Defiance PMKS March 7th

[Carmichael 685]

So to elaborate on the trinkets.

 

They would come from more permanent areas called "dungeons" for example. Different levels give different levels of trinkets.

 

As an example

A super easy pig dungeon would give a trinket that increases specific stats and skills be like 1-7 skill.

Easier one with wolves gives  3-10

Medium with like spiders/bears 5-15

etc etc.

 

Stats are hard capped at 70 with trinkets.

Skills are not.

Damage/Defenses are hard capped at like 20%.

 

These trinkets would be jewelry based, or even add capes for the harder ones, and shoulder pads even. cosmetic items that don't drop, but lose charges. To maintains those charges you have to kill mobs or obtain orbs or something to charge said trinkets from the "dungeons"

 

You can expand the trinkets into anything really, can add cut/slash/pierce attack and defenses too. Some rare ones to add overall damage reduction. Basically making these obtainable for anyone at any level. As you progress through the dungeons you get better trinkets obviously. It also creates pvp. And you can also do it for the goblin camps whenever that comes out. But it would basically follow that type of guideline....

Edited March 1, 2023 by Carmichael

[Carmichael 685]

Oh and you can also make spells specific to whatever element too. And these would be placed around the map. but they don't really move often or at all. cannot deed within like 150 tiles of it.

 

Fire resistance 20%

Fire penetration 20% for example for like the high end trinkets

[Pnutp 293]

What did I miss? Can someone please update me on the recent suggestions? I have been at work for the last 12hrs (check that out 😃 a JK player with a job) and to lazy to read over all the relevant suggestions. 
 

Did we all agree there is a perfect safe area to gain skills and become PvP ready and build a crafter to create good gear at fast speed just on the other side of the portal to PvE and finally understand the concept of PvP? 

Edited March 1, 2023 by Pnutp

[feldoh 74]

@PnutpJust opp on discord, its all posted by your group. They can give you a recap

[thegrayfox 10]

Revert the change allowing enemies to follow through doors. 

Reasons:

• Basically made any off-deed building pointless.
• Can even make this only work within kingdom influence making towers actually useful again for something other than deed-chaining + can't just go into enemy lands and drop a "safe" structure. 
• This would make building kingdom infrastructure actually worthwhile and strategic again. Kingdom territory would also become more important if change was only reverted in tower range.
• Players would actually feel like they had a chance to roam within their own kingdom despite not being the strongest pvp player on the server
• Everything not on a deed wouldn't be dead and lifeless as there is a point to building off-deed again
• Easier for new players to not be followed into their house with a locked door and killed because they don't understand this mechanic.
• Can still pick / bash in easy enough as there are no raid windows.  Possible to balance this if needed by making it easier to do to an off-deed building. or by making picked open timers longer for off deed structures to make it easier to "raid" giant off-deed complex
• More spontaneous "raiding" on a smaller scale -- we can bash/pick into enemy structure without needing an organized group around a raid window.
• Sure players might have more off-deed protections because of this change but they would also be off-deed more because of change (building / maintaining these buildings + roaming more)

Edited March 1, 2023 by thegrayfox

[Atndy 385]

1 hour ago, gnomegates said:

Delete all pvp servers and everyone can just sit on the forums and pvp here like this.

You all talk about wanting new players to come join, but with the amount of negative attitude and behaviors on display in the many different pvp posts...why would any new player want to come and pvp in Wurm. I'm often asked to come join pvp, but I can tell you that this is one of the main reasons why I wont, you all just destroy your self from the inside out.

There is more pvp on freedom with hostile neighbors. Ours just usually doesn't involve gms.

[Atndy 385]

3 minutes ago, thegrayfox said:

Revert the change allowing enemies to follow through doors. 

Reasons:

• Basically made any off-deed building pointless.
• Can even make this only work within kingdom influence making towers actually useful again for something other than deed-chaining + can't just go into enemy lands and drop a "safe" structure. 
• This would make building kingdom infrastructure actually worthwhile and strategic again. Kingdom territory would also become more important if change was only reverted in tower range.
• Players would actually feel like they had a chance to roam within their own kingdom despite not being the strongest pvp player on the server
• Everything not on a deed wouldn't be dead and lifeless as there is a point to building off-deed again
• Easier for new players to not be followed into their house with a locked door and killed because they don't understand this mechanic.
• Can still pick / bash in easy enough as there are no raid windows.  Possible to balance this if needed by making it easier to do to an off-deed building. or by making picked open timers longer for off deed structures to make it easier to "raid" giant off-deed complex
• More spontaneous "raiding" on a smaller scale -- we can bash/pick into enemy structure without needing an organized group around a raid window.
• Sure players might have more off-deed protections because of this change but they would also be off-deed more because of change (building / maintaining these buildings + roaming more)

Roaming 2 titles from a hop at all times. Sounds real fun.i would be all for this but I want 1h lotimers.

Edited March 1, 2023 by Atndy

[thegrayfox 10]

8 minutes ago, Atndy said:

Roaming 2 titles from a hop at all times. Sounds real fun.i would be all for this but I want 1h lotimers.

 

I would think actually more fun than two tiles from a deed you can't raid because you don't have a group or are not in raid window. + more options to balance this by capping offdeed QL / boosting dmg / increasing / lotime for example.  Also if it has to be in tower influence, it encourages players to build / bash / defend more towers.

Edited March 1, 2023 by thegrayfox

[Atndy 385]

6 minutes ago, thegrayfox said:

 

I would think actually more fun than two tiles from a deed you can't raid because you don't have a group or are not in raid window. + more options to balance this by capping offdeed QL / boosting dmg / increasing / lotime for example.  Also if it has to be in tower influence, it encourages players to build / bash / defend more towers.

So this is how it went to epic. Someone pop your local go into your hop. Log off. Gg pvp averted.

[Carmichael 685]

9 minutes ago, Atndy said:

So this is how it went to epic. Someone pop your local go into your hop. Log off. Gg pvp averted.

I agree with the 1 hour timer with enemy in local. Cannot use karma home and suicide either. But minedoors offdeed definitely created a lot of pvp

[Melros 588]

Given the snowball nature of the game and that the people in power typically stay in power until people quit the game from boredom, i would unironically be in favor of a challenge server relaunch and regular restart. I think the biggest crux of that would be tinkering with the mode so that it was less of a 1 week wonder and could be invested a bit more into. PvE rewards, what ever, that could be a whole other thread.

 

If I've seen anything in my time playing Wurm, its that the most fun and exciting period of any pvp server is the first 6 months of its existence.

 

I see a reply to this being that the great thing about the pvp servers as they are right now are that people are "invested" in the work they put in. However, just by a quick scan of this thread, and the Skirmish thread over the last year. I reckon most of us can agree that it has created a stagnant and toxic environment. 

 

The amount of literal time it takes for progress to be made on PvP is atrocious. Its kind of a joke to expect any new player to ever be able to compete and the current system will never be new player friendly. The game mode will never grow. The set up for PvP as it is now, will always be in a state of attrition. It only takes getting 3 shot by the enemy kingdom's hyper active mega account a couple of times to remind you that you don't want to mine or dig tar 6 hours a day for 6 to 12 month to actually make a relevant account.

 

If the response to that is "that this is how the game is meant to be played and the intention is fully to make playing on it as difficult as it is" then we can stop here. But the PvP aspect of the game will never grow. And maybe fishing for Whales is the end goal of it all. No harm no foul. I just see so much more potential.

 

I think a merge of the PvP servers and finally getting the player base under 1 roof would be a good thing. It would definitely be "ripping off a bandaid" vibe. But I think we're kind of covered in bandaids at this point.

 

However, I feel like even once that is said and done, we still arrive at the same problem of player base stagnation. There will be, at most, one fresh account that ever becomes pvp relevant ever again in this game. If the main issue of the difficultly curve of having a playable character is not addressed then this will never change.

 

Hence, my support of the challenge server.

 

I dont know how we would make peoples current accounts relevant. Maybe there could be a bonus to base starting stats on a challenge server based on the current stats of your PvE character. But ultimately not something a player couldnt catch up to with a curve in REASONABLE time. Just spit balling here. But I think this could be explored. Its a fair point to acknowledge we'd need to figure out how peoples work on their current accounts wouldn't be all for waste if PvP transitioned to a less permanent, faster paced model with a collective playerbace under 1 roof.

 

And maybe this is just another dumb idea to throw into the endless sea of dumb ideas. Ive solidified my theory. That somewhere in a discord at any given time of day, someone is explaining an idea they think would fix wurm.

Edited March 1, 2023 by Melros

[Carmichael 685]

2 minutes ago, Melros said:

Given the snowball nature of the game and that the people in power typically stay in power until people quit the game from boredom, i would unironically be in favor of a challenge server relaunch and regular restart. I think the biggest crux of that would be tinkering with the mode so that it was less of a 1 week wonder and could be invested a bit more into. PvE rewards, what ever, that could be a whole other thread.

 

If I've seen anything in my time playing Wurm, its that the most fun and exciting period of any pvp server is the first 6 months of its existence.

 

I see a reply to this being that the great thing about the pvp servers as they are right now are that people are "invested" in the work they put in. However, just by a quick scan of this thread, and the Skirmish thread over the last year. I reckon most of us can agree that it has created a stagnant and toxic environment. 

 

The amount of literal time it takes for progress to be made on PvP is atrocious. Its kind of a joke to expect any new player to ever be able to compete and the current system will never be new player friendly. The game mode will never grow. The set up for PvP as it is now, will always be in a state of attrition. It only takes getting 3 shot by the enemy kingdom's hyper active mega account a couple of times to remind you that you don't want to mine or dig tar 6 hours a day for 6 to 12 month to actually make a relevant account.

 

If the response to that is "that this is how the game is meant to be played and the intention is fully to make playing on it as difficult as it is" then we can stop here. But the PvP aspect of the game will never grow. And maybe fishing for Whales is the end goal of it all. No harm no foul. I just see so much more potential.

 

I think a merge of the PvP servers and finally getting the player base under 1 roof would be a good thing. I think it would be like ripping of a bandaid. But I think we're kind of covered in bandaid at this point.

 

However, I feel like even once that is said and done, we still arrive at the same problem of player base stagnation. There will be, at most, one fresh account that ever becomes pvp relevant ever again in this game. If the main issue of the difficultly curve of having a playable character is not addressed then this will never change.

 

Hence, my support of the challenge server.

 

I dont know how we would make peoples current accounts relevant. Maybe there could be a bonus to base starting stats on a challenge server based on the current stats of your PvE character. But ultimately not something a player could catch up to with a curve. Just spit balling here. But I think this could be explored. Its a fair point to acknowledge we'd need to figure out how peoples work on their current accounts wouldn't be all for waste if PvP transitioned to a less permanent, faster paced model with a collective playerbace under 1 roof.

 

 

That's why Introducing trinkets with hard caps at certain levels would help even the playing ground tremendously. A new player with like a +30 body str and like +whatever in whatever random skill is generated from a table or whatever damage/resistance can jump into pvp without dying in like 3 hits to a higher end account. 

[Atndy 385]

20 minutes ago, Melros said:

Given the snowball nature of the game and that the people in power typically stay in power until people quit the game from boredom, i would unironically be in favor of a challenge server relaunch and regular restart. I think the biggest crux of that would be tinkering with the mode so that it was less of a 1 week wonder and could be invested a bit more into. PvE rewards, what ever, that could be a whole other thread.

 

If I've seen anything in my time playing Wurm, its that the most fun and exciting period of any pvp server is the first 6 months of its existence.

 

I see a reply to this being that the great thing about the pvp servers as they are right now are that people are "invested" in the work they put in. However, just by a quick scan of this thread, and the Skirmish thread over the last year. I reckon most of us can agree that it has created a stagnant and toxic environment. 

 

The amount of literal time it takes for progress to be made on PvP is atrocious. Its kind of a joke to expect any new player to ever be able to compete and the current system will never be new player friendly. The game mode will never grow. The set up for PvP as it is now, will always be in a state of attrition. It only takes getting 3 shot by the enemy kingdom's hyper active mega account a couple of times to remind you that you don't want to mine or dig tar 6 hours a day for 6 to 12 month to actually make a relevant account.

 

If the response to that is "that this is how the game is meant to be played and the intention is fully to make playing on it as difficult as it is" then we can stop here. But the PvP aspect of the game will never grow. And maybe fishing for Whales is the end goal of it all. No harm no foul. I just see so much more potential.

 

I think a merge of the PvP servers and finally getting the player base under 1 roof would be a good thing. It would definitely be "ripping off a bandaid" vibe. But I think we're kind of covered in bandaids at this point.

 

However, I feel like even once that is said and done, we still arrive at the same problem of player base stagnation. There will be, at most, one fresh account that ever becomes pvp relevant ever again in this game. If the main issue of the difficultly curve of having a playable character is not addressed then this will never change.

 

Hence, my support of the challenge server.

 

I dont know how we would make peoples current accounts relevant. Maybe there could be a bonus to base starting stats on a challenge server based on the current stats of your PvE character. But ultimately not something a player couldnt catch up to with a curve in REASONABLE time. Just spit balling here. But I think this could be explored. Its a fair point to acknowledge we'd need to figure out how peoples work on their current accounts wouldn't be all for waste if PvP transitioned to a less permanent, faster paced model with a collective playerbace under 1 roof.

 

And maybe this is just another dumb idea to throw into the endless sea of dumb ideas. Ive solidified my theory. That somewhere in a discord at any given time of day, someone is explaining an idea they think would fix wurm.

What's the point of grinding skills if they are meaningless? I never understood this everyone be the same.

Edited March 1, 2023 by Atndy

[Melros 588]

3 minutes ago, Atndy said:

What's the point of grinding skills of they are meaningless? I never understood this everyone be the same.

 

Rewards for winning factions on PvE if you're talking about the point of playing Challenge to begin with. That is if you need a reward to feel like it was worth it and if the reward of actual game play and pvp isn't enough for you.

 

As it stands, ground accounts arnt even being rewarded for their work because there is no content to use them in bar a single kill or 2 every 3 weeks+ so seems like we're net 0 on effort to reward as it is.

 

And I mentioned at the end of my post that workshopping a way to make current work relevant in a challenge setting would be a good idea.

[Carmichael 685]

1 hour ago, Carmichael said:

So to elaborate on the trinkets.

 

They would come from more permanent areas called "dungeons" for example. Different levels give different levels of trinkets.

 

As an example

A super easy pig dungeon would give a trinket that increases specific stats and skills be like 1-7 skill.

Easier one with wolves gives  3-10

Medium with like spiders/bears 5-15

etc etc.

 

Stats are hard capped at 70 with trinkets.

Skills are not.

Damage/Defenses are hard capped at like 20%.

 

These trinkets would be jewelry based, or even add capes for the harder ones, and shoulder pads even. cosmetic items that don't drop, but lose charges. To maintains those charges you have to kill mobs or obtain orbs or something to charge said trinkets from the "dungeons"

 

You can expand the trinkets into anything really, can add cut/slash/pierce attack and defenses too. Some rare ones to add overall damage reduction. Basically making these obtainable for anyone at any level. As you progress through the dungeons you get better trinkets obviously. It also creates pvp. And you can also do it for the goblin camps whenever that comes out. But it would basically follow that type of guideline....

 

1 hour ago, Carmichael said:

Oh and you can also make spells specific to whatever element too. And these would be placed around the map. but they don't really move often or at all. cannot deed within like 150 tiles of it.

 

Fire resistance 20%

Fire penetration 20% for example for like the high end trinkets

Heeeeellloooo. This will close the gap for new players to a point where it's not gamebreaking. Allows players to jump right into it. Without also hurting players who put work into their accounts. Someone with like 25 body str can have 55 body str with a simple trinket and not die instantly, but also do enough dmg. Shortfalls would be other stats, unless they have more trinkets. Hell even make trinket slots. like 3 would be good enough. Make them no drop if in the slot. 

 

This also gives players something to do other than sitting on deed. It creates content and pvp through pve. 

[Atndy 385]

5 minutes ago, Carmichael said:

 

Heeeeellloooo. This will close the gap for new players to a point where it's not gamebreaking. Allows players to jump right into it. Without also hurting players who put work into their accounts. Someone with like 25 body str can have 55 body str with a simple trinket and not die instantly, but also do enough dmg. Shortfalls would be other stats, unless they have more trinkets. Hell even make trinket slots. like 3 would be good enough. Make them no drop if in the slot. 

 

This also gives players something to do other than sitting on deed. It creates content and pvp through pve. 

Why reward people forn ot playing the game? Also they will just be 50 body strength toons to sit on deed with. Would like to see the removal of portals or at least a cd on them like once a week. Want to play on pvp commit to Pvp

Edited March 1, 2023 by Atndy

[Trash 189]

Anyone here knows the pvp DR diffrence between 40str, 60 and 100? on defiance.

Edited March 1, 2023 by Trash

[Carmichael 685]

2 minutes ago, Atndy said:

Why reward people forn ot playing the game? Also they will just be 50 body strength toons to sit on deed with. Would like to see the removal of portals or at least a cd on them like once a week. Want to play on pvp commit to Pvp

Because the game shouldn't be a second job in order to keep up 

[FallenKnight 114]

Lets cap all characteristic skills to 50 and weapon/shield skills to 90. All other crafting etc normal

[KarlFranz 172]

It's honestly maybe in the best interest to get players off of the starter island more.  People learn from experiencing the game instead of being hold up on an island where they feel safe.  The game is about doing things that involve risk.  Obviously there's some knowledge, skill and experience gaps and they only seem to be getting worse as the server progresses.  

The whole safety net feature has not worked as intended.  Instead of being a place to regroup and push from.  They've become areas where most of the deeds exist and no interaction is gained.  They never see any pvp and they yield nothing for themselves or the server.  It's sadly turned a large group of players into groups of self proclaimed newbs even though they've been around for years.  

People don't know that a lot of the vets playing shaped Defiance.  We were the ones that already advocated for a substantial buff to the body str curve.  As well as having SOTG not only nerfed but then removed.  Then advocating for easier access to iron plate since it used to be only steel.  We've already nerfed ourselves plenty so that newer players can have an advantage.  It's just people need to play the game and achieve more than 35 body str.  There's just only so much the devs can do for you until you have to do enough yourself.

The 2 hour a day argument is totally invalid with SB and coffee.  I get that it's an extra silver a day but that's not too hard to earn in game making a rare or selling items.  70% of JK have families, jobs, and homes.  

[Venochi 7]

1 hour ago, Melros said:

 

Rewards for winning factions on PvE if you're talking about the point of playing Challenge to begin with. That is if you need a reward to feel like it was worth it and if the reward of actual game play and pvp isn't enough for you.

 

As it stands, ground accounts arnt even being rewarded for their work because there is no content to use them in bar a single kill or 2 every 3 weeks+ so seems like we're net 0 on effort to reward as it is.

 

And I mentioned at the end of my post that workshopping a way to make current work relevant in a challenge setting would be a good idea.

 

There could be rewards. The skills you gain could roll into a linked freedom account in some fashion perhaps. My understanding is that epic had a system kind of like this to incentivize people to start a fresh account while gaining a benefit to their longer term more persistent account.

 

There could also be unique rewards for members of the group that held the most territory at the end of the server that could be claimed on a persistent server account. These could range from sleep powder, marks, or trophies.

 

While I hold out hope that defiance and other longer standing pvp servers can find a way to be viable, I really like the idea of a fresh challenge server you described here.

[Sinnjinn 508]

2 hours ago, Carmichael said:

So to elaborate on the trinkets.

 

They would come from more permanent areas called "dungeons" for example. Different levels give different levels of trinkets.

 

As an example

A super easy pig dungeon would give a trinket that increases specific stats and skills be like 1-7 skill.

Easier one with wolves gives  3-10

Medium with like spiders/bears 5-15

etc etc.

 

Stats are hard capped at 70 with trinkets.

Skills are not.

Damage/Defenses are hard capped at like 20%.

 

These trinkets would be jewelry based, or even add capes for the harder ones, and shoulder pads even. cosmetic items that don't drop, but lose charges. To maintains those charges you have to kill mobs or obtain orbs or something to charge said trinkets from the "dungeons"

 

You can expand the trinkets into anything really, can add cut/slash/pierce attack and defenses too. Some rare ones to add overall damage reduction. Basically making these obtainable for anyone at any level. As you progress through the dungeons you get better trinkets obviously. It also creates pvp. And you can also do it for the goblin camps whenever that comes out. But it would basically follow that type of guideline....

 

I like your out-of-the box thinking, and honestly it's not a bad idea.  However I feel it's way to complicated, and I would greatly fear that it would be implemented poorly and be super abusable.  Plus I realistically don't see the dev team spending the development hours it would take to code something like this.

[Omar 479]

1 hour ago, KarlFranz said:

The whole safety net feature has not worked as intended.  Instead of being a place to regroup and push from.  They've become areas where most of the deeds exist and no interaction is gained.  They never see any pvp and they yield nothing for themselves or the server.  It's sadly turned a large group of players into groups of self proclaimed newbs even though they've been around for years.  

1. If the server isn't engaging / working out for these players, do you think making life more difficult for them will encourage them to play on the server more? 

2. HotS has had 2 players that equal JK main group average, living on the starter island. And only 3 players with any real pvp experience. You guys keep talking about a large group of PvPers living on a starter island. Please elaborate (seriously) because I don't know of such a group. All I'm hearing is waaaaaaa people won't play pvp against me!! lol  Perhaps kidnap some folks, chain them to chairs in front of Wurm, is the only suggestion I have for you.

3. Raiding with trebs is quite powerful (as intended, they said they wanted to make raiding easier iirc). This could be a reason people are reluctant to live off starter. But I think it's that JK has the only good sized group of dedicated PvPers and some really experienced great fighters, and pushed everyone off.

4. I think the balances are fine as is and the Devs did a great job with the server rules and changes. Much better than previous years.

5. To non PvPers commenting on the toxic posting. It's not that bad in game, we aren't usually as toxic as to each other. It's just that we care about witch way the server rules go, it can make a big difference. I have seen tons of toxic crap on freedom. And interactions inside a PvP kingdom are unparalleled in good feels  

 

Edited March 1, 2023 by Omar

[Sinnjinn 508]

40 minutes ago, KarlFranz said:

It's honestly maybe in the best interest to get players off of the starter island more.  People learn from experiencing the game instead of being hold up on an island where they feel safe.  The game is about doing things that involve risk.  Obviously there's some knowledge, skill and experience gaps and they only seem to be getting worse as the server progresses.  

The whole safety net feature has not worked as intended.  Instead of being a place to regroup and push from.  They've become areas where most of the deeds exist and no interaction is gained.  They never see any pvp and they yield nothing for themselves or the server.  It's sadly turned a large group of players into groups of self proclaimed newbs even though they've been around for years.  

People don't know that a lot of the vets playing shaped Defiance.  We were the ones that already advocated for a substantial buff to the body str curve.  As well as having SOTG not only nerfed but then removed.  Then advocating for easier access to iron plate since it used to be only steel.  We've already nerfed ourselves plenty so that newer players can have an advantage.  It's just people need to play the game and achieve more than 35 body str.  There's just only so much the devs can do for you until you have to do enough yourself.

The 2 hour a day argument is totally invalid with SB and coffee.  I get that it's an extra silver a day but that's not too hard to earn in game making a rare or selling items.  70% of JK have families, jobs, and homes.  

 

I think there is something you guys aren't understanding.  We're not on starter sticking our tongues out going "NANANA BOO BOO...you can't get us".  We live on starter cause that's the only place we can exist.  

 

ok, story time.  Literally the same day I joined BL, they were doing a tower bash.  We had, oh I don't know, I think it was 16, maybe 18 people bashing one of your towers between BL starter and malice.  At some point during the bash Friede showed up and we gave chase.  He wasn't alone, there were other JK with him.  I don't remember the exact number, but I want to say 5 others?  maybe 6?  Don't think it was much more then that.  As soon as you saw our numbers you ran.  Why?  you complain about there not being enough PvP, and here was a perfect opportunity for a fight, why did you run?  Because you don't take the fights you're pretty sure you're going to lose.  THIS is why we live on starter.  Pushing us off starter without giving us some way of defending ourselves will just push us off the server.  And I'm not asking to be 100% safe, but leaving starter is 100% guarantee we get raided into oblivion.  So just like you didn't take that fight when Friede lost his rare drake set, we are unwilling to leave starter.

 

And I'm curious as to why us being on starter even matters so much to you?  Maybe because you're upset that you can't simply raid us on a whim?

[Melros 588]

1 hour ago, KarlFranz said:

People don't know that a lot of the vets playing shaped Defiance.  We were the ones that already advocated for a substantial buff to the body str curve.  As well as having SOTG not only nerfed but then removed.  Then advocating for easier access to iron plate since it used to be only steel.  We've already nerfed ourselves plenty so that newer players can have an advantage.  It's just people need to play the game and achieve more than 35 body str.  There's just only so much the devs can do for you until you have to do enough yourself.

....

The 2 hour a day argument is totally invalid with SB and coffee.  I get that it's an extra silver a day but that's not too hard to earn in game making a rare or selling items.  70% of JK have families, jobs, and homes.  

The 30% of JK that don't can 1v4 easily the average BL or MR accounts

This also implies months of spending your 2 hrs of gaming time a day mining in a cave or just digging. How boring. If that's what it takes for someone to be playable no one, once again, will ever join.

 

The advantages you cite are obviously not enough. And for folks to suggest that the game needs to get harder for the people who are months/years behind to incite pvp is....

Edited March 1, 2023 by Melros