Elevation Logoff Timer On Deed And Stronger Guards

[vinius 1,496]

If they have such a huge advantage how come they are logging off?

Remember this change would be to make them stay and fight for an hour and possibly win.

Not just run away gate hop and hide or log off.

1. Most people have bad deeds IMO, hard to defend

2. People don't know how to defend, or can't (priests can't repair)

3. Most raiding parties are roughly 10 people, 2 catapaults, hitting deeds with 0-2 people online

This change would not encourage people to defend, it would just discourage raiders. Even now, raiding a deed with broken catapaults is ridic, not to mention that guards alone can kill people if something wrong happens (DCs, wurm bugs etc)

Actually, Nadroj made a good point to me today.

I dont like how res stones work always even after you have activated one like a year ago. I think they should have something like a 1hr to 30min effect, so you can pop them when you are dying instead of just having the constant bonus.

Just thought i'd throw it in.

'I don't want to spend 5s until I absolutely know I am going to die'

[Protunia 735]

1. Most people have bad deeds IMO, hard to defend

2. People don't know how to defend, or can't (priests can't repair)

3. Most raiding parties are roughly 10 people, 2 catapaults, hitting deeds with 0-2 people online

This change would not encourage people to defend, it would just discourage raiders. Even now, raiding a deed with broken catapaults is ridic, not to mention that guards alone can kill people if something wrong happens (DCs, wurm bugs etc)

Maybe they are not training to defend or the ones who have already left?

Maybe you are not getting the types of players to defend you want because of the fact its not worth it and costs to much?

There are other factors here.

Edited March 22, 2013 by Protunia

[Redd 4,281]

'I don't want to spend 5s until I absolutely know I am going to die'

Im sure you cannot think of a different reason, so i shall help you. AFK/Dc'd players will generally have a res stone active, i think changing the res stone mechanic to what i said above. Generally speaking i really dont like res stones, they activate way too much, and lets be honest this is a loot game.

[Vean 131]

I would change 1h with something more reasonable like, 20 min but only when enemy is in local.

Deeds are places where players hide there valuables and themselves from enemy, making deeds less usable may cause people not making so many of them in future (like myself).

[BrQQQ 2,854]

Both ideas sound interesting, I think we could all just give it a try and see how much we like it.

[Klaa 4,872]

Aye an hour is way over the top. As Vean mentioned, 20 min with an enemy in local is more reasonable.

[BrokenSanity 717]

One problem with this I think is it reduces the chance of defenders "giving it a go" and attempting to defend their deed, even if they're outnumbered. Instead of trying to resist until the last minute, when the raiders finally break into the main deed, people will just log off as soon as they see they can't easily repel the raid to guarantee the safety of their stuff.

A good example is the raid on Capehorn, despite there only being 3 of us online to defend, against around 13 JK + a champ nogump, we stuck around for at least 3/4 hours trying to hold them off, even after they were ondeed (no gump and all). After that we were able to log off, sad we'd lost the deed, but happy for a bit of pvp. I presume the attackers enjoyed it more than an empty deed too.

If this change was introduced, it would be much harder to see the benefits from hanging around and fighting when the odds are stacked against you.

[Julepalme 39]

Wheres the poll option: I would still stay.. but i dont like the idea?

[Keldun 335]

If you introduce this you might want to consider giving logged in characters with disconnected players the ability to defend themselves like NPCs do, not stand around and wait for something to accidentally step in front of them. (do they even do that much?)

Also one very radical idea for the players to consider: Have all characters always be logged in as NPC. That way no one can hide anything on alts, but the deed has always the full amount of protectors it can get.

Edited March 22, 2013 by Keldun

[ReaverKane 363]

IMHO the problem here is the lack of PvP in PvP...

I don't play pvp for this one simple reason, i love making stuff, and would find it hard to handle the fact that my stuff got destroyed/ruined/stolen by a bunch of guys while i was sleeping.

I already suggested this back in the day, but why not make pvp a more formal pvp thing.

Create a cheap (1-2s) item called siege camp, available at traders.

Siege camp works like a cart, can be hitched or dragged.

When you arrive at someone's perimeter (or some measure of distance, can be even made that you input the deed name by hand), you deploy it and that deed becomes "under siege".

Siege camp acts like a barrier deed, 4 tiles wide around the sieged deed. Extra guards (max 5, and dependant on emeny deed size) could be hired. Siege camp provides spawn and deed bonus to combat and crafting.

Now the good part, for you to drain a deed, you'd have to "bet" a certain ammount of silver, the ammount of silver to be drained should be equal to the max you can drain (so if you bet 5s you can drain 5s) mechanics should be implemented so that you can't bet more than what's available to drain.

After a deed becomes under siege, it gets a "Rally buff" that makes all guards and structures stronger (30-50% bonus) and token undrainable for a 10-12 hour period, which would allow time for defenders to assemble a proper defense. Also repair and build timers slightly faster as well. At the same time the deed's tweeter tweets a "Under siege" message.

During this period raiders can still do their best to weaken the enemy's defenses.

After the wait period you should have had enough time so that its not a one-sided battle, making it actual pvp, not just glorified griefing/PVE.

If the defenders manage to break siege they can also drain the siege camp "treasure" and claim the "bet", destroying the siege camp item.

If siege is successfull camp can be lifted and reused.

With a more formal system combat and risk are more balanced also this would make it so that everyone wants to bring their A-game to combat, thus making it more rewarding.

Of course there could still be normal overnight raids, but token would not be drainable. To make it even more worthwhile to have these Sieges, players could "claim" a "Treasure vault" item from their deed token, which would be something akin to a Magical chest (except with the decay being attached to upkeep), this chest would be unopenable to enemies except if they successfully managed to siege and drain the token. Also after siege has been declared that vault would be unavailable for the owners as well (preventing emptying it after the fact).

Again this would create a safe and less convoluted alternative to merchant/alt safeguards, and still create a good risk/reward on the whole system.

Again, my 5cents, current pvp system is too unbalanced for me to care for it, so i'm not claiming any special knowlege to playing on pvp servers.

Btw 1hour timers? Waaaay too much. Anything over 10m logout is too much (even 10m is a stretch)

Edited March 22, 2013 by ReaverKane

[Che 250]

If added then add a warning when logging out that you have enemies nearby & will have to wait 1 hour for your character to leave the world

[Necrorave 14]

Now the good part, for you to drain a deed, you'd have to "bet" a certain ammount of silver, the ammount of silver to be drained should be equal to the max you can drain (so if you bet 5s you can drain 5s) mechanics should be implemented so that you can't bet more than what's available to drain.

After a deed becomes under siege, it gets a "Rally buff" that makes all guards and structures stronger (30-50% bonus) and token undrainable for a 10-12 hour period, which would allow time for defenders to assemble a proper defense. Also repair and build timers slightly faster as well. At the same time the deed's tweeter tweets a "Under siege" message.

During this period raiders can still do their best to weaken the enemy's defenses.

This is where I highly disagree with your idea. I know it's PVP and thing can be taken from you. Although, I think this could be extremely unfair towards those who do not have a lot of real money to spend on the game. I can already see people spending 60$ just so they can go around draining all of the money they can. I understand where you are coming from and it makes sense. Although, since the IG money is mostly obtained by Real money, I think this would make this a Pay-to-Win Game. I wish to avoid that please.

[ReaverKane 363]

This is where I highly disagree with your idea. I know it's PVP and thing can be taken from you. Although, I think this could be extremely unfair towards those who do not have a lot of real money to spend on the game. I can already see people spending 60$ just so they can go around draining all of the money they can. I understand where you are coming from and it makes sense. Although, since the IG money is mostly obtained by Real money, I think this would make this a Pay-to-Win Game. I wish to avoid that please.

I don't see how it would be made a "pay-to-win" situation, since nothing i suggested is tied to who pays more or less money. Yes it would require silver to purchase a "siege camp wagon" but would be a small ammount, and this is supposed to be a group effort not 1vs1, so i really don't see how this would hurt anyone.

I mean atm People are draining other people's silver from their deeds without risking anything. I'm simply offering that the risk goes both ways.

The buffs/bonuses are temporary, and are in effect simply to avoid "surprise" attacks, allowing for a short break between declaring the attack and actually being able to consummate it (and is not tied to what you pay in any way). But on the same time, it still allows for attackers to begin crippling the enemy while he rallies.

[Necrorave 14]

I don't see how it would be made a "pay-to-win" situation, since nothing i suggested is tied to who pays more or less money. Yes it would require silver to purchase a "siege camp wagon" but would be a small ammount, and this is supposed to be a group effort not 1vs1, so i really don't see how this would hurt anyone.

I mean atm People are draining other people's silver from their deeds without risking anything. I'm simply offering that the risk goes both ways.

The buffs/bonuses are temporary, and are in effect simply to avoid "surprise" attacks, allowing for a short break between declaring the attack and actually being able to consummate it (and is not tied to what you pay in any way). But on the same time, it still allows for attackers to begin crippling the enemy while he rallies.

(PS: I have never played on PVP. I know a basic amount of knowledge about it so don't ever assume I am right ;p)

I did not know that player can already drain other settlements currently. As I stated, I kinda understood what you were trying to put across. Now that I know that this makes a lot of sense to me. Although, it still has one small flaw. When a place is under siege things cannot go in and out. Meaning messages as well. I think if this were to be implemented, it would have to make it so people within the deed cannot PM people? (Theres always the issue with Voice chatrooms although that cannot be avoided)

Could be something to consider adding to your idea.

[Griebo 107]

Just make all gear/items in your inventory drop in a pile when someone logs off. Either secure it in a locked chest, bank or house or leave it in a pile where the player leaves the world.

EDIT: Guess that would screw us for DC's though.

Could make it impossible for FTP to leave the world with gear and if you want to use a bed, your gear drops if not secured. Would at least force us to pay for storage alts or to not get sleep bonus if we leave with items.

Edited March 22, 2013 by Griebo

[ReaverKane 363]

Just make all gear/items in your inventory drop in a pile when someone logs off. Either secure it in a locked chest, bank or house or leave it in a pile where the player leaves the world.

EDIT: Guess that would screw us for DC's though

Any idea that requires a ideal situation to work is flawed.

I mean you're assuming that people are at their deed near where they keep items when they logout.

All other situations would mean your stuff gets taken.

[Balmore 261]

As long as it doesn't force us to leave the pc running for an hour to log off in a bed...

[Protunia 735]

As long as it doesn't force us to leave the pc running for an hour to log off in a bed...

That is your punishment if you don't stay and fight.

Anyhow I give up its hopeless lol.

Good Luck Rolf!

[Griebo 107]

Any idea that requires a ideal situation to work is flawed.

I mean you're assuming that people are at their deed near where they keep items when they logout.

All other situations would mean your stuff gets taken.

Fixed it (reread last post pg 2)

[ReaverKane 363]

Fixed it (reread last post pg 2)

Well, since we're talking about elevation, which is a Premium only server...

[Che 250]

Remove resurrection stones.

[Keldun 335]

I really like the put under siege idea. It worked well in Ryzom.

The attacking party would lay siege to an outpost and start preparing an attack, which would take a while don't remember how long but it was counted in days.

The defenders could then rally the rest of the server to help defend and we had battles with up to 200 players spread over all sides.

Edited March 22, 2013 by Keldun

[Protunia 735]

I really like the put under siege idea. It worked well in Ryzom.

The attacking party would lay siege to an outpost and start preparing an attack, which would take a while don't remember how long but it was counted in days.

The defenders could then rally the rest of the server to help defend and we had battles with up to 200 players spread over all sides.

having a timer would be better to promote more PvP , but they would complain they had too much to get their stuff on alts and not be looted......

The question is do they want more PvP or just more Loot?

[Keldun 335]

it might work, combining my two ideas to have all chars log in as fightig NPCs during a siege. The defenders get more guards for free and they can't freeze up the loot anymore. The siege timer would prevent having everything available for grabs.

All sides gain, there is a real chance to loot, a real chance to defend and a real chance to retaliate.

Edited March 22, 2013 by Keldun

[JackBurton 903]

We don't raid now as it is because it's too much of a pain in the ass. You implement this on Elevation, and you can bet it becomes a hunting server for people to farm FS. I'll straight up move to Serenity and just go raid the other home servers with the CR nerf (Which is absolutely ridiculous in itself).