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saytheb

Rendering surface objects from inside a cave?

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I'm looking at fixing some rendering bugs that have been around a while, and fixed a "bug" that would prevent anything on the surface from rendering once you fully entered a cave. I've found a fix for this, but there may be a performance impact (if there is, it would be an option you could turn off to increase FPS).


 


Below is roughly what it would look like. So.. any interest?  :D


 


jFjLfha.jpg


 


What it previously appeared as:


sSwtNcP.jpg


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Yeah if the performance loss isn't too high I would say sure


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pretty! Would suggest to fix the ability to see everything from inside mine tho.. unless it is intentional (mine vision thingy). ;)


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looks good. If the performance is strictly for the client and you can disable it, there is no reason not to enable rendering.  As for the mine vision, being able to see things through mine walls, I love this "feature". Without, it would make mining in an old forgotten area quite a chore.


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I could always see out of my mine, so not sure I knew about this bug. However, if there is a small performance hit, it would probably be worthwile, since the hit will only be where you are actually in an area that can see out.


 


Will this also fix the cheaty hacky poke head through wall clipping view problem?


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If this will also impact the ability to poke your head into the walls of a mine to see where cave ins have happened, than I think it may cause more problems than it's worth.


 


Until mines are true 3D, and a lot of the weird restrictions on connecting tunnels are removed, take care with adjusting how to look around in mines.


 


If all this does is let people look out through mines, then sure.


 


Another thing to consider.  Will this change also allow creatures to see out of mines?  Based on their behaviors, I don't think they can (or they couldn't when I last played)


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I could always see out of my mine, so not sure I knew about this bug.

This, the only time I cannot see out of my mine is when I'm not looking at the entrance... Never even heard of this "bug"

 

Personally, I'd prefer a fix to boats + cave entrances over this very minor issue.

Edited by Shadz

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Shadz - when it comes to mines, fixing one bug might fix others.


 


If the outside of a cave is not visible from the inside - where does a boat go when you leave the cave?


 


This might actually BE the boat bug.


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Shadz - when it comes to mines, fixing one bug might fix others.

 

If the outside of a cave is not visible from the inside - where does a boat go when you leave the cave?

 

This might actually BE the boat bug.

 

Now, correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the boat bug usually happening when you are ENTERING the cave? Perhaps I am thinking of something different. I almost always get kicked off the boat when I enter a cave.

 

As to your idea, Freddie... er... Saytheb, I think that if this becomes toggable, as you say, then it would definitely be great to have :)

Edited by Valdor

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Yes, this would be toggleable.


 


This is only a rendering change on the client side, so creatures would have no change in their vision.


 


This was triggered when you stand inside of a mine, but not directly in the mine entrance tile (where we will still render the outside world).


 


The only reason I stumbled across this was fixing some other rendering bugs, I did not set out just to fix this specifically so rest east  :lol:.


 


No, this would not fix the boats entering canals bug. I may revisit that one if I have more time..


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Performance inside caves has always been much better than outside, so that performance drop probably wouldn't even be noticeable.


 


Unless you do something wrong, like rendering the entire area, just to fill that entrance.


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Sort of nice visual I guess but seems to be of little worth to spend any development time upon. Yes, an option to toggle it off would be best as I would then always have it off. If many people have it toggled off what's the point of it then? Something to consider.


 


=Ayes=


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You can actually see some items on the ground through the walls of mines currently, so the outside world is not entirely shut out... 


 


 


But, if you fix rendering bugs in mines. Please think of some new way of making nice mine designs because currently the only good means of finding hidden tunnels or aligning tunnels etc is to look through the walls. If you remove this "feature" it will severely alter the game. 


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Yes, this would be toggleable.

 

This is only a rendering change on the client side, so creatures would have no change in their vision.

 

This was triggered when you stand inside of a mine, but not directly in the mine entrance tile (where we will still render the outside world).

 

The only reason I stumbled across this was fixing some other rendering bugs, I did not set out just to fix this specifically so rest east  :lol:.

 

No, this would not fix the boats entering canals bug. I may revisit that one if I have more time..

That last sentence... If you do it. I'll love you forever lol

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@ Ayes - I see what you mean in your last reply. Makes sense. But I think the idea is that most people would actually have this feature turned ON. It's a small change to the world, as you say, so is it worth it? I think that's why Saytheb is asking us. Still, I think any improvement that makes the game a tad more realistic is worth it.


 


@ Torgrim - You bring up a very good point. The only way of detection of hidden and collapsed tunnels is looking through the walls, as it stands now. Losing that functionality would be very bad, as so many miners rely on it. It's not fully realistic, granted, but it's what we have and what we use. If the change to the rendering of the outside world removed this "functionality", it's definitely not a good idea to implement it.


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The only reason I stumbled across this was fixing some other rendering bugs, I did not set out just to fix this specifically so rest east  :lol:.

 

Sort of nice visual I guess but seems to be of little worth to spend any development time upon. Yes, an option to toggle it off would be best as I would then always have it off. If many people have it toggled off what's the point of it then? Something to consider.

 

You may have missed that line I quoted.

 

Though personally, I'm glad to be able to actually see that things are being fixed and moving along at all.

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If this doesn't impact performance too much, sure, looks nice!


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No, this would not fix the boats entering canals bug. I may revisit that one if I have more time..

That last sentence... If you do it. I'll love you forever lol

it's highly unlikely that a visual change will change anything with boats.

The problem with the bigger ships is the position of the player relative to the ship. The ships location is usually a tile in front of the players location. When the player reaches the tunnel exit the ship is already a tile ahead, in solid rock. The same happens when you hit a wall in the cave. By the time the player is stopped by the wall, the ship is already in the wall, inaccessible to the player.

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it's highly unlikely that a visual change will change anything with boats.

The problem with the bigger ships is the position of the player relative to the ship. The ships location is usually a tile in front of the players location. When the player reaches the tunnel exit the ship is already a tile ahead, in solid rock. The same happens when you hit a wall in the cave. By the time the player is stopped by the wall, the ship is already in the wall, inaccessible to the player.

If you read what I quoted, he said he may revisit that bug. That is what I was referring to.

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I would turn it off - I already freeze as I stand in the mine entrance tile (ancient PC, so not complaining). As all my mines have doors, and I guess those wouldn't become invisible, it would be of no use to me anyway.

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