Poll: Making Pristine And Release Connected To The Freedom Cluster?

[Kegan 3,926]

voted no!!!

 

I dont think they should be connected EVER!!!

That wont happen he already said they would be joined 

[Emane 158]

I thought we were told by Rolf that only pristine release players would be able to vote..WTF...we gonna get screwed by those who dont even play here currently. 4 servers populations against two..BS.  Also we were told probably one more new server before connecting in live dev chat?..havent seen that yet either. 

 

More misleading...kinda like Obama I guess. 

 

Voted HELL NO! We dont want them here!

Edited November 7, 2013 by Emane

[Vroomfondel 1,128]

It was really a mistake to make them separate from the rest of the Freedom cluster to begin with, and it is time the experiment was over.  Let them join!

[Windguaerd 32]

Hell no!

 

Right now the number of asshats is small, but by connecting to others servers, the asshat ratio would increase too much and then those who are active in Pristine and Release may decide to quit. If you need more players in Freedom Cluster... figure it out without messing with the 2 servers which are quite happy as they are.

[Explora 569]

The market prices on Pristine/Release aren't similar to the old cluster for enchantments, they're a lot higher.

That's because one year isn't very long for priest characters to grind their Soul Depth up.  Anybody who's been grinding priest skills for the last year on the new cluster might as well give up if they get connected, they won't be able to compete with the much older priests.

 

That's going to mean less premium priest subscriptions.

[Windguaerd 32]

PS: How can you see if the votes in this poll are specifically from Release and Pristine players and not from Freedom Cluster players? I don't think the forum is set to differentiate between one player or another based on server..

[Kegan 3,926]

Hell no!

 

Right now the number of asshats is small, but by connecting to others servers, the asshat ratio would increase too much and then those who are active in Pristine and Release may decide to quit. If you need more players in Freedom Cluster... figure it out without messing with the 2 servers which are quite happy as they are.

I would think this would make you happy there is no real good bulk goods market on most of the old cluster you could step in and amp up your operation and take it over, lol

[Ruger 610]

First of all they have nothing to lose when it comes to the Economy. I'd like you to point out a single example of prices being lower on the new cluster. If you think the old and new servers are "very close" in pricing then please go check the market place forums again. Weapons and enchants would be a good place to start, pretty much anything that requires crafting skill has a wide difference. 

 

Also please don't write like you're the only adult and you're addressing a group of children in kindergarden. We might have different opinions, but being this arrogant makes it hard to take you seriously. It's almost as if you're incapable of understanding other people having a different opinion than you.

Your right they don't have anything to lose when it comes to economy, it looks like they have something to gain, look below. So I will adjust my tone as soon as a Pristine/Release player comes on here and can support their argument with facts rather then "No it will hurt our economy!". These are just a couple examples and I found them within the first couple posts on the merchant threads of each. I am 100% sure I can find more and could do a full spreadsheet on how close the economies are and how pristine/release is cheaper in areas but I wont spend the time because its not needed. Anyone can quickly look and with basic math and common sense skill see it.

 

Tools:

Release merchant tools are cheaper up to 80ql which then they become the same price. Continuing to compare these two merchants, there prices are very close in pricing.

 

Release Merchant Fujiwaras - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/82246-release-fujiwaras-smithing-shop/

Deliverance Merchant Caltas - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/86232-caltas-schmiede-blacksmith-weaponsmith-and-chain-armors/

 

Another tool comparison:

Release is cheaper.

 

Celebration Blacksmith Merchant  Maximillian - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/90232-stormwind-blacksmithing-and-enchants-celebration/

Release Blacksmith Merchant Necroe - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/83127-repsite-smiths-group-home-of-the-lowest-prices-on-release/

 

Leatherworking:

Release merchant is cheaper on toolbelts and saddles. *Added another merchant who is also same boat as Czary.

 

Release Merchant Czarnymurzyn - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/90262-release-czarnymurzyn-the-high-tanner-leatherworking/

Release Merchant Lothak - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/88590-release-lothaks-leatherworkshop/

Old Cluster Shads - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/90094-shads-leatherworking-90ql/

 

Weaponsmithing: This is a goodie since WHYKILLME is the weaponsmith. A perfect example of an old player using old tricks for new skill on a new server and of course this is one the things you told me to look at.

Whykillme, the Pristine weaponsmith is much cheaper then lancelot. Anyone who plays on Freedom knows that lancelot is one the main weaponsmiths of the old freedom cluster.

 

Pristine Weaponsmith Whykillme - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/88747-pristine-weaponsmith/

Freedom Weaponsmith Lancelot - http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/36899-lancelots-weaponry/

Edited November 7, 2013 by Ruger

[Terpsichore 71]

This poll is to decide what the players want, not what we want obviously. It is brought about because it is highly requested by the players and nothing else.

 

I suspect a lot of players are against it, but never raised their voice because it was already the current situation.

 

Either way, as a player that started in february of this year and no skills in the 90's despite being online an awful lot, I would hate to have nothing left to trade aside from bulk grunt work because those of the old servers can surpass me in every single skill and for cheaper too.

[BibiWaffles 213]

No way! The economy on pristine and release isnt ready for the older clusters yet.

 

Also, older clusters should have a seperate topic to release and pristine players to vote, im sure this can be done somehow. They have a lot more players than Release and Pristine and ofc want them connected for the fresh land (understandable) but i find this poll to wide range and bias. Just my 2 cents.

[Anothernoob 102]

Hell no!

We're quite happy on our little cluster and really don't need older players destroying the game for us nor littering our beautifull lands with the broken mechanic that is trader deeds. You cannot compare the skills across the two clusters in any way shape or form and the act of linking the servers is simply a short term boost to falling player numbers when instead you should fix the reasons for this fall in numbers.

This vote should be solely decided by the population of pristine and release.

 

The truth regarding trader deeds: 

The older players have dropped trader deeds on the new servers since month 1.

Make an alt on the old servers and explore a bit. Do the same on one of the new servers. You will be surprised if you count the number of "small deeds with only a 3x3 house or similar structures".

 

The truth about skills:

First of all you already have people offering 90+ql goods.

Secondly I prefer comparing prices of goods.

 

Take a look at the prices on the merchant boards (Ruger has a few links in his previous posts):

If you don't make ships, drake sets, weapons or vynora enchants you charge pretty much the same or even less than the people of the old cluster. 

If you are a weaponsmith, drake merchant, shipbuilder or vynora priest you can still charge almost the double on the new cluster. But it will not last for much longer. If you are one of them or if you have deeded one of the few utmost gold/iron veins on your server then you have a reason to nag. 

 

What I have to admit though is that I would expect to see 2 polls, one for each cluster, linked to a "debate-like thread" with the pros and cons of each choice.

 

In any case, I want to make a suggestion:

If the decision is no, allow players FROM the NEW cluster to do an 1 way trip with only their money and their skills TO the OLD cluster. If 1 way sounds hard, give them 1 chance to go back within a month. I don't think that anyone from the old cluster would have any problem with this and these players would be able to use a portal and get access to cheaper enchants,  access to Chaos, Hota statues and such.

Edited November 7, 2013 by Anothernoob

[silakka 2,360]

sooner or later, so why not for xmas ?

[thrundarr 23]

I have a toon on Pristine, as well as Celebration. I would like to be able to Move my Cel toon to Pristine. So I vote Yes. (If it don't mess up the Pristine economy, and that is anyone's guess.)

[waarokku 61]

of course connect them. its about time. all south of cele!

[Alyeska 2,621]

So.. the big reason folks don't want them connected.. is because they're worried they can't make as much money?

 

 

I recall reading many many many threads about dragon armour where the argument always was that "letting people make money" "keeping the market intact" should never be an argument against improving gameplay.

[DKSprocket 412]

I am 100% sure I can find more and could do a full spreadsheet on how close the economies are and how pristine/release is cheaper in areas but I wont spend the time because its not needed. Anyone can quickly look and with basic math and common sense skill see it.

Tools: true Fujiwara mostly has same prices as the old servers, and even cheaper in one category (70ql tools).

 

Chain armor: 3s for 80ql on old servers, 6.5s for 70ql on new servers

 

Ore: 5s for 100kg of 90ql iron on the new servers (Fujiwara). You could get 500-1000kg for that on the old servers.

 

Enchants: Compare this to old server prices: http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/77697-enchanted-items-for-sale-new-prices/

 

Weapons: 1.5s for 90ql on old servers, 2.5s for 80ql on new servers. Whykillme can barely make 80ql, it will take ages before anyone can start selling 90ql. Whykillme is very far ahead of everyone else and not playing very actively anymore. The new servers only has two weaponsmiths over 70 skill, how do you think that will hold up against the old servers with 95 skill weaponsmiths?

 

I don't see the relevance of a few people being experienced grinders from the old servers. As far as I know the only high skill players who were also big grinders on the old servers are Whykillme (Blastspawn) and Envious (Shindar).

 

As Explora mentioned it's completely ridiculous for enchanters. I'm quite sure there's only 2 enchanters with more than 75 channeling on the new servers and no one has over 35 soul depth. Compare that to all the 90+ channeling / 60+ soul depth players on the old servers.

 

I'm not saying the economy should be the only factor, but it was stressed by Rolf that keeping the economies separate until they were comparable was a big factor.

Edited November 7, 2013 by DKSprocket

[Kegan 3,926]

Tools: true Fujiwara mostly has same prices as the old servers, and even cheaper in one category (70ql tools).

 

Chain armor: 3s for 80ql on old servers, 6.5s for 70ql on new servers

 

Ore: 5s for 100kg of 90ql iron on the new servers (Fujiwara). You could get 500-1000kg for that on the old servers.

 

Enchants: Compare this to old server prices: http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/77697-enchanted-items-for-sale-new-prices/

 

Weapons: 1.2s vs. 2.5s for 80ql, old servers is 1.5s for 90ql. Whykillme can barely make 80ql, it will take ages before anyone can start selling 90ql. Whykillme is very far ahead of everyone else and not playing very actively anymore. The new servers only has two weaponsmiths over 70 skill, how do you think that will hold up against the old servers with 95 skill smiths?

 

I don't see the relevance of a few people being experienced grinders from the old servers. As far as I know the only high skill players who were also big grinders on the old servers are Whykillme (Blastspawn) and Envious (Shindar).

 

As Explora mentioned it's completely ridiculous. I'm quite sure there's only 2 enchanters with more than 75 channeling on the new servers and no one has over 35 soul depth. Compare that to all the 90+ channeling / 60+ soul depth players on the old servers.

 

I'm not saying the economy should be the only factor, but it was stressed by Rolf that keeping the economies separate until they were comparable was a big factor.

Well sounds like to me you guys are ripping people off time for them to step up and take a stand and vote yes for cheaper prices on goods. 

Edited November 7, 2013 by Kegan

[Coastis 321]

So.. the big reason folks don't want them connected.. is because they're worried they can't make as much money?

 

 

I recall reading many many many threads about dragon armour where the argument always was that "letting people make money" "keeping the market intact" should never be an argument against improving gameplay.

 

Reasons aside, we essentially have a poll where the majority of the population are obviously going to vote yes because they have nothing to lose, which makes the whole vote pointless at best.

[Mormo 353]

And southern of cele then?

More important for me is to give for JK opportunity to cross for instance the eastern border to travel to the freedom cluster safely and for MR the western one.

[Terpsichore 71]

So.. the big reason folks don't want them connected.. is because they're worried they can't make as much money?

 

 

I recall reading many many many threads about dragon armour where the argument always was that "letting people make money" "keeping the market intact" should never be an argument against improving gameplay.

I'm hardly making any money at the moment...but this connecting of servers will give the newest players not even a remote chance to compete with the older ones...not much fun in a sandbox game that relies heavily on trading and skills. 

 

And It's also about hunting grounds being deeded or hunted to extinction by those who do not care about the new servers as they have their own server to go back to, this was already the case with pristine using release as their personal hunting grounds (where did the dragons go?). It's only going to get worse.

[kazkid 23]

NO NO NO WE DONT WANT IT

 

Quoting ROLF

 

Posted 18 January 2013 - 01:48 PM

The new servers will be joined with the existing freedom cluster when it's time, which I don't see happening in many months. Someone asked if it could take 2 years, and yes there is no set time limit, but I have a hunch that it's going to happen before that.
If people on those servers strongly oppose to joining until then and there are no other strong reasons to keep the cluster together that's how long it may take. I think many of you can make advanced estimates out of this information and since I don't have any more at the moment that's what we have to live with. If you absolutely _have_ to know because you can't plan otherwise.. I suggest you.. reconsider 

We may add some checkbox that players on those servers can click which shows if they're opposed or pro joining. This will give a good indicator. 

 

 

http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/73972-a-comment-on-joining-the-pristinerelease-servers-with-the-other-servers/

 

 

What happened to PRISTINE/RELEASE ONLY VOTE! 4 servers vs two..yeah that is fair (did ya catch the sarcasm there)

Edited November 7, 2013 by kazkid

[Ruger 610]

Weapons: 1.2s vs. 2.5s for 80ql, old servers is 1.5s for 90ql. Whykillme can barely make 80ql, it will take ages before anyone can start selling 90ql. Whykillme is very far ahead of everyone else and not playing very actively anymore. The new servers only has two weaponsmiths over 70 skill, how do you think that will hold up against the old servers with 95 skill smiths?

 

As Explora mentioned it's completely ridiculous. I'm quite sure there's only 2 enchanters with more than 75 channeling on the new servers and no one has over 35 soul depth. Compare that to all the 90+ channeling / 60+ soul depth players on the old servers.

 

I'm not saying the economy should be the only factor, but it was stressed by Rolf that keeping the economies separate until they were comparable was a big factor.

[11:13:52 AM] Ruger: Hey whats the stats on your pris/rel vyn priest?

[11:14:05 AM] Ruger: channeling and soul depth that is.

[11:14:21 AM] XXXXX: iirc 78 chan 41 SD

 

Just because everyone is not fully public with there stats doesn't mean there are people higher out there. As far as weaponsmiths over 95 on the old cluster, who? I think there is only one, maybe two and I am 100% confident one of them isn't active. There are maybe no more then 5-10 weaponsmiths over 90 that are public with it.

[Kuwani 16]

I've voted no on this because I don't want to be mixed in with all of the overly aged servers and players. I started playing Wurm when Pristine and Release came out. I only played for about two months, but I paid both for two accounts, a reasonable sized deed, and got a friend to come on board who also paid for her time as well. We only started because there was a new space where we wouldn't be swamped with high skill players around us as a big part of the allure to us was untamed hostile land.

 

When I felt like coming back last month the first thing I checked was if the two new servers were connected or not. If they had been connected I wouldn't have sunk money in again or pulled in friend who also put money in. I believe it is a good thing to have as clean-ish place for new players or as close to possible. An isolated Pristine and Release are that solution seeing as we can't just pop up new servers all the time. I would suggest that until their is a new server that can be isolated that Pristine and Release remain that isolated group to give as much of that new and wild feel to new comers as can be afforded.

[Kegan 3,926]

NO NO NO WE DONT WANT IT

 

Quoting ROLF

 

Posted 18 January 2013 - 01:48 PM

The new servers will be joined with the existing freedom cluster when it's time, which I don't see happening in many months. Someone asked if it could take 2 years, and yes there is no set time limit, but I have a hunch that it's going to happen before that.

If people on those servers strongly oppose to joining until then and there are no other strong reasons to keep the cluster together that's how long it may take. I think many of you can make advanced estimates out of this information and since I don't have any more at the moment that's what we have to live with. If you absolutely _have_ to know because you can't plan otherwise.. I suggest you.. reconsider 

We may add some checkbox that players on those servers can click which shows if they're opposed or pro joining. This will give a good indicator. 

 

 

http://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/73972-a-comment-on-joining-the-pristinerelease-servers-with-the-other-servers/

 

 

What happened to PRISTINE/RELEASE ONLY VOTE!

You are overlooking the "We may add" part meaning they may or may not they chose to not i guess and make it fair to everyone.

[kazkid 23]

So.. the big reason folks don't want them connected.. is because they're worried they can't make as much money?

 

 

I recall reading many many many threads about dragon armour where the argument always was that "letting people make money" "keeping the market intact" should never be an argument against improving gameplay.

 

 

More a case of not wanting your egotistical jackbutts here at all for any reason. we do just fine without you all Thank You.