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Truthowl

Add Map Or A Craftable Map

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I think there should be a map. One that is blank/black until you've been to a location, but one that shows your current location as well as places you've been. I had NO idea the game world was soooo huge. I read the wiki a LOT and stumbled across the maps earlier today. Hell, I got lost several times and that was around Tap Dance. But that's only one itsy bitsy tiny town/kingdom in the greater world(server).

In fact do it the Wurm way, make us 'craft' a blank map.Add Cartography and as it improves your map get's better. Basic map shows major landmarks and settlements/kingdoms/landscape. Would be nice if it could be searchable as well.

Sorry, I'm sure someone probably recommended this previously but I had to mention it, my $0.02 and all. I get frustrated when I get turned around. lol And that happens more often than you'd think.

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You learn your way around. As much as there are possible benefits to a map the land is constantly changing & you never know what you'll stumble on.

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+1 to a craftable map, and carthographers, but a big -1 to any kind of automated map/minimap automagicaly generated by the game.

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Sorry i will never really want a map, There is a map and you can use deed names to easily figure out your location as well as a compass to find direction. No need for it.

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+1 to a craftable map, and carthographers, but a big -1 to any kind of automated map/minimap automagicaly generated by the game.

This. All over, this.

If we want to know enemy lands, we'd have to trust someone that had been there and was selling maps (lord, lol, the trouble that could cause both ways could be fun); or alternatively, you'd have to painstakingly do it yourself, hah.

Mine would look like children's scribbles.

O <--- rock here T <---- really big tree.

x A unicorn nest

Etc. :P With little waves for elevation and such, lol.

I'd still also like to see in-game writeable books (hey, another use for leather!), but the problem I can see with both these ideas is - doesn't the server have to save such things for them to be viewable like others?

That extra stuff could add up fast where we could use it on something else, instead.

But they'd be nice. :)

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+1 to a craftable map, and carthographers, but a big -1 to any kind of automated map/minimap automagicaly generated by the game.

Agreed

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bleh -1 either way, you can totally make a rl map with crayons and paper

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bleh -1 either way, you can totally make a rl map with crayons and paper

This. At best I would agree to a "paint"-style image maker/editor in-game so we could make maps, use screenshots for paintings/wall-hangings, create emblems and submit them in-game, etc.

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This. At best I would agree to a "paint"-style image maker/editor in-game so we could make maps, use screenshots for paintings/wall-hangings, create emblems and submit them in-game, etc.

Lol ok yeah a mspaint level ingame interface would fit pretty well.

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Lol ok yeah a mspaint level ingame interface would fit pretty well.

Especially if you could / had to equip it with reed pens containing the various dye colours you want to use...

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-1 theres no need for ingame maps... this isnt minecraft guys

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Anyone ever play EverQuest? That would be a nice map making system for wurm. Why some people don't want a map and would complain about a in game map are just biased. The only thing i would suggest is in any map to not allow the showing of players on the map that would be a mistake even allowing the showing of ones self in a map would be a mistake. Any map made should be a map with no markers showing where you are on the map. This is something that can be abused with 3rd party programs to allow packet sniffers to read other players. I would suggest only a map nothing more. If there was a way to implament the online map that people have made in a ingame window would be cool with the ability to to wright on it so players could wright down names of places near them. Along this base i would say.

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No, it is possible to play the game without any use of the map at all. You already have a fairly accurate map made here on the forums that you can use, there is no reason to take the time and the memory to to create a map for the game when you can just do it yourself :/

One thing that I thought was cool and unique about the game is that there was no map, not a ton of games do that, this forces it to be a community effort to create a map that the players can use. If you get messed up or turned around on the map then that it more your challenge to try to figure out how to get unlost, not the responsibility of the game. You can go around creating your own map if ya like even, but there is absolutely no need to add an ingame map to the game, whether craftable or game created.

-1

Also, for anyone out there that is wondering what to do if you die and loose your compass, all the deed tokens have a compass on the tops of them, so you are never really without a compass lol

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No, it is possible to play the game without any use of the map at all. You already have a fairly accurate map made here on the forums that you can use, there is no reason to take the time and the memory to to create a map for the game when you can just do it yourself :/

First off yes it's possible to play the game with out a map, Only if you don't travel much at all.

Second part acurate Where? Half the markers on the map of deeds is not accurate and 60% of them not even on the map so how can you say accurate! Only places on map are when players ask for there place to be listed, So what about the other 60% who don't want there place on map? Accurate I think not it's more of a incomplete map.

Third having customizable maps is doing it your self and not relying on someone to keep up a map for everyone and a not so accurate map at that.

Having a in game map allows for each player to mark there own markers. Not to mention not everyone would have a full map cause not everyone would use it. No one is forcing your hand in making a map so you wouldn't need to even look at it your self seeing you don't like maps. Tools in a game don't mean you have to use it.

Now if i look at every thing from only your point of view then lets look at things like this i'll give a few examples.

Priest i don't use a priest so why have them lets do away with them cause I don't like them and think there useless and they ruin the game.

Pvp I don't like pvp and i see it's useless so lets just do away with that as well.

These where examples but I truly don't get into pvp at all on mmo's but I'm personally not going to deny the pvp players there game fun just because I don't like it. I will just not particapate in the pvp simple enough.

I do like priest I have one but it was a example so If the case was i didn't like them I just simply wouldn't play one allow others who liked them to have there game fun.

Now lets look at maps. If you don't like them fine you don't have to use them but for all the gamer's that want one and have asked for one they shouldn't be denyed because a handful don't like the idea.

Now if you would have read my post instead of just skimming over it you would have seen i simply asked for a in game ui just like the ingame wiki search window that would bring in the map online we all use now in a in game window instead of having to look on a seperate screen and rem not everyone has 2 screens so they have to drop the game screen down while looking at a map unlike most players who duel screen.

And the other thing i simply added was the ability to mark on said map ingame so the players around me and far off who don't want there place on the world map i could mark them on my map so i can not get lost my self.

Do you honestly exspect me to go around and remember every single place that all the gamers build and set a deed? this is a game and not real life so i shouldn't have to or no one else should have to go around remembering things that in a year or few months might not exsist any more.

But don't expect this map asking question to ever disappear. Eventually in time wurm will see a in game map it's only a matter of time and demand.

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I think there should be a map. One that is blank/black until you've been to a location, but one that shows your current location as well as places you've been. I had NO idea the game world was soooo huge. I read the wiki a LOT and stumbled across the maps earlier today. Hell, I got lost several times and that was around Tap Dance. But that's only one itsy bitsy tiny town/kingdom in the greater world(server).

In fact do it the Wurm way, make us 'craft' a blank map.Add Cartography and as it improves your map get's better. Basic map shows major landmarks and settlements/kingdoms/landscape. Would be nice if it could be searchable as well.

Sorry, I'm sure someone probably recommended this previously but I had to mention it, my $0.02 and all. I get frustrated when I get turned around. lol And that happens more often than you'd think.

This has been suggested... At least a dozen times...

First off yes it's possible to play the game with out a map, Only if you don't travel much at all.

Second part acurate Where? Half the markers on the map of deeds is not accurate and 60% of them not even on the map so how can you say accurate! Only places on map are when players ask for there place to be listed, So what about the other 60% who don't want there place on map? Accurate I think not it's more of a incomplete map.

Third having customizable maps is doing it your self and not relying on someone to keep up a map for everyone and a not so accurate map at that.

Having a in game map allows for each player to mark there own markers. Not to mention not everyone would have a full map cause not everyone would use it. No one is forcing your hand in making a map so you wouldn't need to even look at it your self seeing you don't like maps. Tools in a game don't mean you have to use it.

Now if i look at every thing from only your point of view then lets look at things like this i'll give a few examples.

Priest i don't use a priest so why have them lets do away with them cause I don't like them and think there useless and they ruin the game.

Pvp I don't like pvp and i see it's useless so lets just do away with that as well.

These where examples but I truly don't get into pvp at all on mmo's but I'm personally not going to deny the pvp players there game fun just because I don't like it. I will just not particapate in the pvp simple enough.

I do like priest I have one but it was a example so If the case was i didn't like them I just simply wouldn't play one allow others who liked them to have there game fun.

Now lets look at maps. If you don't like them fine you don't have to use them but for all the gamer's that want one and have asked for one they shouldn't be denyed because a handful don't like the idea.

Now if you would have read my post instead of just skimming over it you would have seen i simply asked for a in game ui just like the ingame wiki search window that would bring in the map online we all use now in a in game window instead of having to look on a seperate screen and rem not everyone has 2 screens so they have to drop the game screen down while looking at a map unlike most players who duel screen.

And the other thing i simply added was the ability to mark on said map ingame so the players around me and far off who don't want there place on the world map i could mark them on my map so i can not get lost my self.

Do you honestly exspect me to go around and remember every single place that all the gamers build and set a deed? this is a game and not real life so i shouldn't have to or no one else should have to go around remembering things that in a year or few months might not exsist any more.

But don't expect this map asking question to ever disappear. Eventually in time wurm will see a in game map it's only a matter of time and demand.

WoW the bias...

First off, the current maps are pretty accurate, and provide more than sufficent landmarks for anyone to find their way around... I've traveled extensively throughout several servers, never had a problem.

You can play the game fine as it is.

BUT in-game cartograhpy skill would bea awesome addtion, there have been really nice suggestions (a couple by yours truly) about cartography. No one ever picked up on those. We'll have to wait, maybe...

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Actually the usage of current maps simply underscores the need for an ingame map system.

In the early days of Wurm (Alpha-Beta), long before I started playing, there was a cheating utility called roundwurm. One of its main features was a pretty detailed mapping utility. It was widely used in Beta and afterwards for a time til the Devs altered Wurm's packet-handling. However, packet sniffers in general were an ongoing problem, and illegal map dumps were so prevalent Rolf eventually just made the maps (initial server creation and a few with more updated terrain) public. It was rather laughable how some tried to disquise their hacked dumps as "hand drawn".

The official public dumps have served as the basis for just about every player-made map since then.

When there is a void, something will be created to fill the role. Regardless of the means taken (honest or dishonest) there is a huge need for maps in Wurm. In fact the need is such that one cannot simply map an area once and call it good, even with flawless accuracy. Wurm's very design renders any kind of map: political, typographical, botanical, etc completely useless after a few months. Without updates anyways.

Everytime Ive seen a cartography thread there is usually a main consensus of having no automaps. At least anything automatically-generated, 100% accurate, constantly-updating, eye-in-the-sky, etc.

This still leaves alot of room for player-crafted maps of varying accuracy and utility. Just because public map dumps, player-created maps, and player-created databases exist, does not mean there is no use for a cartography skill/craft.

The most common maps in Wurm tend to be topographical (terrain), political (kingdom influence, villages, towers, battlecamps), natural resources (minerals, trees, harvests, animal spawns), and travel (roads, fords, tunnels).

EDIT: Information is power, and maps are an abstract means of organizing information. In Wurm's pvp environment this makes maps crucial and worthy of "metagaming". Public maps are distributed with generalized notes of interest. Restricted-access of more critical information can be found among most major pvp groups. Through various means, opposing groups form their own maps of enemy targets.

Edited by Klaa
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If it had a map, it shouldn't have a "you are here" dot on it. That part should be found out by the player. I would miss the community maps, so -1 from me.

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It was rather laughable how some tried to disquise their hacked dumps as "hand drawn".

Twas good times, abnormally accurate maps for the win.

Not having a map has been one of wurm's greatest joys for me. Once i turn off the chats, its very immersive. I would hate to have that ruined by a system generated hud map. It just feels like a step in the wrong direction. That being said, a 'map' item in your inventory that you can literally draw on with ingame inks and quills, would be great, so long as its you that draws it.

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Getting lost, learning your way around and player made maps are some of the best things about Wurm. If you want accurate maps, there's the official map dumps already. I for one was glad they weren't released until after I got oriented on the new Release server, as I've had great fun walking around (often repeatedly and soon without a compass) and wondering if I'd reached the coast yet or just a really big lake and constantly worrying that I'd gotten turned around and was going in a direction different from the one I aimed for at the last settlement token.

If craftable maps were to be implemented, they should be tied to a "Cartography" skill and be horribly inaccurate at low skill, much like you'd expect from a hand-drawn map made from memory and running around looking at the landscape. I imagine that sort of thing to be kind of hard to code (making it artificially inaccurate) and a bit silly when you can just alt-tab to MSPAINT.EXE and draw your crude map right there.

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First off yes it's possible to play the game with out a map, Only if you don't travel much at all.

Second part acurate Where? Half the markers on the map of deeds is not accurate and 60% of them not even on the map so how can you say accurate! Only places on map are when players ask for there place to be listed, So what about the other 60% who don't want there place on map? Accurate I think not it's more of a incomplete map.

Third having customizable maps is doing it your self and not relying on someone to keep up a map for everyone and a not so accurate map at that.

Wrong, you can easily play without the map even if you do happen to travel a lot. No, it isn't a complete map, you don't need everyone's deeds on the map, there are plenty of people who do not wish their deed to go on the map, and those deeds are not required for you to navigate around the map. You are also not entitled to a map in the first place so be greatful players actually take their time to make a map for you, instead of having to use landmarks to navigate around the dump map.

Now if i look at every thing from only your point of view then lets look at things like this i'll give a few examples.

Priest i don't use a priest so why have them lets do away with them cause I don't like them and think there useless and they ruin the game.

Pvp I don't like pvp and i see it's useless so lets just do away with that as well.

That is not looking at it from my point of view at all, I don't know how you could've pulled that out of what I said.

Having a in game map allows for each player to mark there own markers. Not to mention not everyone would have a full map cause not everyone would use it. No one is forcing your hand in making a map so you wouldn't need to even look at it your self seeing you don't like maps. Tools in a game don't mean you have to use it.

Excuse me? I completely love maps, but I don't grumble just because I have to tab out to see a map. Also, I would rather the dev team be working on more important things then this as there are far more then an ingame map.

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+1 an in-game map would be great! The fact that anti-map opinions have been snuffed multiple times is proof they don't know what's best for Wurm.

Make a centralized database like map hosted by Wurm. Its in game use would be very similar to you how open a map and read it in real life. In short, make use of the highly detailed information already on your computer and the server. Take this information and alter it with some standardized detail or quality level modifiers.

-Map creation: It is updated by players ingame when they choose to stop and make a map. Map detail level could be tied to paper/writing tool quality and cartography skill. The server already has all the terrain information. The new data would be some kind of quality level modifier the server would use to alter how detailed a map read can be.

-Accessing the map: We don't want to create lots of extra client <-> server data communication The information to make a mini-map is already on your computer right now (As a matter of fact their use to be one that was created with a client hack). How can we make use of this information on our computer and vary its detail? Would it be possible to take some standardized quality level converters based on: mind logic, maybe cartography, and the detail level of the master map on the server and use this to alter information? Some kind of matrices manipulation or pixilation comes to mind. Although, I could be wrong about those.

On a different subject, I wouldn't object to a mini-map with real time exact cords.

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to original poster +1

cartographgy skills should raise when:

- you add a deed to the map (you have to be stood next to the token to do it)

- you add a tower to the map (you have to be stood next to the tower to do it)

- you successfully create a copy of the map using papyrus

when you add a deed or tower on the map it automatically appears at the correct grid position on the map

a high cartography skills allow you to:

- increase the chance of copying your map

- increase the number of custom markers and positions allowed on the map

Edited by robino

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I'd take a page out of minecraft and suggest the following:

You can craft a map, but it is a snapshot of the "local" area only. If the area changes, well the map is outdated and needs to be remade. I think this is probably the only way I'd like to see a map integrated into the game.

-Sqwince

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since we have papyrus we can make it so your character writes down where he walks

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