DemonaNightshade

Valrei International: Feeding time!

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So my question is: Those of us who use carts: 1) Will we be able to at least keep the speeds we have now? 2) Will we actually get any improvements in speed/capacity? 3) If yes to at least 1 or 2, how much work is it going to be to get back to what we have today? I'm concerned this patch is exactly what I was afraid of, a nerf that basically is going to make people grind a bunch of AH to get back to where we are today. 

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Posted (edited)

I expect we will get nerfed when the patch hits, requiring us to spend 2-5 months breeding and skilling to recover from it, but then another few months to start getting the really good traits al lined up.  Things like this are good for getting mothballed alts resubbed and deeds expanded to handle the increased creature ratios that will follow.

 

Logically, if the updates aren't being done with the intent of seeing more revenue, then why pay devs to make them?  It is why we don't have main crafters that can also be priests and have access to all spells from all faiths.

Edited by Wurmhole
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I sense a lot of negativity here, so let's try something different...

 

Wow, this sounds amazing, this is really great work and possibly the biggest possible improvement to Wurm I can remember. I haven't played for a while, and stuff like this almost makes me want to come back!

 

Great work everyone on the team, I hope this works out. Some of the people complaining here probably also felt bad when ?-bags had graphics added.

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Well. Thanks for the sneak peek.

 

Does this mean all the 5 …

 

Unfortunately, it is looking like the top notch 5 speed horses we got now .. will all become junk horses.. in one update... is what I'm hearing. Sort of seems like to me, I may have a strong negative view on this update - for that reason.

 

I am still trying to figure the point system. Will re re re read that, see about it later.

 

Besides that, hope it works out to better Wurm.

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1 hour ago, Cecci said:

I wonder how many will feel like Calan, specially on the newer servers :(

Wonder how high AH Malena and her alts have?

Specially on the new cluster.

Now I know you're trying to understand, but i have to point out that malenas suggestion was PURELY about different horse builds, zero to do about traits, and was done WELL before wurm ever thought about going on steam. 

 

Insinuating that this is some underhanded move to gain a few coins is not fair to the work and effort she put in to her suggestion about giving more variety to horse builds. 

 

23 traits is a lot, and I'm getting the idea that genesis is going the way of the nahjo, because everyone has pointed out how easily it would allow gaming the system. 

 

Interesting developments nonetheless, kind of hoping more cow varieties or ambient sounds come with it 

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This update sounds amazing!  It will be great to work on a new breeding project for kine - there are only so many BattleCows and AttackSheep any village needs - lol
I am really hoping we get some more care-for slots though - It is already hard enough to maintain a good variety of breeding stock for all the horse colours.

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Was looking forward to this, til I realized that the nice 5-speed horse I have had since I could ride, will now soon be consigned to the glue factory and that I will likely have to pay 10 s for someone to get me some new stock, as AH has always felt like a job to me not a game.....

 

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Is it too much to ask that such a drastic change be up on the test server for long enough to test the generations out?

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51 minutes ago, Spacy said:

Was looking forward to this, til I realized that the nice 5-speed horse I have had since I could ride, will now soon be consigned to the glue factory and that I will likely have to pay 10 s for someone to get me some new stock, as AH has always felt like a job to me not a game.....

 

 

Wurm Online was originally meant to be a community game where people lived in villages, that worked together. If you think that new features should be designed around hermits want to go GOAT or JOAT on all skills, then they might as well just shut it down now.

 

If something feels like a job to you, then you want to do too many things yourself. Trade something you like to do, that doesn't feel like a job, for those new horses that you need.

 

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2 minutes ago, Wulfgar said:

If something feels like a job to you, then you want to do too many things yourself. Trade something you like to do, that doesn't feel like a job, for those new horses that you need.

But... That's what they said they're doing. Paying for someone else to do it, because they think that AH isn't fun, and therefore isn't worth doing themselves. You're suggesting that they do what they said they're going to do

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i wish i knew this was coming 3 days ago.  i just killed 24 horses what had 1-3 good traits but 1 bad.  also been working on my FO priest for 2 months now 60 faith to get genisis.  if that spell becomes useless. when what are FO priests for on pve?  healing at rifts sure. but if you never go to those?  

still love the idea of all this though, just bought some 5 speeds and 4 speeds, even 5 speed bisons. now have to find new ones to breed i guess or wait a few months and re buy

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Posted (edited)

I'm interested, but also worried.

If we have to go through all these extra traits and steps just to get new specialized horses that accomplish the same thing as current 5speeds, expect a lot of upset players; myself included.

However, if these new specialized horses allow us to surpass the speeds of a 5speed, as well as mix in various traits that could let us ride up steeper slopes for an example (give us budget wetas,) then I think this update could give the game and the market a good boost in variety and rare sought after mounts.

Edited by Synjor
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Posted (edited)

Taming gonna see some love outside of some new traits? A rework of the pet system would really be nice, even if it's just a small bunch of changes alongside this update. 

Also, if we're gonna have traits for domestication, new models that can be seen through breeding for cats and dogs would be greaat.

Edited by Jore
wording
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I really wish new things could come without nerfs.

 

Im not really sure either how playing in a village/community will help when they arent allowed access to genesis... did someone forget fo is white light and the game isnt only pve

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6 hours ago, DemonaNightshade said:

Better Breeding

 

As mentioned before, there is a rework to traits that will provide more benefits to careful breeding of your creatures. 23 new traits have been added, and traits now belong to particular categories with changes to how traits are passed on and calculated. Parents sharing a majority of traits in one particular category increases the chance for all traits in that category to be passed on. Speed trait parents are more likely to have speed trait offspring, draft parents will more likely produce draft traited offspring, and so on. The categories are as follows:

 

  • Speed - Giving ridden creatures a bonus to their riding speed. These no longer increase the speed of vehicles the animal may be hitched to.
  • Draft - Allowing creatures to carry more, and providing speed bonuses to vehicles with hitched animals. Heavier loads will slow vehicles down, but draft animals will increase speed of the vehicle they are hitched to. Bison will have a large natural bonus on top of draft traits.
  • Combat - These traits focus on combat bonuses, reduction in damage taken, and improving taming. Creatures with these traits can be easier to tame, and stay tame longer.
  • Resource - Effect output for things like wool and milk, as well as the quality and quantity of butchered products.
  • Miscellaneous - General traits with a range of effects like preventing creatures to roam even without a saddle, reducing food consumption, and reducing the chance to pack tiles.
  • Negative traits - ones which have effects that may reduce usefulness.

 

A few rare traits have been added which won’t be seen (or passed on) as easily/often as normal traits. These have wonderful effects like making aggressive creatures permanently passive (hello, house cats!), the ability to produce twins with identical traits when bred, and riding up slightly steeper slopes. Creatures may only have one rare trait.

 

Traits will no longer directly be capped by your Animal Husbandry level. Each trait is now worth a certain amount of points (from -10 to 20), and you may have points up to your Animal Husbandry level. This does make negative traits beneficial in some situations due to having a negative "cost", and leaving extra room for more or higher point traits. Rare traits will cost no points against your total. This point system will be explained further once the update is ready to be released.

 

Shaping Up Beautifully

 

These trait categories bring us to the addition of new shapes for our equine friends based on the traits they posses. This will bring more variety to the look of your herds and provide visual clues to the best use for each particular animal. Malena has made some wonderful images to show the changes, and provided a great explanation of the different shapes.

 

Hot blooded horse:

  • These will be your riding horses, with speed traits.

 

Warm blooded horse: 

  • This is the default that we have in the game now (an "all round" horse with no qualities that make it especially stand out more in one category)

 

Cold blooded horse: 

  • Stronger and able to work more efficiently. These will be your draft trait horses.

 

HorseShapeAnimation.gif

 

Below is Malena's original suggestion post explaining the thoughts behind these new shapes and images of the above body styles in each color of horse:

 

 

lmao

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Overall, this looks like it'll bring a lot of new flavor to Animal Husbandry and I'm excited to see how this'll effect the game. I do have some concerns and suggestions I would like to address and I hope the concerns are thought about and responded to before this change is made, so that we all can discuss and work together to make this system really work.

Concerns: 

  • How will the new feeding system effect the usage of hitching posts. Do they still serve a good purpose for at least one unique situation or are they eclipsed by these new troughs?
  • With this change I'm very worried that Genesis will still be extremely needed for any animal breeder and anyone who wants to pump out the best of the best would need to make a Fo Priest alt or be lucky to have a person around with one. Not only will it be needed but it'll actually cause problems for breeders, especially those on PvP. Having Fo priests running around on PvP removing people's bad traits would prevent them from breeding out more good traits. On PvE I imagine that would fall under griefing, but it's still a major concern. I think under this new system Genesis really needs to be relooked at and either removed or modified. I'll cover my thoughts on it in my suggestions.

Suggestions: 

  • I believe under this system their should be no way to remove negative traits. That way you choosing to get negative traits in order to get more positive traits has more meaning behind it and you can't just delete the negative traits later. I think by this logic Genesis needs to at least be reworked to become something like, a Fo priest casting Genesis on a pregnant animal will give it an increased chance at positive traits or potentially modifies it's point values in some form. That way players aren't REQUIRED to have a Fo priest in order to get the best animal they want, but instead a Fo priest becomes an assistance that might speed up the process of you getting to the best animal. As for Holy Crop the new Genesis could apply like a guaranteed slight bonus to positive traits. Could also have it so that if the Genesis fails and "shatters" that the point values are modified in a negative way. If Genesis is instead removed it does need to replaced with something meaningful, because it is one of Fo's best non-healing spells and is also a defining factor of Holy Crop.
  • If possible in the future I would love to see a tab system incorporated to the ingame Wurmpedia. I find whenever I'm searching the wiki for something I'll have at LEAST three tabs open, so I'm not too sure how much this change will effect my experience. I think at best it'll replace the need for the crafting recipe window.
  • I feel like Taming should be it's own category of traits or fall more under Misc. The only trait that I think would be good for taming and would fall under Combat would be reduced loyalty loss from taking damage. I don't think Combat should have anything to do with tames just generally losing loyalty at a slower rate, or giving you an easier time to tame. An easier time to tame for me would be a trait that makes something less aggressive which I don't think would fall under Combat as I assume all traits under their are going to based around aggression and using that aggression to be stronger. 
6 hours ago, DemonaNightshade said:

Combat - These traits focus on combat bonuses, reduction in damage taken, and improving taming. Creatures with these traits can be easier to tame, and stay tame longer.

 

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6 hours ago, Cecci said:

I feel the same! It is way too much to add 23 traits and some players think this will bring in an exodus to WU.

 

But as someone said in another topic, there is always something painful in those big update that they wont tell us and that will upset people.

I hope this is nothing like the fishing update. I miss the good old days of fishing while watching a movie :P haha

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AH has needed something for a long time so good job on working on it. The update from what i have read seems pretty good so far.

 

I am reading this correctly that my horses will no probably not get the same speeds pulling a cart as they do now?

 

 Please tell me the traits are at least tailored so we don't see a resource trait like milking on animals that cant be  or speed/draft traits on animals we cant ride/hitch.

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This all sounds so needlessly complex, hopefully the reality of it in action is not as bad as it looks. At the least, it's looking like breeding without using a Fo priest, as I currently do, will not be a valid option any more.

 

Current speed traited stock should not get any slower with these changes, if the traits they have remain, so should the benefits from them, and adding particular traits to them with ongoing breeding should have the possibility to make them faster. If it works to actually slow them down, this is not an update, it's a straight out nerf. Can we get an answer as to what the actual effect will be on current 5 speed trait horse stock?

 

Going to be so sad that speed traited horses are going to look like the hot blooded model, they look positively sickly in the preview :(

 

Can we get some transparency in this whole points system with a working list of what the traits are, their effect, and what their point value is? IE at 50 AH, is it even possible to breed a horse the same speed as you can now? Or will it require more just to get back to where we are now?

 

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I am so incredibly excited for this update! The pet lover in me is absolutely over the moon! And I cant wait to get into breeding for more specific uses! I am curious, though, if there are any plans to make more animals tamable? I have a champion spider that I've been keeping as a pet, but she's gonna die eventually because I can't care for her. It would be so amazing if spiders could be recognized as pets. Snakes too!

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Delone said:

Can we get an answer as to what the actual effect will be on current 5 speed trait horse stock?

 

Agreed.  Everyone who owns a 5-speed needs to know that their current horses will perform just as well as they do now, both for riding and driving.  If they will not, this needs to be stated up front.

Edited by Muse
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4 hours ago, Arronicus said:

But... That's what they said they're doing. Paying for someone else to do it, because they think that AH isn't fun, and therefore isn't worth doing themselves. You're suggesting that they do what they said they're going to do

 

He was whining about doing it, and he isn't doing it himself? Got it.

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8 hours ago, Hoodoo said:

Is it too late to get a bigger horse name pool too? Part of the fun is seeing what names horses are born with.

 

This please. 

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