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KanePT

Village permissions

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I had started this a while ago, power surge killed my post, so no i'm taking up the ddos time to make this again.


 


I guess we can agree that many of the village settings and such are kinda broken, or simply dumb (sorry but its true).


The idea behind this thread is to make a comprehensive suggestion about changes to the overall village permissions and roles so we can have a bit better control on what happens inside our deeds.


I'd like you guys to help out and don't just post -1, if you disagree with a point or all the points, do explain why (and "i want to grief people" isn't a good point).


When you post try to be clear, like discuss stuff addressing each point, and separate suggestions and additions to counter arguments for changes already added.


Read other people's posts please, i'll try to add suggestions (and if a mod chips in would be great) as soon as at least 3-5 other users agree to them (users with less than 50 posts will be excluded, i mean alt posts aren't welcome).


 


Some of these also come from other player's suggestions, i'll post a link if i can find them:


 


Taming and picking items


Problem: So this is probably the dumbest thing someone ever thought up in wurm. I'm sorry devs, but there's really no way to put it. Why in god's green earth would you associate allowing people to tame a animal within our deed with picking stuff from the ground? And why did it have to be made a GLOBAL setting. To allow a ally to tame you have to allow EVERYONE to tame, and at the same time allow EVERYONE to pickup stuff from the ground on your deed.


 


Suggestion: Separate those two settings for starters, then add them as a role permission, instead of a global thing. This will address several problems at once. First you'll fix the nonsense that is that setting. Second you'll allow people to give tame and pickup permissions either globally (by ticking non-citizens), locally or even select which level of citizenship (if they have many) is allowed to do so. Third you add the choice for people to disallow allies to pickup stuff on their deeds. Not the first time i've seen someone complain, or KOS a ally because a new player "stole" stuff from a allied deed.


 


Set Roles by player name


Problem: Sometimes you want a guy to do something in your deed (be it hired help, or whatever), but he already has a village. So what can you do? You either allow everyone in that village to do that task, or allow everyone to do that ask. Both potentially allowing people you don't know, or don't want, to do stuff on your deed.


 


Suggestion: Keep the system as is, but change the village field to village or player (if there's a problem with unique entries, maybe add a toggle button between player and village). The pretty much the same, if the game encounters the name, it creates the role for that specific person.


 


Filter Village Roles


Problem: When you add a village to your deed's permissions as a role. You essentially add EVERYONE in that village to do those settings. But sometimes villages have new players on probation that they don't know yet which have reduced permissions, and yet those players will have all those permissions in your deed even if they can't do them on theirs. Its complicated, so here's an example:


Player1 of DeedA is longtime friends with Player2 and Player3 of DeedB, so he has open permissions for them to cut wood, farm, dig and mine on his deed, because he knows them, and that they respect his things.


Now Player2 wants to do a big terraform project, so he recruits Noob1 to his deed so he can help out with that. But since he doesn't know Noob1 and doesn't want Noob1 to ruin his oak grove, or any of the other stuff he only gives Noob1 permission to Dig in his deed, and nothing else.


Noob 1 frustrated he can't get wood from DeedB keeps trying till he gets to DeedA, and basically is able to clearcut the place "cause he wantes some skillz". Not a pretty scenario, right?


 


Suggestion: Do a check on player's permissions on their deeds before allowing on other deeds. If DeedA allows DeedB to cut trees, ok, but if Noob1 can't cut trees on DeedB, then he can't cut trees on DeedA either.


 


Gate Management


Problem: Since trolls and such were allowed to enter locked gates, the way gate management works has been left kind of obsolete. The way it apparently worked was if you "opened" them 24h on gate permissions, even if you had them locked they would count as unlocked for all intents and purposes. Which sucks. In my case i had a portion of my deed enclosed in tall stone, with gates open 24h so that players passing by would have a safe place to rest. Also, my mailbox, and water source are within those walls. Since the change happened i had to remove the 24 open thing so that i wouldn't get unwanted trolls bashing my priests while he was near the altar. And i'm sure i'm not the only one that changed this.


Also there's the overall issue of how gates work. The gate management page basically either opens it for everyone or not, and the pass fences setting that either allows people to pass all your locked gates or not. We should be allowed to have more control over those things without having to resort to roundabout measures like building gatehouses.


 


Solution: Well i can think of a few:


- Remove the gate permission page from the writ and have each gate manageable individually (more or less like mine doors) when on deed. But instead of adding names you could have a check box like the house guest list that would show all roles on the deed so you could check which have access. This would be ideal IMO.


- Keep the gate permission page, but modify it so that you can have more control. Add a new role option for "access selected gates" and then on the gates management page add a "select gate" check box.


-Keep the gate permissions exactly as it is, but if it has a lock, then aggressive creatures will treat it as locked. Less desirable IMO.


 


Add Lock Permission


Got this idea from http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/91622-locking-items-restricted-to-writ-guest-only/


Problem: At the moment anyone that can walk into your deed can lock stuff that belongs to you. And on freedom you can't pick them.


 


Solution: Either disallow it entirely on deed, add a role option on deed to allow locking of containers, or only disallow it inside houses, but allow it for guests.


 


Wild Growth


Problem: Having a Fo priest that doesn't belong to your deed cast Wild Growth on trees or Hedges within your deed keeps giving a error message, and apparently failing (although i read someone saying it would work after several attempts).


 


Solution: Allow Wild growth in general, or link wild growth to forestry permissions on deed. So if you give permissions to do forestry to someone they can also cast wild growth.


 


Expanded Branding:


I've had these ideas throughout a few threads about several distinct issues, but i'll cover them here.


 


So branding was a awesome addition to village settings, but imo it can be taken further on, here's some suggestions:


 


  • Naming animals: Either add a equipable item (nametag or something) that when reamed and equiped on an animal (head or torso) will add a title to that animal. Title should be visible when examining offspring for breeding purposes (knowing who are the parents of a certain calf for example so you don't cross breed). Or add a option to name un-named animals (not horses) when branding. Pop up window with input box saying "You have branded venerable fat cow to your deed, do you wish to name it?". The name would be added as a title-like thing (So in this case Venerable fat cow [bessie]) and would show on examine of their offspring. Simmilar Suggestion Here.
  • Allow villagers of the brand-deed to equip and unequip animals without having to tame and re-tame. Brand is already a testament of ownership. And taming is possible for non-deed members.
  • Disallow non-brand deeds to equip and unequip animals (or maybe add a role option).
  • Make branded agressive animals neutral to deed owners and allies (in and out of their village), as well as guards (unless at war or kos, or maybe a added checkbox on deed settings for guards not to attack branded animals). This would make templars more useful for breeders (although probably branded offspring would need to be auto-branded) of agressive animals as well as allow better use of hellhorses on PvP (including for hots).

That's about it as far as i can remember, please comment and leave more suggestions.


Edited by KanePT
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This seems like a pretty solid idea to me . One thing to add would be to give gates writs like houses or maybe a fence line writ so you can allow certain people to pass on to deed when added. I cant tell how many times i have to go unlock my deed for friends just to pass on to deed.


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Without having read the entire post, I know from skimming over each paragraph that these are issues that I believe have plagued almost every deed owner in wurm at some point. 

I still think by far the most ridiculous one is that, as deed mayor, with full permissions, I've been blocked from picking up items that people randomly dropped on my deed, as it would be stealing, and I cannot steal as a deed mayor, as, even though my alignment is at 100, that action might switch me to BL. This is on epic, no less.

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This seems like a pretty solid idea to me . One thing to add would be to give gates writs like houses or maybe a fence line writ so you can allow certain people to pass on to deed when added. I cant tell how many times i have to go unlock my deed for friends just to pass on to deed.

I think this would fall in with what i suggested:

 

- Remove the gate permission page from the writ and have each gate manageable individually (more or less like mine doors) when on deed. But instead of adding names you could have a check box like the house guest list that would show all roles on the deed so you could check which have access. This would be ideal IMO.

If coupled with individual roles for players you could even create a role for your friends instead of their village so they can enter your deed.

 

 

Without having read the entire post, I know from skimming over each paragraph that these are issues that I believe have plagued almost every deed owner in wurm at some point. 

I still think by far the most ridiculous one is that, as deed mayor, with full permissions, I've been blocked from picking up items that people randomly dropped on my deed, as it would be stealing, and I cannot steal as a deed mayor, as, even though my alignment is at 100, that action might switch me to BL. This is on epic, no less.

That's interesting. Never did have this problem. But it might be like when someone drops something and if the owner is still nearby you either have to be on a team with him, or wait till he moves away to be able to pickup.

So probably you will be able to pick it up, but have to wait for a grace period, or that the owner steps away. (Maybe to prevent citizens from taking advantage of when a person drops something for a trade or stuff like that).

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Ah my bad on that one then. But i have had the same issue as Arrconis but picture it on freedom where your just kind of stuck.


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+1

I'm part of a large community and stronger control options for my deed would let me keep it open.

Though I would also add in a little something for flowers.  I don't mind people coming onto my land to take sprouts, but I had to disable it when I realized it also let them take flowers as well.  Just a small point to consider for those of us who keep gardens.

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+1 and thank you for typing this all up in one place


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Those are the main reasons I had to close up my deed with gates, and I keep having trouble to let some individuals in without a gatehouse, let alone working permissions...


 


+1 to this, we need a proper way to manage our settlements.


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Bumping this.


Seriously? There's 3x more replies on the high five emote suggestion than this?


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Also quite surprised at not many adding here. 


 


In my opinion the whole role and settings needs a revamp. What annoys me the most is the lack of control over alliance settings. Sure i could make a role for each village.. but even then you can only have like 10 roles.


 


In some ways, the old alliance system was much safer. You could ally with the village you wanted, now you ally with many villages, so really more options should be made available. 


 


Id like to see an improved roles section, where villages in the alliance automatically appear, and can adjust settings accordingly. Perhaps even a second page where you could add friends or foes to settings too. Id rather add 1 person i want to be able to mine than his entire village. 


 


Pick up really really needs its own box , taming obviously should be separate and they should both be on the roles section with a check box for any role. We have so many problems with this. 


 


With the new load feature, anyone in the alliance can go onto an allied deed and pick up statues, and any container not locked or in a building. Loading should also be covered in a pick up section too, which should be able to be turned off for alliance also. 


 


As the alliance got bigger, i basically had to replan the deed with gatehouses removing all gates as they are essentially useless. Manageable gates is really the only solution i can see, as you said like a mine door.


 


A revamp is much needed, at the moment it is sub standard and quite frustrating at times. 


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+1

Permission in general need a revamp not just deeds.

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Plus there really need to be new 'permissions' added for all the new game features that have come out lately.  Loading/unloading, etc.


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