Make it easier to reduce tool or item quality.

[Ogare 74]

Lower ql tools are useful for optimal skill training. But making these lower quality tools can be convoluted.

 

It shouldn't be so weird or hard to reduce the ql of a tool or item.

[eldarian 166]

if you want a 1 ql tool then just make one, why waste the materials it took to imp a tool up in quality in the first place. I see no reason to make it easier to lower ql of an item when so many people are trying to keep it as high quality as possible for faster actions and better quality material gathered. Just make a new tool. its not much easier then that.

[Davih 1,340]

4 minutes ago, eldarian said:

 I see no reason to make it easier to lower ql of an item

There are.

example:

I have a rare pickaxe, i want to cast a c105+ on it an make it a durable 10ql skiller (5X enchant decay reduction on rares, 10x on supreme)

But i cannot cast coc on a rare 10ql pickaxe, as it would very likely shatter.

I bring it to 60-90QL to cast it without shattering it

There is no way to bring it back to low ql. we were once able to mend on 0.0001 damage and lose 2ql for each cast, was useful for situations like this one.

For wood items, you can burn them down (even though it's dangerous), for metal items there is just no way.

So yeah, +1, having  a way, again, wouldn't be bad.

[Ogare 74]

11 minutes ago, eldarian said:

if you want a 1 ql tool then just make one

Please give detailed instructions on how to get 1ql materials.

[eldarian 166]

23 minutes ago, Ogare said:

Please give detailed instructions on how to get 1ql materials.

um make an alt, and just craft no smithing skill means creation will be like 1ql

 

you can also fail on gathering materials which results with the ql of the material to 1 sometimes, this happens and you should save those mats instead of throwing them away. creation mats are good to have on hand at all times.

Edited March 3, 2021 by eldarian

[eldarian 166]

16 minutes ago, Davih said:

There are.

example:

I have a rare pickaxe, i want to cast a c105+ on it an make it a durable 10ql skiller (5X enchant decay reduction on rares, 10x on supreme)

But i cannot cast coc on a rare 10ql pickaxe, as it would very likely shatter.

I bring it to 60-90QL to cast it without shattering it

There is no way to bring it back to low ql. we were once able to mend on 0.0001 damage and lose 2ql for each cast, was useful for situations like this one.

For wood items, you can burn them down (even though it's dangerous), for metal items there is just no way.

So yeah, +1, having  a way, again, wouldn't be bad.

first i dont understand why you would make a skiller tool rare, it being rare decreases the skill gain while using it because it makes the action easier.

 

Tools that are used to gather resources - for example shovel or pickaxe, get a slightly faster timer (0.1 seconds subtracted per rarity level) and provides a higher quality resource upon finishing the action. How much higher is determined by a multitude of factors:

 

so therefore it defeats the purpose of using it to power skill. and would be better used as a high ql gathering tool or imping tool.

[Oblivionnreaver 5,174]

sunder?

 

if you cast on a tool head then craft it with a 1 skill alt it'll always come out 1ql too

Edited March 3, 2021 by Oblivionnreaver

[eldarian 166]

now there is a way to drasticly lower the quality of an item, put them inside a trash heap and watch the ticks of dmg, pull item out after 1 hour and repair it if u leave it in to long then it will destroy the item for good

 

also the spell sunder like oblivion said

 

https://www.wurmpedia.com/index.php/Sunder

 

Edited March 3, 2021 by eldarian

[platinumteef 2,198]

1 minute ago, eldarian said:

first i dont understand why you would make a skiller tool rare, it being rare decreases the skill gain while using it because it makes the action easier.

 

Tools that are used to gather resources - for example shovel or pickaxe, get a slightly faster timer (0.1 seconds subtracted per rarity level) and provides a higher quality resource upon finishing the action. How much higher is determined by a multitude of factors:

 

so therefore it defeats the purpose of using it to power skill. and would be better used as a high ql gathering tool or imping tool.

 

the quality bonus is applied after the skill check so it doesnt affect skill gains

the slightly faster timer means you are going to have to do like 3 extra actions per 1 hour of skilling. 1 hour of skilling is 1 hour of skilling even if it subtracts .1 per rarity per action

the rarity bonus means you are going to highly preserve the enchant power

 

 

[Wurmhole 3,650]

don't forget lava tiles.  It is slow, but useful for lowering metal tools QL.

[Ogare 74]

There are ways to lower ql. It's just they are all convoluted. Using the right ql tool or item is essential to getting optimal skill gain. It seem strange that such an important mechanic hasn't been given more attention. All the ways we lower ql are essentially meta-gamming hacks.

 

I'd go as far as to say Wurm should give us an option to automatically use the optimum lower tool ql as needed to maximize skill gain. The reduce value would just be for the skill gain roll. Although, it can't raise ql since game balance depends so much on progressing skill to make higher ql stuff.

[Ekcin 2,401]

While sunder is tedious indeed, lava is arguably the best way to lower ql. It needs just bit patience, and timing, but is very exact. Never use trash heaps. To my knowledge items take dmg in the first hour, the next tick destructs. Maybe sunder could bit more flexible.

 

As to lava: Damage on items on the tile is 1/15 minutes, resulting in 96 dmg in 24 hours. If repaired by a low skilled character, ql reduction will be significant. Does someone know the formula?

Edited March 3, 2021 by Ekcin
addendum

[Calan 86]

I think the examples of alternatives all reinforce OPs suggestion to be able to more easily lower an item’s quality. I don’t think a skilled crafter should need to risk loosing an item fully or use alt characters to lower an items quality.
 

And I don’t mean the solution should be quick. 
 

How about adding a ‘worsen’ equivalent to repair improve. Success lowers QL, failure damages. Where a raw mat is needed like log or ore, it needs to be lower quality than the item is currently.

 

So not quick, but still a controlled method that can be done by the character who created the item in the first place.

Edited March 4, 2021 by Calan

[TheTrickster 2,279]

wts starter QL tools - I can practically guarantee nothing over 10ql

wts tool dequal services  - pay me to use your high ql tool with my low skills and many fails

 

Wow, I never thought my arrested development was marketable!

 

😉

[Finnn 3,298]

+1

[Badvoc 204]

20 minutes ago, Finnn said:

+1

As retro once said ...... "Provide constructive comments, +1's and -1's aren't useful, we overlook and ignore them anyways, post why you like or dislike something."

 

Anyway back on topic,

 

Maybe once you hit 50 plus in a skill you can choose the ql you want to craft ( within reason and skill / Mats cap ), its great there's work arounds but giving the crafter the ability to choose the level he wants to make a tool could be helpful?

 

I don't grind or worry about skill gain, so have zero idea if the above idea would be a good or bad idea. Just throwing it out there.

[Finnn 3,298]

1 hour ago, Badvoc said:

As retro once said ...... "Provide constructive comments, +1's and -1's aren't useful, we overlook and ignore them anyways, post why you like or dislike something."

And several people have the opinion that that's nonsense "system" .. and "it' needs dev/staff feedback on suggestions, but that RARELY happens, +1 means that the OP have +1 more vote, another person thinks the same or approves the suggestion.

 

When suggestions start having updates what is considered/worked on/planned/in-under-maybeFor-etc-discussion by dev or other team reviewing ideas, believe me - things are going to get better, and players will be more involved to discuss more details.

There's suggestion to fix the imaginary afk "system", where there's no dev/staff input to suggestions - guess what, there's no reply to that one either.

Current system looks like it's working like this, with customers/players instead of employees:

That's until 6-18 months later you see it maybe implemented with no words of it being considered/planned/worked or implemented, until the post that it's coming in the game next month. *surprise*

It's not ideal 😕