Client hack bans

[Wulfmaer 413]

None of the ISPs I have used provide a static IP address as standard, though a few provide them as an option.

 

Banning IP addresses achieves very little, but with ISPs providing dynamic addresses risks banning other random players if/when they pick up a banned address.

[Trygve 1]

Why IP ban? If you can hack, you know how to give your self a new IP, so it will not help, only do so others on the same IP cant play...

I will be abel to hack in, tjek IP's, on other players and and make my hack events form what the system konws the other players IP, and the other player will know I use hes IP.
I am abel to do it, dos not mean I do it.
 

 

I have acted as a mod for another online game called Tribal Wars, what we did was use ip and in game tracking software to look for illegal events. We received full training on how to spot such behaviour.

When a match was found we issued an immediate ban pending a fuller investigation. The senior admin would then always make contact with the person at fault. In most cases it was pretty easy to identify those who were guilty as the evidence contradicted their statements. Most people who do such things are not organised professional hackers but amateurs chancing their arm. The ban would be upheld based on whether the admin believed the person at fault after reviewing all the evidence and a skype call between them.

This process was designed to eliminate banning the innocent and was all conducted by volunteer admins such as myself.

I have playd Tribal Wars, that is a nother thing then this, you can not compare the to games.

Their biggest problem was find them there playd on the same IP in the first place, becuse that was argenst the game rules.
So if my broder and I will like to play trabel wars we, needed to do it on the same accont ot make to acconts, report that we was playing from the same IP and then get told we cut do that, but we my not support each other, then all the fun to a game with some one know is gone.

I dont see why some one sut hack that game, there was relly nothing to hack, the only thing you needed to find aut how you cut bark the rules without being discovered.

But yes one thing I can compare the to games is with is the consumer support, both games seem to find people who have no experience in talking to others, or any idea what they're doing.

I am sorry to say.

The game here it self is great, and that is why I play it, but i never hope I will be needing a GM in this game, from what I have experienced in the 14 days I have been playing

Closes forum threads without there has been violated rules, baning players withaut confront the player with what he has don.
And all the other lovly things I hear other players say ingame.

A Idea for this game, will get some there know what thy are doing, how to talk to others in, then I think this game will be 100% great.

 

 

 

So let me get this straight.. You can make alts and then use a hacked client until you're blue in the face as long as you don't log in your main on the hacked client. Then even if you're unlucky and get caught you haven't actually lost anything.

Yes that is what it is, and if you IP ban, it will still happen, the hackers will just get smarter.




Until they tell how they can be 100% on their system is flawless, or admits there may be errors in their system, and thy will begin to double-check account manually, where to contact the account holder is included.
I say thy ban players there have don nothing, and it is a much bigger problem than there are hakers in the game!



I'm sorry for my spelling mistakes. I'm dyslexic, and had no one to go through my text this time

Edited February 4, 2014 by Trygve

[Wulfgar 1,132]

The trick here is knowing with 100% confidence that the same person is using both clients, and not one guilty person along with one or more innocent people playing under the same IP Address.  It's far better to allow a few cheaters to go relatively unpunished than to permanently ban any innocent people.  IP Address alone simply cannot uniquely identify a single person.

I would rather see 1 innocent man hanged than 100 guilty go free, same here. There are several in Wurm who have escaped justified bans who cause more harm than banning one innocent player.

[Madt 1,178]

It's great to see the devs working to remove the bad eggs from the game. Thank you Rolf and team.

 

One question I have. These client hacks and mods etc are obviously doing something in the way they function to trip a 'wire' that raises the red flag, be it altering game files or sniffing packets or whatever.

 

Obviously the people who make these hacks are going to get smarter and smarter and eventually may find ways to avoid tripping that 'wire' that raises the red flag. Much like how drug smugglers learn the procedures of border patrol officers and find ways around their checks. My question is will the dev team be able to keep one step ahead of the ones making these hacks? Otherwise there will always be some that slip through the net due to being one step ahead of the devs.

[Gaeron 551]

I. My question is will the dev team be able to keep one step ahead of the ones making these hacks? Otherwise there will always be some that slip through the net due to being one step ahead of the devs.

 

There can never be any guarantees and all they can do is to do their best.

 

Maybe they can catch 80, 90 even 95% of cheaters after which its up to the player base to report when they know something is screwy.

 

If someone were to offer me a hax I'd say yes and then immediately pass it on to  the dev team along with the info of who gave it to me. So having said that I doubt I'd get the chance now..... The more players who behave in this manner, the smaller the market for cheats and the less incentive.

[Trygve 1]

If someone were to offer me a hax I'd say yes and then immediately pass it on to  the dev team along with the info of who gave it to me. So having said that I doubt I'd get the chance now..... The more players who behave in this manner, the smaller the market for cheats and the less incentive.

You are 100% right, the best way to find the hackers, is if the other players help aut...

Give the programmers the hacks so thy can learn what it do, and thy can make systems there find it...

A player there see hack but dont report it, is just as guilty as the hackker.

And no I dont think thy can catch 80, 90 even 95% of them, that will mean that this game only have begins within hacking or hakkers there dont think.

 

If you are lucky you will find the 50% of them, there is to many stupit hackers aut there.

Hacking sut only be uset for development, not to hurt others or cheat in games!

 

 

I would rather see 1 innocent man hanged than 100 guilty go free, same here. There are several in Wurm who have escaped justified bans who cause more harm than banning one innocent player.

I am abel to hack in, get your IP, play the game so the game system think I play with your IP, then I can use a hack, make the system see me, and then you think it's ok you get band becuse the system think it's your IP the hack come from?

Naa I do not think it's fair!

And a skilled programmer can do alot more to erase his tracks.

Dont IP ban, it dos not help at all.

No I will not see a innocent man get hanged, becuse here thy can hang alot f innocent man, before thy get one guilty.  

[Devily 623]

From Rolf's response i think he is commenting from certainty of the accounts banned in fact were being used with an ALTERED client, which i think means there is trace of it. Im not 100% sure but im pretty sure a ban list like this would not have been put together in 2 seconds. Im pretty sure a good investigation was in place for these accounts to be banned. Also, an Altered client is not just a small hack like the ones you mention you did a search on to find out how many people look into it, Im not a programmer but im pretty sure an Altered client is an altered programming allowing for great advantage vs something for example like a macro.

 

With that being said, I also do agree with something you mention which is, I do also believe everyone should be confronted about it, and at least give some what of a chance of 100% evidence to be handed in. For example, if that said player can prove his IP, and computer MAC address are not associated when his account was logged in with the altered client are not the same as his. But the thing is, Wurm also has the policy in which we all already know, letting anyone else on your account is not really accepted and if done so then you as the owner claim all responsibility.

 

I think Rolf has his methods to see if they are using a different client or anything changed to it's client. There enough ways to check this. Only for us it doesnt matter wich way he is using since we are not the judges. 

 

I just like that Rolf takes care of these people.

[waarokku 61]

i love not only the actions taken but you posting the names.tired of the veil of secrecy thats used most times.never understood what satisfaction people got from cheating.just childish

[waarokku 61]

also,actions like this make any who are left shape up and run quieter.puts em on notice.

[MaurizioAM 919]

In a game I was CEO we enabled players laptop camera secretly and record their face. Then specially trained body language professionals looked through the video footage to detect evil laughs hackers do so as to catch them. When they didnt have a camera we used their mic to detect breathing patterns. True story.

 

Where they given a waver to sign telling them of this type of security?

[waarokku 61]

how many wurm hackers does it take to change a light bulb? none! theyve been banned.......... >

[Trygve 1]

In a game I was CEO we enabled players laptop camera secretly and record their face. Then specially trained body language professionals looked through the video footage to detect evil laughs hackers do so as to catch them. When they didnt have a camera we used their mic to detect breathing patterns. True story.

It is illegal in so many levels in most west-eastern countries if not all of them, I do not believe it takes place in any company anywhere!

With that kind of system hack you can find all confidential information on people's computers!

Edited February 4, 2014 by Trygve

[Issle 793]

Where they given a waver to sign telling them of this type of security?

 

It is illegal in so many levels in most west-eastern countries if not all of them, I do not believe it takes place in any company anywhere!

With that kind of system hack you can find all confidential information on people's computers!

 

Me a CEO ? Body language specialists ? Breathing patterns ... Come on people ... 

Edited February 4, 2014 by Issle

[Elen 1,013]

Don't worry I got it. Solid 7/10

Edited February 4, 2014 by Elen

[Issle 793]

Thank you very much

[Redd 4,281]

Issle lost me at "When i was a CEO" . Gave me a good lol tho xD

[spider 842]

nice work but that all new guys better is control the old player in wurm i am sure you found more chars

[mrfusion 21]

Static IPv6 is the answer.  Someday, when everyone has moved away from IPv4, there will be no need for NAT...or at least gamers will have the option to sync their accounts to their individual computers.  Hopefully, it will be made more user friendly by then.  And there will be affordable flying cars too.  Yay.

[Ryamu 80]

Good bye morons! Keep it up Rolf clear em out and teach em they aren't welcomed here xP good work haha

[DoctorAngus 184]

yay! Round them piratez up and hang em on the galleys! Yarrrgh!

[Calisthra 59]

More and more to like about this game and it's staffing.

 

Keep up the good work.

[camobeast 11]

Way to go! scum removed, also agree with removing associated scum as long as sufficient evidence is there would be easy enough to define and filter out people just "logging in to somebody else's account" with a proper investigation, these people deserve all of their accounts to be sent straight to hell.

[AlexLong 128]

Nope.

 

I don't know who you're referring to, and this is not to do with any account mentioned in this thread, but it's worth noting that sometimes when we ban macroers, their friends contact us saying such and such is a great person. They've known them for months/years, they'd never cheat/macro, please reconsider. Well we generally either have irrefutable evidence to the contrary and/or sometimes the player in question has even come clean and admitted to using the macro further down the road. I never know who to feel worse for, the player who has decided to come clean and apologise, but who has lost their account, or the friend who has been lied to/duped.

I don't know, in my experience of gaming and being an admin in different games, no anti-cheat is 100% all of the time every single time.

Logs saying what? that someone repeated the same action over and over again? for how long? 10 mins could just be a coincidence, maybe 3 hours of repetitive actions without moving is different and if that is the case, fair enough. But I think others have raised valid points with their concern.

Java is not the best way to code in the world to be "bug free" and I think there is always, always room for error (even more so in Java).

I'm just going to assume Wurm knows what they are doing, but I also know Wurm has a habit of claiming superiority a "nothing is wrong, we are right in this" motto.

 

Edited February 27, 2014 by AlexLong

[Issle 793]

Java is not the best way to code in the world to be "bug free" and I think there is always, always room for error (even more so in Java).

 

Indeed, one of my friends who works as an administrator in Microsoft told me that the best and safest language to write server applications is HTML. True Story.

 

HTML Enterprise Server Edition, best language for game servers.

Edited February 28, 2014 by Issle

[Keldun 335]

Actually Java greatly reduces the amount of bugs, because it simply doesn't allow you to make certain errors that are possible with some other languages.

However those are language bugs, which pretty much equal spelling and grammar.

 

Bugs in the alogirthm , which is math and logic, have nothing to do with the language used and can be made in any language in the same way.