Poll: Making Pristine And Release Connected To The Freedom Cluster?

[Gypsy 138]

The strongest argument FOR joining the servers is that it WON'T change anything. So why change anything if it won't change anything ? Leave it alone.

 

When people say that, they are saying that to you personally, and the other people with an exaggerated expectation of the coming change. You guys will stay put, and your community will still be intact, and if you can stick out the shatter changes your priests will still be useful. Things will change a lot for the guy who has a deed up the road from you, or me, and wants a change of scenery, and now has the freedom to go ANYWHERE =)

 

By the way, I would miss that guy. He's very nice and not a zombie troll bent on destruction. But I wouldn't begrudge him the move.

 

In any case, as others have said. +1 to closing the thread. Not much more to be said here.

[Ame 99]

some are allways blackmailing Rolf with taking off premium or leaving wurm if something happens... just go with the popular choices and be happy wurm is alive.

[Isosceles 27]

 

better for the economy. better for the scared little fish in the new cluster.

 

My instinct is to hide like the wiley fish, in this barrel!

 

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtFwpXcH-Tw

[ishimitsukai 20]

some are allways blackmailing Rolf with taking off premium or leaving wurm if something happens... just go with the popular choices and be happy wurm is alive.

its not alive atm is it ? giggle ... i voted for joining even if i  like having both sets of toons ( would just like to be able to mail to myself freely)

[Drayka 485]

New Freedom cluster <--> Chaos <---> Old Freedom cluster

 

It would be very interesting to see what the voting would be like given that THIS would be the setup for connection.

[Hussars 511]

i still haven't seen a reason for it being okay for new players/characters starting on P/R now or in the future to compete against their vets, but not their vets to compete against the old cluster' characters.

[Sir Arowhun 473]

I'm not from the new cluster, but I don't think it would cause you guys too many issues if the servers were connected.

Edited November 9, 2013 by Sir Arowhun

[Isosceles 27]

New Freedom cluster <--> Chaos <---> Old Freedom cluster

 

I suggested something to this effect on page 7, using distance as a barrier. It didn't get a lot of attention from the players arguing greed vs exploration. 

[Drayka 485]

That's one good thing about a thread running this long. Once all the obvious topics have been done to death, the overlooked posts can be revived.

[Niclamus 17]

I suggested something to this effect on page 7, using distance as a barrier. It didn't get a lot of attention from the players arguing greed vs exploration. 

 

Noooooooooooo.  No chaos.  Never force people into a PVP area on a non-PVP cluster.  Not good game design

[JDBooker 344]

That's one good thing about a thread running this long. Once all the obvious topics have been done to death, the overlooked posts can be revived.

 

 

yey dogs ...vomit ...save me some lumps!

 

personally i think this whole downtime puts the question to scale ...wont we all be glad to get back online connected to each other or not?

 

maybe this whole downtime is a cunning scam and we'll get back to find one kickass huge merged map!!!!

Edited November 9, 2013 by JDBooker

[Xirith 22]

I didn't vote initially, but after reading drayka's post #384 I decided to vote yes.  While the post is incredibly well written, the attitude behind it is why I feel that pristine/release should be brought into the fold.  Viewing yourselves as versions of our founding fathers trying to break away from the tyranny of the old cluster is terrible for the community of "wurmanians" in my opinion.  If you were going to compare your struggle to an American war it should have been compared to the civil war.  Both sides will likely view themselves as just so i'll skip straight to the part where it was better that the states were united in the end. (some on both sides still disagree there)  It is the land of Wurm, there is no need for a little separate Wurm.

 

Colonists coming to America also brought their skills with them.

 

As to the economic issues, from reading these posts it seems like one group of greedy people is attempting to keep another group of greedy people from decreasing their profits.  

 

Seems most of the problems could be solved by simply having the "crown" levy a tariff on all imports to the mini-cluster. Wanna bring in a ship full of tools, 1s ea tool. Add a similar tariff on mailed items and your fledgling economy is safe.  Crafters could still bring their skills but the value of the goods would remain artificially inflated.

[sunshadow21 4]

New Freedom cluster <--> Chaos <---> Old Freedom cluster

 

I suggested that earlier. It gives connectivity which makes things easier for the devs (and that is a key point that many people on P/R are missing)and those few who are willing to make the long trip across chaos while preserving a sense of isolation for Pristine and Release. Those who want a perpetually separate cluster are going to be disappointed because even if it changes little to merge them on the player side, on the server side, it is going to have a major impact. Having two separate clusters means a lot of the basic databases and such have to be duplicated and updated separately. Given that the only argument remaining is one of "I don't want to play in someone else's sandbox," I don't see the devs being overly eager about continuing making things harder on their end when there's little evidence that the community is going to immediately fall apart just because of a few border crossings. After all, each server on the older cluster has it's own identity despite not having the advantage of forming on their own; the communities on P/R will change, but the core will almost certainly stay intact.

[sunshadow21 4]

Noooooooooooo.  No chaos.  Never force people into a PVP area on a non-PVP cluster.  Not good game design

 

Ordinarly, I would agree, but in this case, it could actually be helpful. Forcing people to risk PVP to cross between would be enough of a risk that people would actually have to want to cross over, limiting even further would what already be a fairly limited migration.

[Kadore 926]

Ordinarly, I would agree, but in this case, it could actually be helpful. Forcing people to risk PVP to cross between would be enough of a risk that people would actually have to want to cross over, limiting even further would what already be a fairly limited migration.

 

I didn't think Arrowhun posted with so many alt accounts.

[Drayka 485]

I think it is an interesting idea worth exploring the pros and cons of.

 

If there is a technical reason that makes keeping the clusters separate unlikely, then what is the best alternative ?

 

Running the guantlet of PvP would be in some senses a fair exchange on the 'price of passage' concept, and I'm sure there are elements of the new cluster that would welcome having access to PvP with their existing character.

 

Does it detract from the pioneer concept that you have to be willing to brave PvP to get here, therefore meaning that those with a PvP attitude are the ones ending up here as opposed to more 'peaceful' people, or is it actually in keeping with the pioneer spirit of braving hardships ?

[Pashka 707]

Traveling is a hardship in itself.  It only takes forever to go anywhere as it is.  That is enough.  People that are traveling from a pve to a pve have no reason to go through pvp and die because they wanted to travel.  That is beyond ridiculous.  I can't imagine Rolf ever even considering such a notion.

[Kadore 926]

I think it is an interesting idea worth exploring the pros and cons of.

 

If there is a technical reason that makes keeping the clusters separate unlikely, then what is the best alternative ?

 

Running the guantlet of PvP would be in some senses a fair exchange on the 'price of passage' concept, and I'm sure there are elements of the new cluster that would welcome having access to PvP with their existing character.

 

Does it detract from the pioneer concept that you have to be willing to brave PvP to get here, therefore meaning that those with a PvP attitude are the ones ending up here as opposed to more 'peaceful' people, or is it actually in keeping with the pioneer spirit of braving hardships ?

 Pitting new players wishing to explore against seasoned PMK's with players that hone skills to kill as a group is close to the most clever idea I've seen today, why not add a tariff like suggested above so if you do survive you can pay 10c an item, worn and in inventory, and a Euro to silver cost for all drake, and half the silver value of your boat ... using the fair pricing system of P and R of course. 

 

Being stuck at the spawn point on Chaos with no inventory or a boat will really gain Rolf a lot of support from people.

[JDBooker 344]

i do agree i see chaos as a way to create a "semipermiable membrane" to keep some isolation, but also allow some trade to flow.

trade routes across a dangerous land will ALWAYS increase value of goods on both sides.

 

even better would be to create "something" that's unique to each side of the gap so that traders have always got something that's needed on the other side.

like the old spice road, tea and spice from the east and medical supplies and technology from the west.

if it's going to happen, lets make it dangerous to trade, but make it profitable for both "continents".

[Drayka 485]

 Pitting new players wishing to explore against seasoned PMK's with players that hone skills to kill as a group ..

 

Well, that just means our veterans will make themselves useful as escorts and protection details.

[Isosceles 27]

I have an idea, how about each cluster gets an additional new island, and in 6 months a new island is added joining the two? Make the journey between them long and hard, add to the sense of adventure and accomplishment when someone travels from Release all the way to Chaos.

 

 

I think that could be a really good idea. Building on this... how about getting between P&R and the old freedom cluster is made very difficult at first - time constraints, more islands to get across, etc - but over time, "New Passages/Routes" could be "discovered" (ie added later by devs) and so all server borders could be brought continually closer together.

 

That kind of idea would make trade harder at first, helping to protect the younger P&R economy - but old and new freedom players alike would still at least with some difficulty be able to cross over to the opposing clusters. A gradual change is much better imho than a quick one

 

 

Actually, I would see this as a reasonable compromise since the merge has been planned from the start anyway, just a matter of when.  Neither side would be 100% happy, I'm sure, but it would be fair to both.

 

Resurrecting my concept, involves putting chaos at the far end and pristine at the other end:

P > R >New Island (now) > NewIsland(6mo) > New Island (now)  > Cele > E > D > I > Chaos

Edited November 9, 2013 by Isosceles

[Kadore 926]

Resurrecting my concept, involves putting chaos at the far end and pristine at the other end:

P > R > Cele > E > D > I > Chaos

Why not 1/4 speed on all current boats while we're at it, if want to make it harder to get to those servers.

[Isosceles 27]

Time is money. As it is now, takes about 30-45 minutes in good wind (90-120 minutes in bad) to cross a server. Why should you be able to quickly get to any given place? If you want to go from one side of the world to the other, it takes time.

 

With the added barrier islands, it would take 5-15 hours to get across the servers. From one side of the "world" to the other. I think that's a fair barrier. 

Edited November 9, 2013 by Isosceles

[Kadore 926]

Time is money. As it is now, takes about 30-45 minutes in good wind (90-120 minutes in bad) to cross a server. Why should you be able to quickly get to any given place? If you want to go from one side of the world to the other, it takes time.

 

With the added barrier islands, it would take 5-15 hours to get across the servers. From one side of the "world" to the other. I think that's a fair barrier. 

I'm not sure everyone shares your opinion.

[Drayka 485]

Clarify this for me, is there any risk involved in a non PvP server crossing, or is it merely the amount of time you have to spend sailing ?

 

Assuming it's only time, how does going from 'you have to start a whole new character from scratch' compared to 'spend a longer time sailing' constitute a fair exchange, or even a gradual change ?