Darnok

Trial by combat and chronicler

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The sparring and dueling mechanics already exist in PvE, so a small addition is enough to make it easier for players to resolve disputes.

 

If there is a problem, one of the players can start a trial by combat by placing the banner on the free tile away from the deeds. By placing a banner, he describes what the duel is about, his version of story, and who he challenges to the duel.
The challenged person may refuse. He can come to a duel, but if he is too weak to fight alone, he can appoint his champion.

 

After placing the banner, it will exist for 48 hours waiting for the respondent to respond, if he does not answer, it means that he has refused.

If the challenged person agrees to accept the challenge, he chooses the time when the duel is to take place (the challenging person chooses the place) and adds his version of the story/dispute.

 

After completing the setup, the duel area is marked (it can be a 20x20 area around the banner).

 

All players near by (not entire map) receive a message that the duel is about to take place and when and information with details of the dispute. If the challenged person has refused to participate, this message is also sent to other players in the area. Other players on entire map are informed about the result of the duel and details of the dispute.

 

Players located near the place of the trial by combat can write it into the books (chronicles) so that the information about the dispute and its result is not lost.

Information about who is creating the new deed and where it could also be kept in the chronicles only by players who are currently online. And that would be the only access to this information through the purchase of a book/chronicle.

 

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  1. PvP is over there.
  2. "Might is right" is not something I would want implemented.
  3. If you want to gank, see point 1.

More loquaciously, many of us on PVE do not want meta-gaming grief at all, and I for one would not welcome injecting them into the game itself. I have in my almost-year of Wurming lodged 4 or 5 support tickets.  One was to have an abandoned boat moved away and that was the MOST like a player/player dispute  issue.  The others were for glitches or official requests relating only to me.  I had one extended grumble about a neighbour in the fora, and that is it.  I do not WANT to escalate disputes into armed conflicts because in real terms that will not resolve anything.  If a players "loses" it is not because they are in the wrong but because they were outmatched.  Only a bully thinks a black eye settles the issue.

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14 minutes ago, TheTrickster said:
  1. PvP is over there.
  2. "Might is right" is not something I would want implemented.
  3. If you want to gank, see point 1.

More loquaciously, many of us on PVE do not want meta-gaming grief at all, and I for one would not welcome injecting them into the game itself. I have in my almost-year of Wurming lodged 4 or 5 support tickets.  One was to have an abandoned boat moved away and that was the MOST like a player/player dispute  issue.  The others were for glitches or official requests relating only to me.  I had one extended grumble about a neighbour in the fora, and that is it.  I do not WANT to escalate disputes into armed conflicts because in real terms that will not resolve anything.  If a players "loses" it is not because they are in the wrong but because they were outmatched.  Only a bully thinks a black eye settles the issue.

 

duel-header.jpg

 

100 years ago, people even made duels in public to decide who was right. The fact that today honor is at the level of a "bully and a black eye" only speaks badly of the times we live in.

The fact that you need someone stronger than you and your "opponent" to settle the dispute for you shows that you are not free, but limited by the will of whoever is above you and decides what is right and what is wrong for you.

On the home page, the description of Wurm begins with:

"Developed around the idea that sandboxes should give ultimate freedom..."

 

 

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if i beat you in a spar will you stop posting silly things on the forums

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So it is a duel with flair added?

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

if i beat you in a spar will you stop posting silly things on the forums

 

Agreed. But first define what a "silly thing" means and who will decide if my next idea is silly or not.

And most important, what will I get if I win?

Edited by Darnok

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Just now, armyskin said:

So it is a duel with flair added?

 

Yes, combined with an entry in the chronicles it would have an interesting effect.

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, Darnok said:

100 years ago, people even made duels in public to decide who was right.

Not to prove who is right, me killing you doesn't make me right in saying that the earth is flat.

Notice how we moved away from those because we realized this proves nothing.

We also had slavery, no voting rights for women, religious inquisitions and so on. We moved away from those too, for a good reason. The were based on illogical premises and shouldn't have happened to begin with.

 

Just like in 

34 minutes ago, Darnok said:

"Developed around the idea that sandboxes should give ultimate freedom..."

I would like to keep my freedom of placing a deed where ever i please without you trying to interfere with public land and challenging my decision because it's none of your business. You don't want me to deed somewhere, you pay for those tiles and there is no problem to begin with, no problem to be fixed, everyone is happy.

Edited by Locath

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14 minutes ago, Locath said:

Not to prove who is right, me killing you doesn't make me right in saying that the earth is flat.

Notice how we moved away from those because we realized this proves nothing.

 

If there is no one to oppose you then you are right and others repeat what you think is right.  No matter what the objective truth is.
The mere fact that objective truth exists is logical, but there is no force to make you accept that it is, and if someone has that force and can make you to change your mind, what will happen if that person believes in flat earth?
 

 

14 minutes ago, Locath said:

We also had slavery, no voting rights for women, religious inquisitions and so on. We moved away from those too, for a good reason. The were based on illogical premises and shouldn't have happened to begin with.

 

We are living in an time of atheistic inquisition right now, and today just as many people in the past centuries agree with these most popular views without trying to challenge them, because they think that society can't be wrong. These are topics for a long discussion, but not here.

 

14 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

Just like in 

I would like to keep my freedom of placing a deed where ever i please without you trying to interfere with public land and challenging my decision because it's none of your business. You don't want me to deed somewhere, you pay for those tiles and there is no problem to begin with, no problem to be fixed, everyone is happy.

 

What about the freedom of those that were in region before you? Look at the real world, you cannot go to any place and the fact that no one lives in the vicinity of 10 km does not give you the right to put a flag in the ground and say it is mine.

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Darnok said:

What about the freedom of those that were in region before you? Look at the real world, you cannot go to any place and the fact that no one lives in the vicinity of 10 km does not give you the right to put a flag in the ground and say it is mine.

It does if you buy the land. Have you seen real world? There is land which belongs to the county which i can buy and make that exact decision! Just like you buy the land from the King in Wurm. If you don't want me to build somewhere, you buy that land and that stops me from doing it. It's not a complicated concept.

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43 minutes ago, Locath said:

It does if you buy the land. Have you seen real world? There is land which belongs to the county which i can buy and make that exact decision! Just like you buy the land from the King in Wurm. If you don't want me to build somewhere, you buy that land and that stops me from doing it. It's not a complicated concept.

 

Not true, comparing Wurm with the real world does not make sense. In the real world, to buy land in a country you must in many cases be a citizen of that country. The islands in Wurm do not have this requirement. Well, you can't buy everything you want, just what is for sale, and in the game it's crazy conquest and the one with the bigger wallet gets what he wants and where he wants.

The fact that free accounts can buy deed is broken too. If at least there was a skill that would need to be developed to the appropriate level to be able to buy deed and further expand it, the current system would make some sense. Right now if it comes to buying land it is pure pay for win.

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Just now, Darnok said:

Not true, comparing Wurm with the real world does not make sense.

 

2 hours ago, Darnok said:

 

100 years ago, people even made duels in public to decide who was right.

FFS, make up your mind, will ya?

 

 

 

1 minute ago, Darnok said:

In the real world, to buy land in a country you must in many cases be a citizen of that country.

No, you don't.

2 minutes ago, Darnok said:

Well, you can't buy everything you want, just what is for sale, and in the game it's crazy conquest and the one with the bigger wallet gets what he wants and where he wants.

Yes, yes you can. This is exactly how it works. In real life and in Wurm.

3 minutes ago, Darnok said:

The fact that free accounts can buy deed is broken too. If at least there was a skill that would need to be developed to the appropriate level to be able to buy deed and further expand it, the current system would make some sense. Right now if it comes to buying land it is pure pay for win.

Win what exactly? The tiles of grass? 

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19 minutes ago, Darnok said:

The fact that free accounts can buy deed is broken too. If at least there was a skill that would need to be developed to the appropriate level to be able to buy deed and further expand it, the current system would make some sense. Right now if it comes to buying land it is pure pay for win.

 

When did they change this? In the past you always had to be premium to start a deed. I believe you also need to be premium to have a deed transferred to you. Also what is the end result of this duel? Just to have a book showing the battle or is there something else in mind? 

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2 hours ago, Darnok said:

100 years ago, people even made duels in public to decide who was right. The fact that today honor is at the level of a "bully and a black eye" only speaks badly of the times we live in.

 

No, they were to decide who won, not who was right.  In most places they weren't  public at all, because they weren't legal.  It pretty much an instrument of injustice at the hands of those with the wealth and resources to make sure they won (e.g. able to spend time training instead of working for a living).  The fact is, escapist fantasy is an idealized version of the age.  We can do without the cholera and pox, we can do without duels of "honour" that only reflect who won and little else.

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19 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

FFS, make up your mind, will ya?

 

Current in game features.

 

19 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

 

 

No, you don't.

Yes, yes you can. This is exactly how it works. In real life and in Wurm.

Win what exactly? The tiles of grass? 

 

I see no point... you are not playing this game I guess.

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1 hour ago, Darnok said:

If there is no one to oppose you then you are right

 

That isn't how truth works.  You can force someone to assent, but that is form only and does not indicate that you are right, only that force your will on others instead of persuading.

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19 minutes ago, Darnok said:

Current in game features.

What? Can you elaborate on how you quoting real life and "this is not real life" in next post make sence?

 

20 minutes ago, Darnok said:

I see no point... you are not playing this game I guess.

Same as above, you claim something from real life (the claim being false too) and are presented with a response and this is what you reply with?

 

Or is the winner the one who owns the most tiles in Wurm, based on the real-life (made-up) rules?

 

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What is the * point of this???

I read it as pointless duel with history and SPAMMING EVERYBODY that's online in local and on the server with bull*, I know that I'd not give a * about whoever challenges somebody else or challenges me, idea's pointless, UNLESS you're hardcore RP-er and want to brag with history or won or lost duels, we'd NEED a way to ignore the bull* that this craB is going to generate, as 99.99999999% of the people wont care to see this on daily basis.

 

 

3 hours ago, Darnok said:

duel-header.jpg

100 years ago, people even made duels in public to decide who was right. The fact that today honor is at the level of a "bully and a black eye" only speaks badly of the times we live in.

The fact that you need someone stronger than you and your "opponent" to settle the dispute for you shows that you are not free, but limited by the will of whoever is above you and decides what is right and what is wrong for you.

On the home page, the description of Wurm begins with:

"Developed around the idea that sandboxes should give ultimate freedom..."

Go to chaos already, you can steal, and kill people, no need to declare anything, you only pay 'taxes' if you lose the fight with the local collectors asking for it.

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This suggestions is eh.

I won't -1 it, but it's so low on the priority list i'm not going to +1 it either.

It could be a fancy little feature where you set up a duel with somoene and it shows up when doing archeology or something.

But right now you can do the same thing but just write a book on it ingame instead. If you wish to store that book somewhere you can build a public library.

Up to the player.

 

Also it sounds like you should consider moving to Defiance or Chaos. You'd have more freedom there to stab your neighbour if you don't like the way they look at you.

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I won't say that this is your worst idea, but it's certainly within the top 10 of the dumbest.

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1 hour ago, Finnn said:

Go to chaos already, you can steal, and kill people, no need to declare anything, you only pay 'taxes' if you lose the fight with the local collectors asking for it.

 

43 minutes ago, GroeneAppel said:

Also it sounds like you should consider moving to Defiance or Chaos. You'd have more freedom there to stab your neighbour if you don't like the way they look at you.

 

Told someone before, some maps are too old, no point. The Wurm with its current gameplay system makes it only worth joining maps that are less than a month old.

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22 minutes ago, Darnok said:

 

 

Told someone before, some maps are too old, no point. For me, The Wurm with its current gameplay system makes it only worth joining maps that are less than a month old.

Fixed that for you.

 

That said, why are old (more than a month old) not worth playing? 

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This could already be done with the existing dual mechanics, the only difference is you wouldn't have the system endorsing it and your argument would actually have to stand on it's own two feet to be spread rather than being spammed by the system.

 

All in all, this notion adds nothing new that is desirable (system spam).

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Posted (edited)
58 minutes ago, Darnok said:

Told someone before, some maps are too old, no point. The Wurm with its current gameplay system makes it only worth joining maps that are less than a month old.

So you'll be leaving soon, once the server gets too old for your tastes? 

 

As Etherdrifter points out, this doesn't add anything useful to the game, it's just an E-Peen measuring system that wouldn't even get used. If people aren't willing to duel you now, why would they do so under your pompous, pretentious framework? 

Edited by Nekojin

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5 hours ago, Darnok said:

On the home page, the description of Wurm begins with:

"Developed around the idea that sandboxes should give ultimate freedom..."

Yeah. And they did that. And they quickly learned that griefers made the game un-fun for the majority of the players, in exactly the same way that Ultima Online revealed, so many years ago (and, honestly, had already been proven in MUDs before that). Unrestricted PvP is not appealing to the vast majority of players, because it becomes a way for old players to abuse new players, which harms player retention. 

 

That's why it says Developed around the idea. You start with an idea. Then you polish it, and remove the parts that don't work. This game has 17 years of polishing, and your ideas don't fit. 

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