Northern Isles feedback

[Ekcin 2,406]

24 minutes ago, Sindusk said:

 

14 slayings between NFI and Defiance with a total of 895 total slayers meaning there is 895 bloods out there which are still completely unable to be used. Still pending after 3 months?

 

Hmm, no source crystals in NFI mines? Should be, indeed. But, <900 bloods are hardly overwhelming. I know more than one player with >100 bloods in their lmc, some maybe more than 200. It did not break the game on SFI so far, and I loathe and fear the coming "balancing" which may destroy much fun. As to rifts on NFI, yes please. From all I heard the northern community is well able to handle rifts. And it is true that lack of rifts botches journal progress.

 

But one word to the complaints:

 

I find it always repulsive, hypocritic and outright dishonest when players who often played the game two, three, even four times longer than me, pretend to speak on behalf of the new players and pretend to know about their desires and needs. In the last months, I got in contact with a number of new players, be it by meeting them on our servers, at impalongs, or talking with them by PM, or watching one of the numerous new Wurmians' streams and talking to them. Their needs and troubles largely resemble those I experienced in the first or first two of my now three Wurm years, and want for new content, or being closely and timely informed about development plans never played a significant role. That is the hobby not even of veterans in general, but a vociferous forum crowd. That is ok for me (as I am one of them) as someone has  to speak with GM, communication operative ("PR guy" as some contemptously name a player they know for a decade), and developers. And I acknowledge that some, like Sindusk, indeed have insight of development processes and their proposals and advices have weight.

 

But I fail to see that any of the issues raised (other than the king's coffers things which seem to be resolved) touches the interests of a newly beginning Wurm player. That may not apply to the relatively small albeit certainly important PvP community where hierarchy and subordination under the veterans is natural, and the interests of the veterans are prevailing. In PvE, a beginning player is a souvereign on his own (or a souvereign group of friends on their own settlement). Their main worries are learning the ropes, master the adventures where a bear is an issue rather than a dragon, where roads and canals have to be built, skills to be developped.

 

I think I am nothing less than a casual player, and had an insane playtime to lifetime ratio during my first two years in Wurm. Anyway, whether there were source springs or fountains did not touch me at all other than people I respected complained that they were all locked up in houses. I always was and am aware that there are years ahead to experience all the content existing. Insofar my primary desires tend towards stability, removal of nasty bugs, and improvements of existing mechanics and features. Personally I would swap all the ground breaking changes looming (I am rather anxious than happy about) against, for example, the possibility of lowering ceilings by concrete, leveling borders in mines, and a case study on test to change the data type for mine ceilings to unsigned char or even unsigned 16bit allowing for cave heights of 255, or 512 or so. And also for work to improve performance, if possible by a multi threaded process chain architecture on the servers to finally defeating the lag monster. And for those, prospectively complex works with many possible drawbacks and disappointments, it needs no "transparency" towards a forum crowd who widely is neither able nor willing to understand the complexities.

 

Ok, now burn me and go on with spoiled brat rants.

 

 

[Etherdrifter 2,517]

8 minutes ago, Ekcin said:

Ok, now burn me and go on with spoiled brat rants.

No...  I fear you've set that bar too high for anyone to compete.

 

Barbs aside, you're assuming your conversations with a few new players eclipses the hundreds (literally) of new players some of us have talked to over the years.

 

THE most common question I have heard in those years? 

 

"How can I earn enough silver to pay my premium"

 

Some of us used to call it "the Wurm dream".  One need only look at the new cluster release to see that reality.

[Ekcin 2,406]

25 minutes ago, Etherdrifter said:

THE most common question I have heard in those years? 

"How can I earn enough silver to pay my premium"

Some of us used to call it "the Wurm dream".  One need only look at the new cluster release to see that reality.

I agree that this is one question I have asked too. I quite soon learnt that - rare coins aside - that is neither a pleasant nor a desirable way though it is possible. Read what Bloodreina wrote about. To follow that path may soon lead towards burnout.

 

But after all, Wurm is a sandbox game, and everybody is free to pursue that path, and great if becoming happy with. Personally, I have hobbies which are more expensive than 5-6€/month (and character), and would not see much of a point to do so.

[Radircs 76]

The Silver earning to buy premium thing is well ok yeah it's possible but come on the game need to be paid. Maybe you could change the model to a buy and play for a year or count just online time so people feel less scammed but over all I think the premium thing is fine. The biggest issue I have with the non-premium that 2 Important Features are gated behind it. Riding and Cart driving I think if this two would be available for the non-premium player more of them would stick around as free toons and maybe buy from time to time something but that's not the point of this thread.

On of the biggest concerns for long time players is "what I will do the next Day -> week -> month" after figuring out the basics of the game build you first house there is a huge gap on content. Uniq slaying sounds good until you understand that its still the same move to enemy and wait until it die and run if you would die combat. Bigger House? Ok that a goal you can work for. Is there more PvE content? How looks the PvP side? People ask this questions and then look it up. They find maybe new activity to do, and they will work for it. But then they have always this low point where they want to do something else after a month of grinding for this one goal. And then they look up what the game will develop in and find.... nothing. What is the next feature? Well i think the combat update somewhat in the future that will do, well we don't know maybe its better but can you design a better system with the limitations of the current game? Ok Oh the are rifts? Oh, they are not available on the cluster I was told to start as a new player well when they come? Well we don't know maybe never because of reasons. Hm ok what else will there be in development maybe I stick around and grind a few more skills because its sound exciting? Well we don't know no one is talking to us if you don't find anything that interest you now well maybe come back in a year and look on the one new feature they have added (maybe) is something for you.

And on and on and on. The moment some one starts to develop a interest in the game and start to be excited of the future hit a wall of silence and this bring people down. If they have nothing to hope for, their ideas feel ignored in the suggestion thread and all the longtime players around them basically say "yeah this is how it is live with it be happy with getting one update a year"  don't keep people engaged.

 

Yes this is not true for the new players, but the new palyers are propably a oen time wave were they try teh game out build the hous they want and then jump to the next game to 99% of the time. Becous they are not TO investet in going for the long term goals. While theo nes that think about be stick around are unsure if the game will be even alive in a year and in activ development becous if the look in the forum or other news to the game its basicly just promises that ther wil be somthing soon and no follow up on it with more infos. And this is how you loose the peopel that maybe would keep playing the game and not allredy ahve singed up to this in ther years they have allredy played it.

[Hoonsuit 17]

7 hours ago, Radircs said:

On of the biggest concerns for long time players is "what I will do the next Day -> week -> month" after figuring out the basics of the game build you first house there is a huge gap on content. Uniq slaying sounds good until you understand that its still the same move to enemy and wait until it die and run if you would die combat. Bigger House? Ok that a goal you can work for. Is there more PvE content? How looks the PvP side?

 

And now we've come full circle. You hit the nail on the head. Right back to my point of new original player made content. Things like going to the movies every once in a while, etc. But unfortunately, as Retro put it, they won't reward people who bring these types of things to the game. Therefore more and more ideas never become a reality here. It's obviously the next step Wurm needs to make to have better player retention, they just refuse to take the reins and do it. They want the ideas/events, but they don't want to reward for them. "Why buy the cow, when the milk is free?"  Now that milk has gone sour and they're left with less and less players.

[Nukacola 60]

Everyone wants to see Wurm succeed, but if the devs don't take any suggestions or measures to improve the game at heart for new players, the Northern Freedom Isles could suffer the same fate as the Southern Freedom Isles.

[Maoh 20]

The forest giant event went pretty well on northern isles...

More things like that would be appreciated

[Carmichael 685]

You got so many ads to you can simply pay for by the company to get the game out there more... Facebook.... YouTube.... those just being the biggest two

 

Because advertising the game how it is now, is just not getting anywhere as well.... just saying

Edited December 20, 2020 by Carmichael

[elentari 2,660]

22 hours ago, Radircs said:

Riding and Cart driving I think if this two would be available for the non-premium player more of them would stick around as free toons and maybe buy from time to time something but that's not the point of this thread.

 

Sounds good, doesn't work for pvp.

 

Pvp has been rife for years with alt abuse, and I don't mean a few alts, I mean alts in the hundreds. Alts for scouting/spying, priest alts in combat, alts logged off on ships so they can give a knarr full speed, alts for unique huntings, alts for repair/defense, alts logged off in starter towns, alts everywhere. 

 

If you allow alts to ride/cart in pvp non premium, it just encourages and allows more abuse. 

 

I've lived on a pvp cluster between 2012-2018, and I can honestly tell ya, alt abuse was one of the most significant factors that really soured pvp for me. I always played on my main, risked everything on my main, just to see someone with a richer wallet buy high fighting skill alts so they can fight with little to no gear risk. 

The ONLY way I can see alt abuse being fixed is to allow no non premium players access to pvp servers. I don't see any other practical solution. 

You wanna pvp ? That's fine. It's high risk/ high reward. Alts will still be spammed but at least people will have to pay extra cash for it. 

Edited December 20, 2020 by elentari

[elentari 2,660]

14 hours ago, Hoonsuit said:

And now we've come full circle. You hit the nail on the head. Right back to my point of new original player made content. Things like going to the movies every once in a while, etc. But unfortunately, as Retro put it, they won't reward people who bring these types of things to the game. Therefore more and more ideas never become a reality here. It's obviously the next step Wurm needs to make to have better player retention, they just refuse to take the reins and do it. They want the ideas/events, but they don't want to reward for them. "Why buy the cow, when the milk is free?"  Now that milk has gone sour and they're left with less and less players.

 

Yep one of my main issues as well.

 

As someone who has been playing for years, I have no incentive to keep playing without content.

 

I've built, I've slayed dragons, I've pvp'd, I've grinded like an insane man, I've done rifts, I've explored, done personal and journal goals, etc. What is left for someone like me? 

The thing is, IF you want to keep players in the long haul, you have to give them FUN things to do. 

And I mean developer created things NOT player made things. Player made events will only go so far. Not many can sacrifice weeks of their life (because that's how long it really takes) to plan and organize impalongs. 

 

I keep hearing from the team the same argument "we don't want Wurm to become a game where all content is handed freely to players like in WoW amusement theme park style" but here is the issue. 

BALANCE! 

 

Players need new content. That's one of the biggest issues of any MMO. Gameplay quickly becomes stale when you realize you have to do the same X amount of actions times 100 000 for personal goals. Grind is repetitive. Many things are repetitive in wurm. That leads everyone to sooner or later ask the question "What am I doing to myself? I got important stuff to do...This grind .... this is NOT fun!"

 

Sorry to say this but as a long term player the biggest issue with wurm is its game design. It's obsolete. It's niche for a reason. Wurm needs to ask the big question: Do we keep going this way or can we try an experimental server with faster skill gain and more content? And if your instinctive answer is : "Well if players have faster skillgain then they will burn through content faster..." = then that's your issue right there. Wurm has very little content then. If most of Wurm's content is "The grind" then here is the answer why most quit. 

 

Cooking update hit and many food types are simply useless. Why do we make brandy ? What use does it give? 

 

Wurm has to offer a bigger reward for long grinds. Ex: Ok....so I've spent months of my life grinding platesmithing to 100 aaaaaand...... Boom! Armor update hits and pretty much any armor is viable now....great...

 

What do I do with my 100 platesmithing? Or someone that has 100 chainsmithing? The reward? We still get a lot of fails improving items past 80 ql. Oh and I occasionally still get fails at 100 PAS. Really? 

 

What is the end game for high skills? Wurm needs bigger content or bigger rewards. 

 

There is a balance to be had between instant gratification and long delay but with a poor reward at the end. Sadly wurm favors the latter than the former. 

 

Here's an example : Tie rewards to accounts. Oh you've hit 90 Weapon smithing? Congratz!

 

You may choose one of these three rewards that will be character bound (non-trade) : 

 

1. A rare item of your choice (can be a warhammer) you can NAME whatever you want, made out of any metal you want. 

2. A rare smithing hammer imbued with 100 weapon smithing increase in ql potion, to help you maintain your gear.

3. A one time use token that can be used to give one weapon a permanent 15% bonus to either : parry, hit chance or damage. 

 

If Wurm keeps relying on the idea of "content must be player made content" then I ask this: What happens when players get tired of always making content? What happens when the player count drops so low then there is no more content? 

THIS has happened before! You have a case study for reference! EPIC! 

There is NO MORE content there! There is no more pvp. There is no more contention for valrei between kingdoms. There is no more content to be had when there are no more players to create it. Hell even OLD freedom is suffering from this. 

 

Wurm either changes its flawed design or it will become a case study why a certain type of game mechanics failed to stay relevant in this highly competitive game market. 

 

It needs balance. It needs BOLD decisions. It needs experimentation so it doesn't become stale. 

[Platyna 521]

While I agree with more content, I disagree with making progress faster. Wurm has a niche which it can lose and not gain anything. If you make progression similar like in other games you will remove challenge, make older players mad, what will cause them to leave and bicker on various forums and this game will be forced to compete with games that are too big and too successful for Wurm to even have a slight chance of winning. Epic with its curve is an exellent example of what I said - it is dead. One of weakest part of Wurm besides customer support/community management is the fact we have many skills but still, like in any game, blacksmiths, mages (priests) and fighters are the only profitable professions, maybe also fine carpenters get a little piece of this cake. With such a hard and slow pace, ANY skill should give a chance to be a sucessful player. Skills that lets you do just one thing (such as first aid) etc. should be completely reworked. I base what I wrote on years of experience in developing RPG economy systems. And what is most important - we should be able to discuss with the team on Suggestion forums (their absence there is appaling) and the community itself should be more open for changes, even such a small suggestion to implement like rework of skill titles that should be made desirable not silly or weird was basically grilled. A more statistical approach such as running through users database and collect information for example on most commly used titles amoung of people who can use them, or most trained weapon skills etc. etc. to gain useful information what to balace and what needs more attention would be good for developers. My appeal to stop this "everything is fine, we are doing great" attitude also goes to the "old" players. 

Edited December 20, 2020 by Platyna

[elentari 2,660]

@Platyna, alright I agree that maybe changing the pace of skilling might be a bit too much, but at least we have to change how skills reward a player.

 

As it stands out there is little to no benefit grinding certain skills to 90. And some grinds are objectively worth less than others.

 

Long grinds should give players better rewards. A title is cute, but ultimately meaningless.

 

The fact is, the "old community" is not that open to change. They prefer the game to stay as it is, but simply have more players in it. That in itself I find appaling. A game should grow, should change while maintaning its core identity. I've seen dozens of suggestions shut down over the years just because they "might" have to force old players to adapt to better systems.

 

Example of better systems shut down in Wurm Suggestions :  1. Auction Houses.

2. Interactive maps

3. Auto-riding for horses on highways using the catseyes system.

4. NPC's : not that many, but at least add a few for flavor in starter towns and maybe some random quest npc's you have to talk to for certain quests and such. Maybe even give the ability to players to "Create their own npc's" with some quest templates they can edit for other players.

 

I thing the missed opportunity with the Steam launch was related to not experimenting with some systems and see how players respond to it.

 

Also, this might sound a bit harsh, but I absolutely despise how poorly information is structured in Wurm. The wiki is an outdated mess! I've seen so many complaints and discussions on steam about players struggling to figure out information in game about highly non-intuitive systems because heh...Wogic, right?

 

As predicted by some, this only leads to a certain elite class of players knowing exactly how the code works and that gives them an edge over the rest of the population. Look how the channeling grind was handled on the new servers. It was dissapointing.

 

Might sound a bit extreme, but even if I am part of this 'Old community" i do believe right now, some of us are also part of the problem and holding the game's progress back.

 

I miss having new and exciting stuff to do in Wurm. I really do. I wish something can change for the better.

 

[Finnn 3,301]

3 hours ago, elentari said:

@Platyna, alright I agree that maybe changing the pace of skilling might be a bit too much, but at least we have to change how skills reward a player.

 

As it stands out there is little to no benefit grinding certain skills to 90. And some grinds are objectively worth less than others.

 

Long grinds should give players better rewards. A title is cute, but ultimately meaningless.

 

The fact is, the "old community" is not that open to change. They prefer the game to stay as it is, but simply have more players in it. That in itself I find appaling. A game should grow, should change while maintaning its core identity. I've seen dozens of suggestions shut down over the years just because they "might" have to force old players to adapt to better systems.

 

Example of better systems shut down in Wurm Suggestions :  1. Auction Houses.

2. Interactive maps

3. Auto-riding for horses on highways using the catseyes system.

4. NPC's : not that many, but at least add a few for flavor in starter towns and maybe some random quest npc's you have to talk to for certain quests and such. Maybe even give the ability to players to "Create their own npc's" with some quest templates they can edit for other players.

 

I thing the missed opportunity with the Steam launch was related to not experimenting with some systems and see how players respond to it.

 

Also, this might sound a bit harsh, but I absolutely despise how poorly information is structured in Wurm. The wiki is an outdated mess! I've seen so many complaints and discussions on steam about players struggling to figure out information in game about highly non-intuitive systems because heh...Wogic, right?

 

As predicted by some, this only leads to a certain elite class of players knowing exactly how the code works and that gives them an edge over the rest of the population. Look how the channeling grind was handled on the new servers. It was dissapointing.

 

Might sound a bit extreme, but even if I am part of this 'Old community" i do believe right now, some of us are also part of the problem and holding the game's progress back.

 

I miss having new and exciting stuff to do in Wurm. I really do. I wish something can change for the better.

 

BRUH, I'm not HODLing anything, all my suggestions get ignored, all voices for progression in any direction get shut, almost all suggestions are ignored, it's certainly NOT a problem with the community, nobody higher up picks up the torch for new content, such magically randomly appear once a year or 2, that's how development seems to work. No news about directions or updates about state of features that are worked/improved or being nerfed, stuff just slap you in the face next week or month and you have no voice weather something is good or bad.

I am surprised asking for 1-2 meaningful fixes to large planters and hitching posts were taken as feedback and mechanics were improved to be actually 10x more useful than initially designed.

[elentari 2,660]

Finn, I never launched any shots at you. If anything, you and I are usually on the same page.

My gripe was with players that simply have nothing more to say to suggestions than  this tired line : "-1 , Wurm needs to stay as it is" or "If we change this, Wurm will become just another trendy MMO". ....

 

OR

 

"If we add this in Wurm THE MARKET WILL DIE WAAAHHH * autistic screeching about MUH market* "

 

I know most suggestions are ignored. I know they die in the dust. Hell I've seen you recently play necromancer on some good threads to no avail. My hat is off to you my Necro Liche Liege ( hope you appreciate the pun).

 

My annoyance is with the vast amount of players that have zero foresight to see that if a game does not change and improve, it will die. It's as simple as that. No game can become stagnant in development and survive. I understand many have entered a psychological comfort zone in playstyle but the fact of the matter is Wurm needs new content that will invariably challenge the old playerbase's mindset on what "Wurm is" or "what it should be".

I don't want to claim my vision  is better. I have biases. I know them. But I do recognize lack of change and stale gameplay and I cant' see a retention  plan, an end game content plan or a new fun content plan.

 

I know Wurm is now practically owned by another company so there might be things going behind the scenes we aren't aware of. They might limit the hiring budget for Wurm so they can't get more devs. Who knows. We are in the dark here. I don't like being in the dark

 

[Platyna 521]

7 hours ago, elentari said:

As it stands out there is little to no benefit grinding certain skills to 90. And some grinds are objectively worth less than others.

 

Long grinds should give players better rewards. A title is cute, but ultimately meaningless.

 

Yes, as I said any skill if mastered, should give a chance to e.g. earn money. My last suggestion to improve thatching seemed so easy to implement - the items are already there, all what was needed was to add the recipe, and one said they are supposed to be easy to make - old player of course didn't like the idea because these were Christmas gifts, despite the fact it was like six years ago, and there is really no point to waste amazing artist and modelling artwork for items a handful of players now have, it especially applies to amazing artwork of Roman-like helmets (plummet helmets), dragon eggs, and many other things. The rare status could still be retained such as "Yule goat" for gift item and "straw goat" for crafted one, plumed helmet for the gift and centurion one for the crafted version. etc. etc. etc. I will not even remind about my suggestions about black dye...

 

7 hours ago, elentari said:

Example of better systems shut down in Wurm Suggestions :  1. Auction Houses.

2. Interactive maps

3. Auto-riding for horses on highways using the catseyes system.

4. NPC's : not that many, but at least add a few for flavor in starter towns and maybe some random quest npc's you have to talk to for certain quests and such. Maybe even give the ability to players to "Create their own npc's" with some quest templates they can edit for other players.

 

Well I will not comment much on these particular suggestion as they are subject for a larger discussion or analysis, but for example I am not in favour of AFK riding, and I think that the game should be made in the way that discourages AFK or semi-AFK activity. 

 

7 hours ago, elentari said:

Also, this might sound a bit harsh, but I absolutely despise how poorly information is structured in Wurm. The wiki is an outdated mess! I've seen so many complaints and discussions on steam about players struggling to figure out information in game about highly non-intuitive systems because heh...Wogic, right?

 

Well, I do what I can to change it, once I got editor rights I began a crusade to hunt outdated, inaccurate or poorly worded content, best (and basically the only way) to do so is monitoring CA_HELP which I do.

[Zarwaddim 42]

On 12/19/2020 at 4:20 PM, Hoonsuit said:

 

And now we've come full circle. You hit the nail on the head. Right back to my point of new original player made content. Things like going to the movies every once in a while, etc. But unfortunately, as Retro put it, they won't reward people who bring these types of things to the game. Therefore more and more ideas never become a reality here. It's obviously the next step Wurm needs to make to have better player retention, they just refuse to take the reins and do it. They want the ideas/events, but they don't want to reward for them. "Why buy the cow, when the milk is free?"  Now that milk has gone sour and they're left with less and less players.

Rewarding content creators for using the game to create content for others? You cannot be serious? Is this what you are literally suggesting - to reward content creators?

 

I'm sorry, but this is a video game. And in real life content creators are "rewarded" with ad revenue, ad placement opportunities, or outright direct payment for "shilling" a product.

 

You should not have to be rewarded as a content creator. The reward is in creating content that people participate in. Could I see developers consider giving out items to people who, say, won a race that was "created" by someone? Sure, but not as a given, a requirement, an absolute. It's at the developer's discretion simply because it is the developer's game. I cannot go into someone's house/business who invites me in (or even charges me and admission fee to enter), then create content and expect the owner to pay me for doing so. That is just...not right.

Edited December 21, 2020 by Zarwaddim

[elentari 2,660]

3 hours ago, Zarwaddim said:

Rewarding content creators for using the game to create content for others? You cannot be serious? Is this what you are literally suggesting - to reward content creators?

 

Respectfully disagree. 

 

While I agree no reward "should" be mandatory that doesn't change the fact that

 

A) The effort to create any event in Wurm for dozens if not hundreds of people is insane. We're talking a ton of RL hours sacrificed for others. An impalong itself can take weeks to plan. Weeks where you're not doing anything for yourself , just for others.  

 

and B ) There aren't many in Wurm that create content for others in a selfless way. 

 

This isn't YouTube where people make fake lazy reaction videos. Creating content in Wurm is akin to moving a sand dune from point a to point b using a pair of tweezers. It's exhausting. On that note, doing it more than once can discourage people from ever doing it again. I know I ran a newbie training deed for years. It took a lot out of me. 

 

Video games or not, every aspect of human life revolves around reciprocity. People that add content to a game should be incentivized to do so. They shouldn't be necessarily paid in silvers, coins or rare items BUT they should be rewarded none the less. Whatever reward the devs decide, but it should be something. 

 

If this doesn't convince you, try running a big event for people that doesn't involve a unique slaying and see the insane logistics involved. Then tell me how many times you could give of yourself till you get tired. 

[Hoonsuit 17]

5 hours ago, Zarwaddim said:

I'm sorry, but this is a video game.

 

You should not have to be rewarded as a content creator. The reward is in creating content that people participate in. 

 

This is a business. It's part of the gaming business sure, but don't be mistaken, Wurm is a business. You don't seem to be aware of that fact. 

 

Here's the thing... Lots and lots of the staff here are volunteers. They don't get paid real cash. They may or may not get small rewards by the paid staff/devs in appreciation for what they do... and deservedly so.

 

Content creators aren't any different. They put in hour and hours of their time,  just like the CAs, CMs, etc.  Let's take a bit of what you've said, and substitute a word ... 

 

"You should not have to be rewarded as a VOLUNTEER. The reward is in the VOLUNTEERING that people participate in."

 

In stating that the volunteer content creators don't deserve any reward because they are volunteering to do so, you have infact also argued that the staff volunteers (CA's, CM'S, etc) should NOT receive any type of reward either.  I look forward to the thread you should now start, demanding that the staff/devs put an end to rewarding the CA, CM, etc. volunteers, because they are doing it out of their own good will, and not for rewards.

 

[CistaCista 253]

4 hours ago, Hoonsuit said:

Content creators aren't any different.

 

Content creators are not staff.

 

We players do not expect to get paid for creating content by playing the game. Zarwaddim said it 100 % correct. You two have no argument and are spamming my feed with pointless trumpian repititions. 

Edited December 22, 2020 by CistaCista

[Oblivionnreaver 5,174]

if you put this much effort into a job irl you wouldn't need to be paid to make an event in a video game lol

[Hoonsuit 17]

1 hour ago, CistaCista said:

 

Content creators are not staff.

 

We players do not expect to get paid for creating content by playing the game. Zarwaddim said it 100 % correct. You two have no argument and are spamming my feed with pointless trumpian repititions. 

 

You have your opinion, I have mine. 

 

No-one is forcing you to read anything or reply to anything. You choose to do that. Now you are attempting to label and demonize me in some negative political way, only for having a different opinion on how things should work. Don't they call that communism? If you want to push your communistic ways here, that needs to be addressed. See how it works commie? 

 

If you don't like what I write, don't read it.

Edited December 22, 2020 by Hoonsuit

[Hoonsuit 17]

19 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

if you put this much effort into a job irl you wouldn't need to be paid to make an event in a video game lol

 

Have you ever thought about actually contributing to this thread? You are only here to insult.

 

PS. Go stalk someone else you creepy jerk

Edited December 22, 2020 by Hoonsuit

[Hoonsuit 17]

8 hours ago, elentari said:

Respectfully disagree. 

 

While I agree no reward "should" be mandatory that doesn't change the fact that

 

A) The effort to create any event in Wurm for dozens if not hundreds of people is insane. We're talking a ton of RL hours sacrificed for others. An impalong itself can take weeks to plan. Weeks where you're not doing anything for yourself , just for others.  

 

and B ) There aren't many in Wurm that create content for others in a selfless way. 

 

This isn't YouTube where people make fake lazy reaction videos. Creating content in Wurm is akin to moving a sand dune from point a to point b using a pair of tweezers. It's exhausting. On that note, doing it more than once can discourage people from ever doing it again. I know I ran a newbie training deed for years. It took a lot out of me. 

 

Video games or not, every aspect of human life revolves around reciprocity. People that add content to a game should be incentivized to do so. They shouldn't be necessarily paid in silvers, coins or rare items BUT they should be rewarded none the less. Whatever reward the devs decide, but it should be something. 

 

If this doesn't convince you, try running a big event for people that doesn't involve a unique slaying and see the insane logistics involved. Then tell me how many times you could give of yourself till you get tired. 

 

So here is someone who happens to have some agreement with me on the topic. Funny how I don't see CistaCista, Oblivionncreeper, et al calling out and attacking this person / post. Wonder why that is?

[Badvoc 204]

@Hoonsuit

 

Ok let me tell you my stance first and then I can add a few thoughts,

 

Am on the fence on this one, on paper a reward for making content doesn't seem a bad thing, I mean anything at this point to keep the game engaging for the new and old players alike has to be a good thing but I can see downsides to this aswell, so unless the idea is fleshed out more, its hard to decide if i agree or not.

 

So can you explain how the reward system would work for content?  First of all we talking about player made content or ideas for content?  We talking about items built in the world or a game hosted in chat? what reward are you after, silver, titles something else?

I would have a big problem with silver rewards, but titles I would be fine with. Maybe if you use an area for public content the deed fee could be waived as its public content? But please explain what reward you want.

 

As the problems I see are many

 

Who decides what's good content or bad content would a reward be given so long as its content?

Would this take up more staff time having to decide what's good or bad, would the players choose?

 

What happens if you make the best content ands its not used do you still get a reward?

would we then just see people spamming content to get this reward.

If its just ideas if I suggested something on the forums and the devs use it, do I get a reward?

 

I could go on, but I think you get the idea, like I said I am not bashing the idea as such, but how can we decide if the idea is a good one without the details fleshed out?  ( dont have to spill the beans on your content ideas, just how the system would work )

[Oblivionnreaver 5,174]

2 hours ago, Hoonsuit said:

 

So here is someone who happens to have some agreement with me on the topic. Funny how I don't see CistaCista, Oblivionncreeper, et al calling out and attacking this person / post. Wonder why that is?

elentari speaks from experience and has more of an opinion than "i should get paid for my ideas" that you posted about selling to staff a few times before you made your suggestion, so i don't mock it because it isnt biased and i respect their opinion on the subject, its pretty simple

 

i like how making two comments days apart makes me a creeper, maybe if you weren't arguing the same thing that got dunked by retro for days you wouldn't get someone commenting on it twice lol, they already get special items/treatment for what they do and you're arguing that they dont and use strawmans saying that people should make suggestions to take away gifts from staff, give me a break lol