Darnok

Darnok's creature suggestions

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13 hours ago, Darnok said:

The difference is that these 4 players use these 8 animals for playing game, and this one keeps them only so that the others cannot get them or you can say he is collecting pokemons for profit 🙂

 

Profiteering is what PvE culture is based on. If you don't like that culture, don't participate/play there. I've met several non-combatants in PvP, and they were extremely zen players that weren't into competition at all, martial or fiscal. They created real works of art on full-loot PvP servers, and were unworried about their art being destroyed - it would simply give them reason to create new art. I don't know why they stopped playing, but I suspect it was because their friends quit and there was no reason for them to stay here anymore. That situation happens equally on all servers.

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On 7/17/2021 at 12:23 PM, Darnok said:

 

So 4 players with 20 animals per deed is using more server resources than single player with 100 animals on deed?

 

Now you're getting it

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11 hours ago, TheTrickster said:

Go visit the Harvestmoon alliance - see the animals that are penned NOT to prevent access but contrariwise to facilitate access.  Oh, you can't because you don't and won't play.

 

Do us all a favour and don't go visiting the motives of people who are playing a game with which you are not even involved. 

 

Also the question is NOT "whether the pen limiting movement also limits CPU consumption" but whether you can back up "Large farms with dozens of animals consume server resources a lot more than a few average players."

 

I have already written a confirmation of this sentence before.


As for your deed, what does it matter?


I am more interested in balance, because it is a matter for every player, and the statistics of how many animals (horses, bisons etc) are wild on the map and how many players have trapped on their deeds is quite important. If more of these animals are in the hands of players who don't actually use them, because how can you use 50 or 100 horses in this game? That means there is something very wrong, but it can be improved with addition of animal training 🙂
At this stage of the game, for example, on Cad, you won't find a wild horse or a bison, the only horses and bisons you can find are animals that have escaped from the deed because someone quit the game.
I know this because I've been riding around Cad over the last few days and I've been watching what has changed since the last time I played.

(Ohh and you can't say I don't like everything about Wurm, I like how combat was changed, maybe it's not a perfect solution, but it's definitely a change for the better and the UI in WO is much better than in WU. I understand why you all are so angry on new players, if I had been struggling with this old UI without 3rd person view for a few years, I am sure would be angry as well)

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1 hour ago, Darnok said:

As for your deed, what does it matter?

This deed exists on a WO-live-server and you're making suggestions for WO-live-servers. It matters because changes to the game will affect it, and not anything built or tested in WU or on WO-test-server.

 

1 hour ago, Darnok said:

I am more interested in balance, because it is a matter for every player, and the statistics of how many animals (horses, bisons etc) are wild on the map and how many players have trapped on their deeds is quite important. If more of these animals are in the hands of players who don't actually use them, because how can you use 50 or 100 horses in this game? That means there is something very wrong, but it can be improved with addition of animal training 🙂
At this stage of the game, for example, on Cad, you won't find a wild horse or a bison, the only horses and bisons you can find are animals that have escaped from the deed because someone quit the game.
I know this because I've been riding around Cad over the last few days and I've been watching what has changed since the last time I played.

Have you found ANY of the free-to-take pens yet, or read any of the forum threads pointing to their locations?

 

Why don't you look into streamlining their functionality with game mechanic and/or volunteer game staff support?

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Darnok said:

At this stage of the game, for example, on Cad, you won't find a wild horse or a bison, the only horses and bisons you can find are animals that have escaped from the deed because someone quit the game.
I know this because I've been riding around Cad over the last few days and I've been watching what has changed since the last time I played.

 I have not been on Cad for months, so I cannot comment definitively on that server, however, even before the recent changes there were always complaints that there were almost no wild animals to find on Cad, including horses, but as a nomad my biggest issues were the opposite - I was always coming across lots of aggressive mobs, and even with giving away horses and cattle every time I found a willing recipient I still always seemed to have 4 in tow (in addition to my team of two).  Like I said, I cannot comment definitively, but I have learned not to put too much credence in "no wild animals on Cad." (True fact, the only wild deer I have ever seen in WO were on Cad).

 

On Release, though, we have many many penned animals across our alliance of deeds, and yet on two separate occasions I only travelled a few minutes out of town and found wild animals, include wild horses, donkeys and bisons (the first of my two "trips" I only got as far as the gap between two deeds in the alliance).

 

Edit:  @Darnokwhen you reference "this sentence" it would be helpful if you only quote the sentence referenced or in some way mark it - for instance with highlighting or something.  Also, If you have bold or italics or something like that in a quote, it is good form to mention whether the emphasis was in the original or has been added by you.

Edited by TheTrickster

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8 hours ago, Drayka said:

This deed exists on a WO-live-server and you're making suggestions for WO-live-servers. It matters because changes to the game will affect it, and not anything built or tested in WU or on WO-test-server.

 

 

 

That's great, every change that fixes a problem must have an impact on those who have taken advantage of the situation.

 

Look try to understand me, I'm not saying that these players are bad or greedy, they are just using the game mechanics in very effective way. The problem is that this mechanic, with many players who use it like this, turns animal husbandry into something that cannot be called a game.

I understand that at the moment it is necessary to have many animals, because if one generation gets randomly many negative traits, you have a big problem if have small pack of animals for breeding.
Therefore, I propose a mechanism that will allow the player to shape the direction of his animal's development. If your animal gets 2 traits randomly (speed and draft tier 1), you can choose whether you train them to ride and develop speed, or if you hitch them to cart and develop tier 2 draft in the next generation.

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Posted (edited)
48 minutes ago, TheTrickster said:

 I have not been on Cad for months, so I cannot comment definitively on that server, however, even before the recent changes there were always complaints that there were almost no wild animals to find on Cad, including horses, but as a nomad my biggest issues were the opposite - I was always coming across lots of aggressive mobs, and even with giving away horses and cattle every time I found a willing recipient I still always seemed to have 4 in tow (in addition to my team of two).  Like I said, I cannot comment definitively, but I have learned not to put too much credence in "no wild animals on Cad." (True fact, the only wild deer I have ever seen in WO were on Cad).

 

On Release, though, we have many many penned animals across our alliance of deeds, and yet on two separate occasions I only travelled a few minutes out of town and found wild animals, include wild horses, donkeys and bisons (the first of my two "trips" I only got as far as the gap between two deeds in the alliance).

 

Edit:  @Darnokwhen you reference "this sentence" it would be helpful if you only quote the sentence referenced or in some way mark it - for instance with highlighting or something.  Also, If you have bold or italics or something like that in a quote, it is good form to mention whether the emphasis was in the original or has been added by you.

 

Horses and bisons are nothing, for a few days I did not see a single wild sheep (there were a dozen or so rams).

 

Imagine a new player joining the game today. He must buy premium and deed with real money. Later he realizes that he needs better tools, weapons and armor, because he can't do everything right away, so he buys them too, for real money, because at the initial level he can't produce anything that advanced players would buy from him. In addition, he has to buy animals for real money and on steam Wurm is marked as "free game".

You still don't understand how many reasons there are why new players don't come here? Everything that I write is perceived as an attack that is to make your veterans life more difficult, while I am looking balance.

Edited by Darnok

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Posted (edited)

Instead of just deleting free accounts characters, turn them into werewolves that spawn overnight before deleting, in the area of 200x200 or 300x300 tiles near the place where they logged off.

A werewolf that was not hunted during the night disappears during the day and returns the next night.

 

- FS 70-75
- quick regeneration (when not during combat, wounds dealt with normal iron or steel weapons heal in 5 seconds),

- when his health points drop below 50%, wounds inflicted with iron or steel weapons heal very quickly, even during combat, so quickly that one player with FS 90+ should have a problem with killing a werewolf,

- wounds inflicted with silver weapons heal much slower,

- werewolf can attack and feed on non-aggressive mobs (for each hunted mob receives +1 FS),

- if a player is bitten by a werewolf, he gains status "marked by a wolf", this status is displayed as an icon and lasts for one Wurm month,

- after hunting a werewolf you can get its fangs, claws, fur, head and blood.

 

Marked by a wolf

For a month, the player can howl like a wolf and other wolves or werewolves within range will respond and he gets better vision at night.

 

(something that probably has no chance of implementation, but would be interesting)

While being marked, if player drinks werewolf blood during the night, he turns into a werewolf. His equipment and inventory are thrown to the ground. Other players cannot see who he is, they see a mob the same as a werewolf NPC.

FS level is same as player had, but weaponless fighting is properly strengthened,  player also receives other werewolf features described earlier (quick regeneration, etc.). He gets skill gain for weaponless fighting if he kills anything. If he dies, he loses some of his skill as if he would normally after die.

 

Werewolf fangs
they can be made into a necklace that scares off (they do not attack player) weak NPCs with 50% or less of the player's FS.

 

Claws
You can use them to make special studded gloves that deal more damage during weaponless fights.

 

Fur
You can make a cape from it, but one item is not enough, you need several pieces

 

Head
can be converted into a helmet like the brown bear helm

 

Blood
I have already described one function.
The second would be that you could give it to your pet if it's a wolf. Then it turns into a non-aggressive dire wolf, it is stronger (FS 40-50), but also requires higher taming skill.

 

 

 

Edited by Darnok

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Why not just add "werewolves" as a spawning mob at nights once per season? 

 

The "idea" has flaws, as there's zero chance encountering a ww will not lead to taking damage, and there's no distinction between material type in the wound. 

 

Again, I see what you're going for, but you're over complicating it. 

 

This can be boiled down to:

 

Tough mob that gives cool individual drops, requires multi to be hunted to be able to bud the full set. 

 

Werewolves aren't needed, as that overlooks a lot of possible existing opportunities, such as more goblin and troll variations, expanding on what already exists rather than trying to fit in a whole new system with clunky mechanics that doesn't fit with anything else. 

 

Good first iteration, calm down on the overcomplicated mechanics, identify your goals and whether it fits with the game, then work from there. 

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-1

no

no vampires

 

we also need a love story and to implement twilight in full, this is unacceptable otherwise🤔

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26 minutes ago, Archaed said:

Why not just add "werewolves" as a spawning mob at nights once per season? 

 

The "idea" has flaws, as there's zero chance encountering a ww will not lead to taking damage, and there's no distinction between material type in the wound. 

 

Again, I see what you're going for, but you're over complicating it. 

 

This can be boiled down to:

 

Tough mob that gives cool individual drops, requires multi to be hunted to be able to bud the full set. 

 

Werewolves aren't needed, as that overlooks a lot of possible existing opportunities, such as more goblin and troll variations, expanding on what already exists rather than trying to fit in a whole new system with clunky mechanics that doesn't fit with anything else. 

 

Good first iteration, calm down on the overcomplicated mechanics, identify your goals and whether it fits with the game, then work from there. 

 

Goblins and trolls are ugly...

 

as for seasonal animals

 

 

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Well, one thing for sure, Wurm could have more variety of monsters.

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4 minutes ago, Finnn said:

-1

no

no vampires

 

we also need a love story and to implement twilight in full, this is unacceptable otherwise🤔

 

You know there are some movies where werewolves looks good? But it is matter of taste so no point arguing...
 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Darnok said:

Horses and bisons are nothing, for a few days I did not see a single wild sheep (there were a dozen or so rams).

Wow.  I would be happy to pm the area where I have historically seen lots of beasties, but I have always been hesitant to post it publicly.

 

1 hour ago, Darnok said:

Imagine a new player joining the game today. He must buy premium and deed with real money. Later he realizes that he needs better tools, weapons and armor, because he can't do everything right away, so he buys them too, for real money, because at the initial level he can't produce anything that advanced players would buy from him. In addition, he has to buy animals for real money and on steam Wurm is marked as "free game".

Just as PVP and PVE are apparently extremely different experiences (no first hand knowledge of that for me) so NFI and SFI are extremely different for new players.  In my experience NFI was much less community minded (I only ever managed to get help from ONE other player on ONE other occasion) whereas in WO Southern Hospitality is a thing.  I was given free accommodation, free food, free animals, free equipment, free transport.  My best sword and shield I made at low QL and traded with an imping service for them to be upgraded to 90ish (and they threw in CoC enchants on both) using valrei items that I collected just by wandering around.  I initially premmed using in-game silver ( most of which I foraged 🙂).

 

1 hour ago, Darnok said:

Everything that I write is perceived as an attack that is to make your veterans life more difficult, while I am looking balance.

Actually, no, I was just sharing my personal experience.  None of it was an argument for this or that, just some things I said about my experience. I don't have a dog in this fight (or a horse or a bison) as I don't much use animal husbandry at all.  I stopped even using taming once I figured out branding.  If I was trying to convey anything in particular it was that "your mileage may vary" is a good principle to remember.   

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Oh, and someone has referred to me as a veteran!  Woo hoo.  🎉

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+ for more mobs, - for this idea

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Carnivorous mobs should at least attack prey mobs and prey mobs should flee the carnivores.

 

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I would love some additional mobs added to wurm. However I do not think werewolves have any place in wurm. 

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5 hours ago, Archaed said:

such as more goblin and troll variations

This would be a good idea to add some more hostile mobs. Perhaps armored goblins of some sort. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, TheTrickster said:

Carnivorous mobs should at least attack prey mobs and prey mobs should flee the carnivores.

This requires a lot of server process computing power. In other games, like Ryzom, the herbivores and other peaceful animals are attacked by carnivores indeed. This is possible there for 2 reasons: 1. animals have fix spawn locations, areas to roam, and numbers to spawn (16 per spawn iirc), respawn when all of them are dead. 2. carni-herbi combat only occurs when a player character comes sufficiently close to the mobs, to avoid endless npc combat in empty areas. I fail to see how anything similar could be implemented in WO . It could be a neverending source of lags.

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-1 until we can make fursuits
 

the idea of alt farming for these silly drops did make me laugh though.

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So if there was a certain player I *really* hated, I could just walk down there, make a bunch of free alts, teleport them in one by one, log them out, and then wait for the werewolf nuke to strike?

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5 minutes ago, Etherdrifter said:

So if there was a certain player I *really* hated, I could just walk down there, make a bunch of free alts, teleport them in one by one, log them out, and then wait for the werewolf nuke to strike?

 

Yes, but 300x300 is large area and I would really like to have that kind of reward and if you are scared don't leave your deed at night 😄

 

*also from player-werewolf you get only blood drop, so nobody would try to abuse that.

 

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12 hours ago, Darnok said:

That's great, every change that fixes a problem must have an impact on those who have taken advantage of the situation.

 

Look try to understand me, I'm not saying that these players are bad or greedy, they are just using the game mechanics in very effective way. The problem is that this mechanic, with many players who use it like this, turns animal husbandry into something that cannot be called a game.

 

Politician takes to the podium: "My campaign is all about the children. Every single thing must be made child-friendly from this day forth. That means everyone who has reached puberty is now considered no-longer child-friendly and must be summarily destroyed... oh wait, that would include me... Wait, just give me a moment whilst I think this through! ... Yeah, that's not going to work because killing breastfeeding mothers isn't in the best interests of children. See! I'm not being selfish!"

 

It's not as easy as it looks to make a game noob-friendly. Delete the wiki, dismiss the staff, reset the servers, roll back the rules, and ban every IP that has ever played Wurm before... It's a standpoint. But is that really in the long-term best interests of new players, or is it just taking a logical premise too far into absolutism?

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Darnok said:
3 hours ago, Etherdrifter said:

So if there was a certain player I *really* hated, I could just walk down there, make a bunch of free alts, teleport them in one by one, log them out, and then wait for the werewolf nuke to strike?

Yes, but 300x300 is large area and I would really like to have that kind of reward and if you are scared don't leave your deed at night 😄

I think you underestimate how many free-2-play accounts a person motivated by self-justified hatred could make. It would make a Freedom rift event look like a sparse hunting trip.

 

Hell, even I've fantasised about making swarms of free-2-play accounts for a protest march. And I go out of my way to aspire to good relationships with the most incorrigible enemies.

 

Quote

*also from player-werewolf you get only blood drop, so nobody would try to abuse that.

Again, I think you underestimate just what extremes people are willing to go to, for reasons you will never be able to justify as rational behaviour.

Edited by Drayka
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