PvP characters collision detection

[vill 248]

I ' d like to suggest introducing characters collision detection for Wurm PvP I know that won't be easy to develop because of tiles system but...

 

 

Players/mounts collision detection would be very beneficial for PvP: 

• No more one tile zerg (30 players on one tile)
  
• Easier targeting
  
• More intense fights in narrow areas/mines/buildings
  
• Flanking
  
• Defending formations, no more passing by players
  
• Archers profession would be more important for example because of wall of players defending them
  

 

 

In my opinion Players collision would introduce new fresh air to Wurm PvP.

Anyway during DEV Q&A Rolf said next big update maybe be regarding combat with high priority so it is worth considering.

Edited March 10, 2014 by vill

[Elen 1,013]

+1 for shieldwall formation

Edited March 10, 2014 by Elen

[Joemog 732]

-1

Would suck with the delays and positioning errors.

[Rakki 429]

pretty sure its close to impossible to get to work smoothly

[Druidnature 1,118]

Yeah... This wouldn't work, with the current ~2 second lag between seeing players move (infact thinks it's more like 4?) this would in no way work to be beneficial. Now, once (if ever) that gets improved, this would be a great idea. But not until then.

[vill 248]

Yeah... This wouldn't work, with the current ~2 second lag between seeing players move (infact thinks it's more like 4?) this would in no way work to be beneficial. Now, once (if ever) that gets improved, this would be a great idea. But not until then.

 

It is high time to finally fix it ;-)

[viruskiller 105]

to get that kind of thing we need movement updates to be done atleast every 20 ms, with the current player numbers that would require a lot of bandwidth and server power.

  until wurm gets to be a succesful application with lots of extra income this would be imposible to do right.

  in fact many games failed at player vs player collision, and those had just max 16 players on a map that is like 10 times smaller than a small wurm map.

 

 

Edit: I'd rather they spend that time to:

   - fix mine wall collision so u don't get dehorsed, get cart stuck/loose horses.

   - fix mine entrance side wall climbing, currently if u enter a mine by jumping from the side u are able to get out by bumping into the side walls, that pretty much cancels the option to block someone just by having a wall in front.

   - fix horses getting stuck in corners of house walls.

   - fix non swimming animals getting stuck in water deeper than they can travel.

   - fix boats getting stuck above mine entrances when lagging/going too fast.

   

 

 as u can see there is lots of collision problems in wurm. all caused by the slow update time that the server can handle.

   a fix to all this would be the ability to reverse the actions when server detects a collision.

  

 like if server detects that the player hit a mine wall and went behind it it should reset the player+mount position back next to the wall.

       if a horse got dragged in deep water reset it to the last position where it was able to walk away from.

       the list can go on this way.

  this fixes will look like a rubber band but atleast ppl won't have to spend time getting unstuck.

 

 iif we apply this theory to pvp then u can imagine where it goes.

Edited March 10, 2014 by viruskiller

[vill 248]

Yes but some where successful in this matter like Darkfall 1.0 which easily handle  300vs300 in real time FPS game   so it is not impossible.

[Orb 259]

This wouldn't work, would cause more lag and cluster. Just imagine trying to fit collision detection with horses (since that's how most pvp happens.)

[Rathgar 959]

-1

[vill 248]

Never say "never".

This game had 0 animations 1.5 year ago ;-)

[Eyesgood 2,121]

I think if just about every other MMO on the planet can implement player collisions, I see no reason why Wurm can't have it.

[Revelation 288]

Yes but some where successful in this matter like Darkfall 1.0 which easily handle  300vs300 in real time FPS game   so it is not impossible.

 

2 different games, 2 different engines.

 

It's not a clear cut case of X game did this why can't game Y? Darkfall didn't have terrain deformation or real player housing, want to take a guess how long it would have taken them to code that in assuming it was even possible?

[vill 248]

2 different games, 2 different engines.

 

It's not a clear cut case of X game did this why can't game Y? Darkfall didn't have terrain deformation or real player housing, want to take a guess how long it would have taken them to code that in assuming it was even possible?

 

That is question to DEV's I would say      but such feature would take Wurm Combat into 21 century ;-) 

[Stonesolid 159]

I think Rolf mentioned this being possible on IRC? Would be nice.

 

+1

[Hussars 511]

Could it be done, likely, should it be done.. not so sure.

 

I can see a very easy ability for this type of collision to go very wrong just as easily for it to be beneficial, like how a small number of people could effectively hold off a larger force using doorways, mine entrances etc... (up to the individual as to if this is a good or bad thing)

 

This is one of those changes that would likely require a lot of secondary re-balancing as part of the process, because of things like the CR "nerf", "ganking" bonuses, basic combat system (would these bodies now block melee and/or range attacks as well as movement, or just movement) just to name a few.

 

Granted, some of these thing people already want to see changed, so it might be a way to get those changes done easier as well.

[Stonesolid 159]

Could it be done, likely, should it be done.. not so sure.

 

I can see a very easy ability for this type of collision to go very wrong just as easily for it to be beneficial, like how a small number of people could effectively hold off a larger force using doorways, mine entrances etc... (up to the individual as to if this is a good or bad thing)

 

This is one of those changes that would likely require a lot of secondary re-balancing as part of the process, because of things like the CR "nerf", "ganking" bonuses, basic combat system (would these bodies now block melee and/or range attacks as well as movement, or just movement) just to name a few.

 

Granted, some of these thing people already want to see changed, so it might be a way to get those changes done easier as well.

Maybe flagged only on pvp servers to prevent griefing. Then if people are in your way you kill them. I just imagine blocking off a big group with a couple of people in a mine while priests lay down the law. Would create a whole new tactical aspect to the game. (Also you could scream "YOU SHALL NOT PASS" and actually mean it.)

[Elen 1,013]

I want to believe !

[tedix 42]

+1

This is hard to do but this isnt any excuse not to do it, this game needs a lot of performance tweaks either way.

[Issle 793]

Would be nice to see what happens when two people push each other. Maybe the one with more strength should be able to push the other back ?

 

Also I don't think its hard to do nor that much more resource intensive than movement currently is.

Edited March 10, 2014 by Issle

[Rathgar 959]

Would be nice to see what happens when two people push each other. Maybe the one with more strength should be able to push the other back ?

 

Also I don't think its hard to do nor that much more resource intensive than movement currently is.

 

I know what happens, they lag, clip into eachother and then insta-death, or stuck untill suicide or GM intervention.

[Telvanni 185]

Eh +0

 

Don't get me wrong, I would love for this to happen. Having a small number people defend a narrow pass(door/gate etc) against 3x+ their numbers is very realistic. Just look at some historical battles, obviously the battle of Thermopylae is the major one that comes to mind, or perhaps the last roman stand against Boudicca, otherwise known as the Battle of Watling Street. Where the Romans backed themselves against a defile with dense woods on either side of them so her army had to funnel, with the Romans superior training and the Briton's lack of open field combat experience they were able to defeat a number nearing 10x+ theirs.

 

But it just doesn't seem very feasible with the current system the devs have. Perhaps one day when our movements are registered with 20ms as DV said. But it would cause WAY too many problems as is, think about it, what if two players walked into the exact position at the same time and then 4 seconds later the servers recognized the position change and they are inside of eachother, I know that the collision detection can force them apart as a fix but just think what that would do to PVP. Not worth the troubles.

[Issle 793]

Why does everyone think wurm can't support this ? Don't underestimate the wurm software datarate capabilities ... 

Edited March 10, 2014 by Issle

[Druidnature 1,118]

Why does everyone think wurm can't support this ? Don't underestimate the wurm software datarate capabilities ...

Someone had to much to drink.

[Issle 793]

I'm sober