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Sheffie

Monsters co-operating

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What if, when you attack a goblin, its yelling brings other goblins in the area towards you?

Wolves traditionally hunt in packs. What if they behaved similarly?

In general, a single enemy could be capable of "calling for help" in just the same way that we call out to guards. Of course, only creatures of the same species should respond.

 

I think the game could be potentially a lot more interesting. It would certainly reward scouting and planning, rather than just blindly attacking.

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This changes nothing, but adds annoyance, geared and skilled players will still not give a dam about the mechanic and kill with ease and not have to move to reach the other 5 goblins in local, while a new player attacked by 1 goblin and auto attack or any kind of kick or slap by unarmed new player will still force the npc to whine-call and magnet local same type creature to the spot.. well great now you have a noob with panic attack.

 

While this could be cool little mechanic in "deeper forest" or w/e higher threat biome in some other kind of game, in wurm you have any kind of creature spawning - well - anywhere... no skill or gear separation, no picking who you attack or skip, no option to run away unless you have a mount to say - NO to that fight;

Have a doubt? go outrun a hellhound or few, see how you like several chasing you while you, nevermind you wont have enough stamina to run far, add slopes, trees and how movement for players and creatures works and you get a pretty good scare to explore.

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We definitely are desperately overdue for some new mobs or other components to make life out and about more interesting. Not sure if this is the right idea or not, but SOMETHING new please other than the same old same old for years.

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I have to go a hard -1 on this idea.

 

There are many times this option would result in my death.  One example was yesterday when I was out on a hunting trip.  I got caught on a side hill fighting 2 greenish trolls, 2 hellhounds, a brown bear and a spider at the same time, without being able to find the way down the hill.  I enjoy this type of challenge 4:1 or 5:1 and once again my large maul "Bonesnapper" got me though.  Under your suggestion, I would have been overwhelmed by mobs so that it may have been 12:1 or 15:1, not a good scenario.  

 

There is no problem finding challenging fights on Melody or parts of Harmony.  Cadence on the other hand was sorely lacking in mobs a year ago, but that was due to high population.  

 

Also, new players would not stand a chance outrunning or fighting their way out of trouble.  Consider someone driving a heavy large cart or wagon with basic horses or bison, it is almost impossible to outrun some mobs.  More times than not it is either stand and fight or die on your wagon.  Calling extra mobs to help would be disaster for a lot of players.     

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On 8/6/2022 at 3:06 AM, Finnn said:

This changes nothing, but adds annoyance, geared and skilled players will still not give a dam about the mechanic and kill with ease and not have to move to reach the other 5 goblins in local, while a new player attacked by 1 goblin and auto attack or any kind of kick or slap by unarmed new player will still force the npc to whine-call and magnet local same type creature to the spot.. well great now you have a noob with panic attack.

 

While this could be cool little mechanic in "deeper forest" or w/e higher threat biome in some other kind of game, in wurm you have any kind of creature spawning - well - anywhere... no skill or gear separation, no picking who you attack or skip, no option to run away unless you have a mount to say - NO to that fight;

Have a doubt? go outrun a hellhound or few, see how you like several chasing you while you, nevermind you wont have enough stamina to run far, add slopes, trees and how movement for players and creatures works and you get a pretty good scare to explore.

what if you did a simple quest that "cursed you" an option in game to get the mechanic that reset every time you die?

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I like this idea, reminds me of the old D&D days where you needed to silence mobs with a spell.  If they was added to priest spell list. This would be one step closer to a battle priest hybrid & one step closer to needing to party. Just need new & tougher mobs is all. 

 

As it stands now, I get attacked, I can go get a snack come back all dead.. just saying. 

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There are a couple of ways we could prevent this idea turning into a nightmare for newbies.

One would be for the "call for help" to only be sent out if the player initiates combat — so a monster that's hunting for players will always be fighting solo, but if the player is asking for trouble, they may find themselves in it.

Another option would be to limit the types of creature that have this ability — perhaps only herd or pack animals would be able to call for help.

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I like the idea of some creatures forming packs and herds, but not as a result of combat situations.

 

It would be more fun and realistic if some creatures were to start following each other if they enter each other's proximity. That way you'd end up with packs of wolves, herds of bison and cattle, etc. The range of this sort of behavior might be fairly short, such that you still encounter individual creatures more often than groups, but they would still form here and there over time, and even potentially become an interesting local feature outside a combat context.

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On 8/9/2022 at 12:06 AM, Muunkey said:

what if you did a simple quest that "cursed you" an option in game to get the mechanic that reset every time you die?

you DON'T just die in wurm..

 

1 death equals hours to days grinding fighting skill alone or way more hours wasted to return to same state you were before that death, PoK helps, but not everybody's PoK or 99 skilled to have skills protected on death

 

The game is really forcing you to never be brave, never have fun, just be always cautious so you don't have to patch skill loss, etc..

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only way to do this... might be reusing the hidden treasure spawns.. with treasure maps and hidden creatures which are event spawned.. different mechanic could be invented to spawn such and force a combat scenario with extra creature wave(s), etc etc etc etc.....

 

Maps are not that big... and not at all sorted for difficulty for new or old players... scenarios for player preparedness could be implemented and spawned  for that reason to provide such challenges.

Anything within reason.

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21 hours ago, Sheffie said:

There are a couple of ways we could prevent this idea turning into a nightmare for newbies.

One would be for the "call for help" to only be sent out if the player initiates combat — so a monster that's hunting for players will always be fighting solo, but if the player is asking for trouble, they may find themselves in it.

Another option would be to limit the types of creature that have this ability — perhaps only herd or pack animals would be able to call for help.

you ignored this completely

 

On 8/6/2022 at 1:06 PM, Finnn said:

This changes nothing, but adds annoyance, geared and skilled players will still not give a dam about the mechanic and kill with ease and not have to move to reach the other 5 goblins in local, while a new player attacked by 1 goblin and auto attack or any kind of kick or slap by unarmed new player will still force the npc to whine-call and magnet local same type creature to the spot.. well great now you have a noob with panic attack.

 

While this could be cool little mechanic in "deeper forest" or w/e higher threat biome in some other kind of game, in wurm you have any kind of creature spawning - well - anywhere... no skill or gear separation, no picking who you attack or skip, no option to run away unless you have a mount to say - NO to that fight;

Have a doubt? go outrun a hellhound or few, see how you like several chasing you while you, nevermind you wont have enough stamina to run far, add slopes, trees and how movement for players and creatures works and you get a pretty good scare to explore.

 

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That's weird, it sounds like you ignored the fact that I didn't ignore a good deal of your post that you quoted.

I specifically addressed the "new player attacked by one goblin".

It may well be that I didn't correctly parse your long run-on sentence. I can only suggest that in future you try to break your thoughts up into shorter, more coherent points.

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I really like this idea, but with the way the wurm combat system is designed I think it would take some more work and expanding to be efficient. But it's one of those topics that will always have people for and against. 

 

Here are some of my thoughts - Pack animals should be exactly that. So what pack animals do we have in wurm?

 

1. Wolves

2. Goblins possibly (I'll need to contact my ex to confirm this, she's the closest to a goblin I've ever met IRL)

3. Hyennas 

4. Gorillas 

5. Cave Bugs possibly

6. Hell Hounds

7. Large Rats

8. Sharks ? Maybe? I dunno depends on species I guess.

9. Wild Boars

 

Those are all the hostile ones that could potentially murder your face, ofc bears do move in a pack until the cubs reach a certain age then they go solo...

 

I also like the idea that was mentioned of having grazer herds for bison/bovines/wild boars & horses and so on. It would be nice to arrive on a large steppe area and seeing a large group of animals grazing however, we all know the greed of some people.

That herd will be captured and moved within minutes to some breeding deed 🤣 

 

As for the concern with newbies, and well non newbies for that matter, at what point when out exploring is it okay to stop using caution and stop paying attention to your surroundings? It's a survival sandbox game after all isn't it? 

 

I recently went back to my SFI character to do a delivery halfway across the map on Xanadu with some very crazy terrain, you can read below if you want to know how that went down, but the short version, planning and paying attention will save your life.

Spoiler

I had to deliver an item I auctioned off on Xanadu, my deed is center of Xanadu and the delivery I had to make was a good 4000+ tiles away. 

 

Things to keep in mind.

I was not prem so my FS was capped at 20

I already auctioned/sold off all my good weapons so I was stuck using a 30QL Large axe with no enchants with very low large axe skill.

I already sold my good plate armor so was using self crafted low QL plate armor.

My animals on SFI were all venerable and from way before the AH rework was made so traits were all over the place, Speed and draft traits were mixed up. No pure draft animals on my wagon. 

My wagon had a top speed of 16km/h, Up hill was a nightmare sometimes only getting 6km/h

 

The trip took me many hours, It was a long distance trip, on untamed Xanadu, there was a lot of mobs trying to have me murdered, trolls in the roads, hell hounds chasing me down, it was a very stressful day in wurm. 

There was a lot of times I had to stop and wait a few minutes for a mob that I knew I couldn't fight to clear off, just far enough so that I can pass, and make my way around it safely. I had to do a lot of off-roading and I had to rely on guards a lot during this trip.

 

Bottom line is, through strategic usage of tower guards and route planning I made it to my destination and back in one piece. It can be done.

 

17 hours ago, Finnn said:

The game is really forcing you to never be brave, never have fun, just be always cautious so you don't have to patch skill loss, etc..

 

I really do not agree with this, I'm brave all the time, only times I die is when its out of my control due to a game crash or something silly like that. Exploring and fighting/hunting is a lot of fun, stay aware of your surroundings and don't be stupid.

There is a fine line between bravery and stupidity. The key is to know where the line is.

 

I love this idea a lot, and it will need some fine tuning, but I think it could be great for the game.

 

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its not that we need to be friendly to new players with easy mode. So of my favorite memories as a new player was running miles while a croc or spiders was close behind me nipping on my butt. Having to jump off a cliff to have only a couple HP left to evade the mod. 

 

That being said, why not just have an option for players in setting easy/hard mode. The code is already made (aka new player protection buffs when you first start) or have that function last longer then it is now say to a stat like 21 strength. 

 

code also add a small code that would limit a mob from calling out for help for new players like the buff noted above.

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22 hours ago, Sheffie said:

That's weird, it sounds like you ignored the fact that I didn't ignore a good deal of your post that you quoted.

I specifically addressed the "new player attacked by one goblin".

It may well be that I didn't correctly parse your long run-on sentence. I can only suggest that in future you try to break your thoughts up into shorter, more coherent points.

autofighting or not, you do automatically do kick attacks and so on(weaponless fighting).. doesn't matter in which stance you fight, you will fight back no matter what you do

- you can be afk

- you will be attacked by the creature first then get rickrolled by that creature call

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My suggestion was

Quote

for the "call for help" to only be sent out if the player initiates combat

 

If the player is "fighting back", they're not "initiating combat", so the call for help would not be sent out.

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