Shift works focus

[Alkhadias 548]

I'm sorry for yet another topic. It's not a rant tho. 

So, here's another Black Friday. Yet, it might be quite sad one and important one for both community and staff, because throwback was pretty intense.

Messed up wagon skin is just a top of an iceberg. Valrei International speaking about yet another PVP shelving is a bigger thing- but yet it's only another iceberg to breakdown. 

It's pretty sad to see so many players not wanting to reprem this year. Not new players who wasn't interested in game anyway, but seasoned veterans who runs multiple accounts for years to support Wurm. And I can imagine that they're minority, and most of us bought premium anyway. Tho, none will convince me that Wurm don't need them and that Wurm has enough money to run further into the future without looking back. 

 

So I simply ask wurm devs, staff if there's possibility to shift their focuses into community needs instead of management plans. If management can't see what's happening, they're just bad at their jobs. 

 

#1 suggestion- PVP and servers merge
I'm not a PVP player. But I'm part of Wurm's community and even if i had barely any idea about PVP needs i hear them. I'm listening and hearing them for years saying the same things over and over again. PVP is dying and while it's not the main part of community it's important part of it. So they need to be heard out. I won't tell anything about possible solutions- they said enough of the same. Merge servers, stop separating already small community even more. You can do that Devs. Of course there will be problems with merging NFI and SFI, but afterall that's your job to make it work. 
You might say it's not the good solution- but you haven't presented any better for years. And even if you would, most likely it won't be better because the only right solution is to furfill community needs. They won't take anything less anymore. 

This will pay out immediately. I'm going to bet everything i have, that as soon as PVP servers would open for each other- dozens of new premmed accounts would return instantly.
PVP merge should be done asap, should be prior to everything else- so even if you're working on other projects, simply shelve them and work on this. Otherwise no matter what you present to us, it will be disappointing. Or there will be only few of us to receive it. 

#2 suggestion- Stop presenting us stuff that none asked for, when there's so much community waits for so long.

Node system might be fresh and cool. Wagon skin could be cool. But who asked for them? Yes of course people wanted wagons to be fixed and/ or to be able to toggle covers. But open wagon skin from shop is not a fix, nor it's a toggeable option. Node system is yet another reworked system. Not everyone welcomes reworked systems like fishing. And I understand that some mechanics within game should be reworked. Forage perhaps is one of them i don't argue with it. But people want new things. Not new skins or "new old" mechanics. Totally new content is more important than reworking old ones over again. We need more stuff to create instead of new skins. We need new mechanics like goblin camps, like excellent idea here:

... instead of reworked ones. Make ingame/ forum polls And yes we also need to rework some stuff, that drives to third suggestion

#3 suggestion- Reorder your plans
Please focus on stuff in right order

1. Fixing things that drives out Vet community like PVP. There might be more of it. Everything that makes community angry, at some point makes them helpless. And sooner or later they are parting ways with wurm. None of the staff or devs can say that he/ she didn't know. Problems like this exist for years and everyone heard of it. Do something in first place.

2. Creating new content
a) mechanics like goblin camps should be at most important in long term (like a year plan)
b) But we also need new content every now and then (new craftable items, new craftable decors)

c) Monthly events. Let it be both forum events and ingame events, but really any events will do. Just make us believe you still see people in us. 

d) God damn, bring valrei international as a regular thing instead of this TV tragedy, thank you. 

3. Skins for already existing items to sell them and earn cash for our beloved game. And yes, we like skins. And we like to pay for them. But none wants to pay for them knowing that this replaces new content more and more.
a) And make variety of items. Not only basinet/ great helmets. But also armors, boats, ships, guard towers, forges etc.

b) make separate subforum in suggestion for skins suggestions

4. Rework old mechanics. But please, make ingame poll and forum polls before you do. Ask people, ask your community what mechanics whould be reworked and then start proposing options. If you work already on old skills like foraging, check our first if people really wants and likes it. Replacing old mechanics that few enjoyed with new mechanic that still only few enjoys- sounds like wasted time? *smh* 
Not saying Nodes wasted time and people don't like them. I simply don't know. But just asking to focus on community needs. 

Order of works/ projects like that wouldn't hurt anyone I believe. If it would, let me know.

I know, I'm aware that new game management wants to make Wurm its main profit well. And that's possible as long as we are heard out. Focusing on getting new players into... 16 years old game? Might be... difficult so to say. Would be wonderfull, but at this point you should really ask yourselves if this is even possible. What is possible tho, is to keep veteran playerbase in Wurm. Is to live and play, and have fun in a greatest community ever existed. And one of if not the most loyal community in gaming industry. Loosing our hearts and loyalty is indeed an impossible task, that sadly becomes a thing. Don't do it. 

And I'd love to hear from staff perspective, why everything I've just wrote is or might be impossible, how might it be inprofitable, how it might be abused or how it might unbalance game. Any reason to NOT do all of this.

Best Regards

Edited November 26, 2023 by Alkhadias

[Alkhadias 548]

added a poll

[thibbledorf 45]

I basically agree, although on your #2 I would say that I think the idea was to make Wurm more visually appealing, which it will be, and the new foraging system came out of that, more than the original intention was to make a new foraging system.

It is almost out, so it is pointless to discuss it anymore, but for the love of {insert deity here}, please do something about PvP next. I don't PvP but they are a part of our Wurm community and they deserve some attention.

[Alkhadias 548]

11 minutes ago, thibbledorf said:

I basically agree, although on your #2 I would say that I think the idea was to make Wurm more visually appealing, which it will be, and the new foraging system came out of that, more than the original intention was to make a new foraging system.

It is almost out, so it is pointless to discuss it anymore, but for the love of {insert deity here}, please do something about PvP next. I don't PvP but they are a part of our Wurm community and they deserve some attention.

You are right, it's pointless now, so the only thing is to wait a lil bit longer and then enjoy new nodes. However I'm talking about next steps that are still up to debate and perhaps shifting towards more important to the community changes. 

[Tor 531]

Don't think there would be many, or any that would disagree with you and whoever is in charge for decision about wurm future can listen and agree with all this as well. But, at this point, first they need to clarify if they really want and actually can do something about what community wants.

[Alkhadias 548]

Just now, Tor said:

Don't think there would be many, or any that would disagree with you and whoever is in charge for decision about wurm future can listen and agree with all this as well. But, at this point, first they need to clarify if they really want and actually can do something about what community wants.

Agree, but it doesn't mean that we should just sit and wait. People need to talk about this until someone "up there" finally realise how things are really looking like. More of us= better.

Community will no longer care about any additions, changes, skins or actual ongoin develepoment projects as long as Staff don't care about community needs. Community that is properly taken care of, will be open for more of "less needed" things. But basics must be forfilled and we all must work together in fair conditions. 

[Tor 531]

3 minutes ago, Alkhadias said:

Agree, but it doesn't mean that we should just sit and wait. People need to talk about this until someone "up there" finally realise how things are really looking like. More of us= better.

Community will no longer care about any additions, changes, skins or actual ongoin develepoment projects as long as Staff don't care about community needs. Community that is properly taken care of, will be open for more of "less needed" things. But basics must be forfilled and we all must work together in fair conditions. 

I can see someone within a month from up there "chime in" and kinda half-promise not so cleary there's maybe, just maybe something cooking up, then everyone is on board, hyped, excited and whoever show criticism or scepticism is just another hater or conspiracy theorist and the sit and wait continues until this same happen again, it's been a quite a cycle past few years.

 

[Ekcin 2,424]

Well "enjoying new nodes" is not the point, rather hoping the destruction remains inside some limits, the only positives being maybe bit prettier landscape, and the enchantable gloves.

 

And I strongly disagree to PvP merge before cluster merge. Rather fast cluster merge which allows PvP players to gather where they like. PvP reorganization might not be as easy, I fail to see all being happy being deported to Defiance, Epic and Chaos destroyed. Load forum campaigners are not necessarily all PvP players or Epic denizens.

 

And as to your illusion: No more than a handful at best will return, if for short time, then run away bored or disgusted as in similar situations before.

 

Events, yes please, but mind it is a sandbox where most is player generated. Goblin camps, yes. Also Rift camps could spawn more often. And please revive Jackal as soon as the clusters are merged.

[Finnn 3,321]

if you merge, some will just drive other to quit the game, the same problem remains... find the cause for the dead pvp community, fix the issue leading for no interest to pvp

[Etherdrifter 2,518]

PvP has been dying for years, at this point it has been on life support for so long one wonders how it can be sustained.  At this point, it seems almost cruel to keep it alive

 

It has unique content and rewards (HotA and Kingdoms) that have failed to win over PvE players.  In general, PvP in wurms style just doesn't appeal long term, especially with a core component of wurms progression being wagered (gear).

 

However, merging clusters would set the stage for a PvP merge, and in this I see no harm.  Give PvP its chance, see if it recovers this time, if only for the data it will generate.

[Alkhadias 548]

1 hour ago, Etherdrifter said:

PvP has been dying for years, at this point it has been on life support for so long one wonders how it can be sustained.  At this point, it seems almost cruel to keep it alive

 

It has unique content and rewards (HotA and Kingdoms) that have failed to win over PvE players.  In general, PvP in wurms style just doesn't appeal long term, especially with a core component of wurms progression being wagered (gear).

 

However, merging clusters would set the stage for a PvP merge, and in this I see no harm.  Give PvP its chance, see if it recovers this time, if only for the data it will generate.

Thats exactly what I mean.

I don't wanna however underestimate pvp community.

 

Anyway, after so many years without solution, which was promised every now and then. They deserve to be heard. And I doubt that players will get anything less than a merge of Sfi and Nfi as a solution. 

 

If that somehow wouldnt work out for pvp players, then at least they would get what they wanted. And nothing will change- beside they needs being forfilled.

[Alkhadias 548]

11 hours ago, Ekcin said:

Well "enjoying new nodes" is not the point, rather hoping the destruction remains inside some limits, the only positives being maybe bit prettier landscape, and the enchantable gloves.

 

And I strongly disagree to PvP merge before cluster merge. Rather fast cluster merge which allows PvP players to gather where they like. PvP reorganization might not be as easy, I fail to see all being happy being deported to Defiance, Epic and Chaos destroyed. Load forum campaigners are not necessarily all PvP players or Epic denizens.

 

And as to your illusion: No more than a handful at best will return, if for short time, then run away bored or disgusted as in similar situations before.

 

Events, yes please, but mind it is a sandbox where most is player generated. Goblin camps, yes. Also Rift camps could spawn more often. And please revive Jackal as soon as the clusters are merged.

I didn't say about pvp merge only. I spoke about full merge.

 

And it's not an illusion. Even if only handful of players will return, like 20-30. And only 15 will stay, thats still better than loosing another 20-30 players that have enough of not delivered promises.

[DannyUK 212]

NFI and SFI merge should have been right at the top of the list in my opinion, that is what's splitting the player base already. If I was a new player coming into the game now and found out I can't travel to these servers without making another character I would be pretty unhappy and probably leave before I even started. I would love to know the reason on why this hasn't happened yet? Or is it being worked on in the background? Because if you want new players and for them to stay merging the servers is a big factor.

 

I haven't tried the new system with nodes but I see a lot of people unhappy about it. I would like them to add new content into the game also, that has to happen on a regular basis through updates. Update the bushes and trees, give them an overall because the likes of the rose bush and camellia just look nothing like them. It would be nice to see some new flowers and trees in the game, I noticed some flowers in the update notes and I think they look nice, I will probably use them on deed but more is needed for decoration.

 

I'd love to see more new players come into the game, at the moment though I don't see them sticking around until things start to pick up and changes are made. I hope you do listen to community concerns because they are what drive the game, should be doing official poles to gauge how people feel about upcoming changes and work around that. Also I noticed the new streaming network on Wurm website, can we please have an official dev stream again? Like once a month like we used to have on Twitch. It is a way of becoming transparent and letting people know what you are working on, where the game is going and what changes will be made. Many games have official streams these days, I just think Wurm would benefit from this also.

[Madnath 3,113]

18 hours ago, Etherdrifter said:

that have failed to win over PvE players. 

 

It's very unique and hard to talk about this element. It's fair and fine to sit and go "I don't like PvP so I haven't tried it" but I've seen more than enough people with issues that can be resolved with PvP.

Low activity? Defiance and Chaos have times where they pop off, increasing overall player count, even if a few are lost because of a merge, means more activity. More people roaming, the more people get on to also roam, or set up traps, more people doing events like HoTA.

Gear issues? Tricky to argue for or against, because most if not all kingdoms will ensure players have gear ready for fights, and if it's not a PvP server you can sail back and forth from, item sets will not leave the server, so when fights are won/lost, that gear still exists on the server to be passed around. Gear loss is a thing that some are worried about, but you don't need to keep that stuff in order to go anywhere.

 

In general I don't have a horse in the race about a PvE merge because I appreciate it's a lot harder to approach that angle. If you take a portal to PvP, that's already a disconnect from one clusters ruleset and it means the server you've portal'd to is a blank slate for whatever the devs put down. In that regard, it makes a PvP server an ideal testing ground to keep some of the NFI elements they think worked and remove whatever didn't, and actually work to guage player reactions to these changes. Rather than seeing a PvP merge as a roadblock to a PvE merge, it's time to open your mind and consider the possibility that PvP might actually be a good experimentation ground to prepare for that future merge of clusters, if it ever happens. The primary dev anxiety seems to stem from the cluster changes, so doing something that can lead to them figuring out how to approach it might be good.

 

I appreciate there's hesitations about work to PvP but it's awful to sit and give the finger to a group of players just because they're a minority, especially when they've been starved of meaningful content and updates for such a long period. I think you'd see a similar downturn of PvE players if the situation was flipped on its head instead.

[Camelrider 210]

On 11/26/2023 at 5:50 PM, Ekcin said:

And I strongly disagree to PvP merge before cluster merge. Rather fast cluster merge which allows PvP players to gather where they like. PvP reorganization might not be as easy, I fail to see all being happy being deported to Defiance, Epic and Chaos destroyed. Load forum campaigners are not necessarily all PvP players or Epic denizens.

 

This really isn't related to the thread, but i wanted to address your comment.

 

That merge suggestion is just about -all- pvp players. There is a cross kingdom discord birthed through the death of TC that is used to discuss and suggest changes with 112 premium PvP players in it from just about every faction on all clusters that are in favor of that change, people who aren't in it don't know about it; but every pvp player knows about the changes being suggested; by whom; and why. Epic has less than 2 unique players a month. I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much every active PvPer has been in agreement on every suggestion made for some time because there was an internal, community led discussion about that being the best way to go about getting changes in as PvP hasn't had any real ones for over six years now.

 

I'm sincerely trying not to come across as negative, but I'm trying to really drive home a point.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Camelrider

[Alkhadias 548]

Yes, I really hate when some players tells that PvP changes are useless because they won't bring back or/ and keep some players like there would be 10 of you across the board. 

 

I bet that there are fairly more of you, just simply not taking a part in more topics and discussions. Perhaps, after 6 years many are too tired of being skipped, not wanting to waste words anymore.

 

Thats not fair, and thats not how game devs act or should be acting. Even worst gaming brands dont let players to wait for so many years.

[Lisimba 779]

4 hours ago, Madnath said:

 

It's very unique and hard to talk about this element. It's fair and fine to sit and go "I don't like PvP so I haven't tried it" but I've seen more than enough people with issues that can be resolved with PvP.

 

My point of view: I'm tentatively willing to try PvP, but I'm pretty confident that I'll be turned into a thin paste the first time I have to fight an actual PvP player. I do not want to put anything at risk I've achieved on the PvE side, just to see if this would be something I'd actually enjoy. No gear or animals, no skills, especially no affinities, and nothing else I may not have thought of. Right now it's very unclear what you put on the line, if anything, and how to deal with that, so PvP feels like a radioactive death zone that should be avoided at all costs.

[Kulthar 76]

if fighting skill wasnt localized to the pvp server and your fight skill carried over more people would participate. Powerful PvE'ers could wander through the portal and wreck s*** on a whim lol. A seasonal PvP server would be nice as well. As of right now I've given up on PvP because its literally just a one sided nightmare zone.

EDIT: someone please explain how forcing someone to grind fighting twice makes sense

Edited November 28, 2023 by Kulthar

[Finnn 3,321]

don't think so...

there's pvp meta.. pretty hard to get into..

full inventory loss and skill/affinity loss is big downside to pvp..

 

it's a very niche rng thrill, meme and meta play;

if you get event server with events/areas where pvp is possible and safe zones.. people will be more willing to try it.. but item drop etc.. is very big downside and annoyance to deal with;

 

in fallen earth(other game) for example.. there are pvp maps, any place any faction or just non-friendlies.. your call, on top.. there was a list of online players and sorting by zone(map/area) and player levels , you can imagine what stalking to bully somebody looked like..

also there were zones where if you dive into it.. you get pvp "de/buff" and even if you go outside of it.. for the timer .. you can still be fought outside of it, normally these places have some better loot to scavenge(resources), not always, it's sometimes territory control or mining operation for "rare resource/s"; same could of worked in wurm if .. pvp wasn't mostly dead, nobody hears anything about A group fighting B group.. or mass epic fight, epic fun and such, yea.. same game.. we know it.. mhm.. boring

 

here most to all pve-ers.. don't know what the hota events are, etc.. that's the pvE view, nothing from the pvp map/s is documented, wurm pvp have a big thick shroud all over it, at no time you get to know how many kingdoms exist, what their art is.. who you could contact to maybe get some merch, it's all dead and buried data.. the PR of pvp as mechanic is awful(this does not exist).. nobody knows anything about pvp, nobody cares about pvp, there's lack of interest because it doesn't exist unless you've dived into it for your own reason;

as groups keep evicting others constantly.. we get into state of stale content.. no new kingdoms, no new art.. being mentioned a few times, there's maybe a need for pve alternative with some more or less moderation on what gets added(vetting into the game after review and acceptance to be content.. maybe have option in launcher to enable/disable player whatever-named. art.jar) and still keep things limited in some way.. as there cant be 1000 random arts flying around, or could?

 

closest thing to proper player event where you all get some common goal was jackal afaik, for the beacons(never done it... was on a break at the time), "sure", rifts have the goal to do the waves to unlock gathering of the rune resources, but they are hardly "rare" or that amazing, we asked for big abilities and hard to make runes.. well we got the hard to make runes-part, unsure if attaching only one of non scav runes counts as big ability(SURE... raise your skills and you get to do it casually, it's still incredible at early stage for players, but that "quickly" becomes easy to get and there's no progression further), something could be done there to keep things crunching resources.. apply 2nd rune of same type.. to get 1% upgrade or fail and drop 0/-1/-2 extra power, or option to "socket" extra rune slot/s, lock like spells some runes to work with other but too overpowering stuff to not be possible to mix together by player choice.. leave rng to archaeology.. but allow replacing custom/specific/ rune with another as long it fits same rules for player modification.. same thing is long asked for feature for di/spells..

somebody knowing the "culture" of wurm community just needs to figure what could be fun to add/change and if necessary drop a poll for opinions if development really works based on player opinion, some think changes only come in if people aren't losing their minds over it

 

1 hour ago, Lisimba said:

 

My point of view: I'm tentatively willing to try PvP, but I'm pretty confident that I'll be turned into a thin paste the first time I have to fight an actual PvP player. I do not want to put anything at risk I've achieved on the PvE side, just to see if this would be something I'd actually enjoy. No gear or animals, no skills, especially no affinities, and nothing else I may not have thought of. Right now it's very unclear what you put on the line, if anything, and how to deal with that, so PvP feels like a radioactive death zone that should be avoided at all costs.

pvp is gamba thrill, it used to be more of that when rmt was a thing before rmt ban;

[Zundy 99]

You know what, it never really occured to me before but you're right @Finnn, PvP has literally no PR going on for it and I don't just mean from official sources but not even from the player base. If you look at the forums, the only thing that comes up PvP wise is largely people complaining about PvP (rightly or wrongly) with some infrequent PvP kills posted (no context for new players or players to get hooked on PvP) and the even more infrequent recruitment "bumps" on threads. Optics wise the only thing a new player sees  of PvP is people getting upset which is an extremely bad look and anyone who might want to check it out has literally nothing to go off. No "current state of the war", no cool images, no smooth banter, no projects. All those things are present within the locked down discords of the factions, but not anywhere for someone to "glance in the window" and see. The only thing you can see is the PvE side of things. 

 

I think there's an element of "being the change you want to see" and having more fun stuff posted on forums etc. JK raided the MR capital the other day which was awesome thanks JK for the fight, but where is that here? Did anyone outside of Defiance even know that happened? Did anyone outside of the main JK and MR alliance on defiance itself even know it happened? We didn't film it but we snapped a few pics, where are they but in the locked down discords? We could've had a post showcasing it and then had some mad banter with each other in thread, but we didn't. Missed opportunity and holding my hands up I didn't even think about it until this moment.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Zundy
Spelling a typos

[Lisimba 779]

41 minutes ago, Zundy said:

I think there's an element of "being the change you want to see" and having more fun stuff posted on forums etc. JK raided the MR capital the other day which was awesome thanks JK for the fight, but where is that here? Did anyone outside of Defiance even know that happened? Did anyone outside of the main JK and MR alliance on defiance itself even know it happened?

 

I didn't even know that "raid a capital" was a thing that happened at all. Yes, show it off.

[Skullripz 62]

2 hours ago, Zundy said:

You know what, it never really occured to me before but you're right @Finnn, PvP has literally no PR going on for it and I don't just mean from official sources but not even from the player base. If you look at the forums, the only thing that comes up PvP wise is largely people complaining about PvP (rightly or wrongly) with some infrequent PvP kills posted (no context for new players or players to get hooked on PvP) and the even more infrequent recruitment "bumps" on threads. Optics wise the only thing a new player sees  of PvP is people getting upset which is an extremely bad look and anyone who might want to check it out has literally nothing to go off. No "current state of the war", no cool images, no smooth banter, no projects. All those things are present within the locked down discords of the factions, but not anywhere for someone to "glance in the window" and see. The only thing you can see is the PvE side of things. 

 

I think there's an element of "being the change you want to see" and having more fun stuff posted on forums etc. JK raided the MR capital the other day which was awesome thanks JK for the fight, but where is that here? Did anyone outside of Defiance even know that happened? Did anyone outside of the main JK and MR alliance on defiance itself even know it happened? We didn't film it but we snapped a few pics, where are they but in the locked down discords? We could've had a post showcasing it and then had some mad banter with each other in thread, but we didn't. Missed opportunity and holding my hands up I didn't even think about it until this moment.

 

I couldn't agree more, @Zundy . A game that does a great job of this is Eve Online. I used to love to read about the battles that played out and what was happening between the varied factions. These stories give the player base a better understanding of what pvp truly is and how it works. There are a lot of misconceptions. It's not as scary as people make it out to be and has very little impact on the pve side of their game upon death. 

 

Our stories should be shared and told. For example, no one will know about Bananas, the legend, who respawned during the JK siege the other day and rushed back out half armored; died again; then rushed back thru their line completely naked and unarmed. XD

 

I think given the outside world a little glimpse of the true pvp side of things would potentially spark interest in people who may never have had the thought cross their mind. 

[Ekcin 2,424]

16 hours ago, Camelrider said:

That merge suggestion is just about -all- pvp players. There is a cross kingdom discord birthed through the death of TC that is used to discuss and suggest changes with 112 premium PvP players in it from just about every faction on all clusters that are in favor of that change, people who aren't in it don't know about it; but every pvp player knows about the changes being suggested; by whom; and why. Epic has less than 2 unique players a month. I don't know if you've noticed, but pretty much every active PvPer has been in agreement on every suggestion made for some time because there was an internal, community led discussion about that being the best way to go about getting changes in as PvP hasn't had any real ones for over six years now.

Hm. You are the one demanding transparency, then come over with:

"We have created a nice backroom, where we discussed all without you stupid Freedumber carebears, and decided what to do. Now, devs, follow suit".

Giving the impression of "PvPers" (imho, some PvPers) are spoiled brats, congrats, you perfectly made it.

 

As to others pointing that "PvP has not got any attention for six years", that does not make it better. It is not untypical for Wurm that developments start, get stuck, and are shelved, half done or mothballed. Such with the priest update 2018 (which fell victim by Sindusk leaving the team to my knowledge and impression). But afterwards, there was the Elevation 3 update 2019 which was a major change. That it led to serious troubles for priests (which was new to me, and never largely discussed in the forums, so Oblvionreaver insulting me for "revisionism" - and Madnath parroting it - is not only an outrage, but beside the point) and the issues not being fixed soon, may have been the case. But certainly a major change had been implemented.

 

And not only PvP development got stuck at that time, so did PvE with Jackal being mothballed, without "the whole PvE community" complaining.

Further on, the creation of Defiance 2020 and later, with a new set of rules and mechanics which - to my impression - reflected a lot from the Elevation3 experiences, certainly was a major PvP development. That it got stuck half way, kids, that is Wurm. But no change for 6 years in PvP is plain untrue. I hope that it will go forward, no less than other topics in Wurm (the cluster merge for example, also goblin camps).

 

For "Epic has less than 2 unique players a month":

Quote

PVP
Chaos: 10 | Defiance: 27 | Epic: 14

 

 

Edited November 28, 2023 by Ekcin

[Alkhadias 548]

2 hours ago, Ekcin said:

Hm. You are the one demanding transparency, then come over with:

"We have created a nice backroom, where we discussed all without you stupid Freedumber carebears, and decided what to do. Now, devs, follow suit".

Giving the impression of "PvPers" (imho, some PvPers) are spoiled brats, congrats, you perfectly made it.

 

As to others pointing that "PvP has not got any attention for six years", that does not make it better. It is not untypical for Wurm that developments start, get stuck, and are shelved, half done or mothballed. Such with the priest update 2018 (which fell victim by Sindusk leaving the team to my knowledge and impression). But afterwards, there was the Elevation 3 update 2019 which was a major change. That it led to serious troubles for priests (which was new to me, and never largely discussed in the forums, so Oblvionreaver insulting me for "revisionism" - and Madnath parroting it - is not only an outrage, but beside the point) and the issues not being fixed soon, may have been the case. But certainly a major change had been implemented.

 

And not only PvP development got stuck at that time, so did PvE with Jackal being mothballed, without "the whole PvE community" complaining.

Further on, the creation of Defiance 2020 and later, with a new set of rules and mechanics which - to my impression - reflected a lot from the Elevation3 experiences, certainly was a major PvP development. That it got stuck half way, kids, that is Wurm. But no change for 6 years in PvP is plain untrue. I hope that it will go forward, no less than other topics in Wurm (the cluster merge for example, also goblin camps).

 

For "Epic has less than 2 unique players a month":

 

 

2 unique players doesn't mean all players i believe. Just as 2 unique logins on forum doesn't reflect logged users. I've been modering forums with 15k users active, 200k+ entries in month but only few hundreds unique logins. Unique login mean- new login/ first time login/ login since XXX (might be 1sty day of month) time, depends on script calculations. 

No, Pvpers gives the impression of closed community within a game, that is still community of the game. And I'll say it again, I'm not a part of pvp. 

PvP as far as I remember, didn't get a major update. Introducing NFI and NFI pvp server isn't certainly the one wanted and needed. And no- if developers work (or not) on something for years, then shelve it for another years isn't acceptable. As you said it might be untypical for Wurm, what doesn't mean it should be acceptable and tolerated. I can't even at this moment name another company that would do such thing. (Even considering Star Citizen that I'm following and investing for 10 years). If you're fine with it- that's fine. But you're not the only one playing game. And majority of voices speaks otherwise.

And yes, not only PvP stucks. But PvE gets updates every now and then. Smaller ones, sometimes a bit bigger ones, not major ones perhaps. But some, all the time. PvP had when? 2018 yo say? 5 years ago? How many updates did PvE received since 2018 I wonder?

And finally yes it must go forward. As well as everything else. I can imagine Wurm's devs limited resources. It's not a Rockstar Studio. But if resources are limited, such as time, which seems to be most valuable, at least focus on right things first. Otherwise they can introduce anything, but it will not get any care or interest, that would bring them income and perspective of future. If majority of folks aren't happy with "your vision" then they won't pay for it, simply. And I'm not speaking only for Pvpers. Skins and broken fixes won't buy you much for so long.

 

Edited November 28, 2023 by Alkhadias

[Finnn 3,321]

So, where are the pvp suggestions, who have asked for pvp content, ignore the merge, that's pvp suacide, that aside, what else is asked for and haven't been implemented?