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Removal Of Salvage Rule Wtf?

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I just want the ability to sink the boats that dock (locked and moored) on deeded land and the "captains" are never seen again... Nothing like coming home, loggin in and seeing a couple of new boats parked around your docks. At least let us levy docking fees or something...

Edited by Hussars
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Yea Yea. All this. But no explanation on why to remove Salvaging???

Was one of the best things about the game to me. Next.... we wont be able to loot decaying houses....There goes all the treasure hunting. :(

So many changes to the game at once. And I am feeling "not for the better". We now will have to pay more for a uncompleted/slightly broken game. Then they start removing some of the best parts of it. Not to mention the inability to fix bugs. - I left Exodus do to the house bug there, it started about a month ago -

If I didnt know better I'd say that they were trying to KILL the game. :angry: -Price hike- Bad unfixed bugs- removal of fun game mechanics-

Actually, that's partly why it is being removed. It's NOT a game mechanic, it's an arbitrary rule enforced by staff which has been deemed no longer 'neccesary'. People can still 'loot' by moving boats in to hideways to rot and claim the contents if there is any.

As for house bugs on Exodus, that started long before a month ago ;) Having said that, while I agree it's frustrating, it is my understanding that it could not be removed without causing untold amounts of damage in the form of reverting data. It is an issue that should work it's way out of the system in time case by case.

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Actually, that's partly why it is being removed. It's NOT a game mechanic, it's an arbitrary rule enforced by staff which has been deemed no longer 'neccesary'. People can still 'loot' by moving boats in to hideways to rot and claim the contents if there is any.

As for house bugs on Exodus, that started long before a month ago ;) Having said that, while I agree it's frustrating, it is my understanding that it could not be removed without causing untold amounts of damage in the form of reverting data. It is an issue that should work it's way out of the system in time case by case.

OK. I can understand that. :)

But I also agree with others about the excess of abandoned boats and them being left on others deeds. Its takes quite a long time for a 80ql boat to decay and kinda sucks for the person/people who want to use the space. Yes, I know you can use support for removing unwanted boats. But honestly, I have used support 5 times and at times waited 3 hrs. Have never gotten a response. Still, the abandoned boats problem is not mine at the moment, as I don't live near the water right now. Also I have seen a whole lot less forgotten boats on the server I have moved too.

I moved to a new server away from Exodus to avoid the house bug. Happy I can plan now without the fear of a "growing" house.

Thanks for the concise response Hordern. ;):D

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Too bad the price on keys cannot be changed..

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Maybe boats without locks should decay 2x faster with the salvage part gone now?

+1

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Hordern, I appreciate your response to this thread, but you Staff Members need to take a second look at this change.... especially the timing of it.

Rolf is increasing the cost of Wurm by 60%. That's a hefty amount.

....and now this change to the Salvage rules for Ships is happening? To me that's a reduction in Customer Support at a time when the cost to the Customer is drastically increasing.

Not to mention Deed owners WILL have issues with Ships left behind by other Players that leave Wurm for various reasons. The new rules do not address this.

Very bad timing for this change to the Salvage Rules. Please pass along my objection to this change.

Edited by Kyrmius

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Hordern, I appreciate your response to this thread, but you Staff Members need to take a second look at this change.... especially the timing of it.

Rolf is increasing the cost of Wurm by 60%. That's a hefty amount.

....and now this change to the Salvage rules for Ships is happening? To me that's a reduction in Customer Support at a time when the cost to the Customer is drastically increasing.

Not to mention Deed owners WILL have issues with Ships left behind by other Players that leave Wurm for various reasons. The new rules do not address this.

Very bad timing for this change to the Salvage Rules. Please pass along my objection to this change.

Boats were fine before the salvage rule, when a certain bunch boasted about all the boats they " acquired " we got the salvage process, the rule did far more to separate owners from their boats than before the rule was in place since the " finder " got a way to legally acquire the boat.
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Hordern, I appreciate your response to this thread, but you Staff Members need to take a second look at this change.... especially the timing of it.

Rolf is increasing the cost of Wurm by 60%. That's a hefty amount.

....and now this change to the Salvage rules for Ships is happening? To me that's a reduction in Customer Support at a time when the cost to the Customer is drastically increasing.

Not to mention Deed owners WILL have issues with Ships left behind by other Players that leave Wurm for various reasons. The new rules do not address this.

Very bad timing for this change to the Salvage Rules. Please pass along my objection to this change.

Actually, this was done a few days before the price change. People just don't pay attention.

And what Kadore said.

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Hordern, I appreciate your response to this thread, but you Staff Members need to take a second look at this change.... especially the timing of it.

Rolf is increasing the cost of Wurm by 60%. That's a hefty amount.

....and now this change to the Salvage rules for Ships is happening? To me that's a reduction in Customer Support at a time when the cost to the Customer is drastically increasing.

Not to mention Deed owners WILL have issues with Ships left behind by other Players that leave Wurm for various reasons. The new rules do not address this.

Very bad timing for this change to the Salvage Rules. Please pass along my objection to this change.

I object to your objection. I'm not sure how boat control falls under the category of customer support as it is your responsibility to look after your boat. Failure to do so is your own fault. There is even a handy little pop up that mentions it now.

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My response was going to more or less be as alaskan bob has said and like my earlier point that this is not a game mechanic: this is not a reduction is customer service, it is the pruning of rules in an effort to get more of the game governed by game mechanics so that hopefully there will be fewer occasions that players need to call on a GM, thus not only making for a smoother playing experience, but also hopefully ensuring a GM is more likely to be available for more urgent matters such as issues caused by bugs.

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Perhaps, the "permissions" need to go away, we can make copies of keys to allow use of the boat. Must have key to pilot or access hold, but anyone can board (captain could kick?).

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No way. I prefer the access. That way I can say who can or cannot operate my boat. I do not want someone that finds a key to be able to take over a boat. Since the way you are talking, everyone that will be able to operate it will have a copy. Then I have to run around with way too many keys in inventory for all the boats or friends boats that I can operate. Too many.

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My response was going to more or less be as alaskan bob has said and like my earlier point that this is not a game mechanic: this is not a reduction is customer service, it is the pruning of rules in an effort to get more of the game governed by game mechanics so that hopefully there will be fewer occasions that players need to call on a GM, thus not only making for a smoother playing experience, but also hopefully ensuring a GM is more likely to be available for more urgent matters such as issues caused by bugs.

Then we disagree. Not mad at you Hodern.

My objection wasn't about active Players not taking care of their Ships. Let them take care of their own Ships or lose them.

My objection wasn't about wanting GMs to hold our hand like children. I don't want GMs hovering over me like a micromanager everytime I do something.

My objection wasn't about stupid mistakes that Players make like forgetting to put a Boat Lock on. We learn best by our mistakes.

My objection was about the timing of this change. It doesn't matter to most customers if the change happened a few days before or after the Price Hike notice. It will be viewed by some as a negative regardless.

My objection is also about the change itself, you left Deed Owners stuck with problems they have no permissions to deal with. Saying a GM will come a move Ships when too many pile up isn't good enough. It's vague and wishywashy. Who decides how many is too many? The GM? Not good enough. The GM didn't spend money on the Deed in question.

Players start playing Wurm all the time. They even go Premium for a month or two and buy a Ship all the time. It's fun and Players try out sailing in Wurm.

Then they quit. They decide Wurm is not for them. They can't delete their characters, and they can't simply hit a button and delete their stuff either. NOW after this rule change we are going to have problems that only GMs can solve, but the rule change also just told the GMs to forget these problems and do other things.

If Rolf and the Staff want to go back to old rules (yes I remember them, been around longer than that), then fine. Bad timing if you ask me, and it's a bad idea to tell Players that own Deeds on the water they will get stuck with Ships they can never get rid of unless there is a fleet of them. Because it's not the GM's job.

And that IS my beef. At the new price we are paying for Wurm it had better damn well be the GM's job. Whether GMs are being paid by CCAB or not is irrelevant. GM support ingame *IS* a part of Customer Support, that is an Industry Standard for MMOs.

You want to tell a Player that lost his key that he screwed up and is out of luck? Fine. Next time he will have to be more careful. You want to tell a Player that it's on them for not using a Lock on their new Ship? GOOD, I agree. Both of these examples I am in agree with you Hodern, and Alaskanbob and ReaverKane.

But IMO it is not OK to tell Deed owners that every Tom, ######, and Harry can moor their Ships on someone else's Deed and then tell the Deed owner "Too Bad, oh Well". THAT is my objection. I am not seeing in this new Rule change any allowance for Players to call upon GMs to help them with this issue... unless many Ships have been abandoned... and Players leaving their Ships on other Players Deeds (moored) happens all the time.

That's the problem I see that the new Rule Change does not adequetely address. That's not hand holding unless you think that Players should bash the Ships on their deed (instead of a GM moving them off Deed) and then that Player deal with the pissed off returning Player that finds their Ship gone. That's fine for the PvP servers, but not for the Freedom Isles servers afaik. T

Is that what you want? Is that the intent of the Rule Change?

At least the Temorary Salvage System we had addressed this issue. Even if it was only one or two Ships we had a way to deal with the problem.

Edited by Kyrmius

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Actually, this was done a few days before the price change. People just don't pay attention.

And what Kadore said.

Actually I did see the Rule Change. I was too upset to even post about it until now. That is how much of a bad idea I think it is.

Edited by Kyrmius

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What interests me about your objection is that it has absolutely no bearing at all on the removal of the salvage rule.

My objection is also about the change itself, you left Deed Owners stuck with problems they have no permissions to deal with. Saying a GM will come a move Ships when too many pile up isn't good enough. It's vague and wishywashy. Who decides how many is too many? The GM? Not good enough. The GM didn't spend money on the Deed in question.
The salvage rule has nothing to do with 'moving ships when there are too many'. All the salvage rule did was provide a way for players to claim ownership of an item that was already moveable - either by pushing/pulling or commanding. As such, any vessel you could have claimed with the salvage rule in the past, will still be movable.

Ships clogging up deeds is an entirely different matter - for which you are free to make suggestions in the appropriate forum board.

Please note that the following in the game rules under 'Abandoned vessels' is not actually part of the salvage rules:

]Abandoned vessels

Abandoned vessels are those that have been left in such places that constitute a problem to playability such as on deeds. An abandoned vessel can be brought to the notice of a GM and if found appropriate the vessel will be moved sufficiently away from the immediate area of concern.

However, it also needs to be noted that a 'problem to playability' is for things like obstructing construction works and similar. Also, a boat that appeared a day ago won't be considered abandoned ;)

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What interests me about your objection is that it has absolutely no bearing at all on the removal of the salvage rule.

The salvage rule has nothing to do with 'moving ships when there are too many'. All the salvage rule did was provide a way for players to claim ownership of an item that was already moveable - either by pushing/pulling or commanding. As such, any vessel you could have claimed with the salvage rule in the past, will still be movable.

Ships clogging up deeds is an entirely different matter - for which you are free to make suggestions in the appropriate forum board.

Please note that the following in the game rules under 'Abandoned vessels' is not actually part of the salvage rules:

However, it also needs to be noted that a 'problem to playability' is for things like obstructing construction works and similar. Also, a boat that appeared a day ago won't be considered abandoned ;)

I had an abandoned boat moored in where i set my deed in inde.

The boat was there for a long time, and i even ended up flatraising the area where the boat was (the previous owner had left a trail like 1 dirt above water level and then made a pool inland where he had the boat).

I /supported it (/dev at the time), and the boat was moved to my perimeter in water. Tool like 30m for the whole thing to be fixed, did take like 2 messafes for support though.

And although i agree that the price change announcement was done in a poor time, and frankly Rolf was kinda misfortunate since (with the patch issues and such), but sincerely, this change isn't one.

Edited by ReaverKane

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What interests me about your objection is that it has absolutely no bearing at all on the removal of the salvage rule.

The salvage rule has nothing to do with 'moving ships when there are too many'. All the salvage rule did was provide a way for players to claim ownership of an item that was already moveable - either by pushing/pulling or commanding. As such, any vessel you could have claimed with the salvage rule in the past, will still be movable.

Ships clogging up deeds is an entirely different matter - for which you are free to make suggestions in the appropriate forum board.

Please note that the following in the game rules under 'Abandoned vessels' is not actually part of the salvage rules:

However, it also needs to be noted that a 'problem to playability' is for things like obstructing construction works and similar. Also, a boat that appeared a day ago won't be considered abandoned ;)

You're right Hordern. My old memory is faulty again. I am getting the Salvage Rules and Abandoned rules mixed up. Too many changes over the years, too little gray matter (in my case).

Damn I feel like an idiot. Sorry about that and Thanks for clarifying.

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