elentari

Would you like to add maps MOI's for other action types? (ex. carpentry, smithing, etc)

Would you like to add maps MOI's for other action types? (ex. carpentry, smithing, etc)  

55 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you like to add maps MOI's for other action types? (ex. carpentry, smithing, etc)

    • Yes I would like them.
      31
    • No, I prefer the system as is.
      24


Recommended Posts

25 minutes ago, Minnie said:

I'm certain I'm not the only one who's grinding mining, digging, etc. to a much higher degree lately in order to get maps.  I almost never mined before the update, but I've mined a ton since.  None of it is visible to anyone who doesn't go into my mine...but if I'd been woodcutting instead, it would be quite obvious to all.

but that cave will probably be there for a long long time after you are gone, any trees people cut down today would be back in a couple of weeks, maybe a month if they dont replant at all.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, Tpikol said:

any trees people cut down today would be back in a couple of weeks, maybe a month if they dont replant at all.

 

I don't think you can say that with any degree of certainty.  If a ton of players headed out at once and started clearcutting, things would not grow back as quickly as they do now, obviously.

 

Probably the last I'll say on this topic as I doubt we'll be reaching an agreement on it.  :)

 

Edit:  (And let's face it--almost nobody would be replanting.)

Edited by Minnie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, I understand the bit with woodcutting, maybe yes. But: minding that I have no ambitions to do a lot of treasure hunting (great as the new feature is, but I have a lot of projects, and prefer others to find the initial bugs to be ironed out 😎), I already have 3 maps to work on (rares, ql29 46 65) just from casual activities like tiny farming, and mining out a vein (3k ores so far), and the one from the journal. Given that foraging and botanizing, which I do not few every day, will work and drop caskets in the future, I may soon end up in ways more treasure hunts than I can reasonably do without dropping other activities.

 

Now players, those bored before in particular, enthusiastically jump onto treasure hunts, but at best for a few weeks and months, then it will normalize. A glut of maps is not a good thing to have it as a sustainable feature.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Ekcin said:

A glut of maps is not a good thing to have it as a sustainable feature.

 

It would also make the treasure itself less valuable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

to be clear i also have used 0 maps, when i find one i give it away to someone who cares about treasure hunting, but it is just unfair that all gathering skills except woodcutting have it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, VelvetSun said:

Random drop chance at Rifts or the small rifts that spawn around the servers maybe as well

THIS! OMG! 

 

This would make rifts so much bearable! And more people would actually show up! 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Minnie said:

It would also make the treasure itself less valuable.

What do we want in Wurm? 

 

To sell stuff at higher prices to people or to give FUN towards more people? 

 

Prioritizing the "market" and designing things around the "market" is a factor that's been slowly killing wurm for years. 

Edited by elentari
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, elentari said:

What do we want in Wurm? 

 

Depends on who you ask, of course.

 

52 minutes ago, elentari said:

To sell stuff at higher prices to people or to give FUN towards more people? 

 

I was just stating a fact, not trying to make a point.  However...

 

You are assuming that everybody finds it more fun to find a treasure than to sell it for a high price.  Everyone's definition of fun is different.  To some, making money = fun.  

 

Personally, I rarely buy or sell anything.  I've done a few maps, which I've found to be extraordinarily fun.  Haven't sold any of the loot and have no immediate plans to do so. 

 

From the devs' perspective, I'd imagine that it's a delicate balance between making the game "fun" (whatever that even means, considering the above) and keeping the economy robust.  And that is as it should be.  As players, we tend to focus almost solely on how the game could be better for us as individuals.  But that perspective has very little to do with how to keep the game going in the long run.

 

53 minutes ago, elentari said:

Prioritizing the "market" and designing things around the "market" is a factor that's been slowly killing wurm for years. 

 

Lots of assumptions you've got going there.  I'd pop an "in my opinion" on the front or the back of that statement if I were you.  And maybe throw in at least a fact or two to back it up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not one that goes out and does the newest, coolest thing in Wurm, like treasure hunting or whatever. Like Ekcin, I have a lot of Wurk to do and will only leave that for helping friends out with a project now and then. However, it does seem weird that only those select few things give a chance at a map/casket. I wouldn't want to see chances for imping or creating, but do think that woodcutting, butchering, and burying should be included, as well as fishing. Also the chance of getting one at a rift would be cool, even if I no longer go to those for various reasons.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fishing is already. And to say that, I am not caring at all about the market. If at all, I care about treasures being treasures, not just some collectible so plenty that one starts, sees it is harder than the last, throws it away, and takes the next one. In short, it is about trivializing.

 

Finding an equilibrium may not be easy, so maybe why not caskets during rifts, for woodcutting, butchering .. but it should be observed and balanced, even if the drop rate needs to be reduced.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Minnie said:

 

I don't think you can say that with any degree of certainty.  If a ton of players headed out at once and started clearcutting, things would not grow back as quickly as they do now, obviously.

 

Probably the last I'll say on this topic as I doubt we'll be reaching an agreement on it.  :)

 

Edit:  (And let's face it--almost nobody would be replanting.)

 

Even with this change I don't think people are going to start woodcutting specifically to farm maps. Mining and especially digging are way easier to farm maps from since you can just stand in one spot hitting your mine/dig bind.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[22:48:43] <Cynamon> I believe that maps should also be a reward for missions. This would combine different activities.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like how this started as a poll, and just became attacking anyone who said no lol 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Archaed said:

I like how this started as a poll, and just became attacking anyone who said no lol 

 

It's more about expanding the options to get maps at the end of the day. 

 

I like treasure maps. They are fun and imply some attention to detail to read 'em right. 

 

What I don't like is how RNG locked they are. This is simply my subjective experience but I feel RNG locking any form of content is unhealthy at best and bad at worst. Call me extremist for saying this but we all pay the same subscription so I expect we should get the same equality of opportunity to have access to content. I am not advocating for equality of outcome here, aka all of us receiving 1 fantastic map per day with the same 99 ql loot. 

 

But I do feel the current system is just so RNG focused it's just frustrating. I want to do this content! I really do! But I can't! Not if I get insanely lucky. And this is the source of this poll.

 

I pay a subscription in the hopes I get lucky to access content....does this sound a bit familiar to you in regards to game design?

 

I want a system where you can also earn maps through hard work that guarantee a map that isn't just 100% RNG. 

 

Maybe we should be able to "buy" a map via the marks shop, maybe via karma or doing missions, maybe through killing mobs or just increasing the chance to get them via other in game approaches or actions. I don't know which system is better until at least we try it to see how it feels. 

 

It's up to the devs to decide at the end of the day. 

 

But keep in mind one thing, if you're one of the players that had the blessed luck of getting 20-30 maps so far, there are players out there who want to do this content and have only gotten maybe 1-2 maps. If you like this system simply because you're lucky, don't be suprised one day if the unlucky player simply chooses to leave Wurm because he's paying for the hopes of getting lucky in game by doing the same repetitious task in game ad nauseam. 

 

I hope some devs do respond to this. 

Edited by elentari

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

To be clear, I've gotten two maps since the system came on live, but I'm also not doing bulk resource actions and such, so it's no surprise to me. 

 

I do think it should be added to woodcutting, as digging, mining, woodcutting always felt like the big three resource collection actions. 

 

What I don't want is a system that basically floods players with maps (and I'll be honest, buying maps for marks is just a straight up no imo) 

 

I think too much pressure is being put on this one piece of content to be a whole new focus for players, when it's just another piece of the puzzle that is playing wurm. 

Edited by Archaed
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, elentari said:

Maybe we should be able to "buy" a map via the marks shop, maybe via karma or doing missions,

An actual use for karma, yes please

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Usually, the poll results are way more relevant then someone's "No, just because i say so". The track of the bad decision making and not listening to the player base would keep going on, i guess.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, elentari said:

What I don't like is how RNG locked they are. This is simply my subjective experience but I feel RNG locking any form of content is unhealthy at best and bad at worst. Call me extremist for saying this but we all pay the same subscription so I expect we should get the same equality of opportunity to have access to content. I am not advocating for equality of outcome here, aka all of us receiving 1 fantastic map per day with the same 99 ql loot. 

 

THIS!

 

This is the worst part, the way it's locked behind a first RNG wall that is the MoI... which we now know is utterly broken. And then another RNG wall that give you a measly chance of 20% to get a map... (took me 12 MoI to get my first one)... and then more RNG on the rewards.

 

I hear that people are afraid that maps are going to be too common and we will be drowning in maps... Well... Some people are already drowning in maps. When I hear people got a dozen, I'm getting fairly jealous, because no matter what I try I get none. The system is not fair, it force us to do tasks we'd rather not do... for no rewards.

 

I've been advocating moving out of the utter randomness for content since years now. It would be a good thing to start doing it and finally give everyone a decent shot at the complete game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

10 minutes ago, Odynn said:

 

THIS!

 

This is the worst part, the way it's locked behind a first RNG wall that is the MoI... which we now know is utterly broken. And then another RNG wall that give you a measly chance of 20% to get a map... (took me 12 MoI to get my first one)... and then more RNG on the rewards.

 

I hear that people are afraid that maps are going to be too common and we will be drowning in maps... Well... Some people are already drowning in maps. When I hear people got a dozen, I'm getting fairly jealous, because no matter what I try I get none. The system is not fair, it force us to do tasks we'd rather not do... for no rewards.

 

I've been advocating moving out of the utter randomness for content since years now. It would be a good thing to start doing it and finally give everyone a decent shot at the complete game.

 

You pretty much brute-force them with alts. You won't get much doing your "usual" activity

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Tor said:

You pretty much brute-force them with alts. You won't get much doing your "usual" activity

 

Just upsets people who aren't in the situation of being able to afford 10 alts spamming actions all day long. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I figure maps should only be added to things where 1) it makes sense lore-wise, and 2) it's something that could do with having its rewards beefed up a bit, and 3) it's not going to screw up other game systems unduly. Obviously that's all subjective.

 

I don't think they should be added to imping. You can come up with a way to make it work, lore-wise, but it feels too contrived. And imping is already fairly rewarding.

 

There's something to say for adding it to woodcutting, and to other gathering professions. But if it's added to woodcutting it should be added to sprout planting as well, so we don't lose loads of forest to it. And finding a buried bottle when you plant a tree makes perfect sense.

 

Adding maps to the karma system works fine lore-wise as karma is basically a measure of goodwill from the gods for completing their missions, so repaying you with a treasure hunt works. This is also a system that can really do with better rewards.

 

A similar thing goes with rifts. I like doing rifts but I've not been very impressed with the things you can buy with rift points. Add the option to buy treasure maps with rift points and that's another way that would rely on just doing things instead of luck.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if we wanna go to the lore route, then farming potatoes, mining marble,  fishing, praying , botanazing mints, doesn't make a sense for getting maps. maybe for digging to get out the whole treasure. But sure, you can twist the narrative to fit into anything really, if you really want.

I don't like how this "exploration update" turned into lottery system ticket with go here and there checkpoints, and tweaked towards 10 alt army 16 hours a day players.it's nothing to do with your average joe playing routine, beside for the mining and digging. And on top of that we are going to get bugfixes for it for next two month while OLD and way more terrible bugs are just laying out there.

 

Idk

 

Hope the next "bigger" update is cancelled and actual bugs are being fixed and perhaps is looked into pvp instead sicne we have so much empty pvp maps laying around now,. i wouldleave this thing as it is so it's pretty much waste of time to talk about it now

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Tor said:

You pretty much brute-force them with alts. You won't get much doing your "usual" activity

 

And that's where the whole system is wrong. Yes, we could bruteforce them with alts, untill the devs decide it's an exploit and nerf it forward, making it even harder for players playing the game the "normal' way to have a chance at them.

 

Might as well fix the system right now and get something decent for everyone, instead of pushing for more abuses. Traders got nuked into the ground because they were abused by a handful of players, leaving a large amount of us with nothing but loss. Rares were also nerfed  into the ground because players abused the heck of the creation roll. Sorcery items were wiped from uniques because someone through treachery and cheating manage to get all of them within a few months, leaving the rest of us trying to get them through years now. And we have so many more issues like that...

We shouldn't validate a system preaching for abuse but fix it instead and open it to a larger player base... and if possible make it less dependant on the RNG.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/20/2022 at 1:45 AM, Tor said:

Woodcutting should have been added from the start but probably for some bizzare  and unknown for me reason, the game design experts put it behind.

 

 

This is totally true when you are chopping down a tree or bush and in the middle ( the tree has not been fully chopped down ) and you get a moi.

 

There is Zero benefit from this when this happen.  The End Chopping Action moi's give a rare log, or scrap ( with some bushes )

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/20/2022 at 7:23 AM, Finnn said:

Do you play this game?

Yes Finnn i do play the game emphasis on play, i do not try and meta the game i try and play the game , and yes i use alts but not to meta the game but to play different aspects of the game. so in my opinion as a player i think this way. and to actually respond to the second part no i do not know how many people use their alt charactors to just spam for rares because of the way i play the game.( makes me feel sorry for those guys spending so much time doing something so unenjoyable just so they can get extra rares to sell)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now