Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) Campfire A campfire at night should scare away aggressive mobs, in such a way that the player sitting close to the fire will not be attacked by migrating mob. But this feature won't work if the player starts the fight by himself, or if he was during combat or if the mob had already followed player, but distance was too large to enter combat. Leather line Cut with any knife from leather piece, although any knife except the leather knife will lower ql. It can be used as a rope for basic activities or for creating small containers that do not require metal to build. It could also be used to craft leather whip. Mini-crate A small container made of leather line and hides would act as a mini-crate, i.e. averaging ql, holds 50 items and requires no metal for creation, can't hold logs or items of that size. Improved with leather. Cargo donkey/mule We should be able to add one mini-crate or two saddle bags or two small barrels to the saddle (or to special harness). In the case of a saddle, player would have to choose either he is riding donkey or is using that saddle as cargo-saddle. Edited September 11, 2021 by Pandalet Moderation edit 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 20, 2021 -1 No merit to these suggestions Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 20, 2021 56 minutes ago, Darnok said: Cargo donkey/mule We should be able to add one mini-crate or two saddle bags or two small barrels to the saddle (or to special harness). In the case of a saddle, player would have to choose either he is riding donkey or is using that saddle as cargo-saddle. I can see this or something similar to this being quite useful as a starting player. Since small carts are unable to have anything hitched to them (unless that changes), and large carts take a bit before you can craft them and ride them. This could be a very good alternative for a starting player. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 20, 2021 1 hour ago, DaletheGood said: -1 No merit to these suggestions How so? Also to note I thoroughly agree with majority of this suggestion! Although for the leather lines I do believe we already have leather strips which essentially would be the same thing. Also would you say the small tiny crate would be something a player can pick up? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) Campfire Yes, it would be good if the current campfire kept away certain animals, but not all types and not all conditions. Coding and server resource for that would be a barrier, though, I think. Leather line We can already cut leather strips - so being able to plait a shortish leather cord/rope would be a good thing. The basic rope is a standout item for newbs - there is a discontinuity it its difficulty level compared to other beginner equipment. I can't remember if a rope is in the starter equipment, but there is fairly quickly a need for more rope. On that - why not rawhide? A newb will be able to get hide well before they can reliable make usable leather. Mini-crate You mean, a box? 😄 We have the small chest. Actually the description of making it out of animal skin would not so much be a crate or box and more of a wrapped package. A scrip? The small bag would seem to fill this function Cargo donkey/mule Maybe have a different kind of "saddle" being a pannier harness. An animal with a pannier harness can have either cargo or a rider but not both (this would not apply to whatever is in normal saddle bags, which should also be attachable to the pannier harness). Edited July 20, 2021 by TheTrickster Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 20, 2021 And then add a rear hitch point to saddles, so we can lead a dedicated pack animal. (Actually, put this hitch point on wagons and large carts, too - it makes no sense that you drive these with one hand while holding a leader in the other). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 21, 2021 7 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Campfire Yes, it would be good if the current campfire kept away certain animals, but not all types and not all conditions. Coding and server resource for that would be a barrier, though, I think. When the player is at the campfire, then NPCs simply do not start chasing him and don't start fighting they only walk away, but when the player is away, campfire is left and nobody sees it, it is not worth wasting server CPU. 7 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Leather line We can already cut leather strips - so being able to plait a shortish leather cord/rope would be a good thing. The basic rope is a standout item for newbs - there is a discontinuity it its difficulty level compared to other beginner equipment. I can't remember if a rope is in the starter equipment, but there is fairly quickly a need for more rope. On that - why not rawhide? A newb will be able to get hide well before they can reliable make usable leather. But strips can be made into Leather wound handle and I have different idea how to use that on more than just one item as it is done right now 😉 "A small container made of leather line and hides" - you would need only one piece of leather to cut line and then you "wrap" your items with hides. 7 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Mini-crate You mean, a box? 😄 We have the small chest. Actually the description of making it out of animal skin would not so much be a crate or box and more of a wrapped package. A scrip? The small bag would seem to fill this function Name is not important I focused on feature. 7 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Cargo donkey/mule Maybe have a different kind of "saddle" being a pannier harness. An animal with a pannier harness can have either cargo or a rider but not both (this would not apply to whatever is in normal saddle bags, which should also be attachable to the pannier harness). Whatever is simpler and could be added would be good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 21, 2021 (edited) Campfire Spoiler 22 hours ago, Darnok said: Campfire A campfire at night should scare away aggressive mobs, in such a way that the player sitting close to the fire will not be attacked by migrating mob. But this feature won't work if the player starts the fight by himself, or if he was during combat or if the mob had already followed player, but distance was too large to enter combat. 16 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Campfire Yes, it would be good if the current campfire kept away certain animals, but not all types and not all conditions. Coding and server resource for that would be a barrier, though, I think. 8 hours ago, Darnok said: When the player is at the campfire, then NPCs simply do not start chasing him and don't start fighting they only walk away, but when the player is away, campfire is left and nobody sees it, it is not worth wasting server CPU. Okay, this could work if you change it to a campfire giving a player standing on the same tile, a Fo-priest(60faith, 30favor) immunity buff to 'animals' - this by default does not include goblins, trolls, scorpions, hell scorpions, lava fiends or dragons - as this has already been coded in. At the very least it could be used as a basis of a campfire deterrent code. However. It may have to be that only 1 campfire will give this buff in a certain area - like guardtowers - to avoid it being overpowered as a mechanic. Leather line Spoiler 22 hours ago, Darnok said: Leather line Cut with any knife from leather piece, although any knife except the leather knife will lower ql. It can be used as a rope for basic activities or for creating small containers that do not require metal to build. It could also be used to craft leather whip. 16 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Leather line We can already cut leather strips - so being able to plait a shortish leather cord/rope would be a good thing. The basic rope is a standout item for newbs - there is a discontinuity it its difficulty level compared to other beginner equipment. I can't remember if a rope is in the starter equipment, but there is fairly quickly a need for more rope. On that - why not rawhide? A newb will be able to get hide well before they can reliable make usable leather. 8 hours ago, Darnok said: But strips can be made into Leather wound handle and I have different idea how to use that on more than just one item as it is done right now 😉 "A small container made of leather line and hides" - you would need only one piece of leather to cut line and then you "wrap" your items with hides. Leather strips require scissors to create. Make this a rawhide strip that can be cut with any knife directly from a hide. +1 to a plaited rope made from rawhide strips, with same ability to lead animals as a standard rope - not as a standard-recipe rope substitute. +1 to a plaited rawhide whip - for use to encourage non-aggro mobs to move away from the current tile without entering into combat with them. Popular with farmers? And the rest... Spoiler 22 hours ago, Darnok said: Mini-crate A small container made of leather line and hides would act as a mini-crate, i.e. averaging ql, holds 50 items and requires no metal for creation, can't hold logs or items of that size. Improved with leather. Cargo donkey/mule We should be able to add one mini-crate or two saddle bags or two small barrels to the saddle (or to special harness). In the case of a saddle, player would have to choose either he is riding donkey or is using that saddle as cargo-saddle. 16 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Mini-crate You mean, a box? 😄 We have the small chest. Actually the description of making it out of animal skin would not so much be a crate or box and more of a wrapped package. A scrip? The small bag would seem to fill this function 8 hours ago, Darnok said: Name is not important I focused on feature. Cargo donkey/mule Maybe have a different kind of "saddle" being a pannier harness. An animal with a pannier harness can have either cargo or a rider but not both (this would not apply to whatever is in normal saddle bags, which should also be attachable to the pannier harness). 8 hours ago, Darnok said: Whatever is simpler and could be added would be good. At this point I'm feeling like I should be reading the entire post in reverse order. Not quite sure how a campfire is required for a cargo-donkey, but I'll give it a try: Donkey/Mule/Player-carriable bulk goods box - reuse single longbox graphic, from bsb and empty bsb rack graphics. Does not use nails or any other type of metal to create it - substitute with rawhide ropes, plaited from rawhide strips, cut with any knife, from hide. Fits in a rawhide harness cargo-slot, as can small/wine barrels. Rawhide items cannot be improved. (It is easy on its gear - draft trait) Logs (WT 80) do not fit in the bgb. Max Wt is 75.00 per box (4x dirt/ore) - quality of contents is average per type. A harnessed donkey or mule can hypothetically carry upto 150.00 WT (2 bgbs at full capacity or 3 liquid-full barrels). Positive traits may be required to achieve this. Young/f2p/portalled accounts using this mechanic on the frontier might require additional protection. Thus, outside of guard tower influence, and at guard tower spacing, a campfire will confer a Fo-like buff immunity from any 'animal' that has not already aggroed the player or their pet, whilst standing on the same tile as the campfire. Rawhide whip - plaited from rawhide strips - can be used to encourage a non-aggro animal to move away from the current tile without entering into combat with them. and/or Lit torches equipped/in-inventory reduce aggro range of mobs for any account <20.01 Fighting Skill Edited July 21, 2021 by Drayka formatting 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 23, 2021 On 7/21/2021 at 5:28 PM, Drayka said: Reveal hidden contents At this point I'm feeling like I should be reading the entire post in reverse order. Not quite sure how a campfire is required for a cargo-donkey, but I'll give it a try: Campfire feature should help new players survive dark nights, before they find something to ride. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 27, 2021 (edited) A little idea that came to my mind after testing ship... what if horses, carts, and wagons had a similar movement system as ship sails unfolding works? Some kind of "gearbox": R- reverse N - parking, stop 1st gear - character movement speed, 2nd - 2/3 max mount/vehicle speed, 3rd - max speed Depending on the type of armor of character and whether or not the horse has barding, speed of acceleration and deacceleration could be different. Just as the turning rate would be different for different speed and armor type, the heavier the armor and greater speed, the larger the arc you would have to make to turn. Edited July 27, 2021 by Darnok 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 27, 2021 Gaits Walk Trot Canter Gallop Charge Backing up would be limited to walking speed. A gallop would not be sustainable over a long period. These gaits are obvious for equines, but all quadrupeds are capable of them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 27, 2021 Show me the open road, and I'll knock Bouncer into overdrive and exceed his top speed (whilst reducing hay consumption). Will he go faster if I feed him oats instead of hay? or will he become heated, uncontrollable and buck me off? I think we all know the answer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 This is the first Darnok-suggestion I would heavily back with only a few tweaks to the implementation. Functionality should be retained to go straight to maximum-speed under the principle of fight or flight. It's an animal, not a ship. It should have survival instincts that trump player privilege to control its speed. I'm intringued by the possibility that the HORSE being in-combat would be required to achieve maximum speed from it. It would make dehorsing more challenging - you target the ridden animal, take a swing and miss, and your target is now moving faster than your horse can (assuming identical traits and no RNG). +1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 19 hours ago, TheTrickster said: Gaits Walk Trot Canter Gallop Charge Backing up would be limited to walking speed. A gallop would not be sustainable over a long period. These gaits are obvious for equines, but all quadrupeds are capable of them. The names do not matter much, I gave them to make it easier to understand how feaure works. 4 hours ago, Drayka said: This is the first Darnok-suggestion I would heavily back with only a few tweaks to the implementation. Functionality should be retained to go straight to maximum-speed under the principle of fight or flight. It's an animal, not a ship. It should have survival instincts that trump player privilege to control its speed. I'm intringued by the possibility that the HORSE being in-combat would be required to achieve maximum speed from it. It would make dehorsing more challenging - you target the ridden animal, take a swing and miss, and your target is now moving faster than your horse can (assuming identical traits and no RNG). +1 It depends, if you mean that horse, cart or wagon has to start from 0 to max speed in 0.01 sec (which is like now it works) then I am against. But if you mean that by jumping on a horse, cart or wagon during combat you can switch on 3rd gear-max-speed in one go and horse/vehicle will start accelerating from 0 to max speed according to the restrictions, that means type of your armor counts for horse, and for cart and wagon weight of load is counted for calculating your acceleration, then I see no problem. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Darnok said: The names do not matter much, I gave them to make it easier to understand how feaure works. It depends, if you mean that horse, cart or wagon has to start from 0 to max speed in 0.01 sec (which is like now it works) then I am against. But if you mean that by jumping on a horse, cart or wagon during combat you can switch on 3rd gear-max-speed in one go and horse/vehicle will start accelerating from 0 to max speed according to the restrictions, that means type of your armor counts for horse, and for cart and wagon weight of load is counted for calculating your acceleration, then I see no problem. So compromise is synonymous with corruption to you? You can't give a single micron to acknowledge that anyone else's idea could work with your idea under any circumstances? RIP all of your suggestions then, because as anyone on these forums will tell you, no suggestion will make it into the game as-is, therefore all your suggestions, by being publicly suggested at all, have been auto-downvoted as will-not-be-implemented in this exact form, and all you will get by playing this game, is the possibility of seeing one of your suggestions implemented in a way that is distorted, mutated, corrupted and perverted from its original intention. -1 (same as my previous vote, but translated for clarity) Edited July 28, 2021 by Drayka 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 2 hours ago, Darnok said: The names do not matter much, I gave them to make it easier to understand how feaure works Yes and no. Function is more important than name to some of us but others may not see the application without a useful tag. Having a real world analogue helps to justify the suggestion and to give it useful context. Also, if this WAS to be implemented it will NOT be implemented as an animal gearbox, which is the only way you suggested it. A sign of a usable suggestion is other people working on how it could be implemented. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 1 hour ago, TheTrickster said: Yes and no. Function is more important than name to some of us but others may not see the application without a useful tag. Having a real world analogue helps to justify the suggestion and to give it useful context. Also, if this WAS to be implemented it will NOT be implemented as an animal gearbox, which is the only way you suggested it. A sign of a usable suggestion is other people working on how it could be implemented. I did not say that the proper names should not be given in the game after implementation, but that it wasn't important for me while I was making this suggestion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, Drayka said: So compromise is synonymous with corruption to you? You can't give a single micron to acknowledge that anyone else's idea could work with your idea under any circumstances? RIP all of your suggestions then, because as anyone on these forums will tell you, no suggestion will make it into the game as-is, therefore all your suggestions, by being publicly suggested at all, have been auto-downvoted as will-not-be-implemented in this exact form, and all you will get by playing this game, is the possibility of seeing one of your suggestions implemented in a way that is distorted, mutated, corrupted and perverted from its original intention. -1 (same as my previous vote, but translated for clarity) Wurm is one big compromise that has many different functions, but due to the fact that Devs had to compromise with a groups that used little too much of some features, it turned out that we have one strongest religion in PvE, one strongest weapon, one strongest fighting style (aggressive), one "strongest" ship, etc. Either balance or compromises and broken features, it is simple choice. Besides, if fully loaded wagon would be able to accelerate at the same rate as now, that means like a horse with just a rider, why change anything? It wouldn't make sense. Edited July 28, 2021 by Darnok Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 You might notice that my suggestion did not include any references to hitched creatures if you reread. My implication to vehicles was that a driver could not FORCE a hitched animal to try to move at less than maximum speed. I made no additional comment about whether a hitched animal, or horse, managing its own speed, should be able to achieve this instantaneously. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) 52 minutes ago, Drayka said: You might notice that my suggestion did not include any references to hitched creatures if you reread. My implication to vehicles was that a driver could not FORCE a hitched animal to try to move at less than maximum speed. I made no additional comment about whether a hitched animal, or horse, managing its own speed, should be able to achieve this instantaneously. Why not? If you are in the mine and an NPC appears, and it is too strong for you, that means you need to escape from it, you need a slower gear to be able to turn more precisely. While you will use the faster gear on straight section of tunnel. Edited July 28, 2021 by Darnok Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 2 hours ago, Darnok said: I did not say that the proper names should not be given in the game after implementation, but that it wasn't important for me while I was making this suggestion. Which is why I suggestion some to add some depth. Good grief, I liked your suggestion and responded with a supportive post, offering some input and you still find a way to argue about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 28, 2021 17 minutes ago, TheTrickster said: Which is why I suggestion some to add some depth. Good grief, I liked your suggestion and responded with a supportive post, offering some input and you still find a way to argue about it. I'm not arguing, just explaining why my post does not contain the names you suggested, which does not mean that I am against adding them. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 29, 2021 12 hours ago, Darnok said: Why not? If you are in the mine and an NPC appears, and it is too strong for you, that means you need to escape from it, you need a slower gear to be able to turn more precisely. While you will use the faster gear on straight section of tunnel. The context, was when HORSE is the one being attacked - triggering its flight reflex and desire to use its maximum speed. This does not affect your suggestion of being able to have lesser speeds when YOU are the one being attacked, and not YOUR HORSE. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
