Fight Skill from Alt accounts clarification

[Redd 4,281]

I personally dont see the difference between giving your char skill via killing them, and giving them an affinity to gain skill quicker via killing them. Both things i think should be legal, but at the same time if one gets policed, the other should also.

[MetalDragon 1,630]

I don't agree on affinity trading either, it was supposed to be a perk to influence PvP but easily exploitable.

[Schneehamby 4]

So does this affinity trading mean you'll actually get one of the affinities your enemy has if you kill them?

I thought you'd get a random one if you kill someone in pvp, guess that would be less exploitable... O.o

[MetalDragon 1,630]

Yeah you get one affinity the enemy has. It is random which affinity you get if the enemy has multiple, but the majority of Freedom players have one, so it's guaranteed. (assuming Freedom players come to chaos to sell affinities still)

[Klaa 4,872]

Keep in mind the following is no manner an official statement, as a CA I dont have that authority anyways. Simply a player vounteer. The following is simply an observation garnered from years of playing on pvp servers and involvement in the inevitable-related shenanigans.

In a way Rolf's opinion on the matter has already been expressed: many, many times. Granted I have not heard his recent views on the matter, through IRC or any other medium. One is entitled to being able to change their views on a matter.

Skill gain, affinities, or whatever gained from killing/fighting alts was an old issue long before I even began playing. Over that time period there have been numerous changes to how skill is gained and how fast.

Everytime there was a situation where Rolf felt things were out of balance, he placed limitations: skill could be only gained from premium chars, gain was only within a certain time period, needed at least 20 fighting, enemy chars only, gain shifted from fighting to actually killing, pve skill cap at 70 so pvp for more, could only have prem chars on (wilds)pvp servers, and so on and so forth.

Affinity trading as an example, when I last bothered to trade affinities, you couldnt just trade off six affinities with six quick deaths. Theres coded limits on how fast and when.

Rolf has shown a preference for hard-coded solutions in contrast to bans and rules that require GM-monitoring, especially in situations that arise on pvp servers. Something Im sure the GMs appreciate since they are mostly volunteers as well, let alone players who wish to be able to play and pvp at will.

Placing and Enforcing "alt abuse" rules have been attempted off and on in the past. Unmitigated disasters every time, so its no surprise personally theres hesitation to go down that road again. Heck Rolf probably feels like he's fighting a hydra by now. Keep striking off heads only for more to grow back.

Edited February 6, 2014 by Klaa

[Pingpong 1,070]

Here's a question, if folks on PVP servers want PVP so bad, why do they want/love/MUST HAVE affinities in non combat skills? Doesn't this lend itself to crafting and such which in essence denies the pvp code of the servers? I'm not flaming chaos. Just saying there's a lot of yakking about rules and such for a server with supposedly "no rules". Either it should be "anything goes" or "find a set of rules that work and keep'em". Farming alts of the same/different kingdom seems perfectly legit to  me on a server with toon killing, how you gonna stop it? And if Wurm decides it's against the rules, how will it revert the FS on the folks who've leveled up toons to very high levels without destroying other peoples hard work? Or will it just ignore the "problem" it's decided now exists?  Policing wild/chaos is next to impossible, attempts to do so with GM's seem to wind up in cries of GM favoritism and power abuse. A thriving Chaos/wild/epic is better for wurm long term and better for all wurm players.

[Kagrenac 812]

Affinitys in non combat skills are just as useful as in combat skills. In fact, they are generally better because pvp skills raise so fast.

Crafting is a required part of pvp, someone has to make the gear people use.

[Klaa 4,872]

Its mostly fear, born from the competive nature inherent to pvp servers. That someone has gained an overpowering advantage through shady means. However, fear is rarely rational, so all kinds of lunacy results. Unfortunately some even resort to shady means themselves to bridge this so-called gap, which typically doesnt even exist.

 

Although at the risk of stoking the flames, there have been - unfortunately enough - examples that make the fears semi-justified.

 

On another point, "Non combat" skills are just as important in pvp as fighting skills.

 

Much of war is logistics and infrastructure regardless of if its RL or in a game. The vast majority of the Knights Templar were merchants, clerks, and bankers... a standing (private) army in the field is a very expensive proposition.

[Lancelot 765]

[16:46:37] Tommty slain by Embolism Nadroj Pimprage Nightfall Farmerfred Garrettwademan Roman 

 

Ok this is just getting ridiculous now. Something needs to be done  to stop this fs and affinity farming.

[atazs 962]

[16:46:37] Tommty slain by Embolism Nadroj Pimprage Nightfall Farmerfred Garrettwademan Roman 

 

Ok this is just getting ridiculous now. Something needs to be done  to stop this fs and affinity farming.

Here are my death logs from 2013 12. Only going to post what i assume are alt and other random kills

Logging started 2013-12-18

[17:37:07] Passepartout slain by Leaf (don't know about this one)

Logging started 2013-12-22

[18:27:08] Senakal slain by Aramisii 

[18:36:28] Dderick slain by Rolandt 

Logging started 2014-01-06

[03:09:46] Theophilus slain by Eyesgood 

Logging started 2014-01-06

[15:23:27] Drega slain by Rosie 

Logging started 2014-01-06

[21:20:30] Vough slain by Nadroj Red Nightfall 

[21:21:30] Vough slain by Nadroj Demondan 

[21:22:17] Vough slain by Nadroj Demondan 

[21:26:37] Vough slain by Nadroj Red Nightfall Demondan 

[21:31:46] Vough slain by Nadroj Nightfall 

Logging started 2014-01-08

[15:36:09] Palikka slain by Demondan (don't know about this one)

Logging started 2014-01-12

[19:56:52] Xtigermanxx slain by Hexproof (don't know about this one)

Logging started 2014-01-13

[16:08:32] Aamanus slain by Christa 

[16:35:15] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[16:36:15] Aamanus slain by Christa 

[16:38:05] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[16:40:13] Aamanus slain by Christa 

[16:48:30] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[17:17:30] Aamanus slain by Garrettwademan 

[17:17:39] Tommty slain by Christa 

[17:20:46] Tommty slain by Christa 

[17:20:49] Aamanus slain by Garrettwademan 

[17:23:14] Tommty slain by Christa 

[17:24:40] Aamanus slain by Garrettwademan 

Logging started 2014-01-14

[17:30:48] Angerous slain by Empire 

[18:56:16] Keywide slain by Yurik 

[18:57:25] Baid slain by Yurik 

Logging started 2014-01-20

[20:01:17] Tommty slain by Christa 

[20:01:33] Aamanus slain by Garrettwademan 

Logging started 2014-01-21

[17:26:39] Tenderwolf slain by Yurik 

[17:26:57] Keywide slain by Yurik 

[17:32:36] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[17:32:54] Aamanus slain by Christa 

Logging started 2014-01-21

[20:08:00] Vynoprayer slain by Damao (don't know about this one)

Logging started 2014-01-22

[20:42:06] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[20:42:12] Aamanus slain by Christa 

Logging started 2014-01-23

[22:31:25] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[22:32:16] Aamanus slain by Christa 

Logging started 2014-01-24

[14:24:21] Gav slain by Gavin 

Logging started 2014-01-24

[20:27:25] Jberg slain by Tommty 

[20:38:05] Jberg slain by Tommty 

[20:39:07] Tommty slain by Mobius Jberg 

Logging started 2014-01-25

[16:16:16] Keywide slain by Yurik 

[16:16:29] Tenderwolf slain by Yurik 

[16:16:39] Baid slain by Yurik 

Logging started 2014-01-25

[22:16:55] Erysia slain by Lonwolf (don't know about this one)

Logging started 2014-01-26

[15:36:53] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[16:43:46] Aamanus slain by Garrettwademan 

Logging started 2014-01-27

[18:04:06] Sharkin slain by Fevfev 

Logging started 2014-01-27

[19:01:26] Keywide slain by Yurik 

[19:01:26] Baid slain by Yurik 

[19:01:32] Tenderwolf slain by Yurik 

Logging started 2014-01-31

[19:21:25] Keywide slain by Emoo Red Cita Garrettwademan Christa 

[19:22:03] Tenderwolf slain by Emoo Red Cita Garrettwademan Christa 

Logging started 2014-02-01

[18:17:31] Alistar slain by Eroing 

[18:19:08] Alistar slain by Eroing 

[18:20:46] Alistar slain by Eroing 

Logging started 2014-02-02

[19:55:24] Keywide slain by Yurik 

[19:55:39] Tenderwolf slain by Yurik 

Logging started 2014-02-03

[00:10:47] Angerous slain by Empire 

[00:29:38] Epicphail slain by Felinas 

Logging started 2014-02-03

[11:03:07] Epicphail slain by Felinas 

[11:04:07] Epicphail slain by Felinas 

Logging started 2014-02-03

[18:52:36] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

Logging started 2014-02-04

[16:18:49] Epicphail slain by Felinas 

[20:13:02] Aamanus slain by Garrettwademan 

[20:15:55] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

Logging started 2014-02-05

[17:38:26] Sharkin slain by Fevfev 

Logging started 2014-02-05

[19:09:09] Epicphail slain by Felinas 

[19:26:20] Tommty slain by Jberg 

[20:52:54] Midnightalan slain by Dderick 

[20:54:15] Dderick slain by Midnightalan Rolandt 

Logging started 2014-02-05

[21:31:37] Dderick slain by Rolandt 

Logging started 2014-02-06

[18:06:52] Sharkin slain by Fevfev 

[18:27:06] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan 

[18:27:35] Aamanus slain by Garrettwademan 

Logging started 2014-02-06

[22:30:46] Epicphail slain by Felinas 

Logging started 2014-02-07

[13:03:46] Angerous slain by Empire 

[13:16:44] Angerous slain by Empire 

[13:27:53] Angerous slain by Empire 

Logging started 2014-02-07

[14:54:45] Tommty slain by Garrettwademan Aamanus 

[14:57:29] Aamanus slain by Tommty Garrettwademan 

Logging started 2014-02-08

[14:41:08] Berkley slain by Garrettwademan 

[15:10:34] Aamanus slain by Tommty Battlepaw Datfreealt Bloodlust Garrettwademan Kriet Tommmy Wat 

[15:14:38] Tommty slain by Battlepaw Garrettwademan Aamanus Tommmy Wat 

Logging started 2014-02-08

[16:49:40] Tommty slain by Battlepaw Kriet 

[17:45:16] Angerous slain by Empire 

[17:49:36] Angerous slain by Empire 

Logging started 2014-02-09

[16:46:52] Tommty slain by Embolism Nadroj Pimprage Nightfall Farmerfred Garrettwademan Roman 

[16:48:57] Tommty slain by Nadroj 

[16:50:42] Tommty slain by Nadroj 

[16:52:25] Tommty slain by Nightfall 

[16:54:29] Tommty slain by Nightfall 

[17:00:11] Aamanus slain by Tommty Embolism Nadroj Pimprage Nightfall Farmerfred Garrettwademan Aralin Roman 

[17:05:31] Aamanus slain by Nadroj 

[17:06:19] Tommty slain by Pimprage Nightfall Farmerfred Roman 

[17:08:29] Aamanus slain by Nadroj Nightfall 

[17:09:46] Aamanus slain by Nadroj 

[17:13:15] Aamanus slain by Nadroj Nightfall 

[17:25:10] Aamanus slain by Vynorachamp 

[17:26:33] Tommty slain by Vynorachamp 

[17:27:24] Aamanus slain by Vynorachamp 

[17:28:30] Tommty slain by Vynorachamp 

 

Yes. I know one a few of those are not/may not be alt kills, those i marked with "I don't know this one"

Correct me if i am wrong, but i don't think something like this goes on on the epic servers.

Edited February 9, 2014 by atazs

[Issle 793]

[19:21:03] <Yurik> I dare any MR to make more alt kills than me. Challenge issued, if you are cowards do not accept it.

 

He started it ...

[MetalDragon 1,630]

This is why I petition removing the fight skill soft cap, let everybody get 100 fight skill a piece of cake. If people are so but hurt about that then let us gain at least up to 1 fight skill per day unhindered by the fight skill cap, then allow us to gain it at the slow rate.

 

It means it would take a maximum of 30 days after 70 fight skill to reach 100

[Redd 4,281]

-1.

[Lancelot 765]

Just remove this 'soft cap ' completely. this is a pvp server. But this alt killing is getting out of hand now, it needs to stop.

[Fireflyb 920]

I don't know a whole lot about this whole thing, but there seems to be some people suggesting in this thread that it's not that bad grinding FS to 90 or 95 or whatever with just regular PvP/hunting, but that's not even relevant to this discussion, lol. Even if it's "not that bad" or actually is not that bad, people will alt-kill regardless and will probably alt-kill even if it's less efficient than PvP (which it of course isn't) because that's just the way they think. You don't look at a problem like this where people abuse a game mechanic to get higher gains than "honest gaming" (so to speak) and say "Well this clearly doesn't make any sense! I am so sure that hunting and PvPing for FS is a reasonable way to do it! These people can't be doing it with alts because it just doesn't make sense!!!"

If people want to do it, they'll do it unless there's a rule against it (in which case a few will do it and get punished) and then everyone will be happy and hug each other until the next thing like this pops up, and we get all this window of opportunity drama again...

[Gumbo 1,563]

Seriously lame. Any folks doing this should be embarrassed.

[Shrimpiie 3,665]

[11:05:07] Vynorachamp slain by Embolism Nadroj Nightfall Pinejon Garrettwademan Aamanus Aralin Christa

Second time. That Alt killing...

[Rolandt 825]

I believe that this should have been stopped long ago... Who really approved this from the GM team? Is Rolf nuts? I know for a fact JK, BL and MR have done it. But MR has taken it to a level that I do not agree with.

 

In my opinion, anyone killing lats should be reduced to 70 or 80fs.. something... at least stop it now ffs

[Emoo 4,357]

Would be nice to see something changed, removing the soft cap would be a suitable compromise I think. 

[Rolandt 825]

If that means me, because I have killed for affinitys, so be it... But I have never and will never kill for FS

 

We are playing wurm, a hard game, if you have to cheat. Go play minecraft guys

[WesncIsMe 492]

I can't tell if people are trolling in this thread or not...

[Orb 259]

If there's anything I've learned from Wurm. It's that everyone complains and the game doesn't matter. 

[Rolandt 825]

If anything ive learned about Orb, its that he will change his opinion at the moments notice as long as he feels part of the group.

 

A week ago he was bitching about this mechanic just the same

[Stormcrow 182]

Personally, I would reset everyone's FS based upon their mind speed. All kingdoms are guilty to some degree, people should have gotten this fixed before it became such an issue. But hey, I am probably biased being the only one to legitimately earn 99FS.

 

 

 

(Freedom only)

Edited February 9, 2014 by Stormcrow

[Brunwulf 470]

People with lots of money to spend will always be ahead.

Its like this for every game. However, if they want to waste tons of cash to make 70fs alts to "cheat" their FS then that's sad.

I don't understand people who use these gimmicks because it erases any kind of sense of achievement.