Samool

Update on development

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With these graphics... even with terraforming.. it's returning to pre 1.0 beta wurm..

Icarus on the other hand offers a lot.. but lacks terraforming or actual long term gameplay, pvp, and several restarts .. rather than deeding and owning land, it forces you to restart a few times to gather different resources etc..

New games keep lacking what ppl want to see and try.

Which is why we stick to wurm, it just needs a bit more polishing at few rough edges.

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On 9/7/2021 at 9:32 AM, Damascus said:

Not sure why they even changed AH to the extent they did ..

Have not seen anything other then name changes and messed up animals ..

 

I wish the best for Wurm , i still like it , but many a new and old game are blowing pass it  in style and play options ..

Uhh, all traits were essentially useless unless they were on a horse/hellhorse and you couldn't read traits anywhere besides inside a wall of text upon Examine. The new Inspect window and a great many new traits were added that are cool and uncommon, plus traits that are actually useful on other animals/monsters. The updated system in which traits are passed down has changed too with the "points" each trait uses and how many trait points a creature gets is the part I see in the most critical light, but I believe a lot of people just hate change. "If it's no broken, don't fix it" -> backwards thinking.

 

What games are blowing past WO in style and play options? and don't mention Life is Feudal 🙄

 

On 9/8/2021 at 10:25 AM, Mclavin said:

will wurm be coming to Playstation 4 because I got a VR headset for that. 

I think if you made X to do an action and R1 to open a sub menu, the Arrow keys on the pad to direct attacks [hold Left and Up for Left Upper cuts] we could easily get this on the playstation.

I managed to play WO with a Steam controller YEARS before the Steam launch just fine haha... Even combat wasn't too bad or anything

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At this point I really want to know....why do unicorns even have draft traits?

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Exactly. like 4 speed or 4 (3?) draft pigs. Why can't the devs just implement a trait matrix similar to the spells table for priests where the non class traits are just not available?

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Also while on topic...why do pigs get combat / speed / draft traits? They aren't battle boars, we have wild boars for that in the ecology of Wurm. 

Why do animals that can't be used for combat, riding or wagon pulling get these traits? It just seems the AH update added a huge RNG pool for the sake of having an RNG pool so that high level breeders get a mix of irrelevant traits more so than the previous system. 

 

Meanwhile for 3 bloody months players have been giving you their feedback how this is a terrible system and still nothing... Sure you lowered the chance for animals to get a negative trait, which was a good step in the right direction, but it shouldn't have been such a high chance in the first place. Again...player testing.

 

But seriously....you do realise at this point that whatever update you will implement, the players are asking for a design similar to the old one right? 

 

Aka if you have 4 draft parents, there should be a HIGH chance to get a 4 draft (maybe even 5 draft) horse. Which is exactly what the old system was like!

 

Literally this update made players want it changed to resemble the old update. What are we doing here? Game design wise, players will never accept this system unless it's made in a logical fashion and guess what....the old system, ancient and simple as it was, had logic. 

 

Oof this seems to be 2 steps forward, 1 step back. While I am glad we have the inspect window, new items and ways to feed animals, the overall breeding system won't ever please anyone unless it resembles the old one. Which begs the question who loves RNG so bloody much they want to spend months of their life killing 100s of horses (assuming you're one of those people having a 200x200 deed and can afford the ratio) just to get some decent 4 speeders (apparently one trait doesn't even work right from what I've read, so really they're 3 speeders) ?

 

It's been 107 days since the AH update hit.... 3 and a half months and it's still not fixed. Meanwhile how the players perceive these events :

 

1. The Community Manager has left.

2. The utter lack of communication is destroying any semblance of confidence in the team and the future of Wurm. 

3. Bugs are piling up. 

4. More people are starting to wise up on how the dismal the population is looking. 

5. We get another pointless skin before an actual update or communication. 

 

and of course the cherry on top

 

6. The VR news made people think we're talking to blizzard / activision at Blizzcon "Is this an out of season april fool's joke?" & "Do you guys not have VR?" 

 

I just can't anymore...do whatever you want with Wurm. 

Edited by elentari
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Don't accept that the skin is pointless. But otherwise, widely agree.

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13 hours ago, Finnn said:

They show steam statistics, probably not including alts, and wo is not just steam, even though it actually is just steam for steam players, they have their nfi cluster and nothing more.

/who shows numbers from nfi and sfi..

Concerning fact is .. many of these are alts and dupes playing on both clusters, meaning that 1 person will cut a lot from the online count during a break from the game.

Numbers are melting again, retention is fading, nobody seems to care to find out why and to boost the numbers again.

Hopefully new content brings more people, but hope does no business, at least I haven't seen one being run by hopes.

 

While it would be expected that the steam statistics only show those who are using the steam client. As has been stated many times, there is no restriction on which cluster those using the steam launch can connect to.

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6 hours ago, elentari said:

Also while on topic...why do pigs get combat / speed / draft traits? They aren't battle boars, we have wild boars for that in the ecology of Wurm. 

Why do animals that can't be used for combat, riding or wagon pulling get these traits? It just seems the AH update added a huge RNG pool for the sake of having an RNG pool so that high level breeders get a mix of irrelevant traits more so than the previous system. 

 

You are thinking way too deep into this.

 

They just made a generic system and slapped it on top of all the animals and couldn't be bothered to tailor it to specific animals because the devs volunteers simply don't give a ######. 

This mentality applies to the whole development of Wurm. Just rush something out so that the simps will eat it up, fix some minor bugs, and move on to desperately rush the next update out "on time" with the handful of volunteers working on the game. Of course delays happen since the volunteers can't work full time and have no contract or obligations to do so, thus the whole "real life issues".

You don't see that happening with other MMOs. Then again, other MMOs have proper, in house, contracted, full time, employees whereas i believe codeclub has less than 5 actual employees according to tax documents that you can check online. Even Keenan (the server guy) is a 3rd party contractor.  

 

If they just hired some random outside party who never played and most likely never heard of Wurm before to develop it for VR (which they 100% did) then lord have mercy on this game. Hell, most experienced VR devs out there have no previous experience on doing VR for MMOs, so what possible team could they have hired with such a small budget when the company is/was losing money? The logic here is mind boggling and i have truly never seen such out of touch developers/company. I'd rather see Activision Blizzard get their hands on Wurm at this point.

Edited by atazs
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12 hours ago, Ekcin said:

Why can't the devs just implement a trait matrix similar to the spells table for priests where the non class traits are just not available?

That will be in the next update. They've spoken about removing traits that are useless for certain animals

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kind of amazing how they pop in "sorry for no updates, hope you guys are ready for what you've been waiting for.......... VR support!" and then just disappear all over again

like, is this a prank? am i getting pranked? who in god's name thought adding VR support would be a good idea, who thought anyone would want to do this? why is there any effort being put into that on an official capacity? why would anyone think playing wurm on vr is a good idea?

i can't even comprehend it. it's not like there's voip to speak in local either, you're just mute and staring at progress bars in vr? the menu wouldn't be hard to do but it's still just like. why?

this is surreal. this had to be some sort of weird wacky dimension where the devs are just pranking us or using the game as a project to learn how to program random stuff instead of actually working on the game.

what???????????

what a bloody joke of a game

Edited by RainRain
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I think it's more Gamechest telling Samool he has to do VR and not the devs deciding to it. The idea of VR was floated back when Budda was in charge and they knew it was a bad idea then, different era but still a bad idea without changing engines.

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On 8/17/2021 at 4:40 AM, Samool said:

Hi everyone,

 

MOAR BAD IDEAS
 

Thanks for the attention, and keep on Wurming!



STAHP! Just stop. Delete the source code repository and just stop making things worse.

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5 hours ago, Gumbert said:

I think it's more Gamechest telling Samool he has to do VR and not the devs deciding to it. The idea of VR was floated back when Budda was in charge and they knew it was a bad idea then, different era but still a bad idea without changing engines.

I believe it’s not Samool who is doing it, but rather they got a new external 3rd party dev team to develop it.
 

At least i think that’s what they said or implied. 
 

And yes this is 100% Gamechest trying to be “innovative”. 

 

It wouldn’t surprise me that when the team got wind of it, they all got sick of the stupidity of it all and just left, hence the lack of updates. 
 

I mean VR is finnicky, difficult, time, money, and resource intensive. 
 

Just look at the new medal of honor VR game and how bad it is, and that was developed by EA a multinational, multi billionaire AAA company for a popular franchise

 

Meanwhile here we have a random noname company pushing VR for a random niche noname MMO that’s coded in Java and is notorious for being terribly coded and optimized.

Edited by nitram20
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VR. This saddens me. What kind of machine do you need to get 60fps in this game during a impalong or slaying. I have a very decent one, and I am no where near that in this game when I am in populated areas.

But good luck with that. I just wish it was close to april 1st

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Hope devs and their bosses are reading this..... the Rising World reference wasn't a diss, that game has the loveliest terraforming.  Lost the map, but had a cool house half on land half on water, a basement, my farms were a tunnel that peeked out the cliff face to artificial platforms with the crops on them.  3D mines, real 3D mines... All it was missing was the skills' system and (can't believe imma say this), some timers to not make it so minecrafty.

 

Y'all should download a copy or even better, talk the creators into some form of joint venture to branch RW into Wurm 2.0.

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On 9/11/2021 at 8:14 PM, RainRain said:

kind of amazing how they pop in "sorry for no updates, hope you guys are ready for what you've been waiting for.......... VR support!" and then just disappear all over again

like, is this a prank? am i getting pranked? who in god's name thought adding VR support would be a good idea, who thought anyone would want to do this? why is there any effort being put into that on an official capacity? why would anyone think playing wurm on vr is a good idea?

i can't even comprehend it. it's not like there's voip to speak in local either, you're just mute and staring at progress bars in vr? the menu wouldn't be hard to do but it's still just like. why?

this is surreal. this had to be some sort of weird wacky dimension where the devs are just pranking us or using the game as a project to learn how to program random stuff instead of actually working on the game.

what???????????

what a bloody joke of a game

 

Not a single line in the original post was committal. Read the language carefully.

 

On 8/17/2021 at 7:40 AM, Samool said:

Obviously we’re not too happy with the current state of animal husbandry, and we’ve got multiple tweaks pending for the next update we release, including large changes to how traits are passed down (more likely to be passed down rather than replaced with random ones), lowering the chance of passing down negative traits as we’ve decided it was a bit too harsh, as well as significantly reducing the chance of getting traits not relevant to the animal, such as resource yield traits on animals that don’t produce any resources.

 

Does pending mean it's locked in? Or does it mean that it could potentially be changed and removed from the update?

 

On 8/17/2021 at 7:40 AM, Samool said:

We’re planning to release a smaller update next month, before the exploration update, and that will include those animal husbandry tweaks as well as some content additions.

 

Planning to release, not going to release. Update might not happen this month.

 

On 8/17/2021 at 7:40 AM, Samool said:

To fix the communication issues we’ve been having here a bit, we’ll be looking at getting some extra Community Managers on board to help with things, and until that time I’ll try to keep you all updated a bit better than how we’ve done recently.

 

Looking at getting, not getting. There's no assurance that a new community manager will be coming and that communication issues will be resolved.

 

Try to keep you updated. Not going to keep you all updated.

 

On 8/17/2021 at 7:40 AM, Samool said:

Lastly, while this might be a bit of unexpected news, it’s something we’ve teased in the past, long long ago, in one of the news posts - we’ll be starting development on adding VR functionality to Wurm, and while we can’t release any further details on it yet, we don’t expect it to derail development on the content features we’ve announced. Other than this feature, the last roadmap we posted is still relevant, and so there’s more exciting stuff to look forward to.

 

This is the only committed language in the post. VR starting development is the only statement that carries weight. Everything else is just well crafted hot air.

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All I can say, is I hope Sindusk is wrong, not because I disagree with what he said, but if he's right, then I don't think the current development cycle (in actual real life time) can sustain the growing frustrations and expectations of the community. Keep in mind every disappointment is compounded over time in the playerbase and it results in a feeling of imbalance in our minds. "We pay for this? I hope next update you have something better to show after waiting for so long..." until one day the player gets fed up and simply quits, probably also leaving a negative review in the process. 

Personally I think the VR announcement did more damage to the community's faith in the management of Wurm more than 1000 bugs could do. 

 

Edited by elentari
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biggest problem with wurm is that it seems like most things are half done, they have for years just pushed stuff in to the game with no logic behind it and many things full off bugs, some for years with no fix.

 

Just look at the animal update, most devolepment team would work the days after the release to fix bugs etc, here it just hanging in the air for months, and my feeling says it wont be fixed on next update.

another example is Cooking, whats the point with 600+++ recipes when they are totally useless.

Also steam release, i mean why didnt they follow that up more? ofcourse so few would stay, but maybe they where just after the short term cashflow, who knows.

I could make a 30 pages essey about stuff in wurm that has no use or ligic.

 

VR will be the same, truth is i kinda like the idea of VR, with a good exploration update and better game engine it could be really cool, but we now this will just be another feature that is pushed out so they can write on the page that wurm is supporting VR.

 

Rising World that was mention above was(is) a java based game that is now been coded in to UE4, singel devoleper, so i know its alot and will take time but its not impossible and i believe it would give Wurm a boost.

Wurm hasnt so far had any real competitions, but theres a few games under devolepment now that can be, lets see if wurm survive it(with the low cost of Wurm they could probably survive with less players then today, but you know what i mean)

 

For us players, all we can do is to decide to play it or not, for all we know maybe wurm is in a place where the devs is happy, keep the game floating with minimal work/expenses.

 

Also think blaming personal issue is just a excuse and not a real reason, yes i do understand that wurm is driven by volunteer mostly, and im all for that personal life is a priority, expecially if something happens that change it or you couldnt predict, but that this was the case for all the devs and others in the wurm team at the same time, that none of them couldnt even communicate or atleast have som written update on the forum, that i can just not believe.

 

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Hi :)

Five days ago, i send a kind message to know what happen with the contest, if it's totally abandonned or still in result process but no readding and of course no answer....

Even when you're kind and ask answer gently, there's no earing.... 

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16 minutes ago, Miell said:

Hi :)

Five days ago, i send a kind message to know what happen with the contest, if it's totally abandonned or still in result process but no readding and of course no answer....

Even when you're kind and ask answer gently, there's no earing.... 

 

another good example, sounds like kids that jump from one toy to another and never clean up.

isnt that a couple of month since the contest ended? Theres just so little effort from the Wurm team put in to it that im not sure if i should laugh or cry.

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Its strange that they partnered with an esports company just to get help in organising that contest, yet still fail to live up to it and have nothing going on for it after months. What was the point then? We had plenty of other design and whatnot contests before and none needed the help of other companies.

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18 hours ago, elentari said:

All I can say, is I hope Sindusk is wrong, not because I disagree with what he said, but if he's right, then I don't think the current development cycle (in actual real life time) can sustain the growing frustrations and expectations of the community. Keep in mind every disappointment is compounded over time in the playerbase and it results in a feeling of imbalance in our minds. "We pay for this? I hope next update you have something better to show after waiting for so long..." until one day the player gets fed up and simply quits, probably also leaving a negative review in the process. 

Personally I think the VR announcement did more damage to the community's faith in the management of Wurm more than 1000 bugs could do. 

 

Oh, I am sure another skin will have have pages of gushy posts and a bunch of people hand over dosh to buy one or two from the marks store.  I thought this would not be a sustainable practice but if people keep paying for it the company will keep doing it.

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If you look back, you can see a lot of threads over the years of people (including myself) suggesting a cosmetic shop would open in Wurm..

With the idea that the extra influx of cash would help Wurm development. Pretty clear this hasn't been the case. I imagine every cent now goes to GCG who love this current business model of having volunteers develop their game while they only pay a few staff and server costs. 

We also thought the steam release would bring in quite a lot of cash for wurm development. 

We also thought the WU release would bring in resources for WO development. 

 

With that train of thought....even if VR is somehow an astounding success and brings in high paying customers...will that money actually go to developing content and fixing bugs? 

 

Comes a point where you can't break a pattern without acknowledging there's a  problem somewhere. Personally I regret I don't have a few million euros around to just buy this game, keep it afloat long enough to develop Wurm 2.0 and migrate people and their skills to new improved lands. 

 

Edited by elentari
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