Sheffie

Stone Circles for Fast Travel

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Posted (edited)

Summary

  • Your time, as a player, is valuable.
  • Frequently you need a way to get home, quickly — perhaps with a horse, or a wagon, or a ship transporter — and you're prepared to pay for the privilege.
  • Many games allow you to do this. Stone Circles allow you to do it in Wurm.
  • You can't just zip about. You still need to explore and touch a stone circle before you can add it to your personal network, and each journey costs something.

 

Creating a Stone Circle

  • Create a 3x3 tile flat area at least 100 dirt above sea level, off deed.
  • Create 14 menhirs and one dolmen, from any type of stone you prefer.
    • The menhir is an upright standing stone, decorated with runic carvings that glow slightly once the circle is complete.
    • The dolmen is a capstone that is supported by two menhirs to form a portal arch.
  • Create a Stone Circle by combining a menhir + dolmen and then adding further menhirs until complete. 
    • Similar restrictions apply as to a guard tower. You can only begin or continue construction in the middle of a 3x3 tile flat area, at least 80 tiles away from the nearest active stone circle.
  • Each Stone Circle will have a name, which will default to "Playername's Stone Circle" and which can be changed by the creator (or a GM, if need be).
  • Once constructed, players in the vicinity will hear the wind whistling through the stones. This will be similar to the ambient sounds heard on steppes and in caves.

 

Activating a Stone Circle

After completion the circle must be infused with power. This can be accomplished through one of the following proposed methods, in ascending order of complexity/cost:

  1. Enchant the circle with a spell or spells to be decided (initial proposal: Wind of Ages (Vyn), Life Transfer (Fo), Light Token (Mag), and Dark Messenger (Lib) — counter proposal, just Courier / Dark Messenger).
  2. Buy a Druid Contract from a trader and use it on the circle, as you would use a merchant contract on a stall.
  3. Buy a contract and get the enchant spell(s) cast.

 

How to use a Stone Circle

  • Enter the circle and use the portal arch.
  • You will be shown a list of available destinations — basically, all the active stone circles that you have personally touched, on this server — and also the cost of this journey.
  • The basic rule is that everything you bring into the circle will be transported. This includes your inventory and equipment, your mount or vehicle, and any animals that you're leading.
  • After selecting your destination and assuming you can pay, pow. You're teleported using the same mechanism as various other spells.

 

Cost Of Travel

  • One player on foot: 
    • 1 Karma per tile from the source to the destination circle
    • Minimum cost 500 Karma
    • Players may pay in gems instead of Karma, a 1 QL gem being equivalent to 10 Karma points.
  • Double the cost to bring a riding animal.

 

Suggested price

  1. 600 Karma, or
  2. give a gem to the Druid, or
  3. Donation or sacrifice of items worth X Favor(?)

 

Suggested price modifiers:

+10% if dragging a cart

+20% for each animal led or ridden

+50% if riding a large cart 

+100% if riding a wagon or creature transporter

+200% if riding a ship transporter

 

Comments, Problems, Protests

  1. But I want to explore!
    You are free to explore just as much as you want to. In fact, this proposal encourages you to explore further afield than before, because once you discover a stone circle, you can use it to return home quickly. This doubles your exploration range per hour of play time. Stone circles don't make much difference until you don't want to explore any more.
  2. It's too difficult to set up
    I expect that there will be plenty of players who have more than enough time, energy, and Masonry skill to build these circles, and even on NFI there should be no shortage of priests able to cast the needed spells. We don't need one of these at every deed. You just need something to cut your journey time shorter.
  3. It's too cheap
    Prices can be adjusted, depending on demand. The base comparison point is that any player, without any effort, can teleport back to their home deed from anywhere for 1000 Karma (without a mount). Going to the effort of building/enchanting/discovering stone circles ought to be rewarded with decreased cost. (There's another possible comparison point with the Favor cost of a Summon spell, which I personally am not as familiar with.)
  4. It's too expensive
    Prices can be adjusted, depending on demand.
  5. The Developers have more important things to do with their time
    Certainly there are lots of demands on their time. Personally I think that this would improve quality of life, travel and trading possibilities for many players... but of course it's up to the developers to decide what's a priority. All we as players need to consider is what we really want the game to offer.
  6. Yes but No to moving carts, ships, and all that. That would destroy trade.
    I accept that this is a concern. There are two possible avenues here. One would be to increase the price multiplies so that taking anything more than your mount would become prohibitively expensive, meaning that it would only be used rarely. Another is to make this work the same as Summon, Town Portal, and Farwalker items, i.e. only moving a person and no mount. (Note the modified modifiers above. This is an attempt at a compromise that most players will support.)
Edited by Sheffie
to clarify: stone circles must be off deed (public)
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Seems good, but no to any vehicles/mounts going with you. 

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this seems workable/ a realy god idea with some restrictions , but also no to mounts / vehicles , no one wants sailing to be taken away , and thats coming from someone who lives on lagadu

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Courier + Dark messenger = portal enchant.

 

I love the idea! Great suggestion overall.

I also like the idea of it not costing coin. Maybe karma is good enough and i dont mind the thought of getting one creatur through with you for a hefty price.

 

+1 and a free bump for @Keenanto see ;)

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Posted (edited)

Not allowing mounts/vehicles makes it pointless, theres already like 6 ways to teleport home or random places without them.

Edited by SmeJack
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Thanks for the feedback folks. I'm trying to take everything on board and improve the proposal.

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+1 good suggestion, mounts have to be included as well

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5 minutes ago, Tor said:

+1 good suggestion, mounts have to be included as well

 

I think, and hope, that this may be "sweet spot" that people will agree on. 

I can certainly see why people wouldn't want trade deliveries to be made using fast travel.

Perhaps  600 Karma for you, or 1200 for you + horse, would be a decent balance?

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I was day dreaming about fast travel during lunch break yesterday.

I was thinking of being able to build a gateway that would take you to a server/island/deed(?), that had a travel ring to every starter town.

For traveling on your own cluster you would just be able to take your inventory. (Maybe I'm to old school, but taking a vehicle would really remove almost all reason to have ships)

For Traveling between NFI/SFI, it would be like traveling to epic, your skills go and your funds but nothing on you.

 

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20 minutes ago, Ohana said:

I was day dreaming about fast travel during lunch break yesterday.

I was thinking of being able to build a gateway that would take you to a server/island/deed(?), that had a travel ring to every starter town.

For traveling on your own cluster you would just be able to take your inventory. (Maybe I'm to old school, but taking a vehicle would really remove almost all reason to have ships)

For Traveling between NFI/SFI, it would be like traveling to epic, your skills go and your funds but nothing on you.

 

 

I shied away from proposing travel to other servers using this method (partly because the destination list might get unwieldy). And I prefer not to touch the whole NFI/SFI question in this post. I just wanted something that would get me across one server.

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I support this idea. Make the difficulty and material cost high to prevent people just cranking these out all over the place.

 

Maybe involve high requirements from multiple skills, like Stonecutting, fine carp, and nat substances. Make it a regional effort so that people have to work together to make one.

 

It would make getting out and exploring more fun since the main thing keeping me to my deed is "if I spend 3 hours exploring, I will need to spend another 2 hours to get back home."

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+1, and I'm a fan of the restrictions, since as travel becomes easier, so too does the world become smaller. Seems like a good way to allow a means of direct transportation without undermining exploration or encouraging its exclusive use for A->B travel.

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Posted (edited)

My worries are balancing difficulty with making them and/or maintaining them so that there aren't hundreds of them around.

 

I also agree there needs to be some sort of cost to using it, but something that newer players can use with help from a more skilled player or a ton of work.

 

Random idea that just came to me, but why not require a blood sacrifice? Make every player/animal require a blood from a unique? Or craft a special potion using unique blood just to use with this idea?

 

Edit: Also require perhaps an attunement process for each stone circle, so you have to go out to each one you want first the old-fashioned way.

Edited by Rayen
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Perhaps the cost for travel should include some gems

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Add a half hour cooldown before you can use it again, and make it otherwise free. The cooldown is enough to prevent people popping all over the server and to make it a meaningful decision to go through.

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I have a couple separate opinions. Either or both could be implemented.

 

To use a ring one of the two rings should need 100 favor linked to it via priest. 200 if also including a horse in travel. I know people don't like the idea of carts but i think it's fine so, 500 for large cart or some crazy amount.

 

Second opinion is that valid destinations should only be powered rings or an unpowered ring you set as your home ring. So you can go from your unpowered home ring to a powered ring, then from a powered ring home to your unpowered ring. But not just jump all around the world wherever you want. This lets markets or events put forth effort to put themselves on the map, but not dilute destinations with everyone's base.

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I think how cumbersome travel is in Wurm is one of the things holding it back, but I'm not sure this is the solution. This completely destroys the highway system.  Guaranteed within a week of something like this going live, there will be 50 deeds with one, and you will stop seeing new deeds putting in the work to build highways and connect to the system

 

How about something like what you've proposed here, except instead of having it be player built, have one spawn near the mid-point of each quadrant...so there are only 9 of them on the whole server.  Wouldn't really effect the travel most people do, as it would still be more efficient to just ride to your favorite troll hunting grounds, but it would still greatly expand exploration and in general make the map much smaller.   

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Sheffie said:

Summary

  • Your time, as a player, is valuable.

 

Have to strongly disagree. Wurmians time was never valued and never will be lol. There were tons of posts suggesting to increase sailing speed, as its really fun to crawl at 10kmh on a boat across the server for 3 hours. There were suggestions to make craftable portals on your deed, so you could easily zap from your deed to the starter town and back, making any remote wurm land as valuable as any overcrowded areas around starters. Sadly, deaf ears to any of the QoL improvements regarding travel. Hell, they even made you waste 4 times as much time as you did before if you want to restock your sheep/cattle herd 🤣

Edited by Skatyna

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This is a very interesting idea that would likely be most welcome on Xanadu in Particular. I like the idea of having to find a ring first before it can be used. This would still encourage travel if only to find the rings. As for deed rings verses a fixed set of server rings I foresee the fixed number of rings per server being much easier on a programming level and having less of an adverse impact on roadways as well as potentially adding less lag. Hopefully Xan will have more of them than the smaller servers though given it's vast expanse. I really like the idea of being able to include carts and wagons as I rarely travel without mine but at a higher price of course. Plus as SmeJack pointed out there are already several ways to get back without them. As for the cost I think having to high a cost though like unique bloods would put newer players at too high a disadvantage. Ultimately finding a payment system that works for everyone yet maintaining a system travel balance will be a challenge.

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Somewhere in the middle of this idea.  Being able to teleport with a crap load of rares/supremes from a far off disbanded deed or sacks full of high level arch items doesn't seem quite right.  Being weighed down with loot and getting home safely is part of the adventure, even though it can be very boring and tedious.    

 

I propose range restrictions, like guard towers only much further apart, maybe 1000 tiles or more.  Also, cannot be built on a deed except starter towns. 

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7 hours ago, Sheffie said:

Summary

  • Your time, as a player, is valuable.
  • Frequently you need a way to get home, quickly — perhaps with a horse, or a wagon, or a ship transporter — and you're prepared to pay for the privilege.
  • Many games allow you to do this. Stone Circles allow you to do it in Wurm.
  • You can't just zip about. You still need to explore and touch a stone circle before you can add it to your personal network, and each journey costs something.

 

Creating a Stone Circle

  • Create a 3x3 tile flat area at least 100 dirt above sea level.
  • Create 14 menhirs and one dolmen, from any type of stone you prefer.
    • The menhir is an upright standing stone, decorated with runic carvings that glow slightly once the circle is complete.
    • The dolmen is a capstone that is supported by two menhirs to form a portal arch.
  • Create a Stone Circle by combining a menhir + dolmen and then adding further menhirs until complete. 
    • Similar restrictions apply as to a guard tower. You can only begin or continue construction in the middle of a 3x3 tile flat area, at least 80 tiles away from the nearest active stone circle.
  • Each Stone Circle will have a name, which will default to "Playername's Stone Circle" and which can be changed by the creator (or a GM, if need be).
  • Once constructed, players in the vicinity will hear the wind whistling through the stones. This will be similar to the ambient sounds heard on steppes and in caves.

 

Activating a Stone Circle

After completion the circle must be infused with power. This can be accomplished through one of the following proposed methods, in ascending order of complexity/cost:

  1. Enchant the circle with a spell or spells to be decided (initial proposal: Wind of Ages (Vyn), Life Transfer (Fo), Light Token (Mag), and Dark Messenger (Lib) — counter proposal, just Courier / Dark Messenger).
  2. Buy a Druid Contract from a trader and use it on the circle, as you would use a merchant contract on a stall.
  3. Buy a contract and get the enchant spell(s) cast.

 

How to use a Stone Circle

  • Enter the circle and use the portal arch.
  • You will be shown a list of available destinations — basically, all the active stone circles that you have personally touched, on this server — and also the cost of this journey.
  • The basic rule is that everything you bring into the circle will be transported. This includes your inventory and equipment, your mount or vehicle, and any animals that you're leading.
  • After selecting your destination and assuming you can pay, pow. You're teleported using the same mechanism as various other spells.

 

Cost Of Travel

  • The base cost is for you, on foot, plus all your inventory and equipment.
  • Additional costs apply if you want to bring a riding animal through.

 

Suggested base price

  1. 600 Karma, or
  2. give a gem to the Druid, or
  3. Donation or sacrifice of items worth X Favor(?)

 

Suggested price modifiers:

+100% if riding any animal

+10% if dragging a cart

+20% for each animal led or ridden

+50% if riding a large cart 

+100% if riding a wagon or creature transporter

+200% if riding a ship transporter

 

Comments, Problems, Protests

  1. But I want to explore!
    You are free to explore just as much as you want to. In fact, this proposal encourages you to explore further afield than before, because once you discover a stone circle, you can use it to return home quickly. This doubles your exploration range per hour of play time. Stone circles don't make much difference until you don't want to explore any more.
  2. It's too difficult to set up
    I expect that there will be plenty of players who have more than enough time, energy, and Masonry skill to build these circles, and even on NFI there should be no shortage of priests able to cast the needed spells. We don't need one of these at every deed. You just need something to cut your journey time shorter.
  3. It's too cheap
    Prices can be adjusted, depending on demand. The base comparison point is that any player, without any effort, can teleport back to their home deed from anywhere for 1000 Karma (without a mount). Going to the effort of building/enchanting/discovering stone circles ought to be rewarded with decreased cost. (There's another possible comparison point with the Favor cost of a Summon spell, which I personally am not as familiar with.)
  4. It's too expensive
    Prices can be adjusted, depending on demand.
  5. The Developers have more important things to do with their time
    Certainly there are lots of demands on their time. Personally I think that this would improve quality of life, travel and trading possibilities for many players... but of course it's up to the developers to decide what's a priority. All we as players need to consider is what we really want the game to offer.
  6. Yes but No to moving carts, ships, and all that. That would destroy trade.
    I accept that this is a concern. There are two possible avenues here. One would be to increase the price multiplies so that taking anything more than your mount would become prohibitively expensive, meaning that it would only be used rarely. Another is to make this work the same as Summon, Town Portal, and Farwalker items, i.e. only moving a person and no mount. (Note the modified modifiers above. This is an attempt at a compromise that most players will support.)

what is 100 tile above water if you live on the shore

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Sheffie said:

 

I think, and hope, that this may be "sweet spot" that people will agree on. 

I can certainly see why people wouldn't want trade deliveries to be made using fast travel.

Perhaps  600 Karma for you, or 1200 for you + horse, would be a decent balance?

I am definitely in favour of limited fast travel for those who would like it.  I think anything more than character+mount would be too much.  To be honest, I am undecided about the mount even.

 

There are 3 things I thought of that I think would help with the limited nature that I think would be necessary;

 

 

  1. Cool downs.  A miminum period before you can use the system again.
  2. Two-way travel only.  By which I mean no one-way trips, only return trips.  The only "second" trip allowed is back to where you started, and the cooldown doesn't start until you get back
  3. On-deed only, and each alliance is its own small closed system

 

 

Edited by TheTrickster

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if it costs karma.. and you deliver.. you burn karma.. that's not infinite for some... and requires some effort to recover it, especially for these who deliver - the burn rate will be extreme

 

cost shouldn't be a kidney or a leg.. or people will just wave a mid finger and waste their time to not waste karma, coins or w/e it costs

 

idea is to make a shortcut to what you want to do.. or find a taxi and zoom around for a few tips

 

simply rock shards is too easy to spam such everywhere on the map.. excessive amounts

 

there should be some limitation or you kill the need to travel at all

 

in my initial idea, it was people connecting with other or making use of group resources to help each other in various ways, being crafting, enchants, help with construction, imp on the spot, etc or visiting the local of somebody for a murder spree, all limited mainly to linked deeds or alliance and permissions or trust build network for teleports, with some "major" cost to have such construction to discourage you from making them everywhere...

 

 

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Hi there,

 

We did something like this on Mystic Highlands, had portals to 9 different area's of the map.

 

People did like it. They were free to use, but all that got transported was the player and their inventory.

 

Alas the downside of portals was people were making carts and leaving them at every portal site, horses standing around everywhere, wagons, small fenced in areas, it left the area's looking really messy.

 

Valiance

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