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Wurm Online Roadmap - What's after Steam?

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17 minutes ago, Sindusk said:

 

Why would we go back to 50ql weapons? We have two weapon smiths at 90. If you need weapons, just kill JK.

 

Okidoki

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4 hours ago, Sindusk said:

 

Why would we go back to 50ql weapons? We have two weapon smiths at 90. If you need weapons, just kill JK.


can i have a 90ql staff plzzz ty

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2 minutes ago, RainRain said:


can i have a 90ql staff plzzz ty

We're taking converts. Peeps like you who aren't afraid to have fun and die are always welcome😉

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On 10/14/2020 at 12:10 PM, Sindusk said:

 

They all in JK lands.

 

Lies, ive been all over your lands past few days and I haven't seen ######!

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I wonder why nothing is done about the botched MIME type of https://client.wurmonline.com/client/wurmlauncher.tar.gz

There has already been a thread in the bugs section. Is it so hard to change that?

 

In fact, for those aware of the workarounds, this is a trivial issue, either uncompressing before unpacking, or using curl or wget. But many of the Linux users are just users, and may not be aware of. 

 

The download section is sort of a showcase for the company and the community. I wonder when this taint will be removed.

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On 10/14/2020 at 10:57 PM, Ekcin said:

Actually -100 for forced item decay. And wrong "analysis" again. There is no such beast as a "balanced economy", it will be evolving all time. Items already do decay and are lost. Destruction on death is a PvP ##### idea.

 

Sadly ekcin, Wurm's economy does not evolve!

 

It's the same economy it was 10 years ago. The same phenomenon happened on Epic and Freedom. People spam the market with high ql stuff, players get their skills higher and higher,  prices go down, people stop buying because it's not worth it for me to make a 90 ql longsword to sell it for 1 silver.

 

There are no item sinks in game, no character bound items, no chance to lose items if you are organized, simply put, items in game almost stay forever. I'm not talking about buildings but items themselves. A 80 ql chain set will take 1-2 years to decay. The chance for a random player to find that chainset on a random decayed deed is high.

 

Steam servers will suffer the same fate. A new approach to wurm's economy is not only required, it's a critical must have or people still start leaving again. No trade = less player interaction = less incentive to play.

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Some of these last couple of pages of comments just fill me with joy and remind me why I came to this game :)  

They are positive, patient, and reasonable.

Goats, Ducks, Ostrich, Coffee Beans, Short Spears, Log-cabin Textures, Cloth armour variations, Gurl-armour (seriously, I agree with that idea) - all great suggestions!

 

Not so great are the step-back suggestions that would penalise people for not logging in 24/7. That is just short-term click-bait thinking. There are plenty of games out there who will happily delete your characters and property if you fail to log in every week/month or are 10 seconds late with your RMT. There is even a whole culture of paid 'account sitters' to go with it too. 

Maybe if you can max out a chari in 4 weeks then you might expect things to decay over a similar timescale - but if you can't max a chari in 7 years then you don't expect to see significant decay this decade.

 

@Eleraan - That is a fantastic idea and I wish I could like your comment a million times!  The idea of converting a certain minimum-X quality item into a 'master item' that once 'fixed' becomes un-repairable (like pottery) would indeed create a huge market for crafters of X level goods, a process for Y level artisans, and an ongoing market for users of Y-mastergrade items. It wouldn't even require much of a new mechanic as potions provide a very similar service bonus.

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19 hours ago, elentari said:

 

Sadly ekcin, Wurm's economy does not evolve!

 

Of course it will, and it will not. Mind that Wurm is designed as a survival game. As Tor wrote in

https://forum.wurmonline.com/index.php?/topic/180186-what-new-players-seem-to-think-about-the-old-servers/&do=findComment&comment=1820799

 

Quote

And for "the market" argument, especially the new players would get rather sick and probably burn out from chasing it as this game is more then selling stuff. Properly informed, anyone can get it going in this game without ever selling or buying anything

 

Therefore, there will never be an economy market fans are dreaming of. Honestly, I did and do play without much connection to the market most time. Much of my stuff I do not and cannot make myself is given and taken between friends and allies. The rather sparse exchanges I did and do are often between acquaintances, and personally I tend to give huge discounts just for sympathy. Other than that, I hired a priest/ess for some collapses before I had my Nahjo/Magranon priest. Though nothing less than an inactive or casual player, I am a contributor to a "dead" economy.

 

In fact, the economy is alive, but only to the extent it is allowed in a widely self sustaining socioeconomic environment (as it was, btw., in the Middle Ages and Early Modern Age the Wurm "society" refers to). It will always be a niche economy. Inside this niche, those fervently interested in trading may find their place, if they are striving hard. But the niche will never be large enough to accommodate  a big  number of suppliers just because the demand is too small, and will always be unless you break the game.

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On 10/11/2020 at 11:57 PM, Ekcin said:

It all stems from the wrong belief (carved in stone in econometric models) that markets were ergodic systems which they are not.

 

*faints in geekgasm*

geekisthenewsexy_newthumb.png

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11 hours ago, Ekcin said:

In fact, the economy is alive, but only to the extent it is allowed in a widely self sustaining socioeconomic environment (as it was, btw., in the Middle Ages and Early Modern Age the Wurm "society" refers to). It will always be a niche economy. Inside this niche, those fervently interested in trading may find their place, if they are striving hard. But the niche will never be large enough to accommodate  a big  number of suppliers just because the demand is too small, and will always be unless you break the game.

 

omg, THIS, all day long. 
(stop talking Ekcin, you're making me all hot & flustered again)

 

For example: "back in the day" a blacksmith did not generally compete with all the other blacksmiths in the kingdom for economic viability. A blacksmith was a village blacksmith and provided goods and services for the village. The blacksmith set their rates (in coin and in trade) by what could be afforded by the people who lived within 1 day's walk. WALK since for most people, if they even had a horse or cow to begin with, the animal was a working animal, and too precious for its ability to pull a carruca or provide milk, to consider riding it. As peasants became slightly more affluent, yeah, we start seeing draft animals and carts like we have in Wurm... but overall... the blacksmith is still NOT going to be competing in an economic "market" like we think of today. 

This (that) is what the Wurm world is based on. Our global chat and trade chat channels (and magical mailboxes) allow for an extra level of economic movement... but overall, this game is a survival / life sim game NOT a mercantile / economy & trade / resource management game. Building and crafting are in aid of self-sufficiency, first and foremost - not competitive capitalist profit. The "need" / use for coin in Wurm is overwhelmingly feudal land tax (deed upkeep) and premium time (metagame) - as such, a player's "career" as a blacksmith is roughly equivalent to working at ... foraging. An entry level skill that everyone can do from day 1 and will eventually produce enough coin to comfortably cover both those costs. 

TLDR: if you have supplied your own needs, and supplied the needs of your Local neighbors, and you have enough raw materials / access to raw materials to be decently confident that you will be able to supply for your next need whatever it may be... Congrats! You are rich. You have won at Wurm. 

Edited by Amata
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I love the idea of more decorative features.  Better tables please! the wooden one is HUGE, can we have some tables that better fit in with tile sizes/chairs.  Things you can hang on walls - YES looking forward to that! how about paintings! made with dyes perhaps? Soft furnishings...we have rugs and carpets, why not curtains we can weave? cushions?  just would be great to furnish my house a bit more than i can currently.  Bookshelves...so empty! Bookmaking with papyrus? that you can write in with reed pen?  gift wrapping for presents. tablecloths.  just some ideas :)

 

creatures? catch a fish, make a fish bowl to put it in? ah we don't have glass.... parrots on perches? RED squirrels.  peacocks would be great   

 

bring back the GNOME!

 

In the meantime, it all sounds exciting, can't wait to see what new things come along.

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On 10/8/2020 at 7:21 PM, Badgers said:

I would love to see a new "desert themed" patch. Where trees and bushes like Palms and Cactus can only grow on sand tiles, the introduction of camels that can have a passenger like unicorns. Maybe also some Arabian or Moroccan styled walls.

the famous mountain climbing camel, right next to the famous desert seal? 😄  +1 for new animals, but they always end up in places where they do not belong lol ^^

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Idk know that others think about the game, i was talking to someone on Steam, that he had alot of villagers around when WO Steam went live. Now he mention lost about 90% of players that loss interest in the game, not sure if any of them ever played WO before, but i do know that nothing compare to other MMO games. I remember some saying, the character models is terrible, ie the animations, etc. Funny few of them wanted to play a elf with long pointed ears. They are happy with the graphic overhaul, but many went back to WU instead or find another game. Guess they though it was a walk in the park with this game and didnt realize it will take weeks or months to get your skills up there to be effective. The skill system seem to be fine with me, just a long road. But wouldnt hurt to work on those character models for animation.

 

I also remember someone wanted a scale armor, that would be nice and a padded armor too. No i am not talking about dragon scale, something more of large fish scale or snake.

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So, where does ruining imbues fall in the timeline?

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4 hours ago, Delacroix said:

So, where does ruining imbues fall in the timeline?

General balances and bug fixes will be ongoing and occur regularly throughout each update. 

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On 10/14/2020 at 4:47 PM, Sovos said:

The Wurm economy is like this:

  1. New server opens, new characters made.
  2. People rush to carve out their niche and make crazy silver selling in an open market.
  3. Other players catch up and prices stabilize.
  4. Buyers purchase a handful of items that will last them for months or years with proper care.
  5. The market becomes oversaturated with goods from competing sellers trying to keep silver flowing in.
  6. Prices crash due to lack of buyers, most items are barely worth the time put in to them.
  7. People complain.

 

Following the Eve Online model, which also has a primarily player driven economy similar to this one, I think that there should be a chance for some of your items to either be destroyed or degrade when you die. People are going to complain about it, but you cannot have a balanced economy when there is nothing taking items out of circulation. The only item sinks that exist are decay, which hardly affects anything on a deed, or players forgetting to repair; compare that to the sheer amount of items flowing into the market and you'll see just how lopsided it is.

 

 

 

I've made suggestion about economy some time ago.

 

Possible scenarios to solve this are e.g.:

- limit the number of improvements for each item, once the limit is reached, the item can only be repaired, but you can not increase ql.

- possibility of further improvements or fixes for the item being blocked by item creator (burned like clay items at the ql level where he believes the item is complete).

 

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4 hours ago, Retrograde said:

General balances and bug fixes will be ongoing and occur regularly throughout each update. 

 

That doesn't answer the question. You've made it clear that you have a hard-on for imbues and intend to do what you can to get them changed (re: trashed). Where does this fall in the roadmap? Sooner? Later? It's a surprise because to hell with anybody who actually uses them?

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On 10/20/2020 at 1:41 AM, Darnok said:

 

I've made suggestion about economy some time ago.

 

Possible scenarios to solve this are e.g.:

- limit the number of improvements for each item, once the limit is reached, the item can only be repaired, but you can not increase ql.

- possibility of further improvements or fixes for the item being blocked by item creator (burned like clay items at the ql level where he believes the item is complete).

 


are you saying like the skill of the maker is the cap at the time made type thing? as a for instance a 30 skill person makes and item and at that very specific creation point the formula (skill * .79) +23(in this instance 46.7ql is the max ql it can ever be) is applied as its max ql capacity for the life of the item? or more like you made have 70 skill and a 70ql starting material and make an item 1/5th your skill as per normal. The item comes out as 14ql and you only get to improve it 20 times whether you fail or not? or would it be 20 successful improvements?

 

the second option kinda limits the market for anyone entering it, unless your also implying the option of not halting ql improvement? Which again would narrow the market pretty hard for incoming people. 


To help economic I think the best way to help in the current populations might be to cause multiple step processes that have to be completed outside your deed, ally, alts, emails and same general IP. I.E. You want to make a knarr, but you have to buy sails from another player otherwise you cannot add them. this would increase the movement of items (yes hard swaps could happen obviously, but it would require more socialization. When people socialize more then tend to like each other more and the stuff they really don't wanna do they can offer out).

A second option could be something as simple as you can only get 1 skill to 100 (must specify when 2 skills hit 70), 2 skill to 70(must specify when 2 skills hit 50), 2 skills to 50(must specify when 5 skills hit 35) and the rest have to stay under 35(you would not be aloud to pay for more either, hard cap). This would force people into focusing on 1 skill and allow for the market to breathe instead of having 5 players with 90 skill in the 15 most lucrative silver earning skills and will let the server balance out. Yes, they could create alts to focus on other things, but hey, it give the devs more life blood to develop the game and add new features at a fast pace. (most of us already have a main and a priest alt as it is.)

The last suggestion id have is, you also get a increased decay tick if you yourself could not create the item yourself. The higher the item is outside your skill, the heavier the decay hit or the more frequent the hit/more repairs. This extra decay tick could be countered(somewhat) by the appropriate  rack(weapon, armor and so on) The higher the ql the less the decay tick....and yes, if you cannot create the rack or improve the rack, that extra decay tick would be applied to the racks. if you couple this with the skill limitations i previously suggested, this would remove items from the world at a regular and predictable rate, goods would flow, silver would flow and the economy would always be moving. in this way no one can corner a market and there would ALWAYS be a demand on goods. I would apply this to everything but houses, gates, fences and the like, anything you create like a longsword or a ropetool a tick applies.

 

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On 10/26/2020 at 4:26 AM, azuleslight said:

A second option could be something as simple as you can only get 1 skill to 100 (must specify when 2 skills hit 70), 2 skill to 70(must specify when 2 skills hit 50), 2 skills to 50(must specify when 5 skills hit 35) and the rest have to stay under 35(you would not be aloud to pay for more either, hard cap). This would force people into focusing on 1 skill and allow for the market to breathe instead of having 5 players with 90 skill in the 15 most lucrative silver earning skills and will let the server balance out. Yes, they could create alts to focus on other things, but hey, it give the devs more life blood to develop the game and add new features at a fast pace. (most of us already have a main and a priest alt as it is.)

 

It's not the players with multiple 90s which are problematic to the economy as  they are still limited by their actions as to what they produce; in fact locking accounts into specialism would be detrimental as it would mean those generalists who would otherwise be skilling for personal gains are now focused on one skill, and they are now likely managing more than one account and producing more. 

 

Fundamentally its and issue of items not being taken out of circulation which means the economy will eventually stagnate. I'd suggest simply limiting the number of times an item can be repaired and perhaps adding an enchant which reduces the damage taken on an item. Limiting the number of times an item can be repaired would encourage players to make the most use of an item before repairing. This would also mean that a player with low blacksmithing would have to pay for an imp if they overuse a high QL item which they have bought, further stimulating the economy (this would massively favour blacksmithing a profession though).

 

 

Edited by icfred

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Again, stop it and put such wishes to Suggestions where they can be rejected in kind. Nerfing acquisition of higher level skills will drive away players fond of achievements, destroying items will add new chores driving away many long term players playing casually due to job, family etc. situation while upholding deeds and communications. Both may discourage also lower level players (churn rate is damn high enough) and destroy the sandbox character of the game only for the illusions of market fanatics.

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On 10/18/2020 at 5:20 AM, Arelia said:

I love the idea of more decorative features.  Better tables please! the wooden one is HUGE, can we have some tables that better fit in with tile sizes/chairs.  Things you can hang on walls - YES looking forward to that! how about paintings! made with dyes perhaps? Soft furnishings...we have rugs and carpets, why not curtains we can weave? cushions?  just would be great to furnish my house a bit more than i can currently.  Bookshelves...so empty! Bookmaking with papyrus? that you can write in with reed pen?  gift wrapping for presents. tablecloths.  just some ideas :)

 

creatures? catch a fish, make a fish bowl to put it in? ah we don't have glass.... parrots on perches? RED squirrels.  peacocks would be great   

 

bring back the GNOME!

 

In the meantime, it all sounds exciting, can't wait to see what new things come along.

 

All this sand and no glassmaking. it's way overdue.

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