DLCs for WU, since people haven't all left there

[Wurmhole 3,650]

Not sure if Devs even look at WU suggestions, since quitting any dev work for that branch, so I posted here.

 

I believe there is still a pretty strong group of players that play WU, despite all the efforts to kill it, by not doing any development of new content.  THat being the case, wouldn't it make sense to at least offer paid DLC updates every 6 months, or every year?  I have another game I play occasionally like I occasionally dabble with my WU server (for my one friend that plays it every 6-8 months) and it would be something I would be happy to pay for.  Something simple like $7 or 9 bucks each.  I'd throw that in my cart and buy, without even glancing at what the actual content was.  It is less than a Big Mac, fries and coke, so why not?

 

Anyone playing that doesn't want to pay for more content updates?  Ok. Don't. 

 

I suppose it would be up to server admins to determine if their server will run DLCs or not.

 

Seems like all upside?  Game makes money and players that don't want monthly subs can still get the new content.

[Drayka 485]

+1

 

I don't see why Devs can resell their updates for WO after X time, as DLCs, alongside player-created mods. WU server admins can then choose which mods - official or otherwise - to enable on their servers.

 

It's probably worth trying it at least once, to get data on its cost-effectiveness. Like DVD sales after a theatre release.

[Locath 531]

I like the idea but wouldn't that mean developing some sort of versioning mechanism?

A lot of the changes added to WO since WU was abandoned would require server side and client side DLC at the same time so if you update your server to allow for X, only clients with the same DLC would be able to play?

 

I fully support that kind of monetization for the devs and the idea is great. I would happily pay to have the new skybox and water and distant tree rendering in both, WO and WU but i think a lot of the new functionality would have to be deployed to both, server and client for it to work.

 

+1 anyway, for the bigger brains than mine to find a olution.

[Drayka 485]

Not versions per se.

 

The Devs get to keep their intellectual property rights in WO updates for x-timeframe (appropriate to Wurm budgets) and then they release a patch for WU.

 

Cheapest option, and least like classic DLC packs: The modders can then unpick raw-code they purchase, and do the heavy lifting of converting it to be compatible with the broad spectrum that is WU servers.

[Locath 531]

@Drayka

 

What i meant is what many other games do. If i play a game which has 20 DLC or expansions or whatever the game calls their new content and i don't pay for 5 out of the 20 released addons, i can still play, i just can't access parts of the world or can't use some items or can't level past certain limit (EQ2 has a habit of adding 10 levels with each expansion for example but if you don't buy it, you can't hit max level).

Not paying for one of the DLC doesn't stop me from playing the rest of the content because the game is built with that in mind from the beginning.

 

In WU, say i buy a DLC which includes donkeys or the big planters or rifts.

I can't use that on a server which doesn't have the code behind that.

 

On the other hand, if i run a server with all that included, because i paid for the DLC, people who didn't pay, don't have the graphics and client side functionality without mods.

 

Graphics and menus and all the rest can be pushed out from the server to the client (example below) but that means that only server owner has to pay for the DLC for all players to enjoy it because there is no way to validate if the client steam account can access those resources or not, past the client version.

 

This is what i mean by "versioning", perhaps not the right word to use but on steam authentication, client would have to check which parts of the content it can access and server would have to be built to disallow usage if the client didn't pay for it.

Having the code public and having the brilliant modders that we have out there, each DLC would have to be purchased only by server owners. Without a steam auth check for each DLC the rest of the players would be able to use it as well. Effectively meaning 1 copy sold per server to accommodate all players on it.

 

I am all for selling the new content to WU players but it might not be as simple as copy-paste. Entire system would have to be built around validating which steam account can access which content, without stopping them from logging on to a server if they didn't purchase a donkey.

 

This beauty comes with the Highway Portals mod and the graphic is sent to the clients so they don't need to download it separately:

 

 

[Drayka 485]

I'm just not sure we have the staff for it. Creating DLCs is dedicated department work, which big games can outsource under the umbrella of their sponsor company (as I guess at it working, because that's how I'd do  it).

 

I'm not sure our team can afford to create and test industry-standard DLC, in addition to keeping Wurm Online running and being updated. They may have to get creative, and just sell/release 'outdated' source-code to modders, or pure graphics packs without the mechanics.

[Etherdrifter 2,517]

Somewhere, buried in the forums, is the written promise that WU will be supported as long as WO...

[Finnn 3,302]

5 hours ago, Wurmhole said:

Not sure if Devs even look at WU suggestions, since quitting any dev work for that branch, so I posted here.

 

I believe there is still a pretty strong group of players that play WU, despite all the efforts to kill it, by not doing any development of new content.  THat being the case, wouldn't it make sense to at least offer paid DLC updates every 6 months, or every year?  I have another game I play occasionally like I occasionally dabble with my WU server (for my one friend that plays it every 6-8 months) and it would be something I would be happy to pay for.  Something simple like $7 or 9 bucks each.  I'd throw that in my cart and buy, without even glancing at what the actual content was.  It is less than a Big Mac, fries and coke, so why not?

 

Anyone playing that doesn't want to pay for more content updates?  Ok. Don't. 

 

I suppose it would be up to server admins to determine if their server will run DLCs or not.

 

Seems like all upside?  Game makes money and players that don't want monthly subs can still get the new content.

I see it possible to get monthly skins.. for free with that kind of money.. like season pass in other games.. free money for basically no work...

 

but as it is.. seems like there's too much work with just WO to pass content to WU and debug/patch addition things in WU.. whatever the differences in the branches might be... will be some extra work(maybe)

[Ekcin 2,406]

1 hour ago, Etherdrifter said:

Somewhere, buried in the forums, is the written promise that WU will be supported as long as WO...

As long as there was no written contract or EULA paragraph stating that, the promise was never worth more than a Darnok suggestion. It was at best a statement of intent, and the intent changed when the company was sold, or made ready for sale.

 

As to the suggestion, +1 if feasible with sensible effort.

Edited July 16, 2021 by Ekcin

[Skatyna 432]

29 minutes ago, Ekcin said:

the promise was never worth more than a Darnok suggestion.

 

LOL, this gotta be the 'joke of the day' too 🤣

[Bakhita 515]

Moved to Wurm Unlimited Discussion

[Brash_Endeavors 4,735]

On 7/16/2021 at 4:00 PM, Ekcin said:

As long as there was no written contract or EULA paragraph stating that, the promise was never worth more than a Darnok suggestion  Rolf's word.  It was at best a statement of intent, and the intent changed when the company was sold, or made ready for sale.

 

 

The sale had nothing to do with it.  This started long before there was ever any word of a sale. WU updates started out coming out 2 weeks or so after the WO update, then 5-6 weeks, then 3 months later, then 6-9 months or even a full year later.  Then they would announce that by golly they were going to do better and start keeping WU updated more regular, but instead it actually got worse. Then they simply realized the "team" was simply too undisciplined and unfocused an organism to continue even pretending they could stick to a disciplined pattern or schedule, so they simply ditched it because no one on the team was really interested in doing it.  This is the same development team that took like six years to introduce sheep, even after they had the model  done and showcased to the community. They were excited but then almost immediately lost interest in sheep.  They are the George R.R. Martin of game developers, progressing by whim and impulsivity and crumbling if forced to stick to any kind of a rigid discipline. Sometimes creative people are like that, and can promise more than they can ever deliver, even if their hearts were in the right place. Sometimes it is the same artistic force that initially creates something different, that no one has done before. Things get done when and if one member of the team gets interested in it, and no one on the team thought it was "fun" to update the WU code update after update.

 

Who can keep those kind of promises, especially if it looks like they aren't going to get sued over it?  I even believe they initially felt dang bad about it, just as I am sure GRRM feels bad knowing in his heart of hearts that A Song of Ice and Fire will never ever ever EVER get finished. And I am pretty sure the reason Rolf sold the company was after so many years he just lost plumb interest in it, and who can blame his team if they kind of have done the same, especially since WU was no longer bringing in much regular income from sales. Zero benefit to keeping your word. And it was dragging the entire team down in morale.

 

I tend to think of it like a mountain climber who gets in trouble and panics and cuts loose his longtime climbing partners below him at the first sign of trouble, in hopes maybe it will keep all of them from falling to their deaths. Wurm was struggling even with just WO let alone the increasing weight of promises made to WU, even if as they said updating WU wouldn't be any extra work, and even if it was the initially hefty  WU sales that brought a huge one time influx of money that saved the company.  Yes it is kinda scummy, but hey what can you do. Certainly you would never want to make the mistake of trusting that person ever again, but on the other hand, just like the climber who cut the rope, Wurm survived.   And I guess if you care anything about Wurm's survival, that's what counts.  Enjoy the game now while you can, but remember that all video games are fleeting things, and many MMOs promised things they just couldn't sustain once they lost their initial interest.

 

And few of them ever lasted as long as Wurm.

 

As far as paid DLC for WU to brin g it back up to date with WO -- the mere thought makes me want to gag. It would take a company with ZERO remorse or integrity to charge for something they know they promised as part of the original agreement. But hey whatever, because "hey whatever" is kind of the company motto. I still love Wurm, and I don't blame the individual devs, because many of them care a lot, but this is not the type of company you would ever want to invest your money or your heart into. No company ever really is. But Wurm's business model in  particular is built on whims of the moment and not on discipline or promises.

 

It's asking something that is unfair to ask of them. That's simply not who they are. Make your peace and move on. 

 

But paid DLC is going to be ripping the scab off a wound that has nearly healed now.

Which means of course -- they are going to do it.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 17, 2021 by Brash_Endeavors

[Sklo:D 2,210]

Looking at the current state of Wurm Online, I am not sure if I would want such a DLC at least not for server side features.

Better graphics would be a DLC that could be worth buying, performance has become even worse since the new rendering but when there is not much going on in local it could be fancy.

[wipeout 1,355]

I have always been of the opinion that WU should have a once a year update cycle with the idea being "you want the latest features? come play on wo" as a idea to push people to wo but instead WU is just a stark warning to avoid anything wurm

If anything dlc shouldnt be "hey this was a free update in WO but you want it in WU you have to pay for it" but instead should be "Here is jackal/NFI/other themed server that ran on WO in the past by you buying this dlc you get access to using this rule set for your server" and that would be a good way of doing it.

Making dlc for WU would be tricky as most idea's would just be seen as cash grabs on a abandoned game so if anything they would have to do a update to catch up to where WO is at and then release specific things as dlc.

For example the monthly skins could be released as a once a year dlc after all it doesn't really impact gameplay and is purely cosmetic but some people would want it still and just like in WO you have to pay(although indirectly in WO) to get these skins so that would be a worth while dlc.

I for one would love to see a return to WU updates even if they happen once a year and are mostly a "hey we caught up to this years wurm changes plus here is this years skin releases dlc" and its like 10 bucks or something as combining them that way would bring back people wanting to play WU more then they already do

DLC should honestly be cosmetic only content if they go back to updating WU next to server rule sets like jackal and the likes things that would not take away from WU's experience when compared to wurm as a base game.
And any game changes should be server sided requirement eg the server owner needs to own the jackal dlc not the players to be able to use the jackal content BUT to get the jackal skins from the point system for example they should have the dlc still as those are cosmetic again.

It would be a bit of work but honestly i do think it would be worth it as it would not be an impossible amount of work.