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More Creatures, Creature Deed Limits, And Changes To Elevation

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Do you think that the number of horses in someone's deed is really related to that, though, when we have huge unicorn infestations?

Yes. & I haven't seen a unicorn infestation....if anything I've seen a spider infestation.

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Do you think that the number of horses in someone's deed is really related to that, though, when we have huge unicorn infestations?

Do you know deeds that have more than 14 animals on them? Because like I said with our old cap, 14 is all it takes (per deed) to hit the non-aggro cap WITHOUT counting the ones in the wild.

Thank you Rolf for finally bringing spawns to servers that were sorely lacking them, and for installing measures to help prevent it from happening again in the future.

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Do you know deeds that have more than 14 animals on them? Because like I said with our old cap, 14 is all it takes (per deed) to hit the non-aggro cap WITHOUT counting the ones in the wild.

Thank you Rolf for finally bringing spawns to servers that were sorely lacking them, and for installing measures to help prevent it from happening again in the future.

Actually its 14 PER PLAYER (premium). And if you think that's a reasonable number, great.

Second, when it hit the cap, did you stop seeing ANY aggro animals at all? Did horses stop spawning, server crashed? For you to "hit the cap" you'd have to have 0 aggressives (aka total animals = non aggros), or the total aggro count would need to be = to aggroes in pens. Because yes, the server will always spawn as many animals as it can, that's the whole point.

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blah blah blah tl;dr

The aggressive cap and non-aggressive are separate. You don't see aggressive stop spawning, because they're constantly being killed and replaced. Not so with the non-aggressive that sit at their cap. It means they're already in the world, and no more spawn.

Anyhow, I think you've wasted enough time. You're not interested in how this is a benefit, and I'm tired of trying to explain it to you.

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The aggressive cap and non-aggressive are separate. You don't see aggressive stop spawning, because they're constantly being killed and replaced. Not so with the non-aggressive that sit at their cap. It means they're already in the world, and no more spawn.

Anyhow, I think you've wasted enough time. You're not interested in how this is a benefit, and I'm tired of trying to explain it to you.

I should have taken my own advice on that, I feel guilty for feeding the troll.

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I foresee tweaking of this ratio so that smaller deeds need less tiles per horse and large deeds need more tiles.

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Do you think that the number of horses in someone's deed is really related to that, though, when we have huge unicorn infestations?

Yeah, getting pretty tired of hearing about the so called 'unicorn infestation'...Even with the spawnings last night i saw about 5 unicorns in total...adding to that the other 5 i have seen in 2 months. I dont know where you live, but obviously this 'infestation' is around you...so id really like people to stop assuming this is happening everywhere.

Edited by Lolly1
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Yeah, getting pretty tired of hearing about the so called 'unicorn infestation'...Even with the spawnings last night i saw about 5 unicorns in total...adding to that the other 5 i have seen in 2 months. I dont know where you live, but obviously this 'infestation' is around you...so id really like people to stop assuming this is happening everywhere.

Obviously it doesn't happen everywhere, maybe if you get out more, you'll see it happening. Although, now its kinda pointless, since the cap increased...

Edited by ReaverKane

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Obviously it doesn't happen everywhere, maybe if you get out more, you'll see it happening. Although, now its kinda pointless, since the cap increased...

I roam Indy. I've come across a few pockets that will have 5-10 unicorns in them but nothing to warrant an infestation. I'd say I meet 20 spiders per unicorn.

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interesting just killed off 25 horses and only went up a little over 1 ratio point looks like i cant be a multi species breeder anymore...

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I roam Indy. I've come across a few pockets that will have 5-10 unicorns in them but nothing to warrant an infestation. I'd say I meet 20 spiders per unicorn.

Yeah, but thats the other issue, only spiders spawn on aggro cap. I also doubt you saw all unicorns that spawned, specially on inde... I mean who knows just what's on top of those peaks?

but think about it, if you can find wild non-aggros spawning on INDE which is the oldest server, and should be by far the one with most penned animals, how can one claim caps have been topped out?

We're working on optimisations all the time, both server and client side and we are currently moving more code to use the GPU with shaders which hopefully will help a lot.

Optimisations won't help us when you render several 100 decent 3D models on the ground and 100s of animated creatures and a bunch of customized players. Eventually you will run into hardware limitations no matter how well you code.

I believe that's why you can find no other games with these numbers except Ultima Online which is using 2D graphics. Oh, Xsyon apparently is unlimited. I checked their website gallery and saw (rough estimates) 10 players and 5 creatures in the same screenshot, or screens with something like 50 crates or cannisters max. Trees in other games usually use more advanced models than we do though, but still can't be put in one place in endless amounts either.

Allowing unlimited number of items on a tile and solving it by clipping doesn't matter either. Since clipping involves figuring out whether an item needs to be clipped its vertices still have to be processed which uses up cpu be it on the server or the client. If the server should figure out whether an item is visible, it would have to run graphics calculations which would require supercomputers.

In short: it's not only what renders that takes a toll on cpu and graphics card, first you have to figure out what should be rendered and that also uses up cpu. Hence we want to spread them out so there are fewer within viewing distance. One alternative would be to only use piles and billboards for creatures but I don't think anyone of us want that.

The barn idea seems to do a couple of things:

It may make it possible to have pretty much as many creatures you wish

It may free up a lot of slots for hunting

It may make it very easy to stand still and grind, and a lot of the current mechanics for AH would be made pointless

It may make full trait horses everyones property for free

It may take away a lot of the connection with the creatures

If you should be able to enter them in some sort of instance, it may halt development for months or a year so that's too big a risk

It may be very good so I will consider it

My conclusion is still that we need to make sure you are somewhat limited in the number of creatures you can keep in a certain space. It has always been the intention but disease and other functionality fails for various reasons usually called bugs or OP. I don't see how it is unreasonable.

After reading this, i'm thinking this cap has less to do with spawns and spawn cap, and more with client rendering, if its true, then even lamer way to implement.

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Time to kill off some bears then deer then dogs then cattle, ugh im so over this crap after 25 or so horses I gained a little over one ratio point. what the use to breed now when you cant even have anything to breed. And latly I was only playing to breed, no use to play anymore when i cant breed them in a safe environment.

Edited by Airwalkre
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Yeah, but thats the other issue, only spiders spawn on aggro cap. I also doubt you saw all unicorns that spawned, specially on inde... I mean who knows just what's on top of those peaks?

but think about it, if you can find wild non-aggros spawning on INDE which is the oldest server, and should be by far the one with most penned animals, how can one claim caps have been topped out?

Hmm, I should at that this isn't a frequent occurance. ;) should probably adjust it to 50 spiders to 1 unicorn. When the Bison spawn jumped in I saw some for the first month. Since then. Extremely rare. Deer also a bit location oriented & aren't common. Pigs, took me a few months to find a wild one. Chickens. Never found 1. Pheasants. Seen a handful but I think that's more because everyone ignores them or or misses them because they are small. Cows. Never seen a wild one. Wild Horses Rare.

Indy may be older but it has a higher cap then deli/exo/cele.

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Because without the deed caps, breeders will just reach the population cap again! It's alright for Exodus and Deliverance to have NEVER seen a bison (until today) since they released?

I regularly get bison spawning inside my perimeter enclosure and have seen every spawnable creature just outside my gates or a short trip away. The cap and breeding have never been an issue on the server I'm playing on so it hardly feels like my animals are dieing for the greater good of anything here.

But no reason to get mad anyway. The solution is pretty simple. I just shrink my village so my horses aren't in it because villages are now lethal to livestock particularly pregnant ones and increase the number of mares so that I can maintain my breeding output due to the new time restrictions on breeding.

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Obviously it doesn't happen everywhere, maybe if you get out more, you'll see it happening. Although, now its kinda pointless, since the cap increased...

Huh? whats that? All i see when i see a post from you is 'wah wah wah...whine whine whine...blah blah blah'.....need a tissue?

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I got 20 animals on deed, I got a 67x23 I have alt villagers, said ratio is 44%/15 and was a good figure. Id say nothing wrong at all. Animal horading needed put under control. there is hundreds of wild horses spawning now, also for breeding pretty simple kill or set free those that aren't 5 speeds, sell the 5 speeds. Doesn't take much thinkin to make all this work. Im loving the hunting and animals ive found. I personally have 0 problem with todays update. Those that are angry about aggros, well get your FS up as this is how the servers suppose to be. Those with animal issues, well you DONT need 200+ animals on your deed, im sorry but that's horading and insane. Yes this is a sandbox, your actions effects everyone else around you and you have know this the entire time, yet do not care that there was no spawns and still kept mass breeding. I for one am HAPPY something is being done to try and cut back on it. However I see your point of views, those with high AH should be able to get 5 speeds very often vs lower levels that would cut there needs for 200+ animals.

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I got 20 animals on deed, I got a 67x23 I have alt villagers, said ratio is 44%/15 and was a good figure. Id say nothing wrong at all. Animal horading needed put under control. there is hundreds of wild horses spawning now, also for breeding pretty simple kill or set free those that aren't 5 speeds, sell the 5 speeds. Doesn't take much thinkin to make all this work. Im loving the hunting and animals ive found. I personally have 0 problem with todays update. Those that are angry about aggros, well get your FS up as this is how the servers suppose to be. Those with animal issues, well you DONT need 200+ animals on your deed, im sorry but that's horading and insane. Yes this is a sandbox, your actions effects everyone else around you and you have know this the entire time, yet do not care that there was no spawns and still kept mass breeding. I for one am HAPPY something is being done to try and cut back on it. However I see your point of views, those with high AH should be able to get 5 speeds very often vs lower levels that would cut there needs for 200+ animals.

Not to pick your post personally, but now that the changes are here, can we be done with everyone making sure to explain to everyone else how they dont need X amount of animals, as you claim thier actions effect everyone else around you, dictating to others what they may or may not need makes you no better then you claim they are.
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Yes this is a sandbox, your actions effects everyone else around you and you have know this the entire time, yet do not care that there was no spawns and still kept mass breeding.

Well now people will need even more animals if they intend to breed as a profession. It only affects villages so there will be more people just using big enclosures that don't support the game directly. As people have said people could break in then but on freedom it's much easier to protect yourself. Any smart breeder is just going to block off a nice big area with long houses stick locks on them and imp up the stone wall segments and have them 3 thick. They'll never have to worry about people breaking in in a realistic amount of time and can freely breed as many as they like increasing the amount to keep up the output with the new restrictions.

Every profession in the game causes game strain which will affect the server performance for everyone else playing on the server. How would you like it if to keep things nice and optimized the game just randomly nuked your good and uncommon items that took many months of work to get just to keep the server clean and stop dirty merchants and crafters from item hording?

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It is insane in game now, you can't leave your deed. Evil spawns in your pastures. Templars dead all over. This has made accomplishing anything impossible, it is ruining the game for me. I absolutely hate it.

What was said in another comment is true, a new player cannot survive. I am not a new player, but still finding it hard to stay alive.

Total mayhem.

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wurm201303262326_1_zps7b7b1e9c.jpg

Thanks Rolf I could keep those and the other ones still alive in their pens ( that is obviously not where everything lived I have pens all over my deed since I became a breeder ) fed and disease free :)

Nice little battle field there huh that's gonna be some fun butcher exp gained there... ruined my crappy maul a bit killing everything there

EDIT: oh i missed about 8 or so other animals i kill up in the village housing section to put in there ;)

EDIT 2: I can post my hell horse aftermath tomorrow after I kill them off from my other deed to fix that ratio

Edited by Airwalkre
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This is why I think the AH/cared for thing was a better fix people are just going to fill up off deed enclosures now and we will be back to where we started in a little while. I think the last fix last what 6 months? I am not sure how long it will take for everyone to fill up the 10k but I am guessing not long I could be wrong it might be enough for it to not be a problem only time will tell.

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This is why I think the AH/cared for thing was a better fix people are just going to fill up off deed enclosures now and we will be back to where we started in a little while. I think the last fix last what 6 months? I am not sure how long it will take for everyone to fill up the 10k but I am guessing not long I could be wrong it might be enough for it to not be a problem only time will tell.

They think they have this clever way of getting around it, I don't think that will work either as its not that hard to make

( off deed ) animals in the wild more prone to things just like in RL.

On the bright side any clusters of off deed lost or stuck would succumb and be respawned.

Edited by Protunia

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They think they have this clever way of getting around it, I don't think that will work either as its not that hard to make

( off deed ) animals in the wild more prone to things just like in RL.

If it's an exploit and damaging to the game to be an animal breeder then Rolf should just stop screwing with people and remove the feature from the game already. It is amazing how hostile and condescending some of the posters here are to those that have fun breeding. Like I said before just imagine the outrage you or anyone else had if these types of punishments and restrictions were placed on their favoured profession. I'm not hording hroses I'm carefully breeding them and enjoying it so much that I do extensive bookkeeping, write numerous tools to help me keep track of my animals, make pedigree trees, etc. It's a lot of fun and I'm sure I'm not the only one having fun doing it. Severely limiting the amount we can keep is really crippling and detrimental to our enjoyment of it and isn't even fixing a problem on the PvP servers where large numbers of animals is even more critical to have.

Edited by Theodis
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I think that aggressive creatures shouldn't count against the ratio of animals to deed tiles unless they have the bred in captivity trait (not sure if that's in-game yet or not). This way those of us with large, open deeds won't be affected by aggros roaming on deed negatively.

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It is funny how people think they can circumvent this new mechanic by building off-deed enclosures for their animals. I am 100% sure that Rolf made it so that off-deed probably has a much worse disease ratio than on-deed. I already saw diseased mobs in the wild (they were normal colour so not the conditioned from lairs). The only problem I see at all with this change is the fact that the aggro cap was raised as well. I am not sure that was necessary at all.

Edited by Wulfgar

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