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Buttercups

Add looting code to Chaos

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Basicly with this mine door change, everything is completely in the defender's favor, if this was ever changed here.    That means that not only can they spawn on their deed, the attackers can't gatehop, or even get loot.    It's a HORRIBLE idea.   PvP is a two way street you have to balance attacker and defender, atm it is already entirely unbalanced here.    


 


Keep your stupid ideas on Epic, you have already done enough damage to pvp here.    

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Who is this Battlepaw guy and does he even pvp

 

Yep, and I've been around longer than you've been buying accounts and still failing at PvP.   

Edited by Battlepaw
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A guy in TS just asked "does Battlepaw play on epic or something". That's how big of a shot u r brahski. #youngmoney


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Basicly with this mine door change, everything is completely in the defender's favor

 

But everything has always been in the defenders favor and don't you think it should be? In many cases the attackers will know of the attack beforehand and show up with a very large attack force greatly outnumbering the defending force; whilst the defenders only have whoever is online at the time unless they somehow know the attack is coming. There must be various mechanics in place to assist the defenders IMHO.

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The first time somebody dies outside a gate hop and you cant get the body cause theres enemies right inside. You're gonna want it reverted. Epic has very few of those situations but when they happen the loot code suuucks.

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Ah make it so two or more people can drag a corpse, making it into a tug-o-war of body str.


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+1 only cause battlepaw thinks its a bad idea.


 


in no way should an attacking side have an advantage in hostile territory.


Edited by hemrzz

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A guy in TS just asked "does Battlepaw play on epic or something". That's how big of a shot u r brahski. #youngmoney

 

Never was a big shot, but I've been here a while  <_<   

 

 

The first time somebody dies outside a gate hop and you cant get the body cause theres enemies right inside. You're gonna want it reverted. Epic has very few of those situations but when they happen the loot code suuucks.

 

The issues with Chaos server is one huge game of deed chess, mostly because of it's size and how spread out it is, and how much more resources it takes to replace things.    Less crafters, and larger skill gaps between low tier players and higher tier players... and ofc farwalker ammys.    Its not always a bad thing, in fact I like the size of the server, its just the minedoor changes made a massive impact on pvp because of the differences.    

 

All of this makes  gameplay with many more differences then similarities compared to Epic.   If you try to argue we are the same simply because we both have pvp, and somehow Epic's system is better, your living in a fantasy land, that has about as much touch with the reality of things here. Its exactly the same ignorant viewpoints I saw when freedom players were complaining years ago because our war deeds were ugly because they were deathtraps for enemies and not fairy tale castles that have more in common with a theme park than something that players who PvP need to survive and repel the enemy.

 

 

+1 only cause battlepaw thinks its a bad idea.

 

in no way should an attacking side have an advantage in hostile territory.

 

PvP is all about balance, trying to shoot for some sort of turtle mentality, especially here is stupid, and self-destructive.   There is a difference between trying to balance things and trying to stack every advantage you can on defenders simply because one side is currently on the offensive.     There are always attackers and defenders, I've seen it swing both ways in the past and it will again.    It is both shortsighted and involves a level of tunnel vision that is frankly disturbing to watch.

Edited by Battlepaw

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Never was a big shot, but I've been here a while  <_<   

 

 

Being here a while, sitting ondeed is not anything to be proud of

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Being here a while, sitting ondeed is not anything to be proud of

 

I just ran the HOTA a few hours ago.    I'm around, I run more on the lines of kingdom projects and assaults. Recently I've been in several tower caps, the raid on Valhalla, GOTL, two attacks on LOG, and quite a few others.  Its enough, especially with the last tower cap I was on to see a big difference in gameplay that the changes to mine doors have wrought.  I sure haven't seen you on Mortal for a long time, though the way you guys bicycle accounts and how many times you have switched accounts its hard to keep track of which one you are on these days.    ;) You have your way of playing, I have mine.   

 

I don't measure myself based on some sort of trumped up self-image, as you seem to assume.  I've actually been there in person to see how much things have changed, and for the worse in the last few weeks since the recent changes.    You want to keep trying your e-peen comparison go ahead, It won't change a thing and just makes you look quite silly.  

Edited by Battlepaw

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We all know you're just upset because MR got owned by the minedoor changes this time. Another time it will be JK getting owned and you will see us complain. No point really.


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We all know you're just upset because MR got owned by the minedoor changes this time. Another time it will be JK getting owned and you will see us complain. No point really.

 

I wasn't there.   So nothing for me to be upset about.  It seemed many players enjoyed the PvP.   I'll let them share any experiences they had.  

 

I pointed out weeks ago that this "minehop" change had nothing to do with minehopping, and I was right.   From what happened. the end result was a massive imbalance in the PvP system.  A defender on Chaos has a massive advantage on an attacker here.  

 

1.  A defender can easily respawn, also with res stones combined with mag bonus they have a large chance of keeping their stuff, if the looting changes are implemented as per the OP it will make it even more in their favor.   A defender can often quickly rejoin a fight, an attcker has no way to heal on the go outside of Fo heals, which are very limited, while a defender can just skip to complete safety inside their on-deed gatehops, mine doors, etc where the can take the time to heal with covers, bandages, etc.  

    

2. The door code is broken, Enemies were able to lose target useing bug caused by skipping in and out of a mine entrance to lose target.  Not sure about the exact nature of the bug as this is second-hand knowlege, but sounds like some work may be needed on the minedoor/entraces code.     

 

Possible Solutions:

 

1.  Change death to include all loss of favor, and an exponential chance of dropping loot the more times you die in the space of a short time.    

2.  Revert the mine door changes here so that Attackers and Defenders both can heal and have an even chance.    

 

 

It is a suggestion, and is certainly more sensible then trying to compound the issue by stacking everything even more in the defenders favor by not even allowing atackers to pickup corpses.    This wouldn't be so much of an issue if deed distances here weren't forced to be so massive, putting most attackers well out of range of any safety.  In the end the attacker's resources are always going to be more limited, in the number of heals the can get, in their reinforcements and what favor they can bring along with them.  Due to the distances involved,  they get caught into an attrition they can't possibly win in the long run if they can't heal, and regroup.  

Edited by Battlepaw

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Posted · Hidden by Shrimpiie, February 16, 2014 - Removed - Trolling
Hidden by Shrimpiie, February 16, 2014 - Removed - Trolling

Wall of text rage achieved, took a while


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Mine door changes are fine IMO, the recent example simply showed that even numbers of attackers/defenders the defenders had an advantage (How is that bad?) attackers are not meant to have everything battlepaw and you should not expect them to. War of attrition should also be with the defenders, like why would it ever not be? :/


 


I think its a bad change to implement the epic code, however don't think anything else needs changing/drastic changing from second hand experience or a single skirmish.


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Mine door changes are fine IMO, the recent example simply showed that even numbers of attackers/defenders the defenders had an advantage (How is that bad?) attackers are not meant to have everything battlepaw and you should not expect them to. War of attrition should also be with the defenders, like why would it ever not be? :/

 

I think its a bad change to implement the epic code, however don't think anything else needs changing/drastic changing from second hand experience or a single skirmish.

 

 

There is a big difference between defenders having an advantage and defenders having EVERY advantage. How can you POSSIBLY think it's a good thing for attacking forces to suffer 

 

1. No fallback, no safe place.

2. Enemies can respawn and rejoin the fight.

3. Being in enemy territory which isn't known to you.

4. Enemies having guards on their side.

5. Enemies being able to use mines and houses as hops.

6. Enemies having a much easier time bringing in reinforcements.

 

Thats off the top of my head and then this suggestion would also add in "Enemies can collect their gear back as they respawn while you as the attacking side cannot.

 

Simply put i think your response to this a purely selfish desire based on the knowledge that your own kingdom is defensive 90% of the time.

Edited by Nadroj

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I think more impetus should be in favour of the attacking side, there is too much swinging in the defending side as things stand.


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I think more impetus should be in favour of the attacking side, there is too much swinging in the defending side as things stand.

 

It was a really big overcompensation,  and its affects are only beginning to be known here on Chaos, in the long term this mechanic is going to affect everything here, the formation of PMKs, fighting over artifacts, the WL, everything.   

 

I do think its very silly that anyone can thumb their noses at any glaring issues that have already cropped up over this and try to claim we are looking for advantage simply because of this current situation.   Recent events, have shown us just how many problems the mine door changes causes. That is why its a big issue now, but by no means is it something that only affects MR, this effects gameplay on the whole server.    

 

On a whole, especially I can see serious disadvantages in any attacking force that wants to push back MR, especially considering we still hold the majority of combat artifacts.    This whole issue is quite possibly a disaster for PMKs trying to conquer territory from us or the JK.    

 

Consider this, in that recent fight some of the most powerful fighters in MR including several champs couldn't make much difference against all the odds, and we fought very well, ripping the JK apart in the fighting getting many kills before we were taken down.  Just think what a kingdom with even less advantages and no champs, artifacts, or anything would have against one of the established ones.     

Edited by Battlepaw

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+1


 


This would remove a lot of people just running around in scale or drake and bring some small balance to pvp.


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Battlepaw, your in the wrong thread with that tbh. Got issues with other chaos aspects go elsewhere? This thread should be about adding epic loot coding or not. I've not seen anything yet to change my -1 to a +1 though..

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+1

 

This would remove a lot of people just running around in scale or drake and bring some small balance to pvp.

 

This doesn't address farwalkers, and how does this in any way remove drake or scale?    The only thing the OP would change is looting, not the existence of those armors.... did you even read the OP or did you get lost on the way to the suggestion tread for that silly nodrop stuff.    /facepalm  :huh:

 

 

Battlepaw, your in the wrong thread with that tbh. Got issues with other chaos aspects go elsewhere? This thread should be about adding epic loot coding or not. I've not seen anything yet to change my -1 to a +1 though..

 

 

This is the same, issue, changing looting is interlinked with the current mine door mechanics and gameplay. Almost every one of my posts have adressed the problem in context along with the more recent changes because they stack up on each other.  

Edited by Battlepaw

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It only benefits winning team. Yes winners should get rewards but IMO it makes it even worse for the losing side, discouraging PvP to begin with. 


 


Ex: If my 5 man force is confronted by a 10 man force, I won't have my force engage due to the unlikeliness of winning, because there will be no chance of us saving our items in combat; whereas with the present code It's more likely that I would engage knowing I can grab my friends' corpses while fighting.


 


EDIT: oh, -1


Edited by Deathangel

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