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echosx

Community Assitant?

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I just have a concern about the behavior from one of the game's Community Assistants. There is an area in Blossom where myself and others had worked hard and built our areas. Sadly, a Community Assistant purchased a deed over our areas which of course stopped some of us from continuing to work on our areas. I had started flattening my area that was not deeded over and was digging next to my enclosed area at the bottom of a big hill near the edge of a perimeter. After some time, I noticed someone was messaging me and asking why I was digging in his perimeter. I did not notice the message since I was doing other things on the computer. I noticed when there was already a threat to have my fence broken down and have my area dug in. Rude! I just ignored the person since I thought the threat was in poor taste. Even though I stopped digging, he went ahead and broke down a fence and started digging in my area. After chatting with a GM, I was informed since my structure did not have a roof the Community Leader did not violate any rules. Because of a technicality this community leader gets away with such disheartening behavior? You would think a Community Leader is there to help and support the community and be more patient and welcoming of new players. I knew he was a community leader because you can see the title when you mouse over him. I was also advised by a GM to not even bother posting about his in the forums since nothing will be done about it. Okay, but I still feel this Community Assistant's actions were still rash. Not a premium customer yet, but will think hard and twice about becoming one. I hope this is not typical of the game's leadership.

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A roof counts for the enclosure rules? Everyone in CA here on Independence has been saying it doesn't count, hope that's clarified some place. You get the "yay you have a house!" message when the walls are up and can sleep in it then. If the roof counts for enclosure rules then there's a lot of places that are not enclosures at the moment.

I'm really sorry to hear this, personally. There are better ways to handle the situation all around. I hope this has not soured you on the game, as there are some truly lovely people playing, some times it just takes a bit to find them.

If you need any help setting up a new place please don't hesitate to let me know and I'll do my best to help.

edit: I asked around. Apparently free to play characters can't even build a roof, and they are NOT needed for an enclosure. If your walls were all completed and all you were missing was a roof, they had no right to bash your fences down.

Edited by Stargrace
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worst part is it wasnt even a normal player, but one of the CAs whom should know better

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Echosx, the story you tell is a very sad one. I really hope that somewhere in the telling of that story you have made a mistake because I found your story shocking. I would be taking this up with Oracle if I was you as it is clear that there is some ambiguity, again, about what constitutes an enclosure. I reread the rules on enclosure and it does say a "completed intact house". Nevertheless, Stargrace has shown in her post where some confusion may arise and it is good for all involved in the game, staff and players, to have as much ambiguity as possible removed from the rules.

edited after rereading the fence bashing rules

Edited by Xianruflux

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No mistake. I went inside my enclosed area because I was alarmed by the CA's threat. He and another player started to destroy the fence I had built. I started to build a fence on the tiles that were not deeded, which I should have done before and would have not mattered anyway, but they destroyed the fence too fast. I just started placing all my stuff in my cart and left since he was going to be a hostile neighbor. He even put me on his KOS list. Of course I did not leave quietly and should not have cursed at him, but the whole situation was infuriating. This is a CA! I am glad to see this CA's mentality is not typical of the game's community.

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Hey there guy, I'm really sorry to hear of a story like this....wurm is filled with awesome and fun players to hang around with. Sometimes there are bad apples, and I hate to see that a CA of all people has done this to you! If you ever ever ever need help setting up with anything shoot me a PM and I could help you out :)

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CA's are just players who aspire to be in an elevated position. Truth be told, you don't need to become a CA in order to help other players but having the formal position gives you that recognition of status and power.

I myself have been involved in a nasty incident involving a CA lurching over me and threatening me with KOS when I was a new player, I am glad that the CA who did that to me is no longer in that position.

Unfortunately in your case, the GM determined that your structure was not a legal enclosure and I do wish that someone could offer you more assistance or the CA involved could offer you a compromise. Sadly, things like this happen but don't let it turn you away from buying premium because Wurm is still a very enjoyable game and the majority of players are generally fine.

I do applaud you for speaking out like this, people need to know that there are players out there (even the ones accepted into a position of power and responsibility) who do things like this.

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I would like to have a GM ruling -- preferably by Oracle -- on whether the lack of roof means an attached structure no longer counts towards a protected enclosure if the roof is now missing. The game forcibly removed all of our roofs and it will take some time to get them redone. In addition, there is currently a server BUG where it does not make any sense to roof off-deed buildings as the roofs cannot be repaired/improved, and any off-deed roofs added now will simply rot away again in a short time.

This means that most of the work I have already done on reroofing, will probably be completely wasted as the dev team can give no general timetable when this is going to be looked into, or even whether this is considered a high priority issue. Fair enough, but I will be upset if this game update (removing current roofs) plus server bug basically makes all off-deed protected enclosures, suddenly lose their protections, and if GMs currently are making ingame rulings that houses/enclosures missing their roofs since the update, are now fair game for bashing.

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I'm sure there is another side to this story. As the OP notes, the other player did send them warnings; it's not their fault if the warnings were not seen in a timely manner. That said, not applying the enclosure rule because of a missing roof is worth questioning, to me. Drop a line to Oracle - even GMs can make mistakes sometimes.

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Sorry to hear about your issues, i hope you find a better home and kinder folks.

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Uhhh that means I have a couple of off deed farm "enclosures" that are bashable? Noooooooooot ok.

Could we get a formal ruling on whether or not a roof is required for enclosure to be considered complete?

Eh rather unsightly behavior on their part. I'm sure their is more to it then that but it would have been polite to find another spot if it was obvious someone was working on it.

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  View hidden Post
Posted · Hidden by EnvyODB, December 31, 2012 - Ill let enki deal with it
Hidden by EnvyODB, December 31, 2012 - Ill let enki deal with it

I would like to have a GM ruling -- preferably by Oracle -- on whether the lack of roof means an attached structure no longer counts towards a protected enclosure if the roof is now missing.

It has been discussed and as long as the house has all the walls finished its a legal enclosure

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CA's are just players who aspire to be in an elevated position. Truth be told, you don't need to become a CA in order to help other players but having the formal position gives you that recognition of status and power.

Maybe some become CA's because they believe it gives them status and power, but if so they are deluding themselves. Community Assistants, in my opinion, should strive to behave like a role model to the community and do their very best to uphold the Freedom Code of Conduct (if playing on Freedom).

I find this whole ordeal appalling and I hope the OP will write a forum PM to Enki describing the whole situation and naming the CA and GM in question. I can't find it in the rules where it says it is illegal to deed over a legal enclosure, but it is certainly poor behaviour to do so in most cases, and a GM should know better than to claim that a legal enclosure requires a roof. I hope this situation is just basically a misunderstanding.

I hope you will choose to give Wurm a chance and buy premium because Wurm has a great community and its a truely brilliant game which will become much more apparent to you if you decide to buy premium.

Edited by Wulfgar
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If what you say is true, echosx, this is just outrageous. A CA is supposed to help and assist players and you would expect him/her to be especially patient with newbies. In this case the CA in question does not seem qualified for his job - providing that the situation was as you described.

I would really love to hear the CA's version of the story!

Edited by Yaga

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The issue of whether or not a house should have to have a roof to be counted as an enclosure has been raised and a clarification is likely to come soon.

As for staff, if you wish you may forward a complaint to Envious (EDIT: He is EnvyODB on the forums) about the CA in question regarding his/her behaviour. Envious is one of the GMs responsible for Community Assistants, any further problems feel free to contact me.

Also can I thank you for not mentioning names in this thread, I assume that was deliberate and it's helpful in not making a forum flamefest start x)

Edited by Docterchese

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A building is complete if all walls are, roof does not count towards that.

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Just to get it out of the way, it would be pretty ludicrous to currently include the roof as part of the enclosure rule seeing as all roofs were removed with 1.0 This is just common sense. If it is included in the distant future, so be it, but ample opportunity for people to catch up should be given. note: deed owner here, no horse in the race.

Having said that, Echox, to address your concern that this is the norm... it is not!!

I've had many occasions to interact with CA's, GM's and others whose title I don't even know because frankly I don't think it's that important to a lot of people, including many CA's, GM's and others whose title I don't even know :). It has always been a very positive, helpful, prompt experience. Not once have I not received the help I needed!

Honestly the only status and power I recognize in Wurm is in the old-timers that are very willing to help, to offer guidance and share their knowledge. To me, this has generally been the norm.

Community, and assistant, seem completely lost on the individual you encountered. Keep exploring and meeting the locals, you'll find a friendly place :) I'm sure of that. There are also villages that specialize in helping new players get settled and grow. I don't know if Brash_Endeavors still has one going but if she does, I'd recommend it.

Good luck out there, have fun, and please don't feed the crocs :P

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Name and shame!

Who is watching the Watchmen?!

Edited by Darkmalice
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I intentionally did not include the names of the CA and the few GM involved since I thought it would be inappropriate. Also, forum rules do not allow it, but mostly because it is not my intention to start a pitchfork rally. I just needed to share my experience with others. The CA did say in Local chat that he already had GM permission to break down the fence when other locals started responding in chat to the situation. The second GM I chatted with said I should contact the first GM in the forums since he or she was a villager in the CA's village?! I explained to the third GM that the first GM was probably not aware I did have a building in my enclosed area. He said since I had no roof the ruling stands, and I should not bother posting about this in the forums since it would not matter. Is it the word biased I am looking for? I am glad to see this game has an awesome community. I have since moved on and found helpful and friendly people elsewhere in Pristine.

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I intentionally did not include the names of the CA and the few GM involved since I thought it would be inappropriate. Also, forum rules do not allow it, but mostly because it is not my intention to start a pitchfork rally. I just needed to share my experience with others. The CA did say in Local chat that he already had GM permission to break down the fence when other locals started responding in chat to the situation. The second GM I chatted with said I should contact the first GM in the forums since he or she was a villager in the CA's village?! I explained to the third GM that the first GM was probably not aware I did have a building in my enclosed area. He said since I had no roof the ruling stands, and I should not bother posting about this in the forums since it would not matter. Is it the word biased I am looking for? I am glad to see this game has an awesome community. I have since moved on and found helpful and friendly people elsewhere in Pristine.

Glad to hear it, in the meantime do forward on this thread as well as your experience to the above mentioned gm.

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Wow... leave it to the CA's to take up all the good spots for themselves and bend the rules to their favor.

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I intentionally did not include the names of the CA and the few GM involved since I thought it would be inappropriate. Also, forum rules do not allow it, but mostly because it is not my intention to start a pitchfork rally. I just needed to share my experience with others. The CA did say in Local chat that he already had GM permission to break down the fence when other locals started responding in chat to the situation. The second GM I chatted with said I should contact the first GM in the forums since he or she was a villager in the CA's village?! I explained to the third GM that the first GM was probably not aware I did have a building in my enclosed area. He said since I had no roof the ruling stands, and I should not bother posting about this in the forums since it would not matter. Is it the word biased I am looking for? I am glad to see this game has an awesome community. I have since moved on and found helpful and friendly people elsewhere in Pristine.

Well done mate. Not only did you read and understand the forum rules, but not throwing a name out in public would have been your instinct anyway. Seems to me the CA you had the unfortunate experience of meeting could actually take a lesson from you!

I'm glad you found a better area to settle down and get some roots. I would get all your finances in order, and do a lot of grocery shopping asap as one you get bitten by Wurm... real life can sometimes pass right on by :lol:

Have fun, and welcome to Wurm!

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I am glad to hear that you found a better place and you were right to bring this to people's attention in the forums so at least others can avoid your misfortune.

GM's and CA's are people and therefore not perfect but most of them do have the community's best interest at heart and I hope you do not let a few bad apples spoil your enjoyment of this game.

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