Wurm Online News Announcement: Our Current Focus

[splize 2]

maps don't bother me at all drop me anywhere in wurm and ill find my way out ive played long enough o know the lands it would be nice for newbies but i agree with the no you are here marker and don't show deeds just a map of the terrain would be fine. that way people can just look around and see oh there's a lake to north a mountain to east and a ocean south i must be here like they did in the old pioneer days.

[Keldun 335]

It's a great idea to focus on the first five hours of the game, but before that you should have rather focused on the first five minutes of the game.

 

You really have to do something about the game's performance. Peple don't care what the game play is like when there is no game play at all.

 

not even two years ago I was playing two clients on medium, or one on high, then it got rapidly and progressively worse. So that I had to use one client on minimum settings.

 

Well there was a so called performance upgrade earlier this year. Well, It was so great that I even had to stop measuring performance in FPS. I'm on FPM now! and there are no settings left I could set any lower.

[Menoch 10]

Maybe you failed to read the part where it says there will be no "you are here" marker. Meaning you can't look at the map and instantly find where you are, its the same as playing windowed with community map open. Actually the in-game map has less features. Of course prejudice, ignorance, and well, some other bad words i'd like to say, but best not, will always stand in the way of making wurm a better game, because what prevails on many of the older players is the "if i had to go through it, then everyone else will have to" kind of sentiment.

 

Not wanting a map in game is not prejudice, ignorance, nor should bad words be slung hitherto or in anyone's general direction if they voice their opinion about how they would like the game to stay or become.

Once again, I am a noob to the second power.  I'm at the end of my third week in Wurm and have died twice.  I have no map.  It is not that I have better luck than anyone else, nor am I smarter than any other player by far... trust me.. I can be pretty daft at times.  I just realized right away that this game is not your average mmorpg.

This game is not about running headfirst into a blueberry hedge with your mouth open hoping to fill your hunger bar. (being sarcastic).

 

It is a game that invokes thought and planning.  Just like real life (and I am aware that this is not real life... however it is a RL simulation in a whole slew of ways), if you head into the wilderness unprepared, unawares, and without a clue, you will have a challenge ahead of you merely staying alive.  Handing a map to a noob still makes that map irrelevant.  That person just has a map that they now can use to head out into the wilderness unprepared, unawares, and challenged to live through the next hour.

It is not an argument of knowing where the hell you are.  It is a matter of knowing how to survive where you are, and it is with much irony to be found a corpse on a hill with a backpack full of berries, a wooden shield, no armor, and a map in your back pocket. 

 

You have a compass.  If you head north out of town, then chances are you will have to head south to reach town again, unless of course that town happens to be a band of gypsies, to which I will then say you are plum outta luck, map or no.

 

I have seen the remark "if you don't like maps, then don't use it" in more than a few posts.  Were I or anyone else to be prejudice, or ignorant, then that statement could simply be met with "if you want a map, then ALT+Tab and use it."  The remarkable part about that therein is that that feature is already implemented.

But check it out:

"Meaning you can't look at the map and instantly find where you are, its the same as playing windowed with community map open. Actually the in-game map has less features."

...Then why wouldn't you WANT to use the community maps?

 

I do not however wish to go uncaringly headfirst into that fray by saying that I do not, even a little bit, sympathize with the good people of Wurm who want to know where they are. But for the love of Pete there are already maps!  Use them!  Hours spent developing code to pull up an in-game map of a map that already exists outside of the game is something that would seem to me to be a huge waste of time and resources at this point when there are a myriad other areas of this game that need attention... more so than a map that is already accessible.

The tutorial needs a facelift.  This is a given.  Knowledge of starting skills, the "why's" and "why not's" should be addressed with the fledgeling player.  Give them a reason to feel the impact of their actions.  Before they leave the tutorial, they should already have a vision of what they could now see their character becoming.

How does the saying go?  "Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day.  Teach a man to fish and he will eat for a lifetime... unless he lives in a desert..."  (I kid)

 

My first week in game involved me hiding near the guards in the starter town.  I taught myself how to make cloth from the cotton I had foraged (Using a loom at an abandoned deed), and made my own armor (and I use the word "armor" here loosely  8D  ).  I was fortunate enough to find a dead croc and butchered it.  I got hide, and with the ashes of my fire and a jar (which I made of the clay that I was directed in game to) of water, I made lye and then leather.  I used that to make a cap and a boot... very poor QL but it was better than a cap and boot made of air.

At the end of that week, after living out of a large cart that I created, complete with lock, I was kindly offered a change of life here in Wurm by 2 kind souls named Exene and Notstupidbobb.

They didn't hand me a deed to a mansion or a handful of silver.  They offered me some of their time, effort, and generosity and gave me a ride (In my own cart mind you) to where I could see the lay of the land and choose a spot to set up my deed.

I still had a lot of work ahead of me... and still do...  It was the kindness of these 2 people that really show what this community has to offer.  If it weren't for them I would be at least a few weeks behind, but with care and patience, it is possible.

It shouldn't be about being handed armor and weapons and gear (and a map) so you can just go out and know the lay of the land and be Uber.  This game has more to offer than that.  And there are a plethora of other games out there that will do that for you.

 

My words here are laid out to not bash pro-map individuals, noobs or well-seasoned, but to encourage the use of other skills.  As I had mentioned in a prior post, not only can your compass give you bearings, but the moon, the sun, and nature are landmarks in their own right.  Learning how to use them in-game can become indispensable.  Learning your surroundings not only gives you a more intimate view of the lands of Wurm, but can in many ways make a map obsolete.  Yes, knowing the land while it is ever changing is a challenge, but after all, isn't that the nature of Wurm?

Edited September 12, 2013 by Menoch

[Sir Arowhun 473]

+1 to maps, but I like it how there is no "you are here" marker so you have to look at the map, look at your surroundings, and travel the old fashioned way. This has been one of my favorite parts of exploring new places.

 

I'm glad the devs are thinking the same way I am on this.

Edited September 12, 2013 by Sir Arowhun

[Hussars 511]

+1 to maps, but I like it how there is no "you are here" marker so you have to look at the map, look at your surroundings, and travel the old fashioned way. This has been one of my favorite parts of exploring new places.

 

I'm glad the devs are thinking the same way I am on this.

The problem being, what happens when the general terrain changes if the devs do not update the map?

 

There are already issues with this on the community maps where islands have been built or large plots have extended into the waterline, changing the general area.

 

I built a small 15x15 land mass on Cele (with permission of the deed owners around it at the time) which required changes in the boat traffic but I never listed on the community map.  Indy has a couple 30+ tiles isles or new "raised" land which if you don't know where you are, can completely confuse some people.

 

At least the community map usually shows there is a deed there, so you can figure out if it was a change in the land mass or your not where you thought you were.

Edited September 12, 2013 by Hussars

[JackBurton 903]

Maps are good mmmkay.

[Aldur 652]

Thought I'd share something I've observed in our ally. Please be advised this mainly applies to Freedom servers and the NEW players, not the 2+ year veteran community.

 

It is true many players never come back after their first game session or few sessions and perhaps improving this experience may make them log again. But I am doubtful this will contribute to increased total staying player count or to bottom line in any meaningful way.

 

If I were to guess percentages, it would be that ~50% of all newcomers these days stay up to few days (none of these go prem), 40% stay up to few weeks (almost none of these go prem), 8% up to few months (most goes prem and some get small deed) and that remaining 2% stay for many months or year+ and usually have multiple prems and many deeds, joining Wurm "veteran" community, as it's usually called.

 

Out of the 2% staying group, I have observed, that these players do so only, because they have made friends within ally community, although most eventually burn out regardless of that fact (average of 6-8 months, which is still rather low for a sandbox game). I don't believe anyone in this group is staying purely because they like Wurm so much, the notable exception was 1.0 where plenty of players stuck around for 1-2 months because of the multistory, proving that world-building features are in high demand among new and old freedom players alike.

 

Most of the quit reasons appear to be following, in order of significance:

• Excessive grinding endgame, that feels boring and very repetitive,
  
• Game runs out of adventure/survival/exploration content/feel,
  
• Lack of community-building game content/activities (keep in mind this factors our ally best efforts at creating them!),
  
• Issues with performance or connections,
  
• Lacking systems for trading and sharing,
  
• Game changes that ruin their plans (rare).
  

From the few players who could provide some feedback on non-ally gameplay (for example they have previously tried with a deed, on their own, in some remote place), their main quit reason was almost always severe lack of intelligent life forms around.

 

Based on the above, I can conclude this in respect to new Freedom players:

• Focusing on improving first few days will only extend average gameplay time for newcomers to those few days. The number of staying players will most likely be only marginally affected. From business standpoint, I have considered that very good initial gameplay could cause players to prematurely invest in premiums, but free trials are not restrictive enough to encourage such move within just few days.
  
• It would be best to focus on addressing the aspects, that usual staying players complain about. This will not cause many (any?) few-hour quitters to continue playing, but it will increase number of few-day+ staying players and should probably make the few-month group willing to spend much more money on wurm, given the opportunity. It will also reduce retention, which has compounding effect on quits (having your in-game companions quit contributes to your decision to quit if you care about community, which most players do).
  
• It would be highly effective to encourage new players to join communities and rapidly develop systems to facilitate that process. Most issues with current alliance system are: the need to physically meet a player to invite into alliance, the need to invite newcomers into a deed, the need to manually invite all newcomers without any option to allow them to join automatically upon request, lack of in-game promotion system that newcomers could easily access to find an open alliance (forums are very rarely visited by newcomers, it is usually a domain of 1-2 week+ players, by which time they are usually settled somewhere already, making alliance join difficult).
  
• It may be a good idea to focus on creative aspects of the game, continuously allowing players to build more interesting things.
  
• It may be a good idea to create some major event system for freedom servers, that could bring some variety to the world now and then. Wurm becomes very static experience after a while, which disappoints many players, who initially stayed due to survival/adventure feel of the game.
  

[ReaverKane 363]

I don't care about your past experience, my experience is probably even more eschewed from using maps than yours (i started playing in a time where if you wanted a compass you had to make it, and stil never got lost, wandered as a non-premium around about 75% of inde, and never failed to find my way back).

What i don't want is opinionated people (being polite) trying to force THEIR play style onto other players. (This and the fact that many older players are like this, and devs listening to them, are some of the reasons wurm has the population of a rural town).

 

The problem being, what happens when the general terrain changes if the devs do not update the map?

 

There are already issues with this on the community maps where islands have been built or large plots have extended into the waterline, changing the general area.

 

I built a small 15x15 land mass on Cele (with permission of the deed owners around it at the time) which required changes in the boat traffic but I never listed on the community map.  Indy has a couple 30+ tiles isles or new "raised" land which if you don't know where you are, can completely confuse some people.

 

At least the community map usually shows there is a deed there, so you can figure out if it was a change in the land mass or your not where you thought you were.

I'm hoping that the markers we can add can be shared with players. Otherwise, the map will be pretty much a waste of bandwidth and disk space.

[Menoch 10]

 

What i don't want is opinionated people (being polite) trying to force THEIR play style onto other players. (This and the fact that many older players are like this, and devs listening to them, are some of the reasons wurm has the population of a rural town).

 

 

If you don't like people with opinions then you probably shouldn't be in the forums.  That is why they are here after all.

 

And I am not trying to force people to play this way or that.  Looking back at my post I see no "Thought Police" tactics or "Mind Control" techniques.  Just opinions.... well for the most part.  There was one fact, and that was that there are already maps and they are already accessible to each and every single player in Wurm.  You just have to use 2 fingers a little common sense and you have a map.

 

And while I do appreciate your perceptive take on why Wurm's population is so small, I would like to point out that  I heard of Wurm via word of mouth.  I have not once seen a flashy advertisement for it.  I don't see it in gaming magazines nor do I recognize it as ever being shoved in my face on some random internet page.  I do my part in trying to tell everyone I can that I know is a gamer about Wurm.  It is a game that MUST be experienced.  However...

 

An Independent developer has one hell of a fight clawing its way to the top of the crap-pile of games out there that have publicity and public relations backing, but nothing to offer in the end.

I doubt very highly that not having a map is turning people away.  If you were to say it is the lack of a cohesive tutorial, I would say I agree with you.  But dare I say, as I may have hinted to it already, living in a gaming era where gamers don't feel they should have to work hard for what they accomplish is probably another factor. But I see this game as trying to be different.  And in its own right it should be.  I just fear it turns into just another graphical interface that caters to the whim of an already watered down mass of "Hard Core" survival games.

 

If they put a map in the game, then they put a map in the game.  I wont lose any sleep over it, or rage quit, or cry.  Lol.   If they don't then they don't.  But just because "You don't want opinionated people" telling the devs how they feel, is nothing short of selfish.  And frankly, I don't give a Green Giant Rat's ass-hair what you want if you wrap it up in context like that.  And that there was me being impolite.

 

Apart from that, if I did not state my opinions here, as many others do, I would be doing this game and myself an injustice.   The developers listen to us all for a reason.

[ReaverKane 363]

If you don't like people with opinions then you probably shouldn't be in the forums.  That is why they are here after all.

 

And I am not trying to force people to play this way or that.  Looking back at my post I see no "Thought Police" tactics or "Mind Control" techniques.  Just opinions.... well for the most part.  There was one fact, and that was that there are already maps and they are already accessible to each and every single player in Wurm.  You just have to use 2 fingers a little common sense and you have a map.

 

And while I do appreciate your perceptive take on why Wurm's population is so small, I would like to point out that  I heard of Wurm via word of mouth.  I have not once seen a flashy advertisement for it.  I don't see it in gaming magazines nor do I recognize it as ever being shoved in my face on some random internet page.  I do my part in trying to tell everyone I can that I know is a gamer about Wurm.  It is a game that MUST be experienced.  However...

 

An Independent developer has one hell of a fight clawing its way to the top of the crap-pile of games out there that have publicity and public relations backing, but nothing to offer in the end.

I doubt very highly that not having a map is turning people away.  If you were to say it is the lack of a cohesive tutorial, I would say I agree with you.  But dare I say, as I may have hinted to it already, living in a gaming era where gamers don't feel they should have to work hard for what they accomplish is probably another factor. But I see this game as trying to be different.  And in its own right it should be.  I just fear it turns into just another graphical interface that caters to the whim of an already watered down mass of "Hard Core" survival games.

 

If they put a map in the game, then they put a map in the game.  I wont lose any sleep over it, or rage quit, or cry.  Lol.   If they don't then they don't.  But just because "You don't want opinionated people" telling the devs how they feel, is nothing short of selfish.  And frankly, I don't give a Green Giant Rat's ass-hair what you want if you wrap it up in context like that.  And that there was me being impolite.

 

Apart from that, if I did not state my opinions here, as many others do, I would be doing this game and myself an injustice.   The developers listen to us all for a reason.

How long have you been in wurm?

 

What i'm addressing is people that do posts like your earlier one saying "I did this that way, with these many whatnots, so other people can do that too".

I DON'T CARE! The game isn't about their opinions, its about making stuff that improves the game. Apparently the ingame map will be a empty canvas because too many people don't want too much information, because when they started they didn't have a map to use. So i find it annoying to say the least that in a game with so many shortcomings, bugs, and incomplete content that you have at least 2 different guys (on a team of half a dozen) working on a useless feature that won't be used by anyone because PLAYER MADE community maps have way more information.

 

And no, they don't.

[Shiraek 464]

• Shorten tutorial. Voice acting. Human NPC guide. Story - help us rebuild our village. Help us activate these portals. Short time so you mix newbies and oldbies ASAP

Tutorial quests continue on actual servers. Tie into story of each server. Freedom - taming the wilds. Chaos, Epic - preparing for war.

Newbie areas get vital resource management - deeded mines where you can only mine_forward for rock and ore. Deeded tree yard where you can only cut overaged trees. Deeded clay and tar where you can dig but not drop dirt. These require _easy and fast_ additions to deed permissions.

Tutorial quests pay a few iron coins each.

Working Inns in newbie area so players have a safe and temporary base of operation

Relocate server marketplace on each server into newbie area so you have a steady stream of veteran players passing through. Knight in shining full plate on mighty barding-clad steed riding through = something to aspire to, someone to ask a question of.

Tower guards in newbie zone see mobs harder than rats, lions, wolves as enemy kingdom and kill them. Too many newbies quit because they get repeatedly slaughtered by powerful mobs. Every other game has a low-level newbie zone because it's needed, not because every other developer is a mindless sheep

Newbie quests end with a quest to either join a village or build your own house in the wilderness. These options are clearly marked in their level of difficulty - i.e. join a village difficult, build your own house in the wilderness extremely difficult. Optional quest to start your own village, flag it as requiring premium + payments + being very complicated

 

And that's it. Probably a waste of time posting ten pages into the thread, but that's what I would do with the first 5 hours of play in Wurm if it was my game.

[Timoca 154]

 

• Shorten tutorial. Voice acting. Human NPC guide. Story - help us rebuild our village. Help us activate these portals. Short time so you mix newbies and oldbies ASAP

Tutorial quests continue on actual servers. Tie into story of each server. Freedom - taming the wilds. Chaos, Epic - preparing for war.

Newbie areas get vital resource management - deeded mines where you can only mine_forward for rock and ore. Deeded tree yard where you can only cut overaged trees. Deeded clay and tar where you can dig but not drop dirt. These require _easy and fast_ additions to deed permissions.

Tutorial quests pay a few iron coins each.

Working Inns in newbie area so players have a safe and temporary base of operation

Relocate server marketplace on each server into newbie area so you have a steady stream of veteran players passing through. Knight in shining full plate on mighty barding-clad steed riding through = something to aspire to, someone to ask a question of.

Tower guards in newbie zone see mobs harder than rats, lions, wolves as enemy kingdom and kill them. Too many newbies quit because they get repeatedly slaughtered by powerful mobs. Every other game has a low-level newbie zone because it's needed, not because every other developer is a mindless sheep

Newbie quests end with a quest to either join a village or build your own house in the wilderness. These options are clearly marked in their level of difficulty - i.e. join a village difficult, build your own house in the wilderness extremely difficult. Optional quest to start your own village, flag it as requiring premium + payments + being very complicated

 

And that's it. Probably a waste of time posting ten pages into the thread, but that's what I would do with the first 5 hours of play in Wurm if it was my game.

 

 

This would benefit the game quite a lot I think.

 

 

My reason for quitting is the combat system, the mechanics are outdated and far from fun.

I think Rolf once mentioned something based on Mount & Blade's combat system.  That would be really fun.

 

But for me, every time I return I build a deed, finish it and then quit playing because training my fighting skills ain't fun like this.

[Farmerbob 369]

Maps? Really?

 

I know I'm not alone when I say a map will destroy the survival aspect of the game, getting lost in the woods makes things fun for alot of people.

 

I don't see why you think that maps will prevent people from getting lost in the woods.  Now if the map automagically tells you exactly where you are, and what way you are facing, then yes, that's too far.  However a map which requires you to use landmarks and a compass for accurate navigation?  Perfect.  IMHO.

[Sjach 30]

 

• Shorten tutorial. Voice acting. Human NPC guide. Story - help us rebuild our village. Help us activate these portals. Short time so you mix newbies and oldbies ASAP

Tutorial quests continue on actual servers. Tie into story of each server. Freedom - taming the wilds. Chaos, Epic - preparing for war.

Newbie areas get vital resource management - deeded mines where you can only mine_forward for rock and ore. Deeded tree yard where you can only cut overaged trees. Deeded clay and tar where you can dig but not drop dirt. These require _easy and fast_ additions to deed permissions.

Tutorial quests pay a few iron coins each.

Working Inns in newbie area so players have a safe and temporary base of operation

Relocate server marketplace on each server into newbie area so you have a steady stream of veteran players passing through. Knight in shining full plate on mighty barding-clad steed riding through = something to aspire to, someone to ask a question of.

Tower guards in newbie zone see mobs harder than rats, lions, wolves as enemy kingdom and kill them. Too many newbies quit because they get repeatedly slaughtered by powerful mobs. Every other game has a low-level newbie zone because it's needed, not because every other developer is a mindless sheep

Newbie quests end with a quest to either join a village or build your own house in the wilderness. These options are clearly marked in their level of difficulty - i.e. join a village difficult, build your own house in the wilderness extremely difficult. Optional quest to start your own village, flag it as requiring premium + payments + being very complicated

 

And that's it. Probably a waste of time posting ten pages into the thread, but that's what I would do with the first 5 hours of play in Wurm if it was my game.

 

Time for my two iron worth.  

 

The suggestion was posted above to shorten the tutorial and move tutorial areas to other servers.  

No, please no!  

I was on Golden Valley when it was open for settlement.  Chat was constantly full of new players that didn't bother to pay attention to the very brief tutorial that was available then.  Constant questions on how to do the most basic of mechanics - that were actually covered in the brief tutorial.  I don't really want to have to deal with that again.  

With that, wouldn't mind seeing some well-written tutorial type quests available for learning some of the skills.  I realize that making good quests is a lot of work though.  As for reward - how about earning a "newbie" tool for completing the appropriate quest?  This would give an appropriate tool for the effort and leave earning hard coin to the current methods - working for it.  

Also, would like to see the current tutorial changed a bit.  Instead of giving and taking away and giving tools, just add tools as they start each section.  This way, they learn about each tool as they get it and have a full set by the time they reach the end of the tutorial.  

 

Quest to join village or start your own?  Not really a good idea.  Many players see quests as a "to-do list" and will want to try to do both.  Instead, could have a letter arrive (mail quest) to recommend doing one or the other and congratulating on completion of tutorial.  

 

A newbie area on existing servers?  Where would you put it?  Who would you evict?  

I do like the idea to restrict "pit mining" by some mechanic.  Possibly allowing slabs to be placed in "flat" or "even" (sloped, opposite ends flat) mine tiles to prevent mining the floor?

 

Moving the market?  Won't work, players would simply make another more convenient one (and already have).  Trying to force players to do all their shopping in one area will simply move markets to the forums. 

 

A working inn at the newbie area?  As I am building an inn near the Independence spawn area, I am opposed to competition.  

 

I am not fond of the idea of an in-game map.  Not simply due to me learning without a HUD map, but just that it gives the game a different feel.  

However, I wouldn't mind seeing an accurate map similar to the current player-made map, including terrain, roads and guard towers - as well as deeds that wish to be shown on the map (yes, this would require another check box on settlement tokens).  For example, this would show Freedom Market as a big square of rock slabs, but not the trader shack.  This would provide an accurate map for everyone to use and let those of us that wish to remain hermits to do so (somewhat).  With this, a monthly (or even quarterly) update should be sufficient.  

 

Kinda jumbled (kinda tired), but my two iron worth.  

[Miretta 1,415]

I think there are alot of good suggestions on how to improve the game for starters and some are simply a bit overseen like the making of "Inns" honestly, before starting to build your own house in the wilderness, confronting wild animals and stuff it would be nice if we could have a WORKING system for house management that allows strangers that are NOT on our friendslist to rent "rooms" in a house/inn. beeing able to sell food/water with a merchant, getting door mechanics etc etc. it woul also gives some newbies a better feeling for the community if living in a house with several parties

and all that please with the option to make it free.

 

also I would love to see more options to gain some starter coins in the beginning....no I'm not talking about silvers....I'm talking about irons and maybe copper they can achieve as "basic" money from doing some labor....things that could be handled through NPCs that are placed by players aswell who allow bulk item selling per demand....and doesnt requiere the player to be online.

 

Also there were several discussions on to implement village boards with messages and trade proposals and so on....(in my real life town we have that still )

 

 

its some basic stuff that could bring players together, make their beginner experience alot less steep while learning from others but it also leaves the option to still run into the wilds and beeing eaten

 

maybe some players should also put up big red signs on the borders of the starter towns to mark "wild and dangerous wilderness.continue carefully"

[ReaverKane 363]

Time for my two iron worth.  

 

The suggestion was posted above to shorten the tutorial and move tutorial areas to other servers.  

No, please no!  

I was on Golden Valley when it was open for settlement.  Chat was constantly full of new players that didn't bother to pay attention to the very brief tutorial that was available then.  Constant questions on how to do the most basic of mechanics - that were actually covered in the brief tutorial.  I don't really want to have to deal with that again.  

With that, wouldn't mind seeing some well-written tutorial type quests available for learning some of the skills.  I realize that making good quests is a lot of work though.  As for reward - how about earning a "newbie" tool for completing the appropriate quest?  This would give an appropriate tool for the effort and leave earning hard coin to the current methods - working for it.  

Also, would like to see the current tutorial changed a bit.  Instead of giving and taking away and giving tools, just add tools as they start each section.  This way, they learn about each tool as they get it and have a full set by the time they reach the end of the tutorial.  

 

Well the "stupid" questions about stuff covered by the tutorial are still present today xp.

Many people just don't pay attention to tutorials and cut it dry, and then keep asking about stuff they should know from it. It happens in all games, not just Wurm.

Although, i also lived in GV at that time, and at least CM and PA were somewhat more helpful and abundant then. Another thing that i agree is that i kinda enjoyed that other "tutorial" more than the current one. Although current tutorial is more complete, and approches way more stuff, the other one was more "do it yourself" quest-like thing, which i think was actually a cool way to begin. If i was a DEV, i'd change the current tutorial, to simply teach movement, climbing, compass, drink and eat, and terrain types like it does, then skip to teleport, and have a continued tutorial on the actual servers where the player is taught how to build a house. (Sure its a bit of excessive hand-holding, but it would provide a guide line for the initial hours of game play that, hopefully, would offset that overwhelming "what now?" feeling when you arrive at a new server).

 

Quest to join village or start your own?  Not really a good idea.  Many players see quests as a "to-do list" and will want to try to do both.  Instead, could have a letter arrive (mail quest) to recommend doing one or the other and congratulating on completion of tutorial.  

 

A newbie area on existing servers?  Where would you put it?  Who would you evict?  

I do like the idea to restrict "pit mining" by some mechanic.  Possibly allowing slabs to be placed in "flat" or "even" (sloped, opposite ends flat) mine tiles to prevent mining the floor?

 

Moving the market?  Won't work, players would simply make another more convenient one (and already have).  Trying to force players to do all their shopping in one area will simply move markets to the forums. 

 

A working inn at the newbie area?  As I am building an inn near the Independence spawn area, I am opposed to competition.  

 

I am not fond of the idea of an in-game map.  Not simply due to me learning without a HUD map, but just that it gives the game a different feel.  

However, I wouldn't mind seeing an accurate map similar to the current player-made map, including terrain, roads and guard towers - as well as deeds that wish to be shown on the map (yes, this would require another check box on settlement tokens).  For example, this would show Freedom Market as a big square of rock slabs, but not the trader shack.  This would provide an accurate map for everyone to use and let those of us that wish to remain hermits to do so (somewhat).  With this, a monthly (or even quarterly) update should be sufficient.  

This

Kinda jumbled (kinda tired), but my two iron worth.  

 

 

I think there are alot of good suggestions on how to improve the game for starters and some are simply a bit overseen like the making of "Inns" honestly, before starting to build your own house in the wilderness, confronting wild animals and stuff it would be nice if we could have a WORKING system for house management that allows strangers that are NOT on our friendslist to rent "rooms" in a house/inn. beeing able to sell food/water with a merchant, getting door mechanics etc etc. it woul also gives some newbies a better feeling for the community if living in a house with several parties

and all that please with the option to make it free.

 

also I would love to see more options to gain some starter coins in the beginning....no I'm not talking about silvers....I'm talking about irons and maybe copper they can achieve as "basic" money from doing some labor....things that could be handled through NPCs that are placed by players aswell who allow bulk item selling per demand....and doesnt requiere the player to be online.

 

Also there were several discussions on to implement village boards with messages and trade proposals and so on....(in my real life town we have that still )

 

 

its some basic stuff that could bring players together, make their beginner experience alot less steep while learning from others but it also leaves the option to still run into the wilds and beeing eaten

 

maybe some players should also put up big red signs on the borders of the starter towns to mark "wild and dangerous wilderness.continue carefully"

Yeah, people have been asking for a lot of those. The Inn thing actually works how you describe, you can rent the beds, but you don't have the option to rent them for free, which is something many people have been asking since i've started playing, actually (3 years ago).

We used to start with 10 iron coins back then. Wasn't much, but allowed for some simple transactions. IDK why they removed that (although it might get exploited with alts, it would take a couple of hundreds to make any decent earnings).

 

LOL i do miss the wilderness signs on GV.

Edited September 15, 2013 by ReaverKane

[Timurid 0]

Maps is very bad idea. Only if craftable and their view bound to some location. Even if like that - bad.

GUI - good. Visuality, craft trees, user-friendly, smooth, drag-drops, popups - complex things for complex game.

Newcomers dont like to be guided through labirints, they want to start in wilderness and learn how to survive - not to how to walk at museum.

[vill 248]

When making improvements please just don't brake current game pleasure for devoted part of our community.

[ReaverKane 363]

When making improvements please just don't brake current game pleasure for devoted part of our community.

The only part of the community is the devoted part...

 And that's part of the problem (well more like a symptom of it).

Edited September 17, 2013 by ReaverKane

[Sylver 11]

I've been playing Wurm less than a month, so I'm certainly no expert, but I personally believe an in-game map would be great.

 

I don't think a game should rely so heavily on external wikis and forums. I don't know about PVP servers as I'm not interested in PVP, but on the non-PVP servers, an in-game map would make the game much more playable and enjoyable imo (except maybe for veterans who know their way around like the back of their hand).

 

In my short experience, the way it is at the moment, Wurm is not easy for newbies. Actually, it took me quite a bit of Googling to find a more or less up-to-date map of my server.

 

Maybe if there were some quest that gave veteran players a bonus for mentoring beginners it would make the game more sociable.

[ReaverKane 363]

I've been playing Wurm less than a month, so I'm certainly no expert, but I personally believe an in-game map would be great.

 

I don't think a game should rely so heavily on external wikis and forums. I don't know about PVP servers as I'm not interested in PVP, but on the non-PVP servers, an in-game map would make the game much more playable and enjoyable imo (except maybe for veterans who know their way around like the back of their hand).

 

In my short experience, the way it is at the moment, Wurm is not easy for newbies. Actually, it took me quite a bit of Googling to find a more or less up-to-date map of my server.

 

Maybe if there were some quest that gave veteran players a bonus for mentoring beginners it would make the game more sociable.

Welcome to Wurm, maps can be found on your sever's section on the forums usually.

And thanks for offering us a new player's perspective. Which is what the map thing is all about, providing better integration for new players, to improve player retention.

[Hussars 511]

I've been playing Wurm less than a month, so I'm certainly no expert, but I personally believe an in-game map would be great.

 

I don't think a game should rely so heavily on external wikis and forums. I don't know about PVP servers as I'm not interested in PVP, but on the non-PVP servers, an in-game map would make the game much more playable and enjoyable imo (except maybe for veterans who know their way around like the back of their hand).

 

In my short experience, the way it is at the moment, Wurm is not easy for newbies. Actually, it took me quite a bit of Googling to find a more or less up-to-date map of my server.

 

Maybe if there were some quest that gave veteran players a bonus for mentoring beginners it would make the game more sociable.

 

Not to drag you into the flames, as it were (map discussion has gotten a bit heated lol), but from a new player's view, what would make an in-game map usable for you?

 

Since you mentioned the need for an up to date map, do you  mean showing just the general map, or is there a level of detail you wanted?

 

Basically, in an ideal format, what would the map look like and how would you want to interact with it?

Edited September 18, 2013 by Hussars

[Sylver 11]

I suppose what I imagine is something similar to another game I've played (ATITD) which actually had no in-game map in Beta and was hugely frustrating with players getting lost all the time. At least there you didn't also get killed by wild animals!

 

The ATITD map simply plotted all natural features (water, mountains, terrain such as rock, sand, and clay), and coordinates, so you could tell exactly where you were on the map. It was also expandable, by dragging the bottom corner, which was very useful. It did not have player-made buildings, and I don't think it would be feasible in WURM either to have deeds and houses on an in-game map, as they change too often. There is no need, however, because if somebody wants to meet you somewhere they can simply give you the coordinates. At the moment it's really difficult to meet up with someone unless you know all the deeds around the place, which I don't, and the player-made maps are not always up to date (had an example a few days ago where somebody asked to meed me at a large deed that wasn't on the player-made map). 

 

Since terrain can be modified in Wurm by players, I suppose I envisage the map being updated by the devs or GMs every few months - maybe every six months? I suppose the frequency depends on dev/GM time and terraforming activities.

 

Maps showing deeds can still be player-made and on the wiki or forum, and would be useful for players trying to figure out likely places to settle, and where people live. It would be helpful to new players if these maps were highlighted on the wiki, actually, as I had quite a bit of trouble finding Celebration, where I live. At first I just had an old map. Eventually i found the up to date one.

 

Anyway, that's my very ignorant two iron's worth

Edited September 18, 2013 by Sylver

[sunshadow21 4]

There is actually a lot of good ways to make maps work with this game.

 

The first is to make each map static; this resolves both the technical and ingame issues that people have with maps. It also doesn't interfere with new player maps too much because the areas around the starter towns are considerably more static than other places on the server, meaning that those maps are likely to remain useful for a longer period of time. The rest of the maps change enough that those who want privacy can still largely have it due to the shifting nature of the game.

 

Second, add a skill that is tied to both the compass and the ink and paper already in the game; also, make player made maps tradable. Yes, in some ways, this benefits older players more, but it also sets up potential interactions between older and newer players that are the real key to player retention as the new player seeks out more detailed maps; conversely, a new player bent on exploration has the tools to do so without being handed the keys to the entire server layout. Survival for some is seeking aid from others; for others, it's carving your own niche. This option allows for both, and gives those who don't care for the surivival aspect all that much an option as well.

 

Third, make it so that all labels are created by the players or are only added after clicking on the deed token; the maps can show every building, every wall, every deed, and every tower, but labels telling you the names of those structures/deeds and/or who they belong to should not be automatic. This keeps the pvp advantage to a minimum, and protects the privacy of those who wish it. If you don't want your deed to be labeled easily, simply limit access to the deed and/or deed token; it's still possible to have it labeled, but to do so requires player interaction and real effort.

[Vroomfondel 1,128]

Just make the map dynamic, and only show details of the lands the player has explored.  No need to put a skill restriction on it, you want this map to encourage new players to stay.  As to PVP, make sure the map does not show too much details of a deed, just that the deed exists.  All of you that hate the idea of ingame maps are speaking from your own prejudices and those prejudices are what has kept so many players away, so think about the future of the game before you say anything more.

Edited September 18, 2013 by Vroomfondel