Enjoying the game...

[Aeris 3,764]

Sarcasm alert ahead.

Thank you for all the updates that are clearly made to improve upon our gameplay on the PvE servers. I will bring up some examples of a few of the features that I enjoy particularly much.

A statue lasts virtually forever on deeded tiles, but surely it makes no sense that the same would be true for flowerpots that serve the same function of decorating your village. I really love spending half a day improving flowerpots to have them rot away in 4 day’s time. They used to last a fair bit longer so that we could enjoy looking at them for a bit before they needed to be tended to. This was obviously game-breaking, especially since watering them takes forever and of course I should need to spend hours watering purely decorative items every day.

When we migrated to Independence because Jenn-Kellon Home had to be shut down due to the lovely addition of PvP on a server that people chose to be on to avoid PvP the first thing that struck us was how steep everything was. We had to either dig 300 steep pits to reach rock or we had to make a mine entrance on an already open cliffside. Since there was an item limit and no bulk storage bins we didn’t exactly have the means of bringing a lot of iron so many of us opened up a mine right away to get what we needed. Surely we all loved the update later on that made it impossible to put minedoors on slopes above 90, because why should we be able to use minedoors on our mines? Now that’s just crazy talk! Surely it makes a lot more sense to fence them in and put a house in front of them?

Now our charming and not at all gimpy housed mines are being exposed to yet another lovely feature – The ability for others to break into them. Sure we’ve spent all the time ever since the server opened to secure our mines but since most of us don’t have every single tile of our mines deeded then obviously we are just self-entitled and greedy for wishing them to stay safe. Some random guy that wants to break into the mine because he can is clearly more entitled to the contents of the mine than the people who’ve spent years working on it. Surely only guys with an honest intent would skulk around on a PvE server to break open walls of a mine where the entrance is so well-tended that he cannot get through it? If it had been abandoned he could’ve just walked through the entrance, but why should he have to wait for that when he can just disintegrate the reinforced walls and get access to the contents without having to first deed it himself? The notion that you should only feel entitled to tiles that you pay for is clearly not applicable to people who want to destroy your stuff, it should of course only work one way and prevent you from whining when stuff gets lost. I really enjoy that the mechanic allows for more slack in the other direction meaning that people should feel entitled to everything not bolted down without first deeding it. Perhaps we should make it so that you can disintegrate house walls while we’re at it? It’s game-breaking really that I can make sure to secure a house in the forest and my items in there are safe, just like it’s game-breaking that the mine entrance that I tend to doesn’t let people in so that the poor fellas have to wait for the mine to become abandoned – especially in cases where the mine entrance is fully deeded.

At least we have concrete to use to fix all the havoc that potential griefers may cause in the mine. Sure it takes less than 1 hour to destroy an entire cave and at least 1 week to make and apply all the concrete, but we’re clearly just needy and whiny if we point this out.

Also we shall not kid ourselves, because if we cannot reach that concrete because it used to be stored in a bulk storage bin on your paid for deeded land and the same person who broke into the mine also put a lock on that very same bin it’s all your fault really. You should’ve been foresighted enough to predict that the game mechanics do nothing to protect you in that regard. I cannot stress enough how much I love the fact that everyone except myself is more entitled to my lands than I am.

Don’t get me wrong, I actually DO love the game which is why all the dubious permission mechanics annoy me to such an extent. It seems that the simple gesture of letting us enjoy what we have created have gotten lost somewhere along the way. I love Wurm Online and I have been playing It for a long time and will keep playing it for a long time, but I felt I should share my two cents for whatever it’s worth. This is not a “boohoo imma quit†thread, because I won’t. The developers are all doing a great job and it’s truly a great game, I just hate seeing it go in this direction where everything is lost unless you run around like a madman watching your perimeters and items every half hour. We play this game for enjoyment and one by one the items on my list may not at all be that bad, but when added together it just makes no sense.

[Issle 793]

A whole bunch of paragraphs just to say you feel bad that your off-deed mine can be breached.

 

Deed it or grieve it. I'm fed up with all those freedomers who strive to conquer as much of the map as they can just because they can't satisfy their greed. People that encolse like 500 tiles of map just because some stupid rule allows them to, people who reinforce whole mountains just because they want it all for themselves, people who have trader farms all over the place, dozens of gigantoperimeter deeds in every highly polulated area and so on.

 

Honestly, I feel happy that those hoarders of land will get a kick in their butt and actually will be forced to make room for new players that will ACTUALLY pay for that land instead of getting it for free.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Issle

[Aeris 3,764]

A whole bunch of paragraphs just to say you feel bad that your off-deed mine can be breached.

A whole bunch of my paragraphs just say that I feel bad that a lot of people's off-deed mines can be breached.

Honestly - If you want to get into an off-deed mine just deed it yourself and then proceed to to whatever you want with it. Don't give others crap for not deeding it when you haven't done so yourself.

[WhyThatPost 180]

im ruslted cause a long standing game mechanic has become a bug at the drop of a hat with no notification to the people it effected

 

don't want reinforcements to be 100% safe rolf? cool, fine, but give a fourm post notifying that this change is going to happen in x time, then change it, you just compromised most deed defences(pvp srvr) in one night

[Issle 793]

If you also want a personal space with a mine, deed it. What gives you the right to claim land for free ? It's this mentallity that led us into having so many servers that cost resources to maintain. Random hoarders who cap the whole server with their ambition. 

Edited March 25, 2014 by Issle

[Protunia 735]

Not me after what happened yesterday and deleteing posts about other games im about done with Wurm.

 

I will be having a big sale of all of it soon.  I'll pick up and move on.

 

Hope you have many years of happiness left here.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Protunia

[EliasTheCrimson 348]

If you also want a personal space with a mine, deed it. What gives you the right to claim land for free ? It's this mentallity that led us into having so many servers that cost resources to maintain. Random hoarders who cap the whole server with their ambition.

I'm pretty sure we have "so many different" servers because players think new servers are great and opening new ones causes population surges, not because the greedy space hoarders hoarded all the hoardable space.

[Tikki 65]

Don't leave us Protunia , we love you =) hugs , stay and everything will be alright , you have been here forever , it would not feel right if you decided to leave . relax and breathe , everything will be ok =)

[Issle 793]

I'm pretty sure we have "so many different" servers because players think new servers are great and opening new ones causes population surges, not because the greedy space hoarders hoarded all the hoardable space.

 

And what happened when those new servers opened ? What happened when Pristine & Release were introduced in the game ? Those same Freedom hoarders went in that cluster, occupied the best lands because they knew how the game works and were selling ropes for 1s per piece to new unsuspected players.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Issle

[Rushy 48]

That why every server should be PVP so those ######s trying to sell 1s ropes can be forcibly removed, and the deed levelled and sanded. (im out of here before carebares arrive)

Edited March 25, 2014 by Rushy

[Lancelot 765]

Why should those players that do NOT want to be involved in any aspect of PvP be forced to play that way Rushy ? I mean, I do , because I enjoy the risks, but not everyone does and I respect people for standing up for what they believe in. Your post is just selfish in the extreme mate.

[Aeris 3,764]

And what happened when those new servers opened ? What happened when Pristine & Release were introduced in the game ? Those same Freedom hoarders went in that cluster, occupied the best lands because they knew how the game works and were selling ropes for 1s per piece to new unsuspected players.

Deed the offdeed mines then and sell the lands to poor new players if you really think that that is the real issue here. Honestly though - My bet is that the off-deed mines are off-deed for a reason. Many of them were made on uninhabitable land right after the server opened so have fun selling those deeds to new players.

I suspect that the real issue here though is that you see yourself as the perfect player that go by the rulebook 100% of the time. Surely you must be a perfect player for feeling entitled to pass such high and allmighty judgement on the rest of us. Please excuse us though mister Perfect, since some players had to create mines in inhostpitable areas when the game mechanic actually allowed for those mines to be secured. Have some some understanding for the fact that the floor we've been standing on ever since the server opened has now been mined down below us making us stand in a puddle of water and griefer urine.

[EliasTheCrimson 348]

And what happened when those new servers opened ? What happened when Pristine & Release were introduced in the game ? Those same Freedom hoarders went in that cluster, occupied the best lands because they knew how the game works and were selling ropes for 1s per piece to new unsuspected players.

Veteran players having taking advantage of their experience to gain the upper hand on new servers is a completely different issue. Don't equate the people keeping an off-deed mine with those who price-gouges gear for newbies. Unpaid land hoarding is a potential problem and its definitely worth discussing solutions to limit off-deed land claiming but we are not facing a land crisis.

Another aspect of this matter to consider regarding mines is that players have no control over how far they need to expand them to reach an adequate supply of ores and rock.

Edited March 25, 2014 by EliasTheCrimson

[Dairuka 888]

Deed the offdeed mines then and sell the lands to poor new players if you really think that that is the real issue here. Honestly though - My bet is that the off-deed mines are off-deed for a reason. Many of them were made on uninhabitable land right after the server opened so have fun selling those deeds to new players.

I suspect that the real issue here though is that you see yourself as the perfect player that go by the rulebook 100% of the time. Surely you must be a perfect player for feeling entitled to pass such high and allmighty judgement on the rest of us. Please excuse us though mister Perfect, since some players had to create mines in inhostpitable areas when the game mechanic actually allowed for those mines to be secured. Have some some understanding for the fact that the floor we've been standing on ever since the server opened has now been mined down below us making us stand in a puddle of water and griefer urine.

 

The developers have sided with Freedom. Disintegrate will no longer be a spell usable on Freedom.

 

As for Issle, his current sanctimonious reactions will soon turn to outward rage in the future when the next step of the PvP cycle comes to fruition:

 

Wurm's PvP is never going to be popular. It's not Wurm's fault. Wurm itself is a great concept, and arguably more fun without the PvP element.

 

The fault lies in the concept of Sandbox PvP. It's a deeply flawed, self-cannibalizing concept. It begins with people putting in weeks of work. Other people on the other side will then destroy those weeks of work in mere hours. The people who have had their work destroyed then get frustrated and will complain. The resulting shouting matches on the forums cause those frustrated players to quit. The remaining people who forced those frustrated players to quit will then fracture and fight amongst themselves because there is no one left to fight. One side in that civil war will emerge victorious when the other side is eventually forced to quit. The remaining victors will then get bored, quit, or become insignificant forum dwellers who will endlessly ###### while holding onto the rose-tinted glasses when they were on top of a PvP hierarchy that will never exist again. (Until the next doomed-from-the-start Sandbox PvP comes out.)

 

Sandbox PvP literally devours itself until nothing is left. Even EVE has proven it isn't immune, it just regenerates faster than it can devour.

 

Once the victors take all the spoils, and push their enemies to quit. There is no one left to fight. The very people who pushed their enemies to quit, will then snap at anything and everything in an attempt to shift blame from themselves as the reason why there is no more PvP-fun to be had.

 

The cycle of PvP continues.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Dairuka

[As_I_Decay 1,592]

And what happened when those new servers opened ? What happened when Pristine & Release were introduced in the game ? Those same Freedom hoarders went in that cluster, occupied the best lands because they knew how the game works and were selling ropes for 1s per piece to new unsuspected players.

Shut up, Issle. You know damn well that Chaos players are just as guilty of doing what you claim Freedomers do. "Land rushes" are done by everyone, including your buddies, in hopes of securing a dragon.

 

[Protunia 735]

Shut up, Issle. You know damn well that Chaos players are just as guilty of doing what you claim Freedomers do. "Land rushes" are done by everyone, including your buddies, in hopes of securing a dragon.

Of course they do and plant tons of traders to support their PvP as well.

 

Its Part of the "Wurm" experience..Thems that knows Pockets Grows!! lol!

[Issle 793]

Aeris I'm not standing on the podium preaching about good and bad. It's just that after Rolf's decision the words that come out of most of people who complain are things like "my deed", "my mine", "my off deed mine", "my items", "my safe items"

 

I didn't hear anyone saying something like "you know the new and poor players who can't plant a deed won't be able to have a safe mine". it's as if everyone tries to protect his wealth and cares about nothing else. Let me asure you, people who are attached to their personal gain and wealth so much, end up being alone at the end. 

 

A very very recent example and the root of all this evil, Sparta, the Jenn Kellon Chaos deed that was raided by us. That village had so many rares in their vault and their villagers were so attached to accumulating wealth they were never planning to share with anyone that at the end, their whole kingdom spit them out. Nobody besides some war-hungry players came to defend. Those that clinged to their wealth with such intensity, ended up losing it all at the end.

 

We raided and griefed that deed for a whole weekend to no end and nobody came to defend. Defend what ? Fsbkun's personal safe mine ?

 

See where I'm getting at ? This game is not just about your personal wealth and gain.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Issle

[Tikki 65]

i thought rolf made it possible <by fixing a bug > so that you could raid that deed , without anyone knowing it was happening till it was to late ?

[KanePT 699]

 

Ran out of likes yesterday.

And kudos at Issle for trying to make this whole thing some sort of righteous crusade on Rolf and MR.

[Aeris 3,764]

See where I'm getting at ? This game is not just about your personal wealth and gain.

You're so incredibly far off the point of the thread that I don't even know where to begin. I don't think you even read the OP, and it is painfully obvious that you do not know me at all. You've just run out of arguments to defend yourself with and try to grasp for straws. If you have no valid arguments to come with then perhaps it is time you stop posting?

For the record: I don't have a character nor do I have a deed on any other server. I do not play the game for personal gain, I play it for enjoyment. Which you would've perhaps gotten if you'd read and understood the OP.

[As_I_Decay 1,592]

Aeris I'm not standing on the podium preaching about good and bad. It's just that after Rolf's decision the words that come out of most of people who complain are things like "my deed", "my mine", "my off deed mine", "my items", "my safe items"

 

I didn't hear anyone saying something like "you know the new and poor players who can't plant a deed won't be able to have a safe mine". it's as if everyone tries to protect his wealth and cares about nothing else. Let me asure you, people who are attached to their personal gain and wealth so much, end up being alone at the end. 

 

A very very recent example and the root of all this evil, Sparta, the Jenn Kellon Chaos deed that was raided by us. That village had so many rares in their vault and their villagers were so attached to accumulating wealth they were never planning to share with anyone that at the end, their whole kingdom spit them out. Nobody besides some war-hungry players came to defend. Those that clinged to their wealth with such intensity, ended up losing it all at the end.

 

 

Yes, Yes. We read Emoo's thread. We know that you guys called Rolf in to bust into a deed because, apparently, there was a mechanic in-game that only your kingdom seemed to know about. There was no "spitting out", you guys stole them. Well played in the great Wurm war, though...

This has nothing to do with Freedomer's greed and more to do with the false thought that someone has the right to access a mine that is 1. not theirs and 2. currently used by others.

[Thorakkanath 444]

Aeris I'm not standing on the podium preaching about good and bad. It's just that after Rolf's decision the words that come out of most of people who complain are things like "my deed", "my mine", "my off deed mine", "my items", "my safe items"

 

I didn't hear anyone saying something like "you know the new and poor players who can't plant a deed won't be able to have a safe mine". it's as if everyone tries to protect his wealth and cares about nothing else. Let me asure you, people who are attached to their personal gain and wealth so much, end up being alone at the end. 

 

A very very recent example and the root of all this evil, Sparta, the Jenn Kellon Chaos deed that was raided by us. That village had so many rares in their vault and their villagers were so attached to accumulating wealth they were never planning to share with anyone that at the end, their whole kingdom spit them out. Nobody besides some war-hungry players came to defend. Those that clinged to their wealth with such intensity, ended up losing it all at the end.

 

We raided and griefed that deed for a whole weekend to no end and nobody came to defend. Defend what ? Fsbkun's personal safe mine ?

 

See where I'm getting at ? This game is not just about your personal wealth and gain.

 

 

Unsure how can you compare a PvP gamestyle to a non PvP gamestyle. I chose non PvP because i didnt want 'my stuff' to be stolen and be freely accessible to anyone that had time and resources to steal it from me.

 

How can you, as a PvP-er tell me what is good and right? is like a buddhist telling a christian that his religion is wrong because he dosent belive in buddha.

 

I can relate to and possibly even agree with the PvP change, but I don't care about PvP so my oppinion is irrelevant. But my oppinion is fully relevant for PvE that i chose to join. The grieving opportunities this change provide are huge. And no, deeding is not always an option because you cannot expand your deed in the 5 free perimeter tiles. And guess what?! on the other side of my perimeter is the perimeter of another deed I own! But hey! let's make a change so that those 10 tiles inbetween become griever friendly, because the peeps on PvP (rightfully or not, I will not discuss that like I said) wanted it!

[rosedragon 2,282]

dont take issle wholeheartedly, just feed him some cookies and move on or ignore him. <3

Edited March 25, 2014 by rosedragon

[Leroy 315]

As a new player, when looking for an area to deed I did not once stop to check if an existing mine run underneath.

just saying that for those saying to deed a mine.

[Claies 77]

How many forum threads do we have to have on the same topic? Besides the fact that this is completely unrealistic. A 50% chance of a breach with a 98 power cast by a Magnaron priest doesn't exactly scream of Mass Mine Attacks. A Magnaron priest with enough faith to cast a 70 difficulty spell at 98 power certainly doesn't need whatever you have packed in that off deed mine you are so worried about. And the amount of effort to get a priest to that level just to go breaching mines? Really not likely.