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JDBooker

Good old surface mining.

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We all know surface mining is a nightmare.


i get maybe 1 success in 50, then 2 on one go, it's so crazy even RNG and Wogic doesn't seem to apply.


and i'm wearing through pickaxes faster than a small child through chocolate.


 


So i suggest, in the same way that you can remove reinforced blocks, only on deed and only as mayor, that we have the same rights. 100% success ratio in surface mining, but only forthe mayore and only on deed itself, i'm not even asking for perimiter.


...even a guaranteed 50%, two hits per unit.


doesn't seem too unreasonable.


 


any comments??


 


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I thought surface mining = 1 rock every 6 actions or something? I can't remember its been ages since I did it.
I think it should be reformed somewhat though, its way to slow as it is now. People end up raising everything to the highest point instead of making the best looking land, just to get out of surface mining.

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if it was 1 in 6 then i'd understand. but it's complete ly random and ifyou happen to have a bad RNG then you're stuffed.


another example is i've been 20days now without a single meditation tick. words like "unfair" and "quit" starting to enter my head.


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Alex, that is somewhat correct, on the long run average. It's not that random to be honest. But no, no for the idea, this would literally mean that the mountains go up in smoke in no time. 


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if it was 1 in 6 then i'd understand. but it's complete ly random and ifyou happen to have a bad RNG then you're stuffed.

another example is i've been 20days now without a single meditation tick. words like "unfair" and "quit" starting to enter my head.

and that is why I just don't bother surface mining anymore. it was hard because I'm a perfectionist and I couldn't have my land the way I wanted it, but it was good for my sanity lol.

 

Alex, that is somewhat correct, on the long run average. It's not that random to be honest. But no, no for the idea, this would literally mean that the mountains go up in smoke in no time.

 

Yeah that thought entered my head after I posted it, any reform would have to protect the mountains from just being flattened.

 

Edited by AlexLong

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I dunno what people have with the RNG, it can be annoying whe you have to only get rid of one or two slope and the damn thing just won't hit, but once you do a couple more you notice that it hardly matters. The climbing and dirt blocking at the edges is far more troublesome to me.


 


And it actually fits with real rock mingin, you chip away at the rock and suddenly a large chunk breaks loose.


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Alex, that is somewhat correct, on the long run average. It's not that random to be honest. But no, no for the idea, this would literally mean that the mountains go up in smoke in no time. 

Even if it was 1 minning per attempt, peopel wouldn't just flatten mountains, its still A LOT of rock to go through, plus mines would prevent them from doing so.

In the end this boils down to the same crap. People don't want to change things because they're "afraid" it gets too easy. But they forget the thing they truly should fear. Which is that wurm starts getting true competition, and ends up closed.

 

I mean other day in these verey forums i found out a game that apparently is wurm, but with everythign wurm lacks, and instead of monthly subscripstions is B2P. So basically if it comes to uphold its potential wurm has no chance.

So yes, lets all keep wurm player unfriendly, and then have it crumble beneath our feet.

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Yeah that thought entered my head after I posted it, any reform would have to protect the mountains from just being flattened.

 

This topic has run around in circles so many times in this forum.

Surface mining actions need to be more frequent. Making/obtaining concrete needs to be easier.

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one day surfacemining


94ql pickaxe to 91ql, also lost 88woa to 82 o.O


Had only mined about 330rocks.


 


Usually I get a lot better chances


 


It does need some kind of attention. Not makin it 80% chance, but even 5-10% is a lot difference, as on making rares.


Edited by silakka

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. it was hard because I'm a perfectionist and I couldn't have my land the way I wanted it, 

Sure you can. You check the slope, you mine, and once you get down to within 2-3 slope, you carefully watch your mine actions, and cancel once you hit the right slope. It takes a little focus once you get almost done, but it is by no means difficult, just slow. 

 

 

 

And it actually fits with real rock mingin, you chip away at the rock and suddenly a large chunk breaks loose.

First, it's inconsistent with other mining in Wurm, where every action yields a second piece of rock. Second, in terms of 'real rock mining', that is completely subjective based on the type of rock you are mining through, but even with real mining with a pickaxe, there is control, not nearly as much randomness. 

As for the chance, it has seemed to be about 20% to me, over the course of the 25k~ rock shard surface mining project I did recently.

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Rock is rock, shouldn't be easy to alter, not even on-deed. Let it stay as it is. Also leaves certain area's to place a deed for those determined and skilled enough to settle on. 


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Sure you can. You check the slope, you mine, and once you get down to within 2-3 slope, you carefully watch your mine actions, and cancel once you hit the right slope. It takes a little focus once you get almost done, but it is by no means difficult, just slow. 

 

First, it's inconsistent with other mining in Wurm, where every action yields a second piece of rock. Second, in terms of 'real rock mining', that is completely subjective based on the type of rock you are mining through, but even with real mining with a pickaxe, there is control, not nearly as much randomness. 

As for the chance, it has seemed to be about 20% to me, over the course of the 25k~ rock shard surface mining project I did recently.

Never said it was hard, just slow. its great if you want to remove a cpl of slope, but if you have multiply tiles have fun. its going to take a long time to get everything the way you want it, its faster to raise, way way faster - even if you have to collect the dirt yourself.

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I've done a fair amount of surface mining, however nothing crazy like I've seen on some deeds, but it never felt nearly as slow are as low a chance of success as some here are saying. I've always felt the chance to lower rock was around 25%.


 


I think the problem actually comes about due to the dissonance between surface mining and cave mining.


Cave mining is by far the more common form of mining, so it's natural that we get accustomed to getting a drop for every action.


Having them differ mechanically as radically as they do is just bad game design, but that doesn't mean that surface mining is broken.


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I thought surface mining = 1 rock every 6 actions or something? I can't remember its been ages since I did it.

I think it should be reformed somewhat though, its way to slow as it is now. People end up raising everything to the highest point instead of making the best looking land, just to get out of surface mining.

 

Dis ^    :angry:    

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Never said it was hard, just slow.

You did though =/

 

 it was hard because I'm a perfectionist and I couldn't have my land the way I wanted it, but it was good for my sanity lol.

 

 

As I've stated in previous posts so many times before, +1 to keeping surface mining just as slow as it is now, +1 to removing the randomness. 100% success, 5x as long action timer, problem solved. Consistent, reliable, slow.

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+1


 


I think no one would hurt if the chance to gain a shard would be rised to 33% (fixed) on surface mining (since it's really painful, if you need to change ~10 - 20 tiles) - it's already a work of 3-5 days when you're alone on it...


For comparison - in 3-5 days I could excavate surely ~100 rock tiles with no problem... (instead of lowering 8 tiles by ~15 shards each corner)


 


So I think if we could at least flatten borders or level tiles on surfacemining it would be a huge help and still no break of game mechanics just a little change of existing mechanics...


 


Some calculations...


 


I have checked logs in may (due to no mining actions in a mine so far)


1040 times chipped away, 273 times mined rock shards. (in 2 days) or more correctly 42 hours


that are 1313 mining actions with 273 successful mined shards - result in 20,79 % success chance.


 


If I think that I have to mine 8-12k rock shards (successful) for finishing my terraforming, I have ~ 38480-57720 mining actions to perform to finish "my deeds" terraforming...


If I calculate with my usual online time I need ~1406,73 - 2110,09 hours of surface mining before me... (in hard words 1,95 months - 2,93 months).


 


Or shortly... brb - got 3 months surfacemining to do xD


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Rock is rock, shouldn't be easy to alter, not even on-deed. Let it stay as it is. Also leaves certain area's to place a deed for those determined and skilled enough to settle on. 

Problem is skill has only a tiny effect on how fast you go. Even using my brother's char at 80 minning, and 80 pickaxes it still takes several attempts to lower 1 corner. Its stupid and its slow. What it isn't is hard. Wurm has no hard things, however since you do need to grind like a chinese sweatshop worker (And sorry not trying to be rascist but those people are worked to the bone) it seems hard, but it isn't. I could have my mouse play wurm for me using its macro software, that's how hard it is.

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Idk why people think repetitive slow tasks are "Hard", wen in fact are just boring.


 


Is not like you have to do some complicated black magic maths or something like that. A lobotomized chimp can learn to press a key x times during a second and then wait 2-3 minutes and start over again.


 


Surface mining is slow, boring and mindless, but is far from being something hard.


 


Also if not for the slope limitation is something not rewarding your skill, the extremely random chance of getting a successful action put a 99 miner at the same level than a 20 unpremed miner.


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its a 20% chance per tick, with 100 mining actions i've had a 18-25 constant average.


 


But it feels a bit lower at times, specifically the closer I get to flattening the tile itself.

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I don't mind if it's not fast. It's the randomness that makes it obnoxiously tedious when you're trying to form a specific slope or level an area. You can't just queue up the needed actions to get to get to the height you want and need to pay close attention when you're close otherwise you might get "lucky" and succeed 3 times in a row after failing to lower the rock the last 20 attempts. Just increase the timer to match the average and kill the randomness.

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Rather the chance was more tied to skill level, tool skill, and tool ql


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You shouldn't mold rock surface as you wish, this feature is only for corrections and slight alterations, not mining down entire mountains.

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You shouldn't mold rock surface as you wish, this feature is only for corrections and slight alterations, not mining down entire mountains.

 

I beg to differ.

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Dirt - Rock

See the diffrence? Keep it slow! :)

I like the randomness too.

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I don't mind the speed, but I'd prefer if it was a flat 1 shard per X actions. Random is annoying.


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