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MordosKull

Reaction to Staff Statements on Game Status

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34 minutes ago, Votip said:

out.png?width=1007&height=566

yes

Are you sure your dates and numbers are correct?🙃

Expected Votip art from you @Votip

Edited by Finnn

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@votip

You should add some Info to that graph. What does it show?  The declining amount of riceballs in Timbuktu?

 

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17 minutes ago, Finnn said:

Are you sure your dates and numbers are correct?🙃

yes

out.png?width=1007&height=566

 

1 minute ago, Bekador said:

@votip

You should add some Info to that graph. What does it show?  The declining amount of riceballs in Timbuktu?

 

 

jenn001.game.wurmonline.com/mrtg/weeklylogins.log

Edited by Votip

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3 hours ago, Votip said:

jenn001.game.wurmonline.com/mrtg/weeklylogins.log

 

So it's higher than before Steam.

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2 hours ago, CistaCista said:

 

So it's higher than before Steam.

Not for long

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It is obviously around double what it was before steam. And interestingly, it did not decrease during summer in the ways it did the years before. Btw., the 3 day graph you presented, for a time of 4 days and a scale between 5000 and 5300, was highly manipulative. 

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3500 * 2 =/= 5000....  Seriously, if 7000 is near 5000 something has gone wrong!

 

Weekly logins : is that unique accounts logged in, or just logins processed by the server.  If the former, this might be a good measure (at least no worse than daily online counts as it will have similar alt inflation), if the latter you're going to have some players contributing 35+ if they log in daily with their alts!

 

Folks who play on both clusters also need to be factored in if you want to find a lower bound to player numbers.

 

Overall, these graphs offer a nice upper bound to population, though regardless of which method used, they'd be a hard sell on a lower bound.

 

Also, notice, the graph declines most of the year before hitting heartbeat stability around April...  Hrm...  I wonder where I've seen a similar pattern before....  Hrm...

 

As an aside, Ekcin is right about the first graph, I was about to call out the scale for tricking the user!

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The biggest issue I have with the Enki post is that it was so vague and so unprofessional.  It appears from comments a lot of people are in the same boat as me and started playing after steam launch so we don't exactly have the best idea of how this game operates on the forums.  So people like me who were confused by his post don't have the same wurm history in our heads as the people who have been playing 10+ years.

 

I used to work at a game store and sold magic cards and if I ever posted something that unprofessional I would have been fired.  If you are in a power position and that's how you choose to communicate with your community after prolonged radio silence you really need to self reflect and ask yourself where you went wrong.  I don't think that's asking too much, it's just basic respect.  Most of us don't know him so it's exectionally reasonable for people to see that weird RP and think oh no did I do a bad?

 

Also on a side note, wtf is up with the biker/redneck comment?  That just like came out of nowhere.

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2 hours ago, MrKettle said:

The biggest issue I have with the Enki post is that it was so vague and so unprofessional.

 

I used to work at a game store and sold magic cards and if I ever posted something that unprofessional I would have been fired.

 

I am grateful for Enki's post. It was so genuine and human, that I felt it communicated sincere depth of emotional investment in this community, and that made me FINALLY relax after so much radio silence.

 

Employers who care only about how much money they can make from their robot-substitutes, are not good masters whose rules should be enforced elsewhere.

 

If Enki as HGM had posted something cold, professional and specific, I would have felt MORE alienated from the staff.

 

Kudos to the guy with the guts to be human before the entire community he is responsible for managing, BELIEVING he does not deserve to be fired for daring to be so unprofessional as to actually care about us in the first place.

 

With all due respect, sacc-to-Lib the attitude of your old boss. I want Enki as my HGM, flaws and all, especially when I don't agree with him.

Edited by Drayka
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52 minutes ago, Drayka said:

 

I am grateful for Enki's post. It was so genuine and human, that I felt it communicated sincere depth of emotional investment in this community, and that made me FINALLY relax after so much radio silence.

 

Employers who care only about how much money they can make from their robot-substitutes, are not good masters whose rules should be enforced elsewhere.

 

If Enki as HGM had posted something cold, professional and specific, I would have felt MORE alienated from the staff.

 

Kudos to the guy with the guts to be human before the entire community he is responsible for managing, BELIEVING he does not deserve to be fired for daring to be so unprofessional as to actually care about us in the first place.

 

With all due respect, sacc-to-Lib the attitude of your old boss. I want Enki as my HGM, flaws and all, especially when I don't agree with him.

You're missing my point though, for the people who aren't used to this, the post seemed very isolating.  I'm glad you got a positive experience from this but I don't think it's right to minimize others feelings because they weren't the same as your own feelings.

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4 minutes ago, MrKettle said:

You're missing my point though, for the people who aren't used to this, the post seemed very isolating.  I'm glad you got a positive experience from this but I don't think it's right to minimize others feelings because they weren't the same as your own feelings.

 

I'm not minimising. I spent my entire childhood thinking that having parents who got frustrated was proof that they didn't love me. I found that very isolating and extremely difficult to survive. But in HINDSIGHT, in context, and with a better understanding of what it means to be human, it was proof of the exact opposite.

 

And I would now not change a single moment where my parents were pissed off and thus scared the hell out of me, because in hindsight, it was worth every second of feeling unloved, to realise that I was ALWAYS loved.

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24 minutes ago, MrKettle said:

You're missing my point though, for the people who aren't used to this, the post seemed very isolating.  I'm glad you got a positive experience from this but I don't think it's right to minimize others feelings because they weren't the same as your own feelings.

to me Enki's post was more the reaction you would get out of your parent if they came home and the house was a mess. Like Enki cares enough about wurm to want it to be a safe place for all, and some of the 'children' have been up to no good.
 

Enki understands what it takes to survive, and by extension what it takes for a GAME to survive. and 'tearing up the house', so to speak, is not good for survival.

 

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5 minutes ago, Tomatoes said:

Enki understands what it takes to survive, and by extension what it takes for a GAME to survive. and 'tearing up the house', so to speak, is not good for survival.

 

I read that this is his opinion, yes.

 

And I respect his reaction, and his right, nay, his duty to publicly react that way, regardless of whether I share his opinion or not.

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2 hours ago, Drayka said:

 

I'm not minimising. I spent my entire childhood thinking that having parents who got frustrated was proof that they didn't love me. I found that very isolating and extremely difficult to survive. But in HINDSIGHT, in context, and with a better understanding of what it means to be human, it was proof of the exact opposite.

 

And I would now not change a single moment where my parents were pissed off and thus scared the hell out of me, because in hindsight, it was worth every second of feeling unloved, to realise that I was ALWAYS loved.

I'm sorry you had to go through that but I'm not sure how it relates to anything that I brought up.  

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1 minute ago, MrKettle said:

I'm sorry you had to go through that but I'm not sure how it relates to anything that I brought up.  

 

It relates exactly. Right now, you and many others are going through exactly what I went through as a kid. You don't know what's going on, you don't comprehend why he's pissed-off, and you, like a young child watching any family argument, can feel scared that it's somehow YOUR fault.

 

And it IS indirectly your fault, but not in a bad way. Enki CARES about you feeling safe so much, having a future here so much, that he's willing to risk scaring you as he reacts to the people who are pushing the limits of staff endurance.

 

He spoke in the language of a PvPer. By doing so he demonstrated to everyone that PvP has an irreplaceable function in this community that he will protect the existence of. And you can stay on PvE and enjoy the benefits of it, but when he steps up to the plate and says in his own words, to one Kingdom who is winning over another Kingdom "you went too far, too fast", he is protecting PvP from destroying itself.

 

And whether you grasp it or not, the PvE community needs PvP community to flourish. Not for PROFIT, but because we represent a function of every human community, every living creature in fact. It is our FUNCTION, to be aggressive to the knife-edge of destruction. It's our JOB to express what others will not, and to be a perpetual challenge to him and his, that he cannot afford to ignore for long. If we can't piss him off if he takes his eye off the ball, then this game wouldn't be proving that it needs him, and will always need him. That he cannot be replaced.

 

When he lashes out at my enemies who have deserted me for more challenging enemies, that I would not see gone from the game for any reason, he is saying that PvP must never die, by joining in and throwing his own weight into the mix. He made me feel safer than I have felt in a very long time. And if I can't feel safe to perform my role in this community, I cannot function. I cannot function any better than a PvE player, any better than a new player, any better than a staff member, any better than a developer. I'm as human as the rest of you, and so are the veterans that can so frustrate him.

But our way of communicating is more physical, less professional, very emotional. We care so much we kill each other for fun, because it is SAFE to do so.

 

When Enki proves he can speak the language of PvP, he restores my faith in the future of this community, and that he will not allow this game to become some cash-cow to be milked dry and left for dead by some adopted parent-company, if he has any say in the matter.

 

THAT'S what I needed to hear.

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1 minute ago, Drayka said:

 

It relates exactly. Right now, you and many others are going through exactly what I went through as a kid. You don't know what's going on, you don't comprehend why he's pissed-off, and you, like a young child watching any family argument, can feel scared that it's somehow YOUR fault.

 

And it IS indirectly your fault, but not in a bad way. Enki CARES about you feeling safe so much, having a future here so much, that he's willing to risk scaring you as he reacts to the people who are pushing the limits of staff endurance.

 

He spoke in the language of a PvPer. By doing so he demonstrated to everyone that PvP has an irreplaceable function in this community that he will protect the existence of. And you can stay on PvE and enjoy the benefits of it, but when he steps up to the plate and says in his own words, to one Kingdom who is winning over another Kingdom "you went too far, too fast", he is protecting PvP from destroying itself.

 

And whether you grasp it or not, the PvE community needs PvP community to flourish. Not for PROFIT, but because we represent a function of every human community, every living creature in fact. It is our FUNCTION, to be aggressive to the knife-edge of destruction. It's our JOB to express what others will not, and to be a perpetual challenge to him and his, that he cannot afford to ignore for long. If we can't piss him off if he takes his eye off the ball, then this game wouldn't be proving that it needs him, and will always need him. That he cannot be replaced.

 

When he lashes out at my enemies who have deserted me for more challenging enemies, that I would not see gone from the game for any reason, he is saying that PvP must never die, by joining in and throwing his own weight into the mix. He made me feel safer than I have felt in a very long time. And if I can't feel safe to perform my role in this community, I cannot function. I cannot function any better than a PvE player, any better than a new player, any better than a staff member, any better than a developer. I'm as human as the rest of you, and so are the veterans that can so frustrate him.

But our way of communicating is more physical, less professional, very emotional. We care so much we kill each other for fun, because it is SAFE to do so.

 

When Enki proves he can speak the language of PvP, he restores my faith in the future of this community, and that he will not allow this game to become some cash-cow to be milked dry and left for dead by some adopted parent-company, if he has any say in the matter.

 

THAT'S what I needed to hear.

What does any of this have to do with PvP?  I'm terribly confused after reading that, I don't mean to sound insensitive but I truly have no clue what you are talking about.  I thought all this was about not having enough communication between devs and players?  

 

Also I do not feel like an unloved child in this situation, I feel like a confused consumer and I'm not here to debate psychology, I'm here to voice my opinion on how a post didn't exactly hit the way it was planned to hit.  So once again sorry if I seem dismissive, I just am having trouble following your thought process here that's all.

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1 minute ago, MrKettle said:

What does any of this have to do with PvP?  I'm terribly confused after reading that, I don't mean to sound insensitive but I truly have no clue what you are talking about.  I thought all this was about not having enough communication between devs and players?  

 

Also I do not feel like an unloved child in this situation, I feel like a confused consumer and I'm not here to debate psychology, I'm here to voice my opinion on how a post didn't exactly hit the way it was planned to hit.  So once again sorry if I seem dismissive, I just am having trouble following your thought process here that's all.

You don't sound insensitive. You sound like a PvEer who feels they do not need to know what is going on in the rest of the community, and yet expects themselves to understand and relate to a staff post about something that you weren't witness to. Most of it, I wasn't witness to. I found out through Discord servers and friends in the wider PvP community. And there are aspects of this that are nothing to do with Wurmian PvPers, but who do play PvP in other games and speak that language regardless.

 

What you need to know, is that Enki was and is looking out for the best interests of everyone in this community, including the people he banned, and that he just proved it beyond all reasonable doubt.

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8 minutes ago, Drayka said:

You don't sound insensitive. You sound like a PvEer who feels they do not need to know what is going on in the rest of the community, and yet expects themselves to understand and relate to a staff post about something that you weren't witness to. Most of it, I wasn't witness to. I found out through Discord servers and friends in the wider PvP community. And there are aspects of this that are nothing to do with Wurmian PvPers, but who do play PvP in other games and speak that language regardless.

 

What you need to know, is that Enki was and is looking out for the best interests of everyone in this community, including the people he banned, and that he just proved it beyond all reasonable doubt.

Okay but what does this post that had to do with non responsive devs have to do with PvP?  There was nothing I mentioned about pvp or really anything to do with PvP until you brought it up and I have no opinion on pvp so not to be rude but this conversation is going in circles.

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3 minutes ago, MrKettle said:

Okay but what does this post that had to do with non responsive devs have to do with PvP?  There was nothing I mentioned about pvp or really anything to do with PvP until you brought it up and I have no opinion on pvp so not to be rude but this conversation is going in circles.

 

7 hours ago, MrKettle said:

The biggest issue I have with the Enki post is that it was so vague and so unprofessional.

Which post were you talking about then? Because this is the one I'm talking about:

 

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1 minute ago, Drayka said:

 

Which post were you talking about then? Because this is the one I'm talking about:

 

Yeah that post, the one with no mention of PvP

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2 minutes ago, MrKettle said:

Yeah that post, the one with no mention of PvP

Oh, so your objection is that he was SO professional, he didn't name the groups that pissed him off??

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1 minute ago, Drayka said:

Oh, so your objection is that he was SO professional, he didn't name the groups that pissed him off??

Sure why not.  I'm out, have a good day

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1 minute ago, MrKettle said:

Sure why not.  I'm out, have a good day

You too. Happy, safe, Wurming. :)

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4 hours ago, Tomatoes said:

to me Enki's post was more the reaction you would get out of your parent if they came home and the house was a mess.

More like a parent who just hasn't come home for the last few months finally shows up and when the house is OF COURSE a mess and the kids are OF COURSE getting unruly the first thing they do is promise to find out who has been bad and kick them out of the house.

 

I found nothing reassuring in it at all.  It was to me the opposite to being a sign of caring and investment; it seemed to me to completely lack any empathy for how we have been experiencing being completely ignored by staff.  There was apparently an issue that a small proportion of players had with another even smaller proportion of players, and THAT was the focus instead of the growing dissatisfaction that more and more players were experiencing.  Thankfully, a couple of other staff spoke up with appropriate communication.

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@TheTricksterHave you ever watched Saving Mr Banks? It's a really good film, and very enlightening as to the original author's intent.

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