Eyesgood

An Inquiry to the Dev Team

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I am fairly sure that they will get merged some time in the future. And I fail to see to which kind of example NFI should serve. From the point of view of the company and the team, the steam launch was a success, and the creation of NFI was a prerequisite for a "land rush". Contrary to doomsayers' predictions, SFI has not collapsed due to the new cluster. Still, a considerable number of new players is arriving, to my impression more on SFI than in the months before. What should be addressed under that respect, is the overly high churn rate.

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9 minutes ago, Ekcin said:

. And I fail to see to which kind of example NFI should serve

Whatever it turnsout to be since epic, xanadu and pristine/release are not enogh of example it looks like

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2 hours ago, Ekcin said:

It is fruitless to open spats. Though not being a mouthpiece of the team and the company anymore, I trust that Archaed (Retrograde) is sufficiently informed to give the answer he gave.

 

It just tells that the situation is observed, and possible future measures and events are being mulled. That means, no publishable time frame much less date at the moment, no "yes, certainly" nor "no, never".

 

The phrase "it impacts more than just a single players game" is interesting. It may be interpreted in several ways. One, the trivial one, is that a merge impacts virtually all active players on both clusters, and may cause reactions such as rage quits, so that the hippocratian principle "primum nil nocere" applies. It means that the devs and the company may conclude but haven't yet than the merge should be done, and will set a date after the decision.

 

It could also be that such a merge is seen as a chance to attract attention from a wider audience outside WO if handled accordingly, e.g. by a series of events finally ending in the merge. Such would have to be planned, tested (hopefully, erm 😎 ), then announced and implemented. If so, the steps towards a merge would be in planning and preparation, and any premature indiscretion about might rather harm than help.

Don't take what I say in any way as anything informed, I don't know anything behind the scenes. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Archaed said:

Tl;Dr 

Don't expect an answer because you're asking for definitive responses when that's just not possible

I don't think it's impossible, it just isn't wise.

 

Suppose the Devs announce today that a join won't be happening for at least a year.  Guaranteed they'll lose some players who ragequit on it.

 

Suppose they announce that it will be joined in a month.  Guranteed they'll lose some players (and premes) due to ragequits.

 

But if they stay silent...  The might lose one or two, but they tend to be "problem players" and even that is unlikely.  This is the optimal strategy to take as a developer, at least until one loss scenario is negligible, or some other gain is likely.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Archaed said:

Don't take what I say in any way as anything informed, I don't know anything behind the scenes.

Once more: "What I tell you three times is true.” — Lewis Carroll  😎

 

Edited by Ekcin

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18 hours ago, Finnn said:

Servers proved to be unable to handle many players.. there should be some major change to be able to handle a new wave of actual people and alts doing stuff all over the place, unless somebody thinks otherwise.. that nfi-ers had fun time with the server lag and other issues for month/s with steam release..

 

 

 

I live in the USA and only lagged the first 5 days of steam release, no idea why closer euros seem to lag

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14 hours ago, Etherdrifter said:

I don't think it's impossible, it just isn't wise.

 

Suppose the Devs announce today that a join won't be happening for at least a year.  Guaranteed they'll lose some players who ragequit on it.

 

Suppose they announce that it will be joined in a month.  Guranteed they'll lose some players (and premes) due to ragequits.

 

But if they stay silent...  The might lose one or two, but they tend to be "problem players" and even that is unlikely.  This is the optimal strategy to take as a developer, at least until one loss scenario is negligible, or some other gain is likely.

 

Hard to conclude if that's really the optimal scenario. If the player base starts dropping so low that people really start to feel like they're mostly alone, that there's almost never anybody on, then they'd risk a feedback loop of players leaving, making said feelings worse, thus more players leaving, etc. Combining the player bases of both clusters can prevent that and result in less players lost than announcing that they will be joined in a month or them staying silent.

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Bring back Jackal to NFI and SFI so they can play together.  Opens up new ways to play and new lands to explore without affecting anything between NFI and SFI servers.

 

Be cool to have Jackal server be PvE for 6 months then have it change to Jackal being reset and PvP next 6 months.  Keep resetting and changing them out every 6 months.  I think that would bring a great rotation to Wurm for everyone (NFI/SFI) and not going stale.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Ecrir said:

Hard to conclude if that's really the optimal scenario. If the player base starts dropping so low that people really start to feel like they're mostly alone, that there's almost never anybody on, then they'd risk a feedback loop of players leaving, making said feelings worse, thus more players leaving, etc. Combining the player bases of both clusters can prevent that and result in less players lost than announcing that they will be joined in a month or them staying silent.

In my eyes you misunderstood Etherdrifter. What he did say was that announcing or denying merge would not help Wurm, and he gave reasons for. Not more.

 

A merge, in my opinion, would neither "save" nor doom Wurm. Maybe, with some preparation, and well done propaganda/PR, it might attract some additional players though doubtfully even close to the rush of the steam launch. Maybe it would not even do that. Stabilizing and improving participation is not achieved nor prevented through a merge. I am in favor of it anyway.

 

Yet I agree that a Jackal revival, and opening Epic to NFI, would be good moves.

Edited by Ekcin
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So, I was troubleshooting a Java crash issue today and ended up creating a test toon on NFI.  I noticed there was mention of going to Epic from the portal instructions.  I take this to mean NFI toons CAN go to Epic.  Am I incorrect in that assumption?

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Yes but can you? I think from what I understood you first must travel to SFI then take a portal to Epic from there. NFI isn't linked to epic in the first place.

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16 minutes ago, Eyesgood said:

So, I was troubleshooting a Java crash issue today and ended up creating a test toon on NFI.  I noticed there was mention of going to Epic from the portal instructions.  I take this to mean NFI toons CAN go to Epic.  Am I incorrect in that assumption?

The instructions from the tutorial should say you indeed have to go to SFI first. Last I heard Epic is only connected to SFI.

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8 hours ago, Eyesgood said:

So, I was troubleshooting a Java crash issue today and ended up creating a test toon on NFI.  I noticed there was mention of going to Epic from the portal instructions.  I take this to mean NFI toons CAN go to Epic.  Am I incorrect in that assumption?

you are incorrect in that assumption. 

 

This would allow silver to cross NFI/SFI borders, which isn't the case. 

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Out of curiosity, I'd like to know what people think about a "half" merge, where you can transfer "max" skill between clusters. This would give the [3x] bonus to anything you grinded up to before without fully giving you all your skills on transfer.

 

For example, if you had 70 blacksmithing on NFI and transferred to SFI, you'd get the [3x] bonus up until you reached 70 blacksmithing on SFI again. If you then grinded it to 90 on SFI, you'd be able to go back to NFI where you had 70 and get the [3x] bonus up until 90.

 

Most arguments against the merge are from NFI players who do not want players who have abused windows of opportunity or grinded skills for years to come and decimate the newer economy of NFI. With a half merge, players would simply gain an accelerated "catch up" mechanic instead.

Most arguments for the merge simply want to see the playerbase unified. While this might not fully succeed in getting everyone on the same page, it's a step in the right direction and at least gives the option to transfer to the other server while retaining some of what they've accomplished so far.

 

For clarity, this is referring to only the skills transferring, not items. Maybe they should remain separate, maybe they should have some exceptions. I'm not sure that it's the optimal solution. However, merges don't have to be a binary solution where it's all or nothing. It might be time to consider a compromise that is acceptable to both sides of the argument.

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Eyesgood said:

So, I was troubleshooting a Java crash issue today and ended up creating a test toon on NFI.  I noticed there was mention of going to Epic from the portal instructions.  I take this to mean NFI toons CAN go to Epic.  Am I incorrect in that assumption?

 

The player-built portals in the Northern Freedom Isles that look like Epic Portals do on the Southern Freedom Isles all go to Defiance, the PvP server created for Norther Freedom Isles characters.

The NFI portal instructions really should be corrected if they say Epic to reflect they go to Defiance instead.

 

I believe on the NFI servers they're simply called 'PvP Portals' instead of 'Epic Portals'.

 

Edited by Tristanc

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15 hours ago, Sindusk said:

Out of curiosity, I'd like to know what people think about a "half" merge, where you can transfer "max" skill between clusters. This would give the [3x] bonus to anything you grinded up to before without fully giving you all your skills on transfer.   ..

Not wanting to be impolite, but such would be terrible. The implementation alone would cause instabilities which might make a considerable part of the population (especially newer ones on NFI) quit.

 

Further on, it would require creating double bank accounts which would break the login and accounting database (and shop) in its current architecture. And before implementation, there would be virtually no way to live test it. All their merits acknowledged I have troubles to trust that the development team could seamlessly handle such a transition which requires more than changing horse colours or animal husbandry which have not even been a role model of gracious implementation. If only for that reason, no please.

 

Such a half assed change with far reaching consequences, only to keep the carpetbaggers' cash cows inside the pen seems disproportional to me.

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1 hour ago, Ekcin said:

Not wanting to be impolite, but such would be terrible. The implementation alone would cause instabilities which might make a considerable part of the population (especially newer ones on NFI) quit.

 

Further on, it would require creating double bank accounts which would break the login and accounting database (and shop) in its current architecture. And before implementation, there would be virtually no way to live test it. All their merits acknowledged I have troubles to trust that the development team could seamlessly handle such a transition which requires more than changing horse colours or animal husbandry which have not even been a role model of gracious implementation. If only for that reason, no please.

 

Such a half assed change with far reaching consequences, only to keep the carpetbaggers' cash cows inside the pen seems disproportional to me.

 

It's not impolite, and you make good points. Do you feel that attempting any version of a half merge is out of the question? Or does a merge between the clusters need to be all or nothing? If it has to be all or nothing, why?

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I think the merge is simple.

 

Just allow people on NFI and SFI to sail to each other’s servers by boat. Allow the trade channel to display messages from NFI and SFI at the same time. Allow sending items from NFI and SFI through mailbox. Skills and items all transfer when crossing NFI servers to SFI servers and vice versa.

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Why must Wurm always be so divided?  For heaven's sake, why?????

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[22:12:57] 68 other players are online. You are on Harmony (466 totally in Wurm).    a saturday night.   doing nothing is not good.   these numbers will get lower and lower  

harmony in October had about 1200 deeds. i left the game until april to come back to 600 deeds left.  the stupid portal thats still at the starter deeds thats let players leave to cadance took alot of harmony player base. sure many can sail over, but when it was a portal jump away just to easy .

 

but the total wurm count bugs me.  there was what one sale in past year.   i'm cool with no silver sales. but prem time sales would encourage players to rejoin from a break in the game.  would it really hurt to reduce the prem time  fee. of those 466, we all know half is most likely alts. and out of that maybe half is priests that are prem.  I personaly do the 6-12 month thing as it s the best deal. but not everyone can afford to do that for 1-5 + characters . or even just one character . steam is often showcasing sales for game. why not offer it even at a low 15% for 1-2 month sub. 

 

please join us.

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add on to my opinion

market in the forums on both NFI and SFI seem slow to me  seems like only 10-15 players who sell goods, not much to choose from. and I'd say on both markets, they are good prices, i bought tons of stuff,  I feel they are very close in price. only a few things i see,  like NFI mortar 1k for 3s vs SFI 2.5s  , bricks  NFI 3s/1k vs SFI 2s/1k  . tools seem close to me. services closer now too.  I can see the traders on NFI rather not have SFI selling on NFI due to taking sales from them.  for tools, weapons,   but I find it very hard to find bulk item sales on NFI .  i've been watching for farm goods and building mats.  SFI was very easy to get either by boat or wagoneer NFI good luck finding wagoneer. as 80% of the NFI player base is on candnce only so the rest of us have to wait.  i could be wrong. but this is what i've noticed so far over last 2 months only.

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On 6/13/2021 at 5:01 AM, Nukacola said:

I think the merge is simple. ..

Sure it is or could be. But for ads, and winning over new and old players, it would be good to make a lot of noise in the preparation, and open with some stunning event, maybe some super rift or unique fight crashing the barrier between the two clusters, e.g. making two Islands, one in the Harmony, Melody, or Cadence realm, on in that of Xanadu, Independence, Pristine or whatever, as fighting grounds to crash open the barrier. Or something like that. .

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