Feedback request on fence stuff

[Anothernoob 102]

Thirdly, there is a lot of discussion when it comes to the "legal enclosures" rule on the freedom servers. Adding flying would make it impossible to uphold that rule since you wouldn't even have to break a fence in order to land in someones enclosure. The rule already seems to create a lot of situations that end up in a grey zone of who is right or wrong which is undesirable so many on the team want it to go away anyways.

Removing the enclosure rule completely would require adding other rules to protect newbies. Otherwise it would be like marking any stuff left in their farms as "Free stuff if you bash" and their animals as "Free skill if you bash".

 

While it doesn't protect people completely as fences can still be bashed or picked (it happened to me while I was still a froob) I think that it would be really disheartening for someone to hear that anyone with premium is free to break in whenever he wants and steal or kill whatever is not locked in a house.

 

However the fact that there are a few giant enclosures that virtually serve no use other than making navigation for other players difficult means that there are some loopholes in the current system that need to be patched. Adding a "maximum distance from house" restriction and possibly a rule to leave walkable paths every x tiles would be a good idea.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Anothernoob

[Dorian 865]

I like the idea of flying and jumping, however I live in my off deed farm on Indy supplying my village and alliance with crops and critters.  The legal enclosure stuff aside from keeping my critters from walking away and allowing me to avoid the spiders, wolves, trolls etc helps to keep what is mine, well mine!  There would have to be something in the mechanics that can protect my "back yard", like the locked doors and gates do now.  If that is completely negated and anyone can hop over my wall and take my stuff and kill my critters, sadly I would have to leave Wurm.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Dorian

[Anothernoob 102]

War machines throwing nets on flying creatures to make them fall on the ground or making the creatures randomly fall when getting seriously wounded (and causing a lot of fall damage to their riders this way) would be a good idea too but I think that making flying over deeds impossible would work better until better counters are implemented. If it is implemented it should be a high risk option for an attacker.

 

PS. Wouldn't flying cause too much trouble in the form of bugs/glitches? Being thrown on a tree can already get you stuck, and there would still be issues if you fell on a roof.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Anothernoob

[Flink 21]

I'm against flying primarily for a reason other than being able to get into people's deeds. It'll take away a lot of the mystery of the maps. Yeah, we have horses and boats and maps, but flying would just make the game worlds really small. It'd be cool, but look at WoW. With flying mounts available in all of the zones now nobody really interacts. 

[Amadee 1,543]

Very true, this is what I meant with looking to limit griefing oppertunities Rolf.

 

Even the post Kediec made about flying through the roof of peoples houses is an extremely good example of things that can be overlooked when adding a feature like this (it didnt even cross my mind that roofs are no-clip)..................................................

 

 

 

This, plus upper story balconies and patios with arched walls. 

 

Never underestimate the creativity of a dedicated griefer.  I remember the old days in UO where people would spend extreme amounts of time devising elaborate ways to get into people's houses.  I remember one exploit in particular that the actual getting in was so convoluted it must have taken them days of trial and error to accomplish it.  In wurm, our balconies and arched walls would just make their lives easier. 

Edited December 30, 2013 by Amadee

[Arkonick 557]

Id rather have steam and Electricity added to wurm before flying creatures and ability to jump peoples private walls.

 

Id also rather see UFO's before Flying Creatures or any ability to fly

Edited December 30, 2013 by Arkonick

[KanePT 699]

+1 to jumping.....flying...or what ever as this would add much much flavor to the game.

 

And......Let them make TALL WALLS to have legal enclosures.....Which I think are abused as it is now anyhow.

 

Reduce the size allowed to 2 tiles from the house and make the walls part of the houses barrier......

 

Yes.... I think its time to look at what exactly enclosures were supposed to do and what they have become.

2 tiles from house is too small for a newbie, and too big for a long time premium player (Who can make gargantuan houses multiple times), and since enclosures should be there more for newbies, i don't like that one much xp.

I'd rather have a limit on total perimeter, like max perimeter of 20 borders/walls, whatever you want to name the unit.

So in total you could have at best a 5x5 enclosure with 20 perimeter, but at the same time allows you not to do it perfectly square.

Edited December 30, 2013 by KanePT

[Chiqa 742]

1+ to revamping legal enclosures. they are way over used and abused.

1+ to jumping Not over legal deed fences etc. 

-1 to flying, not now, put this one back on the shelf for awhile. 

[Sharkin 1,319]

Jumping? we don't really need it. Haven't so far but I wouldn't die if it was added. Flying? SERIOUSLY??? It's new year eve tomorrow, calm down on the mead. -1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Flying sounds terrible to me. Good luck on the fence bugs though.

[As_I_Decay 1,592]

What's the point of having 10 different wall types if walls don't do a damn thing?

And this is exactly what I was talking about in that other thread pertaining mine slopes. You guys come up with some wild, undesirable fixes for "problems". Hell, I can't even manipulate a paved slope more than 20.... because of "griefers". SMH. It's a paved tile. 5 seconds to repave. So, i'm extremely limited in creativity, just to prevent "griefing".

And as Aeris said, I can't even lockpick stuff on the deed I am mayor of. In fact, i'm limited to do so many things in Wurm, yet, you're going to allow me to fly. If you're going to add extreme fantasy elements to the game, at least start letting us do some of the stuff that we should be able to do. 

Amadee was right too, most of you lot scream about realism... where are your voices now?

-1, big time. You have a problem with enclosure rules? Fine, get rid of them. Unless the wall is protecting paid land, it's free game to be knocked down. Everything else is fine. Stuck in a fence, use a catapult/maul.

[DonAngelo 263]

And to all other concerns about ppl flying In the deed and stealing/griefing  - So simple to fix, give option to enable/disable flying option over deeds on freedom.

 

Or if its Gliding system, you can glide in, but not out lol, for that you need to be in far higher ground to get anywhere.

 

All of ppl fears about abusing it could be solved very easy.

 

Pvp, while gliding have no defensive, no blocking, no parry, easy target, ppl would think twice before flying/gliding over enemies just being a big archery target with no chance to block arrows

 

Ppl are just overreacting highlighting any possible bad things about it.

Grief What exactly on Freedom..? Deed settings doesnt allow non citizens to attack animals or pick up items on deed outside houses. What could you possibly grief on freedom? All is managed with deed settings to prevent it.

 

On a side note, wurm for me always ment (sorta) Unlimited Freedom to do what you desire, building, teraforming, Shaping the world by your desire. 1 word to explain Wurm for me, its Freedom.

Giving option to fly/glide, whatever, would only expand this feeling of freedom beyond limits.

Edited December 30, 2013 by DonAngelo

[RainRain 591]

I can see this being a scenario reward.

[Serpentarius 186]

Add flying or jumping if you want Rolf , but if you do at least add "lockable hatch/trapdoors" to the ceiling openings we can build.

[rosedragon 2,282]

- Separating the Take item permission on the deed settings from the tame animals permission, and maybe move these into roles, allowing us to give such permissions only to allies or certain citizens only.

So want this! Effing annoying when I just want alliance as added friends.. Or to make sure that the new newbs that other deed invite is not spy etc etc..

 

And as Aeris said, I can't even lockpick stuff on the deed I am mayor of. In fact, i'm limited to do so many things in Wurm, yet, you're going to allow me to fly. If you're going to add extreme fantasy elements to the game, at least start letting us do some of the stuff that we should be able to do. 

Agree. Stuck with bsbs locked by villagers suck.

 

Both enclosure rule and perimeter overtaking house are need overhaul. Seen many poor newcomers get theirs house perimetered even that they are active and not making troubles. Enclosure.. both parties have in... it help newbies making farm but also allow vets to make crazy stuffs.

 

Don't like both jumping and flying. We on freedom put different fences as decorative.. if we need tall fences to prevent people jumping over.. that will be awful.. everything need to be walled.. everything will be fortress..  

[Libertha 145]

stop making new things when there are plenty of current features which could use attention.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Libertha

[atazs 965]

As i said... Just put 50 body control requirement for flying so that those who get it will know better than to abuse and won't need to. 

[vill 248]

Flying, jumping....

 

 

Where is combat update??

Edited December 30, 2013 by vill

[KanePT 699]

So want this! Effing annoying when I just want alliance as added friends.. Or to make sure that the new newbs that other deed invite is not spy etc etc..

 

Agree. Stuck with bsbs locked by villagers suck.

 

Both enclosure rule and perimeter overtaking house are need overhaul. Seen many poor newcomers get theirs house perimetered even that they are active and not making troubles. Enclosure.. both parties have in... it help newbies making farm but also allow vets to make crazy stuffs.

 

Don't like both jumping and flying. We on freedom put different fences as decorative.. if we need tall fences to prevent people jumping over.. that will be awful.. everything need to be walled.. everything will be fortress..

I agree with most of your post, helps that the first paragraph is agreeing with one of my posts. xp

I don't think everything has to be a fortress, problem is for flying and/or jumping to work (and i stand that jumping would be a awesome addition) stuff needs to change specially on deed permissions. Which is why i suggested those before, but i can think of more, like disallowing killing non-aggro animals on deed by default. Maybe even give people who jump fences into other people's deeds a instant negative reputation. Stuff like that.

You can jump other people's fences in real life, but you don't, because its illegal and you don't want to get arrested if caught.

So stuff like the KOS while people are in the deed needs to be reviewed, and etc.

 

The problem isn't jumping or flying mechanics on itself, its just that wurm has been operating under the basis that its inhabitants have 50 ton feet, and can't move of the ground. If that changes, all systems that are based on that assumption would need to be changed, but it isn't that much. Not on freedom at least. And flying would be the ultimate freedom (hint-hint).

 

Of course on PvP we'd need even more balance, but if you don't already make your deed as a fortress on PvP, well... You shouldn't be there.

 

 

Id rather have steam and Electricity added to wurm before flying creatures and ability to jump peoples private walls.

 

Id also rather see UFO's before Flying Creatures or any ability to fly

There are already flying creatures in wurm, but they can't fly and this leads to smart-ass players to pen them up (which is unintended) and then summoning up a horde of high level players, kill them and then make real life "fortunes" by selling the loot.

As in Dragons.

Edited December 30, 2013 by KanePT

[GroeneAppel 373]

YES

+1 To this. Fund it

[As_I_Decay 1,592]

There are already flying creatures in wurm, but they can't fly and this leads to smart-ass players to pen them up (which is unintended) and then summoning up a horde of high level players, kill them and then make real life "fortunes" by selling the loot.

As in Dragons.

Every dragon event i've been invited to (that majority of the public has also been invited to) has given out drake sets to all the attendees who fought the dragon. It's not really a case of "one person getting rich". The real problem lies in the fact that there are a limited amount of dragons spawned, and once these killings take place, the future players miss out.

Hopefully that will pretty much get fixed when Rolf seriously takes a look at adding a PVE hunting only server. Unless he adds no-drop uniques, in which no one will bother hunting them anyway.

[Castile 167]

How about and option on my form to kos the entire server except the people I chose.

Should work to keep flyers off my deed.

[Gamurin 55]

-1 for flying. It will break whole PvP and bring it far away from medieval

[Anothernoob 102]

How about and option on my form to kos the entire server except the people I chose.

Should work to keep flyers off my deed.

It would probably do more harm to you. If riding a flying creature has a high BC requirement my guess is that a player with such skills would be able to kill the guards, while this would start a KOS-drama with other people on your server who weren't in the "exluded" list and got attacked.

 

The best solution for flying and Freedom is not to add it at all (it has already happened with sorcery).

Edited December 30, 2013 by Anothernoob

[Castile 167]

Yes I know, I was trying to make a point by being be absurd just like the way I feel about

a flying.

[Valdor 1,426]

While I like the idea and the possibilities it adds, I am thinking that it will create a lot of havoc. Take the legal enclosure rule, for instance:

 

Even putting flying aside, if I can jump over a fence from a dirt wall, nothing stops me from coming to someone's legal enclosure and building a small dirt raise by his fence. Once it is high enough, I jump over the fence, take anything that is not locked down and then build a similar rise on the inside of the enclosure to jump out. Deeds would prevent such a behavior, but non-deeded legal enclosures won't, because they won't stop me from digging.

 

Now, there a could be an argument that states that the person who owns the legal enclosure should lock all their chests inside and never leave anything laying about. After all, this is what is done on Epic. But that's what Epic is for - high risk high reward gameplay - while Freedom offers a much safer experience. If players on Freedom now have to worry about being robbed and broken into, and the lands outside and inside their legal enclosure terraformed by strangers hungry for access, this changes how Freedom is played more towards Epic. And we already have Epic clusters. Those seeking this kind of thrill should go there.

 

To me, the above example (which I hope is presented clearly enough to make sense) is just the tip of the iceberg. While the idea of jumping and flying does sound very cool, it opens so many cans of worms that it may end up being destructive. Additionally, when I think of jumping and flying, I immediately remember games like WoW and action based MMOs, the crowds they generate and the attmosphere they bring with them. Wurm is different. I think one of many features that set us appart from those games is that there is no silly flying or similar gimmicks. It's more realistic for the time period the game portrays. The lack of these features add to the game's appeal, not subtract from it.

 

I don't remember too many players making a case for being able to jump, as jumping would just be an unnecessary and quite silly-looking indulgence in Wurm. Flying may be more appealing, but the potential game-changing ramifications would have to be well debated for quite some time before such an implementation.