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Rolf

Suggested changes to enclosure and highway rules

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What's the difference between PvE and PvP if on both cases anyone can get on your "property"?

 

You can kill them on PvP. So PvP turns out to be better. :)

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If the legal enclosure rule is to go, I believe that either:


 


Perimeter enclosures should remain protected by the current rules, as many paying customers have done a great deal of work and spent a substantial amount of money in building and maintaining structures in these areas without abusing the rules. Having had to pay for the tiles whether they wanted to or not (via the 5 tile minimum setup) and having to continue to pay for upkeep on these tiles there should be some benefit for them. Previous changes to deed mechanics and the introduction of ratios meant many people were forced into the choice of making legal enclosures in their perimeter or having to cull off months of breeding work. Now we are being told that it will be open slather for folks to knock down walls and take animals / items from them as they are no longer protected by rules (Yes, that is exactly how some people will see this as being intended), or will again be faced with the prospect of having to cull off our animals.


Or


Before this is implemented, zero perimeter deeds be allowed at the same time that a mechanic that allows deeds to be extended in individual compass directions ( ie I can extend my deed just south by 1 tile extra) is implemented, so that people have the opportunity to extend their deeds to cover the areas that were previously protected by this rule set.


 


 


 


Perhaps the enclosure rule does not need to be removed, but rather redefined to stop the abuse - set a maximum amount of tiles that is allowed to be claimed off deed/perimeter, and introduce marker flags that are made and placed (perhaps a new kind of combined lamp/sign) at the corners of a claimed legal enclosure to define it, and have them show the full signature of the maker. Enforce that these "claims" must have a minimum 2 tile border between any other claim to be valid so they can't be adjoined to enclose larger areas. Any account caught claiming multiple areas faces banning. Have these claims protected, not by any form of coding, but by code of conduct and potential banning of griefing accounts.


 


 


 


As someone who has spent $100's of dollars on this game, and with a deed that is over 100 tiles long on one axis, it is costing me a decent amount of money for the 1500 odd tiles of perimeter I am forced to pay for, even though I have only about 200 of those tiles in use for what are currently legal enclosures, one of which is used for breeding Hellhorses without having to turn off my 2 Templars which provide protection for both me and the public roads and tunnels that I have built through my deed (Templars that have been very well used by the new players that have come and gone over the time, several of them settling in to also become paying customers). You have happily taken my money, and I have played within both the rules and (afaik) the intent of those rules, but the ground lately seems to be shifting under my feet way too often.


 


Perhaps it is time for me to check out some of the other sandbox games that are appearing, as I find myself beginning to get very wary about investing more time and money here.


Edited by Delone
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Enclosure rule definitaly needs some tweaking, perhaps a set maximum size for an enclosure and can not be conjoined - a 5x5 max? After that it is no longer protected. Highway rules however, I feel these should stay in place as highways play a very important role on the PvE server for everyone on the entire server.


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REMOVE FREE PLAYERS FROM PAID SERVERS: end the shacks from utopia. Make an island with a city that is all about the LAWS of the land, it may not look mine around the area it's build but, but the city itself can be a beacon of light to what can be made and what is right and wrong way to go about making something you own and control.


COMMUNITY ROADS: make a "corner stone of our effort to make a road system worthy of having. Corner stones have to be made by more than 5 players.

STAY AWAY DECAY: Make more option on things like fence, houses and containers. Ok I only want a house and a small fenced area, so I can open my house write and choice a protection plan for it and objects can be paid to protect, 6 month 1 year plans.

Also the micro managing of the deed itself:

DEED FREEDOM: options to deed in circles because a circle is round not square duh, any patterns can be made, leads way to not deeding water tiles or roads, then we can deed on each side of a road and we don't have to pay for those unwanted or not needed on deed.

FOR THE COMMUNITY: We all play this game and want a fair shake at all it's aspects, just like real we pay tax to keep things we want guarded. If payment options for saving your things are needed then so be it. you buy a house you have to fix anything that breaks, it's up to the owner to maintain these things. Land tax is sometimes overbearing and causes people to hate tax in general, so lets insure what we want, not large area we have no choice but to deed and preserve, so no-one changes what in your eye or mine is beautiful.


The art of writing lay in thrift.

Edited by zalifear

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My questions are this:


  • How many support tickets related to highways do you get per month?
  • How many support tickets related to enclosures do you get per month?
  • How many support tickets for griefing related to these two topics do expect to see per month after the changeover?

Conservatively, I'd wager you'll simply be shuffling numbers from one "pot" to another, and while you'll be able to say the support requests for the first two are reduced, you'll likely gain more than that reduction, for griefing.  I say this because under this change, you'll not even be able to remove the people causing the problems due to there now not being a rule against/protecting from the behavior.  You're basically giving a free pass to those who might want to cause issues for people for any reason (or a complete lack of one).


 


It really makes me wonder what is the underlying need these changes are trying to address.  Because all I can see is making the game harder for new players (not new characters, but fresh faces joining the game for the first time)


 


Yes, the game used to be harder and less forgiving, but the market has changed and catering to a smaller niche of players in a small demographic in this manner is only driving players to be less likely to continue, and ever fewer from joining.  But everytime something is introduced, the level of supporting detail is lacking so we can only shoot into the dark as to how it will actually be implemented.


 


So no matter how it comes out in the wash, I'm willing to bet it fails to meet whatever targets you think it's driving to, but that's just my opinion.


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As someone who spent as a noob 6 months in an enclosure before getting premium and 6 more months to move from my off-deed farm to my already completed deed I have to state that I'm against the removal of the enclosure rule. Allowing people on Freedom to use force against others (in some cases the victim will have to spend a lot of time to repair the damage done) and still having the game code to protect them from repercussions is at least unfair.  


 


I can't think of any way to replace the newbie-protection effect of enclosures but I think that there could be a way to revisit the way that legal enclosures work. It would need quite a lot of work to be implemented though.


 


1. update the enclosure rules* and standardize them in order to make it possible to make an in-game tool that would allow players to register such enclosures.


2. Make it so that the gates do not allow anyone but the owner of the enclosure to get in. This will make the use of f2p alts to make multiple enclosures.


3. Make the tool to register enclosures.


 


*


a. Area restriction


b. an enclosure is personal, no alts or anyone else can enter through the gates. While newbies won't be able to create a valid shared legal enclosure it will still be better than having completely no protection for their assets.


c. no fences/walls shared with other enclosures


d. adjacent enclosures can have a minimum distance of 1 tile. If someone decides to connect enclosures the connecting fences are NOT considered part of any enclosure and can be bashed.


e. The registration creates a parent enclosure-writ containing all the writs of the buildings in it. It also offers a "release" option that deletes the enclosure writ and the enclosures ceases to be considered a legal one. "Releasing" activates a cooldown before allowing the player to register a new legal enclosure so that this feature cannot be used to bypass rule b.


f. They cannot contain open mine tunnels as they can be used to bypass b, if they have a door only the owner of the enclosure can use it.


g. The owner is NOT allowed to bash a wall (as a non premium he wouldn't be able to this anyway) unless a better solution is found that would prevent him from bashing a low ql fence and rebuilding it to bypass rule b.


 


Destruction of registered enclosures:


Fences/walls have an enclosure id. if someone tries to bash it, there is a check about the integrity of the enclosure and its ownership. if it passes the enclosure is still valid the action is not allowed. If a catapult or Wrath of Magranon is used the protected fences remain unaffected (off deed houses on Freedom can't be destroyed with a catapult).


Once a fence or a house wall is destroyed by decay OR by the owner of the enclosure an enclosure-integrity-check is run and if it doesn't pass the check the enclosure is marked as invalid and the records for the legal enclosure can be deleted. The owner of the enclosure needs to register the enclosure again if he repairs it.


 


 


Last but not least: A course about enclosure registration should be added in the tutorial otherwise it will be only the old players who will be using the feature :P.


Edited by Anothernoob

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Get rid of the enclosure rule but for newbies only allow them to:

 

  • Plan up to 20 fence or wall sections that cannot be bashed just like their house cannot be broken into.
  • Make it so the house and fences/walls that cannot be bashed only last for 30 days and after that they disappear instantly.
  • Do not allow unbashable fences/walls to be made in perimeter just like houses.

 

To avoid abuse:

  • These fences/walls must attach to the newbie's house and cannot have gaps. It must be continuous and connecting from the house and back to the house.
  • Do not allow making one unbashable fence/wall here or there.
  • Do not allow other unbashable fences/walls from one player to connect to another players unbashable fence/walls.
  • After the 30 days unbashable walls/fences are no longer available.

 

This gives the new player time to see if Wurm is for them and have some security. They will eventually have to buy a deed or join a deed for real security but this will give them a temporary shelter.

 

 

Remove the road protection rule. Let the players work it out among themselves but change the mechanics of it like this:

 

  • No matter what the tile is (cobblestone or slab etc.) allow the player during the creation of the paved tile to choose to designate the tile as a road. To do this the player must have a certain amount of paving skill. In doing this the mechanic should not allow anyone to build anything on the road tiles. Also this will allow roads to be one, two, three or however many tiles wide the player wants them to be. There is no reason for a different looking tile or to have a marker. If you go to build on or remove the tile a message will pop up in the event tab explaining it is a road tile. 
  • A certain amount of paving skill should allow a player to remove a road tile too. 
  • If someone deeds over an existing road they can remove the road without any paving skill.

The road drama will always be there so if freeing up the GMs time is the main priority it will have to be done by letting the players do it or by game mechanics or both. 

 

Good luck!

 

Q
 

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ok, please take a good look at this, because it is simple and clear for everyone and it is easy to implement, because most of it is already there. It doesn't require any GM interaction, as it simply will no longer be possible to grief. The game can handle this automatically.


 


Enclosures as Writs


 


Use the Writ system to make yards. simplest solution wouly to just copy house writs for yard writs, but I'd like to propose something slightly more elaborate:


 


Alternate standart writs to have both inside and outside tiles. This could be also a chance to clean up the weird ruling here, a room without a roof is not considered inside by my book.


(this also gives the opportunity to have dirt floors in outside areas in higher stories and have a "green roof")


 


Those outside writs/areas would fullfill the same purpose as enclosures do now. Writs are unbreakable without permision, so require no GMs to enforce. There is no question as to what is an enclosure and what not. Of course there needs to be a sensible solution to limit size.


 


Highways as Heritage sites


 


The biggest problem with highways is that they are automatically defined, which causes so many issues for players. So I say, no road is  considered a highway until it is specifically applied and approved as a higway herritage side.


 


Also to protect heritage sides (including highways) better without GM intervention, use the writs again: Make a ground or heritage writ that can only be created and adjusted by GMs. It can then be given to players that request permission to alter the area.


Edited by Keldun
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Can't really be bothered to read all the posts here, just want to state my opinion:

Getting rid of highway rules and enclosure rules, and replacing them with some in-game mechanic is a good idea.

With a (hopefully) growing playerbase, it is best for GMs to concentrate on helping people stuck due to game bugs, rather than being judge and jury in gray area rule situations.

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I would suggest taking a slower simpler route. instead of of removing both and waiting to see what happens start by modifying them.


 


Redefine legal enclosures to those that are on perimeter,  or add fence protection for perim to deed form.


Add terraforming and mining protection for perim to deed form, in my case i would likely remove perim fences from 2 40x40 areas.


Give new players a presized 60 day deed form that includes basic protections, we need a strong ftp player base that stays long enough to get hooked, a great many of us wouldnt be here if gv hadnt given us that, wurm has no stronger recruiter than ftp.


Leave roads connecting deeds protected, but insist that deed permision is required to build closer than 10 tiles to any perim, unless it prevents access to another deed.


Many of the arguements i have seen were over the stripping of dirt from someones area, especially on the smaller servers. So add better ways to get dirt, suggest deeper limit to dredging, and dirt named rubble created from rock shards.


After 6 months or a year modify as needed.


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>>>>>>This post is made as a player, not as a member of staff<<<<<<


 


 


A potential solution to enclosures might be to use the existing deed mechanics but not allow any options. The intent of an enclosure was to give players a place to live that let them secure from harassment in a small zone and try out farming, keep an animal or two, etc. It was mainly targeted at free players new to the game, but personally i dont have any issue with older players using them to live if they want.  you would never get me to give up my decay free deed however, repairing fences and carrying my own light is boring.


 


anyhow:


 


--------------------------


 


What if any player could right click on the ground, his body, a daffodil... something anyhow, and get the option to place a homestead deed.  everything about it would be pre-determined ahead of time.


 


My personal opinion is that it should be the same size as a minimum size deed, (eg 11x11 with 5 tiles of perimeter all around) just to keep it using the exact same mechanics as a deed, and allowing players to use a settlement form on it at a later time to upgrade to a regular deed. It would  use the same planting rules as a normal deed as well, eg must own all houses covered by it, cannot place over existing deeded land... etc.


 


only the owner could do anything on the central (11x11 or whatever) land: build, bash, farm, dig, etc. basically the normal deed settings all force locked to "mayor only"


anyone could pick up items on the ground however. it prevents bashing and lockpicking, but you still have to take the effort to put your things away.


It would have no gaurds.


It would have no decay prevention, no autolighting lamps, and no respawning. 


It would only be able to have one citizen, the owner.


it would be able to join alliances, but not found them, and allies would have zero permissions on it.


 


The owner would not be able to belong to any other deed or homestead. (tho you could remove the homestead and place it elsewhere with a suitable cooldown (maybe 7 days) if you wanted


 


If the owner did not log in and right click on the token to use a reset option once every 14 days(longer, i think thats long enough myself..., shorter? maybe, not too short tho, people have real lives), it would disband and the claim to the land would be gone, any fences would remain, but no longer be protected by game mechanics or rules, and of course writs would still act like any other writ.


 


these could not be traded back and forth.


 


------------------------------------------------


 


This would allow game mechanics to prevent access to the area, force a set limit on the size, provide a pretty simple and straightforward method for making sure the land is still in regular use, and allow for the area to be easily changed into a normal paid deed at a later time if the owner desires. The lack of ability to add others to the land, or to allow allies to use the land keeps abuse mostly in check i believe. 


 


The ideas in this post are not completely my own, and have been condensed down from several other discussions that have been had over the years.


 


>>>>>>This post is made as a player, not as a member of staff<<<<<<


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That sounds like a reasonable idea, Spellcast.

Is this also valid for f2p players, and if yes, wouldn't it be abusable? (to harass others etc.)

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it would be valid for f2p, and it shouldn't be any more ab-usable than the current enclosure rules really. 


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Spellcast,


 


I like the idea of a "template" style homestead to replace enclosures.  Maybe take it a step further and template the structure as well so that when you see it, you know it is a homestead?


 


Basically you craft the individual parts, drop an unfinished framework and add the parts to it to complete it?


 


The player gets a protected space, but is limited in all aspects (preset number of floors as well as tile space).  If they want/need more, replace it with a deed.


Edited by Hussars

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Enclosure:

Revise how deed paper works. Give deed paper for free, minimum size 1x1 (makes 3x3 tiles), give the paper 6500 irons (enough for 5x5 for three days). Teach the newbies how to use this deed paper and sell function. This deed paper only granted the first time player enter a pve server and won't travel to pvp server. Remove 5 tiles free perimeter thing cause it sucks.

I like the concept of this but to not be abused it needs more. It needs to have a perimeter of 1, this would mean that there would be 2 tiles between every "claim" so folks can walk around them. It needs to have a maximum days before it dissolves. If not I could make 10 freebie alts and hold "prime" locations forever.

 

Just make it so no one can terraform/build off deed then add a new newbie plot somehow..my suggestion would be timed as it is meant to be a trial after all. Then cut off all terraforming/building in off deed areas completely. I guess you can extend it for the perimeters but all else is off limits unless on clay/tar..etc  

 

This will leave only the natural land and you just find your own way around in the grass or maybe allow roads be build by the GMs after an area vote on them or something.  This would stop all the griefing..all the road wars..all the enclosure problems if you "own" the land do what you want if not then you can't do anything but gather resources. 

 

I know it won't be the popular choice but that is my thoughts on it anyway and how most of the other sandbox/building games handle it.

That is Landmark right there that you are talking about and it's why I requested a return of my 99.00 founder buy in.

My thoughts.

Enclosure rules: I can agree that they take a lot of GM time. I can also agree that they are not always enforced uniformly. I like the idea of a newbie stake or claim that is like a mini deed. That last only x amount of days at creation but can be funded up to say 30 days. If your still playing in 30 days then you should be ready to move on. It needs to be pretty small. A minimal sized deed is currently 5x5 tiles (makes 11x11) with a perimeter around it of 5. A claim could be 1x1 (3x3 tiles = 9 total tiles), 2x2 (5x5 = 25 total tiles) max of 3x3 (7x7 = 49 total tiles) with a perimeter of 1. the 49 total tiles could be to large as that is big enough that a player might not feel the need to move on and then would be upset at the end of 30 days because they have made a home and now it's going to poof. This isn't a prefect solution, sadly I don't know if there is a prefect solution. It's hard to balance new players vs old land grabbers like me.

 

Deeds and Perimeters:

We should be able to reduce our perimeters to 1 as a minimum, so that we can expand deeds that are currently locked and capture that area to use as part of our deeds. Currently houses by non villagers can not be built in perimeters that should be expanded to included paving, fences and hedges. I would also love to be able to expand deeds in one direction only.

 

Highways:

I love highways and I've made more then my fair share of them. I'm sure that there will be some grief (tit for tat behavior) instances with the removal of it. But as a seasoned player I don't really need them, I go cross country a lot. roads are just nice to have a path to help to get from point a to point b, to use as land marks. But for the newer player highways are a must. Maybe we can do some heritage highways that are gm protected. On Pristine the East/West highway would be a candidate for GM protection. I can see both sides of the coin here. I've seen some good idea tossed around. Hopefully there is a solution to balance keeping paths open for easy access to parts of our islands if wanted vs, waking up and there is a highway in your perimeter.

 

->My thoughts are my own and do not represent Club Code AB<-

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I had proposed this a very long time ago and Ill propose it again as I see a lot of people proposing nearly the same thing or variants on it. If New people are needing a safe grief free area to setup and try the game  just let new toons have a 20 to 30 day temp deed.  The deed is limited in size and will only last x amount of time. Its a one shot item and allows them to try out the game harassment free during this time frame. If they choose to prem up and get a real settlement form they can then transfer the new settlement form to the temp deed and make it a real deed. If they choose not to and the temp deed is abandoned and no action has been made to make the temp deed a real one then all contents within that temp deed are instantly removed.

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Spellcast,

 

I like the idea of a "template" style homestead to replace enclosures.  Maybe take it a step further and template the structure as well so that when you see it, you know it is a homestead?

 

Basically you craft the individual parts, drop an unfinished framework and add the parts to it to complete it?

 

The player gets a protected space, but is limited in all aspects (preset number of floors as well as tile space).  If they want/need more, replace it with a deed.

 

I dislike tying in template buildings, for the simple fact that it requires more code really. perhaps include a limit to the homestead option so that a player placing one cannot do so over a writ someone with his/her skills would be unable to make, but to be honest, the way i laid it out was with the intent of just having the current deed system generate a bunch of pre-filled settings. The only new thing in it is the need to check in at the homestead every so often to keep it intact. 

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I dislike tying in template buildings, for the simple fact that it requires more code really. perhaps include a limit to the homestead option so that a player placing one cannot do so over a writ someone with his/her skills would be unable to make, but to be honest, the way i laid it out was with the intent of just having the current deed system generate a bunch of pre-filled settings. The only new thing in it is the need to check in at the homestead every so often to keep it intact. 

TBH there should be nothing in game remotely like a deed that lasts for awhile if you keep up with it. At the very least a short term hold on land to show them the game but not able to abuse it.

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Im beginning to think Rolf only cares about the money these days... 


First he raising the price of silver and guess what... the population of Wurm plummets, now hes trying to force people to buy more deeds? Theres plenty of people talking about quitting again. Cheers Rolf, way to stick it to those who have stayed loyal. I wouldnt be surprised if this new server is just another poor attempt to gain money and try to retain some of the players hes about to alienate.


 


Rolfs so out of touch with the player base its unreal...


At this rate he'll abandon Wurm all together due to lack of players and money.


Edited by Crack
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Just on the side I'll show a bigger issue rather than Legal Enclosures worked every day to other legal enclosures big and small.


 


I see a ton of deed's and legal enclosures that are owned by players who barley play on indy can't speak for other servers cause I'm a indy server guy only. But on these deeds and enclosures they never hardly ever are logged in and only log in long enuff to pay premium on the deeded and to replace enclosure walls on the enclosures. These are people who play on epic and rarly ever show there face on the freedom servers. These are land hogs as well cause they are taking up virtual space they don't use. I have a neighbor who hasn't logged in beside me for the past 6 months now and the last time he logged in was only for a few days and before that it was like another 6 months of not logging in. This person also has a epic portal on there deed so I assume they are on epic playing a lot but land mass is taken on indy as well. Also a few blocks down the road another epic portal and I never see anyone at this place yet it's been there for over 2 years now since I moved in the area and it has a small deed and tons of blocked of land surrounding it way past a perimeter. There are even more like this all over indy. People have hard time finding land cause people are taking claims and playing on other servers.


 


I don't mind Enclosures as long as these people log in a lot and play. I think what legal enclosures most people complain about is the huge empty land masses with 1 to 4 buildings and these that they never see there neighbors log in yet there walls never come down. Simply cause they come over long enough to repair then they leave again.


 


Sometimes I think it would be better if you couldn't travel to other servers and where only allowed to have 1 account per email. yes people would make extra emails but over time it could become a hassle for them. But removing travel to other places would hurt wurm. So I have a bigger solution that would help out on the load. If you play on epic you can't play on Freedom same goes for Chaos. We have a lot of Chaos players who play in safety on freedom servers then go to chaos. So basically Freedom servers are now a crutch sort of a cheat for PVP. You should be made to have to earn your skills on Chaos just like Epic has to earn there skills on Epic cluster. Make the chaos server like Epic where the avatar is separate from there Freedom Avatar. If this was to be implemented you can give the Chaos player a chose to make there existing Avatar Chaos or freedom and then the other would be set to noob status.


 


Epic can't use Freedom as a crutch so neither should Chaos.


 


There is just a lot wrong with the system in general but Legal enclosures used by active every day players isn't the real issue and we players should never be punished for people who exploit it. Which is what I see getting ready to happen.


 


But Still with all this I've mentioned I still see massive vacant land all over Indy. Why are we really having issues with land and Enclosures? Could it be jealousy? Could it be people have no real way of finding Vacant land area's? Could it be PVP influence where people want a reason to Invade and take others stuff and hard work for there own raiding pleasure? I can keep going but I think I listed the top reasons.


 


Not everyone want's to join a village. I my self loved that about wurm I was able to go survive on my own wing it and learn at my own pace.


 


Roads as far as I can tell had a good rule already. I do believe you need to make it known in the tutorial very good that major highways should not be deeded on and if you have to deed on it you can't tear them down but you could raise and lower them and if you add gates the gates could never be locked or they Would be removed by a GM if found locked. You could make a new Tile that is called major highway and players could use this specific tile to mark major highways and if you put them on your property well then you have to follow the rules and allow them to be passable and could never lock them up. So if you don't want your private roads public never use the major highway tile. Or you could have Gm's have the ability to place this type of tile and make them unable to move or be altered like on test server. Then if someone wants to make a highway threw there deed they can send in a ticket and it could be placed on a list to be done at some point by a GM. You could have neighbors of a surrounding area all sign a petition that it's ok that the road near them can be a major highway then a GM could come and make it so. Over time this would stop road issues seeing only a GM would be able to alter said tiles cause they would have the same mechanics as GM tiles on test server.


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I dislike tying in template buildings, for the simple fact that it requires more code really. perhaps include a limit to the homestead option so that a player placing one cannot do so over a writ someone with his/her skills would be unable to make, but to be honest, the way i laid it out was with the intent of just having the current deed system generate a bunch of pre-filled settings. The only new thing in it is the need to check in at the homestead every so often to keep it intact. 

 

Just feels like part of the issue is in helping promote converting to deeds as well as protecting f2p players in some manner.  Maybe have the check when trying to add a floor above, if on this type of homestead/deed, disallow it?  Otherwise where you had folks with wide land grabs/buildings, you'll now have vertical.

 

Is why I asked earlier what is the actual problem the team is trying to address, because suggestions might actually be counter to the real issue.

 

If the problem is due to protected enclosures blocking paid-for deeds, none of the suggestions solve that problem.

 

If the problem is enclosures being used to bypass the need to deed, the replacement should limit the usefulness as much as possible while still being at least useful for new or f2p players.

 

In either case, removing the enclosure rule won't reduce the support ticket volume.. just redirect it from one source to another.

Edited by Hussars

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Keldun - By George, I think you're on to something! A writ for an enclosure and a GM managed writ for important roads.

Enclosures - we all need them for something - that's why we build them. I believe the issue is some are way too big and hog land as I'm sure no one can complain about a series of connected 1x1's for breeding animals using too much land. Getting rid of enclosures and leaving them unprotected means lots of horse thieves in the near future (I just might be one of them). Creating Enclosure Writs with size (number of enclosed tiles based on a certain skill lvl or combination of skills makes good sense - no one can build a house bigger than 32 tiles and enclosures should have similar limits. If you need more land, build more, based on your skill.

Roads - I personally think there're too many of them, but at the same time I believe some are important enough to be protected. Need some thought on the decision process on how a road section gets on the protected list, but the actual coding mechanism protecting them should be a GM or at least a CA managed writ. Some set of guidelines as to who can get user permissions to change the road need to be thought out, but that shouldn't be to hard to come up with. I liked the idea of Toll roads, but noobs are the ones that hurts most as they won't be able to afford the travel (multiple times as they die often) so that may not be the way to protect roads.

Overall getting rid of the enclosures and road protections without replacing them with some other mechanism will definitely spawn a lot of folks destroying and stealing because they can with out penalty - I have my eye on a few places already . . .

Lastly I want to thank you sincerely for giving the one month notice regardless of what the end solution is - this definitely shows a maturing of the game

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Having read both Rolf's stated intent of enclosures and Rosedragons suggestion of a special deed type i would like to propose what i think is a very good solution that would be easily implemented.


 


I suggest a very basic deed type that is granted free with first premium with the other perks (let's be honest this is NOT a f2p game). The form could be tied directly to the character and create a small (maybe 5x5 (25 tiles) with 1 tile perimeter) that is free of upkeep but only grants bashing and pickup protections as well as preventing hostile mob spawns. No templars or other deed benefits. It could take the space on a character normally filled by a settlement form so that if the player later creates a legit deed or joins a settlement the enclosure would be disbanded. It could be tied to the mayors premium so that if that lapses the enclosure rights also vanish. Having the bashing and pickup permissions set up like existing deed roles would also let people get familiar with deed management to a limited degree.


 


I think that an area this size would be perfect for a new player to have a secure area to get started in without fear of theft and murder, yet still be small enough that few would want to live there forever (especially with no templar etc.). By tying it to active premium it prevents (or at least restricts) the use of hundreds of f2p alts to spam enclosures or grief with them. The mayor would at a minimum have to pay prem or have the enclosure vanish (this prevents unused 'homesteads' from hanging around forever).


 


With that out of the way i would also like to offer thoughts on the removal of highway protections. Highways are crucial to trade and any sort of actual community where people travel to other deeds, use markets, etc. Just flat removing protection for highways is absolutely foolhardy and WILL result in endless chaos and griefing. I liked the idea of a special tile type that is untouchable once placed. Perhaps it could be made so that a player puts in a ticket to have a highway approved and then the cobble tiles or whatever are converted to the special type. I don't think these tiles should be craftable since a permanent tile could be used for griefing if they could be just be made and placed at will. Maybe GM approval would allow the petitioner the temporary ability to craft and place these tiles. Maybe approval could also require the consent of any mayor who's perimeter the road would pass through.


 


Finally i would like to state that i think the existing perimeter system is terrible. I am forced to pay for tiles that i have virtually no control over. It also allows the hogging of vast amounts of land at 10% of the cost of deed tiles thus contributing to overcrowding. I would suggest that perimeter be reduced to a flat 1 tile with no option to increase the size and no upkeep cost. If you want the land then deed the land and pay for it, period. The only reason i concede that a 1 tile perimeter be in place is that it prevents disputes over who owns a border where 2 deeds actually touch. It is wide enough for a proper road but only a citizen of one of the 2 involved deeds could build structures in it without express build permissions from one of the involved mayors.


Edited by Ghoulio
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