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Smwoodburn

Bandit Camps! PVE stuffs

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We need more PVE stuffs like Bandit camps rather than just event bosses like dragons and rifts we need small scale every day or other day spawns randomly across the map make wurm more interactive! PLEASE!? :) was talking with a few other people and friends of mine and Gavias mentioned the Bandit camp thing to me and i thought what the heck thats a great idea! :) 

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I'd like to expand this idea with the Archeology mechanic.


Say a big deed disbands and the player/mayors quit. 

 

After a while say a week , after players finish scavenging the deed a Bandit Tower (similar to a spawner) will appear. 

 

The bandits will be proportionate to the initial deed size. Without looking at the code I'm guessing archeology works based on the idea of verifying tiles that were deeded at one point .

 

So now you got a bunch of bandits that are as strong as the deed itself was large and/or rich. 

 

Smaller disbanded deeds will attract less bandits and looters. Larger ones higher volumes of bandits. 

 

After bandits are defeated you can "Rummage around" in the bandit tower to see what the bandits looted over time. After it's looted, the tower dissapears. 

 

Balancing : 

1. Bandit towers become stronger over time. If say bandits initially spawn with 40 Fight Skill, the longer they're alive the stronger they get. 50 fs, 60 FS, etc. This is to mirror the idea of them getting better gear over time.

2. As bandit towers become stronger so does the potential loot they drop becomes more interesting. 

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If you want a combat challenge, PvP is really where its at. We have these on PvP and they're called battle camps. The guards aren't really a problem, but the players certainly are.

 

We already have rift camps (small rifts with 10 or so rift mobs), though they are quite rare. I've stumbled upon them several times running through the forests of the more lower-pop servers looking for traitor NPCs.

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Yesss Elentari I love that idea! And John I understand that but pvp servers are dying because nobody wants to go lose everything let alone fight each other. Most players are over oriented and with the drop of NFI Sfi population have dwindled drastically too. So if y’all are wanting to attract more people give the people more of what they want “follow the crowd” so to speak. I understand trying to get more attention for pvp but really there’s too much to lose and nothing as valuable to gain. We’re all trapped on our deeds for the most part and nobody really needs anything out in the wild the game needs more flair and I think as do a lot of people that adding something for over like this would get people more actively participating in the game. It’s just a thought. All I’m saying is don’t shoot down the idea before it’s had a chance to get out there because maybe someone doesn’t want to do it just Think about it:) and yes rifts are thing but they’re scheduled, there’s no spontaneity at all and you have to do it with many other players, this allows groups of friends anywhere to go and have fun anytime they want too

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4 minutes ago, Smwoodburn said:

 rifts are thing but they’re scheduled, there’s no spontaneity at all and you have to do it with many other players, this allows groups of friends anywhere to go and have fun anytime they want too


Rift scout camps are not the same as the regular rifts. They're not scheduled, and can appear pretty much everywhere on the map, within a few parameters. What I'm trying to say is that there already exists something along the lines of what you're looking for, except that it's really hard to come by. Like for most things in Wurm combat, you're going to have to travel for a bit to bump into it.

 

19 minutes ago, Smwoodburn said:

And John I understand that but pvp servers are dying because nobody wants to go lose everything let alone fight each other. Most players are over oriented and with the drop of NFI Sfi population have dwindled drastically too. So if y’all are wanting to attract more people give the people more of what they want “follow the crowd” so to speak. I understand trying to get more attention for pvp but really there’s too much to lose and nothing as valuable to gain. 


Without side-tracking too far from your suggestion, than I already have: If you want a spontaneous combat-related adventure, we already have the PvP servers.

 

There are rare/supreme treasure chests spread across the wilderness and a few other nice tids-bits. They are there to encourage people to roam and run into other players looking to kill them. I don't think it would work well on a PvE server, since the inherent danger of leaving your deed isn't as strong there. A similar mechanic with the rare chests spawning lots of mobs to "defend the chest" after you lockpick it could be an interesting idea, implemented on a PvE server, that is based off things already coded for PvP. In my opinion though, no amount of NPCs can pose a challenge to an experienced player with a strong toon. A "small group of friends" can kill a unique or clear out an entire rift - again, something you see all the time on the lower pop servers such as Serenity or Chaos.

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i live the idea. and bandits being weaker to slightly better than guard would make sense, also a guard tower in the area would either cancel a bandit camp spawing or they would attack each others, first to lose all fighters is destroyed. this could add a level of maintenance to guard towers if you dont want the area to be crawling with bandits.

having some sort of event that isnt end game only like the rifts or uniques would be nice for new and medium players, not to mention some high ranking ones might enjoy the challenge of a battling a small army alone ;) . plus making sure most of the loot wouldnt be that great for an experienced player would mean not all would actively hunt and hoard them, but be more open to invite newbies get their fighting feets. even without great rewards most would probably lend a hand to any new person asking for help just for the fun of it(given reasonable travel time and distances).

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17 minutes ago, Ekib said:

i live the idea. and bandits being weaker to slightly better than guard would make sense, also a guard tower in the area would either cancel a bandit camp spawing or they would attack each others, first to lose all fighters is destroyed. this could add a level of maintenance to guard towers if you dont want the area to be crawling with bandits.

having some sort of event that isnt end game only like the rifts or uniques would be nice for new and medium players, not to mention some high ranking ones might enjoy the challenge of a battling a small army alone ;) . plus making sure most of the loot wouldnt be that great for an experienced player would mean not all would actively hunt and hoard them, but be more open to invite newbies get their fighting feets. even without great rewards most would probably lend a hand to any new person asking for help just for the fun of it(given reasonable travel time and distances).

 

Man this is yet another great add on to the idea!!!! and wonderful explanation for the use of these to lower level or newbie players and great reason for new people to join the game meaning more client base for the game! Make it one of the Hooks for new players to really get into it so they want to stick around and get to the point they can join the rifts and unique events!

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+1

It sounds fun to me!

Taking Elentari's suggestion into thought, With as many deeds are dissolved weekly it could really add to the pve server. 

 

13 hours ago, John said:


Rift scout camps are not the same as the regular rifts. They're not scheduled, and can appear pretty much everywhere on the map, within a few parameters. What I'm trying to say is that there already exists something along the lines of what you're looking for, except that it's really hard to come by. Like for most things in Wurm combat, you're going to have to travel for a bit to bump into it.

 

 Is this already a thing on PVE, or is this on PVP?

 

13 hours ago, John said:

A similar mechanic with the rare chests spawning lots of mobs to "defend the chest" after you lockpick it could be an interesting idea, implemented on a PvE server, that is based off things already coded for PvP. 

This would be good too. If it's not a challenge for older players. Beef it up a bit.. If we're considering the dead deed spawner, some of those could be made to be really tough if they deed was big enough.

 

Overall PVE servers do need more going on in the way of just more stuff to do.

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Also, besides all this stuff could add a thing where maybe even collect bones off the bandits by butchering them and make bone statues out of them of different types of bandits, this would perk for Libila followers but also cause neg alignment for everyone due to the humanoid nature of bandits. This would lead to yet more interaction and cause people to either remain indifferent to the neg score ore go and try to get it back up clearing mobs using guards and burying them server cleanup (community service) 

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21 hours ago, elentari said:

I'd like to expand this idea with the Archeology mechanic.


Say a big deed disbands and the player/mayors quit. 

 

After a while say a week , after players finish scavenging the deed a Bandit Tower (similar to a spawner) will appear. 

 

The bandits will be proportionate to the initial deed size. Without looking at the code I'm guessing archeology works based on the idea of verifying tiles that were deeded at one point .

 

So now you got a bunch of bandits that are as strong as the deed itself was large and/or rich. 

 

Smaller disbanded deeds will attract less bandits and looters. Larger ones higher volumes of bandits. 

 

After bandits are defeated you can "Rummage around" in the bandit tower to see what the bandits looted over time. After it's looted, the tower dissapears. 

 

Balancing : 

1. Bandit towers become stronger over time. If say bandits initially spawn with 40 Fight Skill, the longer they're alive the stronger they get. 50 fs, 60 FS, etc. This is to mirror the idea of them getting better gear over time.

2. As bandit towers become stronger so does the potential loot they drop becomes more interesting. 

 

2 hours ago, Ekib said:

i live the idea. and bandits being weaker to slightly better than guard would make sense, also a guard tower in the area would either cancel a bandit camp spawing or they would attack each others, first to lose all fighters is destroyed. this could add a level of maintenance to guard towers if you dont want the area to be crawling with bandits.

having some sort of event that isnt end game only like the rifts or uniques would be nice for new and medium players, not to mention some high ranking ones might enjoy the challenge of a battling a small army alone ;) . plus making sure most of the loot wouldnt be that great for an experienced player would mean not all would actively hunt and hoard them, but be more open to invite newbies get their fighting feets. even without great rewards most would probably lend a hand to any new person asking for help just for the fun of it(given reasonable travel time and distances).

+1 I could go for this. I really like the idea of tying the bandits in with the abandoned deeds as archeology is getting a bit stale. And the feuding towers would give me reason to want guard towers again. I've just been letting them rot since they're a bit useless right now.

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what if someone wants to deed that spot, would be have to wait until the bandit camp was gone?

 

Not everyone wants to "fight" on the PvE servers, some people just enjoy the building aspect, so if a deed that's right up next door to a person who doesn't want a bandit camp, what will be in place to stop the bandits causing havoc on that player?

 

Who gets to loot the tower, everyone? One person? or will we need to make a system like we have with unique hunting where a group claims the tower?

 

whats to stop someone "walling" a tower off using a donut house, waiting until the best loot as been achieved and then go tackle the tower with a couple of friends?

 

At first glance it seems a great idea but a lot of questions would need to be answered before it could be a good or bad idea.

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1 hour ago, Badvoc said:

what if someone wants to deed that spot, would be have to wait until the bandit camp was gone?

 

Clear the camp. Ask for help. There are many 90 Fight skill accounts on Freedom.

1 hour ago, Badvoc said:

Not everyone wants to "fight" on the PvE servers, some people just enjoy the building aspect, so if a deed that's right up next door to a person who doesn't want a bandit camp, what will be in place to stop the bandits causing havoc on that player?

 

Who gets to loot the tower, everyone? One person? or will we need to make a system like we have with unique hunting where a group claims the tower?

 

whats to stop someone "walling" a tower off using a donut house, waiting until the best loot as been achieved and then go tackle the tower with a couple of friends?

 

At first glance it seems a great idea but a lot of questions would need to be answered before it could be a good or bad idea.

 

Mark the formerly deeded area similar to how a rift area works. "There is an active rift here so you cannot build/place minedoor, etc." No walling off. No deeding former area until it's cleared of bandits.

 

"This area seems to be under the dominion of bandits and looters. Building here is not possible at this time."

 

Suggested mechanics to clearing a tower :

 

1. Solo  = Straightforward, kill bandits then initiate action to "rummage through tower" = 1 min timer. Random loot spawns proportionally to the #of bandits cleared & former deed area.

 

2. Group = tag system, similar to rift mechanics. Say 10 bandits spawn. Those that help, aka target mob and hit at least once when it dies = get points from bandit kills. THose that heal also give points. Those that do damage via other means such as spells/archery should also be elligible for points. Rummage through tower. Loot is given proportionally to points earned.

 

Any drama can can unfold out of this system will mostly rely on players unwilling to talk to each other. Best you can do as a game dev is make a system as fair as possible for anyone.

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8 hours ago, Dathius said:

Is this already a thing on PVE, or is this on PVP?

Rift scout camps exist on all servers. There is a link to the Wurmpedia article regarding rifts, and rift scout camps specifically, in my original reply. You get rift points and you can harvest the nearby rift materials.

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3 hours ago, Badvoc said:

Who gets to loot the tower, everyone? One person? or will we need to make a system like we have with unique hunting where a group claims the tower?

 

whats to stop someone "walling" a tower off using a donut house, waiting until the best loot as been achieved and then go tackle the tower with a couple of friends?

 

At first glance it seems a great idea but a lot of questions would need to be answered before it could be a good or bad idea.

Like elentari said but could also do a thing where the bandit camps have a perimeter that disallows builing in a certain area as well but the zone would work best i think as its less work to do on the devs

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On 2/14/2021 at 11:52 AM, John said:

If you want a combat challenge, PvP is really where its at. 


I'm sorry, but no, this is your opinion.
I, for one, find that PvP is horrible and is not even remotely a combat challenge, but even if it was, this kind of reasoning would imply that we can't have things on PvE because we are supposed to appreciate PvP more and therefore don't deserve to have stuff like that on PvE?

Besides that, the general idea seems interesting, and whatever works as an alternative way to obtain even small unique-grade rewards in any way besides having to pen/drama/slay the uniques, is a huge +1 from me.

 

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rewards shouldnt be very high to avoid a few farming the system and selling the reward at overpriced rates.... like archeology. a few ok rewards but mostly it's small stuff that's only good if you are pretty new to the game. nothing over an impalong range of ql and casting for example.

 

the way i see it, and using (mostly?) already existing mechanics. is like a chest/temp item spawning 2-3 small 'waves' of bandits (5 or 10 max per wave. remember: a good guardtower should be able to handle it remember) and last wave got a bandit boss. droping the key for the chest ( that can either dissapear or be kept as decoration back home) and in that chest would be a few ressources/tools/weapons/armors/decorations. no moonmetals, possibly some low chance of alloys but super low. casts and runes would be rare and no cast above 50 or 70.

chest should have a max of 10 items (on the highest rewards. most would get 1-3). if the camp spawns rare, make it like a rare coalpile: some items might be but not all. and very low chance too. 1-2 items max(if any), not 10.

bandit boss could be riding a horse/bull/cow/bison/pig with 2-3 random traits/small gear. either kill it to make the fight easier or bear with it and get a new ride home! this might help some struggling new guy with a faster ride and not destroy the breeders livelyhood too ;)

 

alternatively the 'camp' could be a cart with animal. like a mix of small cart and animal pulling it, leading the animal once camp's cleared (cart gets unlocked from tile when bandits are cleared, like rift ressources when rift's done)

they might be bandit points like rift points the kindom awards defenders of the lands, with a few rewards, like small bulk of 10 ql 50 materials as a reward. would help anyone not having easy access to a ressource in small quantity without damaging the bulk market. since you'd need to clear a few camps to get enough points for a reward anyway.

 

the main idea i have would be to hint at some of the 'endgame' goods and events most of us are used to enjoy but that many new players have little to no clue about. i get frustrated when alliance members ask about rifts and i have to tell them not to go as they would likely not survive it and its not very worth it for them because forget 70 fighting some are still struggling with a spider, but taking them to a bandit camp would surely work! and its one things to be told a horse with traits will speed up your cart or good quality tool helps work faster. its an other to experience it: i had some experienced allies (people with a good deed and some months or years in their belts) not realise how a good weapon and armor made a difference until i geared them up in ql 70s... 

it's only my opinion but the way i see it, it might help keep some mid ground players from quitting after they passed the struggle of survival, by giving hints of some of the fun the game can hold, and work as a way to test some gear/enchats ect without putting too much time or money into getting them. (who'd want to buy a casted weapon to find out the cast or weapon doesnt suit their style after a few minutes?)

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Well, if you think that a single "slaying" event can hand out 200+ bloods at once, giving a chance to the "final reward" to drop a single blood , for a "spawn" that should occurr quite rarely and not be all over the place, could sound reasonable.

I wouldn't put too many kind of rewards that can already be obtained otherwise and are at risk of creating inflation of supply, like rares or moonmetals or sleep powders, since there are already so many ways of getting them. Ofc the blood/hide/scale(small amount) should be the top tier and not even garaunteed reward, other things could be metallic liquids, very small chances for rare+ bones(that at least don't create a specific-inflation) and lower tier, more common rewards could be basically anything, rare coins, alloys, rift resources... stuff like that.

IF the camps are very common, then you really just need to turn down the chance to obtain the good items.

A way to avoid "just a few people farming" could easily be to make them not really hard to find and have pretty low rates on good rewards, but that would mean a considerable change to the game, so i'm not sure...

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On 2/14/2021 at 11:52 AM, John said:

If you want a combat challenge, PvP is really where its at. We have these on PvP and they're called battle camps. The guards aren't really a problem, but the players certainly are.

 

We already have rift camps (small rifts with 10 or so rift mobs), though they are quite rare. I've stumbled upon them several times running through the forests of the more lower-pop servers looking for traitor NPCs.

I don't think you realise how this sounds to me and probably others who would appreciate a more fullfilling pve combat. It sounds like: Go play a different game.

That being said, I do like the bandit idea. I know there are rift camps (supposedly) but Ive never seen one, despite hunting quite often.

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davih all the stuff you mentioned is high value and rather endgame. was thinking none of that and more along the lines of the 'best' gear behing a ql 70 weapon with a cast of 50-70 power MAX. 2 casts if you are extremely lucky. or a nice piece of armor or tool. some basic ressources not easy to obtain but not worth much, like a dozen lumps of ql 50 gold. hard to get without a vein but aside not that valuable, or some logs in a 'rare' woodtype like bushwood. basicly  something that can help a new and struggling or decent but still growing player but not create a need for high lvl people to hoard them like some unique hunts get made private...

i think total reward for a high lvl bandit camp shouldnt reach 1-2 silver worth in player market. it shouldnt be something you do for the coins... and if you want to make a living off it...see how archealogy is...you need to dig a lot to get a statue rebuilt...

the idea to get some sleeping bonus ( like mission give) and maybe some karma from the king for helping removing bandits might work out nice. god mission dont pay a lot but people still do them.

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Man! all fantastic ideas and ways of putting everything into perspective i think this would get people more hyped up about the game, draw more attention and definately get the little guys more experience and know how about many different things! also again we are looking to accomodate everyone but mainly towards low and midlevel people as high level mainly do the rifts and slayings and get really good stuff! now this is coming from a mid level-high level player (myself) of 9 years playing off and on. I have some fighting excperience but not much and really enjoy the idea of taking low and mid levels out to show them the ropes. 

 

Also, as a side note, take into consideration the market again. The more attention and user friendly the game is and appealing, and the more you follow the crowd the MORE MONEY owners make because more people join get excited want to participate more and stay longer get prem deed up and participate more. which leads to progressive playing and more participation in events. Then you will have more people to fill up those new Northern servers you guys brought haha do it there too why not? 

 

Last side note for now, you are concerned with the death of pvp and i understand that. but first what is the ratio of pvp to pve servers? i was on pvp earlier today with my fighter and there were around 10-15 players on out of over 600 players in wurm. what are the statistics of that you might ask. IF that is average, then that puts you at a 1 PVPer per 40 PVEer's so you might be trying to cater to the wrong crowd in my personal opinion with all due respect. Likewise, that pve amount is usually a lot greater than 600 ive seen it hovering around 1300 at times. So in conclusion, drawing more people in with pve stuff like everything discussed above= more attention for the game= more new players=more money in your pockets= more people to think "hey i wanna give pvp a try maybe get some really good stuff now that i know how to fight a bit better and my skill level is higher etc." = now you have reached your "pvp is where its at" reality goal you so desired.

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I love the idea of more ways to encourage players to move off their deed, but I would personally like to see more non-combat motivations. We've got quite a lot of combat related things already and I would love to see some focus on something like blacksmithing as a quick thought. Where a player needs to leave their deed and improve some ancient anvil out in the world that when doing so provides them with a rare anvil or it completes a mission for a god and you get some karma and sleep bonus. It'd probably involve a lot more, but that was just a quick rough idea. However, I do like the idea of frequent camps that can be raided for loot just wish there was more to leaving your deed than combat.

EDIT: Treasure maps is another idea!

Edited by Zuelatak
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Yes Zue I agree with you on that! I’ve been making suggestions over time and it’s a hassle trying to get new stuff going. Suggestions like yours and even more stone stuffs like being able to use slate marble and sandstone for most of the same stuff you can rock like statues or marble roof or forges and other things. But 1 step and a time my friend:)

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[09:26:29] 8 other players are online. You are on Chaos (666 totally in Wurm). seee and for chaos being a 16x16 this is very disproportionate. pve players far outweigh pvpers

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NICE!, my idea was also using the games guard towers to place similar setups that spawn throughout the land. would be like guard tower (Bandit camps) , but Wurm citizens would be the enemies instead to them. You could put crafting buffs/ingredients/affinity foods as treasure or loot on them. They would be as tough as trolls or even troll encampments if you want to make it more fluidic with the game. Area would be 20 tiles with the guard tower system, in play. Another idea is abandoned guard towers that are below 30 ql or more than 50% dmg can spawn into bandit/ troll infestations that after they are cleared must be repaired in order to get rid of the negative element. Just some ideas... that's what keeps this game going even the creators acknowledge that updates and new themes help and are implemented. I love this game. Yes, they do have a pvp server but I don't like the idea of losing an affinity or affinities and my items that I earned having invested my money w/ rl cash(to be able to play this game effectively), so I wont be play pvp (and against decade old vets), change that and I will consider it , oh and the skill losses too(would hate to lose some super high status gains that took forever to get to). 

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On 2/15/2021 at 6:00 AM, Badvoc said:

what if someone wants to deed that spot, would be have to wait until the bandit camp was gone?

 

Not everyone wants to "fight" on the PvE servers, some people just enjoy the building aspect, so if a deed that's right up next door to a person who doesn't want a bandit camp, what will be in place to stop the bandits causing havoc on that player?

 

Who gets to loot the tower, everyone? One person? or will we need to make a system like we have with unique hunting where a group claims the tower?

 

whats to stop someone "walling" a tower off using a donut house, waiting until the best loot as been achieved and then go tackle the tower with a couple of friends?

 

At first glance it seems a great idea but a lot of questions would need to be answered before it could be a good or bad idea.

In theory you wouldn’t be able to deed that spot right away.. as the deed that popped will have buildings in the way. . But not always, and this is a legitimate concern I suppose. I myself wouldn’t care and would argue it would be like wanting to deed a spot with a troll spawn, or even unluckily a unique.

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