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Darnok

Destructible armors & Economical loop & Priests

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I suggest an economic experiment and a change only for armors, so that armor cannot be repaired after it has been upgraded to required quality.

 

Crafter after upgrading armor to appropriate quality, uses a seal or some similar action, and blocks any further possibility of repairing and improving armor.
Unsealed armor is treated as having ql 1.

 

Such a change would add a bit of variety and would be a good test of what economic system would be better for Wurm. The same as today that means indestructible items or the opposite.

 

As for rare, there are two possibilities:
- simply increase chance of rare armor when crafting to compensate adding this idea,
- or it should be possible to smelt armors (we also have smelting pots) to rare metal lumps, from which you can forge rare items, this action have 100% chance of success to make rare item.

 

EDIT

Economical loop

During the discussion, topic of economics and where capital flows appeared.

In my opinion, for game to be equally accessible to everyone, capital should flow in a loop so that a player with any set of skills has more or less a similar chance to get rich.

 

At the moment, I see the problem that items flow in one direction and capital flows in the opposite direction :

miner -> (black/weapon/armor)smith -> consumer (hunter, warrior, skill developing player)

 

On the way, of course, there are priests, sometimes a cook, but there is no closure and instead of a loop we have a straight line.

 

What could a hunter offer to miner or to smith?

- pelt (100ql available for free at the moment on NFI, can be obtained after killing dog with bare hands),

- meat, fish (high spear skill), furs, animal parts are worthless, because nobody needs them in large amounts and they can be obtained from animal farms,

- hides are pretty good, but from animal farm they can be gathered with even higher ql than from hunting wild animals,

 

My suggestion is to add burns for the (black/weapon/armor)smiths if they are not dressed in appropriate leather clothes and gloves near forge, the higher the quality of forge, the higher the temperature around it and the more burns.
The more difficult animal to kill, the thicker skin it should have, and the thicker the skin, the better it insulates against burns.

This outfit should be made of hides and not leather, since good quality leather can be made even from very easy to kill animals and in this outfit type of hides should matter as much as quality.

And this outfit should be made similar to a wooden staff, that means it cannot be repaired.

 

Now for the miners. Mining should generate hunger very quickly so that all this meat is eaten by someone.

 

The second idea is damage when mining metals from veins.
100ql metal mining is as safe as getting 10ql ore, wich is a bit weird. In reality the better quality of iron or coal is deeper, but since we do not have depth in mines, the chance that stones will fall on miner's head may depend on quality of vein.

The higher quality of vein, the higher chance of taking damage while mining, at 90ql vein chance for rocks fall and damage miner should be 90%, if skill mining is higher than the vein quality.

In any case where quality of vein is higher than miner's skill, chance of taking damage should be 100%. Little protection against some evil people, by the way.

 

Wounds obtained in this way should be resistant to LT weapon spell, only way to heal them should be a potion made from parts of different animals.

The more difficult animal to kill, the more quickly ingredients we get from it, should heal wounds of this type.

 

In this way, a character developing combat skills could be able to earn an upgrade of armor and weapons while hunting.

 

EDIT 2

What does a priest need so much that he would have to buy it from followers, because without it he cannot function?

 

Favor regeneration and other sources from which priests receive it could be slightly reduced.

Instead, followers could receive a spell, perhaps other than a vessel, that would take favor from living things like plants and animals and store it in gems.

 

The spell would drain favor from:

- bushes, destroying them at the same time, if bush has sprouts and it is in season, favor gain will be greater,

- trees, turning them into shriveled, just like bushes for sprouts and fruit players get more favor,

- animals, spell must be used before fight, during fight follower draining favor does not receive skill gain and after killing animal, it does not have any loot,

- other players in PvP,

- dragons (last hit gets favor),

 

Followers collecting favor while rite spell of their religion is active get a bonus.

 

Additionally, each character could be "born" with a random favorite type of favor, each type of plant and animal could have a different favor type, that would enhance his spells when he becomes priest.

Allowing priest to cast spells on items with a value above 100, and if priest would get a favor drained from dragon then his spells would...  😄

 

 

 

Edited by Darnok
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This is just changing something for the sake of changing something though, what exactly would you be hoping/excpecting to find out with this experiment?

 

Replacing one of the moons with a death star would add a bit of variety too. Maybe once a day it could randomly select a deed to vaporize as an experiment. 

 

*GG for all those with end game drake/scale armour who have spent months or years assembling yo sets.

Edited by PvtPile

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10 minutes ago, PvtPile said:

This is just changing something for the sake of changing something though, what exactly would you be hoping/excpecting to find out with this experiment?

 

Replacing one of the moons with a death star would add a bit of variety too. Maybe once a day it could randomly select a deed to vaporize as an experiment. 

 

*GG for all those with end game drake/scale armour who have spent months or years assembling yo sets.

 

I wrote that it was supposed to be an economic experiment.

 

There are scissors in the game, so rare leather and cloth armor can be cut into rare leather and cloth and make rare armor from scratch.
Similarly with the skin of the dragon, you can cut them to drake hide when your armors drop to low ql and remake the armor, although the fact that leather drake hide armor requires any leather is a bit strange, but oh well that is different topic.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Darnok said:

 

I wrote that it was supposed to be an economic experiment.

 

There are scissors in the game, so rare leather and cloth armor can be cut into rare leather and cloth and make rare armor from scratch.
Similarly with the skin of the dragon, you can cut them to drake hide when your armors drop to low ql and remake the armor, although the fact that leather drake hide armor requires any leather is a bit strange, but oh well that is different topic.

 

 

So no reason at all then. You're literally just wanting an experiment for the sake of it to see the results in a live economy? No guess on how it would even be a benefit or how it could have adverse affects? Then I 100% suggest the death star idea. It's adding variety and whilst still pushing existing players from the game maybe it'd atleast bring a new SW fan or two to play on a premium toon for a bit. Lets just try it and find out.  Yeah drake armour using leather for imps is 100% the issue here ...🤯 

 

 

That's not how rares work in the game you're making suggestions for though... it's hard enough getting working improvements on the current system as it is.

 

Was just trying to work out where you're coming from. Lots of in for a little out. -1

 

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This doesn't require implementation. You can stop repairing your armor already, without any additional development.

Let us know how it affects your economy, i'm curious of the results of that experiment

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18 minutes ago, Locath said:

This doesn't require implementation. You can stop repairing your armor already, without any additional development.

Let us know how it affects your economy, i'm curious of the results of that experiment

 

Goal is to check how it would affect entire server not just single player.

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Nonono, I'ts your idea, you like it, you do it and keep your hands off of the armor sets which people spend sometimes thousands of euros on.

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29 minutes ago, Locath said:

Nonono, I'ts your idea, you like it, you do it and keep your hands off of the armor sets which people spend sometimes thousands of euros on.

 

What is the point of using such expensive armor?

In PvE, it's cheaper to die because you lose nothing anyway.

In PvP, I suspect that such armor would also be worth more than a single character death.

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Just now, Darnok said:

What is the point of using such expensive armor?

 

It's called fashion choice.

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2 minutes ago, Darnok said:

In PvE, it's cheaper to die because you lose nothing anyway.

 

With exception of a handful of items, you lose nearly everything on death in PvE, just like in PvP. 

Recovering those items have different chances but you do lose stuff and often forever if you don't know where you died.

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33 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

It's called fashion choice.

 

If you use armor as decoration its ql doesn't matter, so what's the problem?

 

30 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

With exception of a handful of items, you lose nearly everything on death in PvE, just like in PvP. 

Recovering those items have different chances but you do lose stuff and often forever if you don't know where you died.

 

You can always summon body with karma spell? So what's the problem?

Edited by Darnok

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Just now, Darnok said:

If you use armor as decoration its ql doesn't matter, so what's the problem?

I don't know what this has to do with you wanting to destroy my armor. QL has nothing to do with not being able to repair it.

 

1 minute ago, Darnok said:

Can you always summon body with karma spell? So what's the problem?

Again, you ask a question which you already know the answer to. Not everyone has karma, my alts don't have karma, they wear proper sets though so that they look nice.

 

It's not mine or your business to question another person's spending habits and it's not your place to destroy what they spent their money/time on, even if it's only a bunch of pixels on the screen. 

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2 hours ago, Darnok said:

Similarly with the skin of the dragon, you can cut them to drake hide when your armors drop to low ql and remake the armor


Oh ok so instead of improving the armor when it drops down in quality, you wait for it to almost be destroyed, smelt it/cut it up and re-make the armor?

 

That totally makes sense and would enhance the game so much! I hope the devs spend their time on quality ideas like this one!

 

+1

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1 hour ago, Darnok said:

In PvE, it's cheaper to die because you lose nothing anyway.

I too feel that 0.25 fs is nothing even with pok /s

Edited by Lethyria

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1 hour ago, Darnok said:

What is the point of using such expensive armor?

Have you considered that some people want to work hard to earn said expensive armor? A Drake or Scale set is something that can't be earned in a day (unless you throw buckets of silver at someone). It is something that you have to work hard to earn. Either by finding a unique and getting some friends to kill it and get a big piece of hide or scale. Which would still take a bunch of slayings to get enough. Or by going to public slayings and leaving with a .01 or .02kg piece. Which would mean you would have to attend 160 to 320 Drake Slayings and 290 to 580 Dragon Slayings. That is a lot of effort to working hard and earning a set of drake or scale. Play the game and earn a set of drake or scale and then come back to this suggestion.

 

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1 hour ago, Lethyria said:

I too feel that 0.25 fs is nothing even with pok /s

 

Well, while in PvP death is associated with additional threats and loss, the low cost of skill loss is reasonably justified.

But in PvE, the penalty for death of a character should be a large drop in ALL skills -2.0 or more. Then there would be some justification for wearing high-quality armor and weapons. There is no such reason at the moment.

 

1 hour ago, brattygirl said:

Have you considered that some people want to work hard to earn said expensive armor? A Drake or Scale set is something that can't be earned in a day (unless you throw buckets of silver at someone). It is something that you have to work hard to earn. Either by finding a unique and getting some friends to kill it and get a big piece of hide or scale. Which would still take a bunch of slayings to get enough. Or by going to public slayings and leaving with a .01 or .02kg piece. Which would mean you would have to attend 160 to 320 Drake Slayings and 290 to 580 Dragon Slayings. That is a lot of effort to working hard and earning a set of drake or scale. Play the game and earn a set of drake or scale and then come back to this suggestion.

 

 

And? Why are they doing this for?

 

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3 minutes ago, Darnok said:

And? Why are they doing this for?

Why is it that anyone does anything? For the experience, for the sense of accomplishment, for the challenge.

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11 minutes ago, Darnok said:

And? Why are they doing this for?

 

Tomatoes hits it on the head well, but because drake and scale are still better than other armours is another reason. At least, it's seen as better by most.

If you lack understanding of why these things are done, please actually log into the game and ask in a chat or question it in Discord. Making a thread to propose a really dumb experiment isn't the play. Wurm isn't your playground, thank god.

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3 minutes ago, Tomatoes said:

Why is it that anyone does anything? For the experience, for the sense of accomplishment, for the challenge.

 

I don't understand what you are defending, armor is "feature" designed only for combat.

 

For high ql and strong armor to be needed, player would have to risk a lot (high cost of death) and there would have to be a high threat in PvE, so that we could talk about the challenge.
At the moment, horses or even donkeys give you a guarantee of survival even without armor and they don't need to be 5-speed.
You can also escape from any fight on horseback, if you start to lose, heal yourself and come back, so what's the point of having a super expensive armor?

 

There is no challenge worth price of a drake armor, no mob with high reward that you would lose if you wouldn't kill it in 1vs1 in the first round, without escaping and healing, and then returning to fight before mob heals itself.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Darnok said:

There is no challenge worth price of a drake armor

 

Yes, there is. Have you seen how awesome scale sets look? They are worth every penny. They have a side bonus of being a good armor too.

 

30 minutes ago, Darnok said:

And? Why are they doing this for?

 

Why do we make a house if we can feet all our tools and a whole pumpkin in the inventory and realistically that is all we need to survive?

Why have carts and mounts if we can walk? 

Why leave the starter town at all if the themplars there keep us safe?

 

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8 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

Yes, there is. Have you seen how awesome scale sets look? They are worth every penny. They have a side bonus of being a good armor too.

 

So the only argument is decoration again? But you won't be bothered by my idea on that matter, so I see no reason not to implement my idea.

 

8 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

Why do we make a house if we can feet all our tools and a whole pumpkin in the inventory and realistically that is all we need to survive?

 

To grind skills and to put a bed in it.

 

8 minutes ago, Locath said:

Why have carts and mounts if we can walk? 

 

To transport items that you can't carry in inventory and to escape fast mobs.

 

8 minutes ago, Locath said:

Why leave the starter town at all if the themplars there keep us safe?

 

 

For resources, space, and permissions that protect what you own from other players.

 

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