a certain region, and I was unable to purchase anything from them untill they had coverage for the region where I live. (I belive it was actually linked to the credit card home-country). So I dont really know in wich of the several stages of buying stuff online they do the check, but they do, and it works, and it tells exactly where you are from. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 They've never checked my address, so it is more likely that the site you were purchasing from had a system that checked where your bank was located. Also, I believe that in most countries you have to pay a fee everytime you request account information like that so it most likely wouldn't be doable for Rolf to force a check on people's bank information. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 I too am from the big ol state of Texas.. Being from America or Europe or even Antarctica has no relevance over who gets to pay or doesn't get to pay for a tax rise in Rolf's country. The game is still cheaper than the other mmo's that I would play. While I don't like the rise in price, I have a choice.. Pay it and play the game or let my premium lapse and walk away. For now, I love the game.. SO I will deal with the rising cost. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 I too am from the big ol state of Texas.. Being from America or Europe or even Antarctica has no relevance over who gets to pay or doesn't get to pay for a tax rise in Rolf's country. The game is still cheaper than the other mmo's that I would play. While I don't like the rise in price, I have a choice.. Pay it and play the game or let my premium lapse and walk away. For now, I love the game.. SO I will deal with the rising cost.There is no tax rise. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 If rolf is actually gonna pay thousands of dollars of unnecessary tax every year voluntarily hes kind of an idiot. It cant be that hard to either find a way to prove who buys his services from where, or in the alternative to negotiate some sort of % or ratio that is fairly accurate (which is how it works most of the time).However wurm has been the same cheap price for a long time, so regardless of the VAT issue its understandable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted April 20, 2013 (edited) Becuase Rolf wants you to. You don't have to, just stop paying premium. Bye o/Becuase you have elected yourself Rolfs rude speaker on this matter, how about you answer why is it a Swedish Wurm competitor (Mortal Online) charges $14.25 or 14.25e for their game, knowing which country players are from using a verified payment processor (the same Paypal) so that they can charge more for VAT for only EU players and not have to pay VAT for the US players. Edited April 20, 2013 by yarnevk 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
