Change skill check and failure outcomes

[Meridius 80]

As it stands, when you try to craft an item and it boasts a 65% chance, it is hardly ever a 65% chance. Are you using a linear random 1-100 roll to determine outcome? How come with a 65% chance (just as an example) I can try and make a plank, waste 3 logs and get no planks? With a true 65% chance, you should at least get ~2 logs worth of planks. If a linear number range is being used, change it to a more bell-curve system such as using three 1-100 rolls and averaging them to get the final result.

Secondly, the waste on failing is seriously illogical. Why, when putting a handle on a sword does the failure turn the sword into scrap? Or an anchor when failing to attach a rope turn the anchor into scrap? This is truely frustrating and very unrealistic.

Also, why when making a house I never fail to put on a plank, but for some reason you can fail to put a square brick on a guard tower over and over? Its SQUARE, how do you fail to add a brick? Or dirt to a charcoal pile, how do you not add it AND damage the dirt? Damage dirt?

[Guest Redsyndicate]

As it stands, when you try to craft an item and it boasts a 65% chance, it is hardly ever a 65% chance. Are you using a linear random 1-100 roll to determine outcome? How come with a 65% chance (just as an example) I can try and make a plank, waste 3 logs and get no planks? With a true 65% chance, you should at least get ~2 logs worth of planks. If a linear number range is being used, change it to a more bell-curve system such as using three 1-100 rolls and averaging them to get the final result.

[Huck. L. Barry 1]

Think of it this way..

You have a dice, the chance of getting 1-5 is 83%.

You can still get nothing but 6 an infinite times in a row if you keep throwing the dice - It's just luck.

[Arcanist 0]

agree with the sword bit.

not the plank making though

[Emoo 4393]

Meh there are bigger problems that need attention than small parts of the game which have been there for years.

[EliasTheCrimson 348]

You don't really know what probability is, do you?

If you have dice, there is a ~17% chance of you getting a six. The next time you roll the dice, the chance is STILL ~17%.

No matter how many times you roll the dice, the probability remains the same. This means you could in theory roll the dice a thousand times and still not get a six, even if that not likely to happen.

In other words, the probability percentage tells you nothing about the final result, just what's the most likely to happen.

The failure frustrations is part of the difficulty curve in crafting. If you removed the material loss of failures, we'd have to make crafting more difficult in other ways, such as much higher skill requirements. I'd rather have a chance of making a certain item at my skill with frustrating material losses, rather than not having the option of creating that item at all because my skill is too low.

[spellcast 983]

The failure frustrations is part of the difficulty curve in crafting. If you removed the material loss of failures, we'd have to make crafting more difficult in other ways, such as much higher skill requirements. I'd rather have a chance of making a certain item at my skill with frustrating material losses, rather than not having the option of creating that item at all because my skill is too low.

EXACTLY.

The materiel loss is there to make failing to create something actually have a downside. It's a game mechanic. Sometimes games have to do things that dont make 100% logical sense in order to make gameplay more interesting/challenging, and in the end, rewarding.

[Guest Saturobi]

Item loss is the most annoying thing in wurm. For example, YAY I finished a lamp head (6%). Attaching attaching... You failed, the lamp head turned to scrap...

Or when I tried to make a bed... Created every part, and when I were to attach them, the legs broke 5 times! (Still haven't finished it...) So annoying. It shouldn't be that hard, it's time consuming as it is. You have to cut trees, make planks, fail, mine, make nails and so on.

[Guest Redsyndicate]

Item loss is the most annoying thing in wurm. For example, YAY I finished a lamp head (6%). Attaching attaching... You failed, the lamp head turned to scrap...

Was making a toolbelt, had almost no skill but i managed to make the hooks and belt. When I tried to attach them I ended up with damage on the belt and no more hooks  > I ended up learning how to use a catapult just to throw the useless thing into the sea 

[EliasTheCrimson 348]

Item loss is the most annoying thing in wurm. For example, YAY I finished a lamp head (6%). Attaching attaching... You failed, the lamp head turned to scrap...

Or when I tried to make a bed... Created every part, and when I were to attach them, the legs broke 5 times! (Still haven't finished it...) So annoying. It shouldn't be that hard, it's time consuming as it is. You have to cut trees, make planks, fail, mine, make nails and so on.

Have you ever considered taking the hint of that 6% success chance? It means you don't have enough skill to perform the action.

Crafting in Wurm is skill-based, meaning that what you're describing is exactly how it's supposed to work. If you don't have enough skill, you are not supposed to be able to create that certain item very easily.

At least Wurm is mostly generous enough to give you a reduced CHANCE at creating it at low skill, rather than completely locking you out until you reach X skill level.

[Guest Saturobi]

Item loss is the most annoying thing in wurm. For example, YAY I finished a lamp head (6%). Attaching attaching... You failed, the lamp head turned to scrap...

Or when I tried to make a bed... Created every part, and when I were to attach them, the legs broke 5 times! (Still haven't finished it...) So annoying. It shouldn't be that hard, it's time consuming as it is. You have to cut trees, make planks, fail, mine, make nails and so on.

Have you ever considered taking the hint of that 6% success chance? It means you don't have enough skill to perform the action.

Crafting in Wurm is skill-based, meaning that what you're describing is exactly how it's supposed to work. If you don't have enough skill, you are not supposed to be able to create that certain item very easily.

At least Wurm is mostly generous enough to give you a reduced CHANCE at creating it at low skill, rather than completely locking you out until you reach X skill level.

You missing the point. When I already have managed to create something it shouldn't be possible to destroy it that easy. I you fail, the item can take 50 dmg or something. Although I get your point aswell. I'm just frustrated When you work a few hours to get all parts and everything, you dont want to see it disappear in a second...

[Tritus 2]

OK so you are trying to attach a big tin can to one end of a log.

You gently tap the can with your 20 pound sledge hammer (really a 2 oz hammer that your clumsiness has made incredibly heavy) and you dent the collar of your tin can beyond repair.

Its not an inconceivable situation at all.

[Guest Saturobi]

OK so you are trying to attach a big tin can to one end of a log.

You gently tap the can with your 20 pound sledge hammer (really a 2 oz hammer that your clumsiness has made incredibly heavy) and you dent the collar of your tin can beyond repair.

Its not an inconceivable situation at all.

Ah when you put it that way... ^^ Nvm then, since everybody likes how it is now.

[spellcast 983]

Ah when you put it that way... ^^ Nvm then, since everybody likes how it is now.

not likes it,  understands it perhaps. but not neccesarily likes it.

It makes the game more interesting and provides incentive to increase skills so you dont destroy stuff as easily, or as often.

[Guest Saturobi]

Your right, I understand that. But some things is ridiculous hard in this game. For ex. creating a mallet, which every newb needs. It takes time to get the parts needed, and when your about to attach the mallet head with the wooden handle, 4/5 times the mallet head turns to wood crap. I can't see how you possible can destroy a mallet head with your bare hands. It's a fantasy simulator after all, and things should make sense.

It seems that some people want the game to be as hard a possible, because that apparently what the game is all about. Let's drop this, I dont belive that I can convince you nor you me 

[Huck. L. Barry 1]

Your right, I understand that. But some things is ridiculous hard in this game. For ex. creating a mallet, which every newb needs. It takes time to get the parts needed, and when your about to attach the mallet head with the wooden handle, 4/5 times the mallet head turns to wood crap.

That's how newbies learn to imp things before messing with them.

[Maximustehgreat 353]

This is what wurms dice looks like for chance as a noob.

[Shadow Mage 0]

Sometimes its normal to destroy the item when you fail.  But sometimes it isn't, like with making a mast.  I mean I've already cut down all of the trees near my neighbors place.  I went through 14 small masts before I finally made a triangular rig...  How do I lose without a trace 60 kg's of wood?  I mean, what did I do?  Just squish the things together or something?  Buzzzzzt!  <waits a second> Buzzzzzzzzzzzzzt!  And honestly?  How do I lose WOOD, ya know oak none the less, over a bunch of spindled COTTON?!?  I mean, what it boils down to is, that the game would be more enjoyable if you could predict what you'd be more likely to lose from an action.  We would be able to do that if you more often than not, lost the not so durable material and only damaged the other component.

Metal should be more durable than wood,

Wood should be more durable than cotton.

Yet I bet if we where to try an make a flag, we'd lose the 60kg's of iron completely, but the flag would sit there with maybe 5 damage...

This thread inspired me to make this comic actually, enjoy.

Also, to all those who quote me, remove the image tags, don't quote the image because if you do, rolf will burn another non premium!

[Klaa 4871]

Your right, I understand that. But some things is ridiculous hard in this game. For ex. creating a mallet, which every newb needs. It takes time to get the parts needed, and when your about to attach the mallet head with the wooden handle, 4/5 times the mallet head turns to wood crap.

That's how newbies learn to imp things before messing with them.

Heh most of us have spent at least one day cursing the mallet-making.  > Especially early in a map when you couldnt just trade/kill for one.  ;D

[Guest Saturobi]

Sometimes its normal to destroy the item when you fail.  But sometimes it isn't, like with making a mast.  I mean I've already cut down all of the trees near my neighbors place.  I went through 14 small masts before I finally made a triangular rig...  How do I lose without a trace 60 kg's of wood?  I mean, what did I do?  Just squish the things together or something?  Buzzzzzt!  <waits a second> Buzzzzzzzzzzzzzt!  And honestly?  How do I lose WOOD, ya know oak none the less, over a bunch of spindled COTTON?!?  I mean, what it boils down to is, that the game would be more enjoyable if you could predict what you'd be more likely to lose from an action.  We would be able to do that if you more often than not, lost the not so durable material and only damaged the other component.

Metal should be more durable than wood,

Wood should be more durable than cotton.

Yet I bet if we where to try an make a flag, we'd lose the 60kg's of iron completely, but the flag would sit there with maybe 5 damage...

This thread inspired me to make this comic actually, enjoy.

Also, to all those who quote me, remove the image tags, don't quote the image because if you do, rolf will burn another non premium!

At last! Someone who understand what I'm talking about haha. Good one Shadow Mage