Poll: Localized resources

[Guest MrConor]

Well if people were to monopolise a resource this would happen.

Player one makes and sells iron tools from his deed.

However, what if there is two of them?

Player two does the same and undercuts the other.

Player one undercuts the other.

Eventully they will be forced to reduce their prices in order to sell their goods, which will have a vastly reduced price.

Also if this player made and sold many tools, eventully he would be rich enough to buy all sorts of stuff, then with this money he could ethier become a spendthrift or try hiring people to mine or something.

The problem with the economy is it is too self-sufficent, nobody has much need to trade if everything that they need and Ql is depending on how highly skilled the player is or somebody in their village.

I live in a village and i have had absolutely no need to leave even a half kilometre of it, everything is there and is self sufficent.

[spellcast 983]

The problem with the economy is it is too self-sufficent, nobody has much need to trade if everything that they need and Ql is depending on how highly skilled the player is or somebody in their village.

I live in a village and i have had absolutely no need to leave even a half kilometre of it, everything is there and is self sufficent.

and, having lived on jk-H when ores of higher than 50QL came from wild, there were plenty of villages that had the same setup even on jk-H. one player or village alt would make a trip to wild once a month and the village would have plenty of lump for that month.

also, when designing game features you have to assume that they will be used in the most selfishly possible way, assume that the least generous people will have control of the resources. Also some people use coins as a way to keep score. it doesnt matter how many they have, aquiring more is what makes them feel good and is thier primary goal.

[Guest MrConor]

Also some people use coins as a way to keep score. it doesnt matter how many they have, aquiring more is what makes them feel good and is thier primary goal.

That seems to show how useless money is.

[Wort 67]

It doesn't even take a large village to acquire whatever resources are needed. For most of my time on JK-h, I lived with one other person. As soon as he hit 50 mining, he swam over to wild, opened a mine on the coast and found a 50+ iron vein. From then on, we never had to worry about iron. Localizing the resources on the same server would only make such behavior even easier to do, thusly, there would be no need for a merchant class. Everyone would still be able to get whatever they need on their own.

[Guest QuakeIV]

Technically he pretty much was the merchant class, the community was just so small and close knit, the ore was free.

[Artillery 6]

-1000 again

and again

and again

and again

and again

It's not that hard to become a part of the market, you just have to try, seems like all these suggestions are just to baby those that dont want to even bother with effort. Players should be able to do most everything they want to with some effort.

I shouldnt have to trade with someone for iron, I should be able to prospect and at least find an iron in a 20x20 area. Every resource will end up shared and free for all, nobody ever monopolizes anything unless it's skill based in this game, ever, It just never happens. The only monoply I can think of right now is miggyropetools and Veanswords, both attainable due to their skill. No matter what resources will always be shared in a community, and even on wild, between warring communities.

I can't think of anyone that will go "YOU SHALL NOT PASS" If I ask them for access into their zinc or copper or tin or iron or gold or silver or lead or peat or moss or sand or steppe or water or lemons or grapes... Simply (at least jenn-kellons) have a natural tendency to help one another.

As a matter of fact there is only 3 resources on wild that are fought over that I can think of. Money (for upkeep, not tools or anything) territory, which allows easy access to the third resource: animals (aka fightskill)

If you want to become part of the market, do so. You don't need to have a monopoly. If you want that monopoly work for that monopoly dont ask to have it handed to you on a silver platter. I can list 30 things that Jenn kellon players would pay for right now that I could create and sell on a new character after about 48 hours playtime, you just have to get creative.

I guarantee with monopoly introduced there will be huge griefing on freedom for sure. I can guarantee that if someone has a resource I want I would do something about it. On wild It won't matter, people just share everything. Epic is supposed to be quest based and all that jazz. I don't think anyone will hold a monopoly there.

[Guest MrConor]

-1000 again

and again

and again

and again

and again

It's not that hard to become a part of the market, you just have to try, seems like all these suggestions are just to baby those that dont want to even bother with effort. Players should be able to do most everything they want to with some effort.

I shouldnt have to trade with someone for iron, I should be able to prospect and at least find an iron in a 20x20 area. Every resource will end up shared and free for all, nobody ever monopolizes anything unless it's skill based in this game, ever, It just never happens. The only monoply I can think of right now is miggyropetools and Veanswords, both attainable due to their skill. No matter what resources will always be shared in a

community, and even on wild, between warring communities.

I can't think of anyone that will go "YOU SHALL NOT PASS" If I ask them for access into their zinc or copper or tin or iron or gold or silver or lead or peat or moss or sand or steppe or water or lemons or grapes... Simply (at least jenn-kellons) have a natural tendency to help one another.

As a matter of fact there is only 3 resources on wild that are fought over that I can think of. Money (for upkeep, not tools or anything) territory, which allows easy access to the third resource: animals (aka fightskill)

If you want to become part of the market, do so. You don't need to have a monopoly. If you want that monopoly work for that monopoly dont ask to have it handed to you on a silver platter. I can list 30 things that Jenn kellon players would pay for right now that I could create and sell on a new character after about 48 hours playtime, you just have to get creative.

I guarantee with monopoly introduced there will be huge griefing on freedom for sure. I can guarantee that if someone has a resource I want I would do something about it. On wild It won't matter, people just share everything. Epic is supposed to be quest based and all that jazz. I don't think anyone will hold a monopoly there.

What if the idea is tried on Golden Valley? Maybe to see if it works?

[Ecrir 887]

-1000 again

and again

and again

and again

and again

It's not that hard to become a part of the market, you just have to try, seems like all these suggestions are just to baby those that dont want to even bother with effort. Players should be able to do most everything they want to with some effort.

I shouldnt have to trade with someone for iron, I should be able to prospect and at least find an iron in a 20x20 area. Every resource will end up shared and free for all, nobody ever monopolizes anything unless it's skill based in this game, ever, It just never happens. The only monoply I can think of right now is miggyropetools and Veanswords, both attainable due to their skill. No matter what resources will always be shared in a

community, and even on wild, between warring communities.

I can't think of anyone that will go "YOU SHALL NOT PASS" If I ask them for access into their zinc or copper or tin or iron or gold or silver or lead or peat or moss or sand or steppe or water or lemons or grapes... Simply (at least jenn-kellons) have a natural tendency to help one another.

As a matter of fact there is only 3 resources on wild that are fought over that I can think of. Money (for upkeep, not tools or anything) territory, which allows easy access to the third resource: animals (aka fightskill)

If you want to become part of the market, do so. You don't need to have a monopoly. If you want that monopoly work for that monopoly dont ask to have it handed to you on a silver platter. I can list 30 things that Jenn kellon players would pay for right now that I could create and sell on a new character after about 48 hours playtime, you just have to get creative.

I guarantee with monopoly introduced there will be huge griefing on freedom for sure. I can guarantee that if someone has a resource I want I would do something about it. On wild It won't matter, people just share everything. Epic is supposed to be quest based and all that jazz. I don't think anyone will hold a monopoly there.

What if the idea is tried on Golden Valley? Maybe to see if it works?

people on GV have skills capped on 20, what would you want to test there, normal resources capped at 10 and the regionals being 10+? lol...

People also cannot have deeds there, which would be a very important part in making outposts, GV is the most useless place to test it on. Might just as well add some new stuff that you can make at 90 skill and test it on GV

[Othob Rithol 700]

Then GV becomes even less of an accurate representation of what Wurm is like.

[Guest Robert]

A good thing about the upcoming epic server is that it would be the perfect place to test a regional resource system like this. If it fails like in gold-1, it's no big deal due to the frequent resets. Just a thought...

[Ecrir 887]

A good thing about the upcoming epic server is that it would be the perfect place to test a regional resource system like this. If it fails like in gold-1, it's no big deal due to the frequent resets. Just a thought...

true, but it failed in gold 2 too so why try it again when it has already failed several times?

[Guest MrConor]

A good thing about the upcoming epic server is that it would be the perfect place to test a regional resource system like this. If it fails like in gold-1, it's no big deal due to the frequent resets. Just a thought...

true, but it failed in gold 2 too so why try it again when it has already failed several times?

You mean localized resources have been tested before?

[Aeris 3,764]

Yes MrConor. The veins with QL50+ was a local resource only accessible on Wild. Noone on JK-H had access to it - in theory. In reality everyone had access to the so called local resources. The local veins didn't improve the Wurm economy, even though iron is the most essential resource in Wurm. That's one reason to assume that adding seemingly uninteresting resources wouldn't improve it either. If people didn't buy the most essential resource there is they surely wouldn't buy local furs. ^^

[Guest MrConor]

Yes MrConor. The veins with QL50+ was a local resource only accessible on Wild. Noone on JK-H had access to it - in theory. In reality everyone had access to the so called local resources. The local veins didn't improve the Wurm economy, even though iron is the most essential resource in Wurm. That's one reason to assume that adding seemingly uninteresting resources wouldn't improve it either. If people didn't buy the most essential resource there is they surely wouldn't buy local furs. ^^

Test it with things such as crops and fish at first maybe?

For example one town could grow tons of cotton well, and the area could be very big to allow space for farming.

However areas with fish could have poor soil for crops and be quite small, as well as having few trees or stuff for example.

[Aeris 3,764]

There's not really a big interest for fishing and buying fish though... Afaik sharks are pretty local already and noone is performing big shark business. :s

[Guest MrConor]

There's not really a big interest for fishing and buying fish though... Afaik sharks are pretty local already and noone is performing big shark business. :s

People will find a way, especially if they are mailed and the village imports salt.

[Aeris 3,764]

The mail cost is pretty horrid tbh so I don't think that'd be a big business. I don't think fishes etc are worth much more than 10 copper (which is the mail cost) so people'd have to give away the resources to get rid of them.

[Guest MrConor]

The mail cost is pretty horrid tbh so I don't think that'd be a big business. I don't think fishes etc are worth much more than 10 copper (which is the mail cost) so people'd have to give away the resources to get rid of them.

Maybe farming would work?

[Ecrir 887]

Yes MrConor. The veins with QL50+ was a local resource only accessible on Wild. Noone on JK-H had access to it - in theory. In reality everyone had access to the so called local resources. The local veins didn't improve the Wurm economy, even though iron is the most essential resource in Wurm. That's one reason to assume that adding seemingly uninteresting resources wouldn't improve it either. If people didn't buy the most essential resource there is they surely wouldn't buy local furs. ^^

Test it with things such as crops and fish at first maybe?

For example one town could grow tons of cotton well, and the area could be very big to allow space for farming.

However areas with fish could have poor soil for crops and be quite small, as well as having few trees or stuff for example.

No point in that. Out of all markets the biggest market is no doubt the iron one with all the smithing, since you need tools for everything and almost all of it needs iron, armor needs iron and weapons too. So there we had a test with Iron, the resource that should be in the highest demand out of all resources, and it failed. Why would small things like crops and fish do any better? I would except those two to do far worse, why? Uou really don't NEED high ql crops or fish for anything, you can do everything with low ql crops and fish, while you needed high ql iron in order to compete on the market or to have the best tools. Fish is even local already, the best (biggest) fish are only found at certain spots, but no trade developed.

[Guest MrConor]

Yes MrConor. The veins with QL50+ was a local resource only accessible on Wild. Noone on JK-H had access to it - in theory. In reality everyone had access to the so called local resources. The local veins didn't improve the Wurm economy, even though iron is the most essential resource in Wurm. That's one reason to assume that adding seemingly uninteresting resources wouldn't improve it either. If people didn't buy the most essential resource there is they surely wouldn't buy local furs. ^^

Test it with things such as crops and fish at first maybe?

For example one town could grow tons of cotton well, and the area could be very big to allow space for farming.

However areas with fish could have poor soil for crops and be quite small, as well as having few trees or stuff for example.

No point in that. Out of all markets the biggest market is no doubt the iron one with all the smithing, since you need tools for everything and almost all of it needs iron, armor needs iron and weapons too. So there we had a test with Iron, the resource that should be in the highest demand out of all resources, and it failed. Why would small things like crops and fish do any better? I would except those two to do far worse, why? Uou really don't NEED high ql crops or fish for anything, you can do everything with low ql crops and fish, while you needed high ql iron in order to compete on the market or to have the best tools. Fish is even local already, the best (biggest) fish are only found at certain spots, but no trade developed.

I mean for certain areas to become breadbaskets and others to become cottonopolis.

For example if you grow tons of high QL cotton and wheat what could you do with it?

There could be a town 2km who has massive amounts of iron but no cotton or much farmland.

And there could be areas in which theres so many animals but very litte of much else that will most likely become dotted with a few hunting lodges.

[Ecrir 887]

Yes MrConor. The veins with QL50+ was a local resource only accessible on Wild. Noone on JK-H had access to it - in theory. In reality everyone had access to the so called local resources. The local veins didn't improve the Wurm economy, even though iron is the most essential resource in Wurm. That's one reason to assume that adding seemingly uninteresting resources wouldn't improve it either. If people didn't buy the most essential resource there is they surely wouldn't buy local furs. ^^

Test it with things such as crops and fish at first maybe?

For example one town could grow tons of cotton well, and the area could be very big to allow space for farming.

However areas with fish could have poor soil for crops and be quite small, as well as having few trees or stuff for example.

No point in that. Out of all markets the biggest market is no doubt the iron one with all the smithing, since you need tools for everything and almost all of it needs iron, armor needs iron and weapons too. So there we had a test with Iron, the resource that should be in the highest demand out of all resources, and it failed. Why would small things like crops and fish do any better? I would except those two to do far worse, why? Uou really don't NEED high ql crops or fish for anything, you can do everything with low ql crops and fish, while you needed high ql iron in order to compete on the market or to have the best tools. Fish is even local already, the best (biggest) fish are only found at certain spots, but no trade developed.

I mean for certain areas to become breadbaskets and others to become cottonopolis.

For example if you grow tons of high QL cotton and wheat what could you do with it?

There could be a town 2km who has massive amounts of iron but no cotton or much farmland.

And there could be areas in which theres so many animals but very litte of much else that will most likely become dotted with a few hunting lodges.

If the farmlands give better ql stuff then it won't matter since there is no real demand for high ql farmed stuff, no matter what it is.

If the farmlands are the only place where you can farm then all villages will be based around that and they will have outposts at the iron, just like how villages from the home servers had posts on Wild where they got their resources (either their friends or their own outposts).

If the creatures are all in one area then everybody will go to hunt there and there simply won't be any good hunting due to the amount of people killing stuff there. Food wise it won't matter due to breeding. Same with leather and pelts, can all get that from Breeding.

Food and cotton don't play a very big role in Wurm, the food system is very shallow and needs mayor improving and extending before localized food would even matter.

[Guest MrConor]

Maybe instead of just testing iron a few more resources could be tested as well?

I know iron holds like half the market but a few others could be added to see if they will work too.

And i won't stop posting here and stuff till i find out if it is going to be tried or not.

[Ecrir 887]

Maybe instead of just testing iron a few more resources could be tested as well?

I know iron holds like half the market but a few others could be added to see if they will work too.

And i won't stop posting here and stuff till i find out if it is going to be tried or not.

It has already been tried with Iron and that did not work. Iron indeed holds half the market, if not more, why would it then be worth Rolf's time to try it out with more resources when the most important resource didn't work? I don't see the logic in that, why spend time on something when a very big experiment with it resulted in a failure already? The Iron stuff with wild and home already proves that it doesn't work, that was run for years so it was a very long term experiment too, what more do you want? It has already been tried out.

[qob 0]

I understand mrconor's wish to have an interdependent economy.

It would be really cool to have greater interaction with everyone.

However, wurm crafters tend to be "do it themselfers".

I know I have spent hours grinding up various skill

rather than shell out a few silvers to simply purchase the tools I wanted.

Economically, my actions made no sense, but hey it is a

game and what else was I going to do with all that rested time going to waste.

I suspect I'm not alone.

[EliasTheCrimson 348]

There's not really a big interest for fishing and buying fish though... Afaik sharks are pretty local already and noone is performing big shark business. :s

People will find a way, especially if they are mailed and the village imports salt.

This is what makes the subject fail; Your views and theories on how the market works and how the economy will respond to this and that are idealistic and doesn't reflect the "reality" of Wurm. Hunting lodges? Fish markets? Fur trading? Making the resources associated with this trade isn't gonna magically spark trade that makes these aspects of the game useful.

We already know for fact that most people who wanted iron did went over to Wild and grabbed some. They did not obtain it through a chain of trade for a good coin. Cotton won't be any different. A game mechanic prevents you from farming corn and cotton next do your deed? Plonk your farm deed outside this "magical radius" and park your priest alt on it.