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Patch Notes 28/SEP/20 – Favor Sacrifice Rework

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About an hour after the server restart (Harmony server):

[16:50:02] There are apparently no coins in the coffers at the moment.

 

Creature spawns is noticeably much better!

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Did some quick test to grind channeling with the pending favor, and i must say from that short test i love it, sure maby a 60 timer before it start to decrese would be nice, but in a whole, i love it.

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7 minutes ago, LionIX said:

There are already resistance to healing/repeated damage spells. There are also cooldown on repeat casting, is it really all that overpowered? (or can those be tweaked?)

there are many spells priests could cast in pvp , and the resistances are on each player not on the priest casting, so having loads of favor on a lib priest for example means everyone can have a hellstrenght cast, same goes for Fo and Oakshell.

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1 hour ago, Maiya said:

I did one update 

it said server was still off line

then after it say retry update 

and I get this 

uWXCwyu.png

 

What to do?

 

i got the same issue

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4 minutes ago, viruskiller said:

there are many spells priests could cast in pvp , and the resistances are on each player not on the priest casting, so having loads of favor on a lib priest for example means everyone can have a hellstrenght cast, same goes for Fo and Oakshell.

Ok, true, but the system as it is makes no difference really. Defensively, you’d have an altar and can buff people after saccing. Maybe no drain unless you get embark or get combat flagged (logoff timer). 

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Suggestion

Lose less favor from storage the lower favor that is stored

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2 hours ago, DevBlog said:

Your total amount of pending Favor is equal to five times your current Faith.

this is a mistake unless youve modified global spells as well to prevent someone from soloing them. Im ok with the rest i guess. (Misread)

I personally wont be oversaccing for extra favor, but i also agree the drain is excessive. I would personally like to see it tied to movement or the altars location, IE not favor degradation or hugely reduced as long as the caster is not moving. Or must be within say 2 tiles of the altar.

Edited by VirusMD

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I can't see myself using this oversaccing system knowingly or deliberately.  I see no benefit in oversaccing if this excess favour can be lost before I get a chance to use it.  That would just be throwing away my time and/or money wouldn't it?

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8 minutes ago, VirusMD said:

this is a mistake unless youve modified global spells as well to prevent someone from soloing them. Im ok with the rest i guess. I personally wont be oversaccing for extra favor, but i also agree the drain is excessive. I would personally like to see it tied to movement or the altars location, IE not favor degredation or hugely reduced as long as the caster is not moving. Or must be within say 2 tiles of the altar.

You are missunderstanding "pending pool" i guess....

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2 minutes ago, Caduryn said:

You are missunderstanding "pending pool" i guess....

ah yes, you are correct, misread

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Sacc 40 favor, around 8-10 favor regenerates during the sacc timer, cast coc - 1 cast for 40-42 favor in whatever, 15 seconds inbetween casts due to sacrificing

Sacc well over favor limit - lose about 1 favor per 5 seconds, don't regenerate the 10 favor inbetween casts, still need to wait 10-15 seconds inbetween casts for favor to regenerate to 50, losing 3 favor here, losing another 4 favor during the 20 second cast time - 57 favor per cast

 

You're using about 40% more favor per cast for no benefit to cast speed or ability to chain cast, absolutely useless.

Edited by Oblivionnreaver
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21 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

Sacc 40 favor, around 8-10 favor regenerates during the sacc timer, cast coc - 1 cast for 40-42 favor in whatever, 15 seconds inbetween casts due to sacrificing

Sacc well over favor limit - lose about 1 favor per 5 seconds, don't regenerate the 10 favor inbetween casts, still need to wait 10-15 seconds inbetween casts for favor to regenerate to 50, losing 3 favor here, losing another 4 favor during the 20 second cast time - 57 favor per cast

 

You're using about 40% more favor per cast for no benefit to cast speed or ability to chain cast, absolutely useless.

You’d think chain casting would be at least tested before going live...

Edited by LionIX
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24 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

Sacc 40 favor, around 8-10 favor regenerates during the sacc timer, cast coc - 1 cast for 40-42 favor in whatever, 15 seconds inbetween casts due to sacrificing

Sacc well over favor limit - lose about 1 favor per 5 seconds, don't regenerate the 10 favor inbetween casts, still need to wait 10-15 seconds inbetween casts for favor to regenerate to 50, losing 3 favor here, losing another 4 favor during the 20 second cast time - 57 favor per cast

 

You're using about 40% more favor per cast for no benefit to cast speed or ability to chain cast, absolutely useless.

Yeah
I'm not sure if you "maybe" can chaincast having exactly 100 favor, cannot test it now as i don't have 100 faith, but this reasoning is still right.

Having to give up the free 10-favor regen that you can use by just saccing 40 favor is already a big downside 
With no favor degen (as suggested before) and faster regeneration, maybe in the future (when favor is cheaper) you could accept the idea of wasting some favor to not have to sacrifice at every cast,  but like this it would just be madness to use it.

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So...  Lets review here.

 

1.  Without sacrificing, initial favour regeneration is still slower than it was prior to the developer's "fix" This was removed

2.  Using links to help level channeling at later levels is no longer viable after the developer's "fix"

3.  The new "favor overflow" feature isn't worse than what we had before (additional favor just poofed), but it doesn't seem to be much of a buff

4.  Sacrificing now takes less time (15 seconds less) which is a clear buff to saccing

 

So, the question is do 1 and 2 outweigh 3 and 4?

 

 

Well...

 

a)  In terms of material cost; no.  You're going to have to sacrifice a lot more during longer channel grind sessions.  This is going to be good for getting rid of bulk items, though in reality it's just going to make the grind unpleasant as this just translates to hours more chopping veggies for favour that would have otherwise naturally regenerated.

 

b)  In terms of time spent; no.  You're definitely not going to be doing natural-regeneration casts; though you could oversacc your two batteries and yourself which would lead to short bursts of chain casting.  However, this comes at a substantial material cost as you're losing about 18 favor per minuite in that setup (according to OR's data) and you'll need to sacc more to accomodate for that.

 

c)  What about sacrificing as a tactic for PvP?  Well yes, you can do it faster and the residual favour will enable you to cast even more spells at the cost of more materials being consumed.  Though, I am not sure this is something they intended to buff...

 

d)  What about  priests who are just starting out?  Most of them use natural regeneration and few actively sacc, so they're worse off generally speaking. Without (1) this is really invalid

 

 

Overall, the only buff seems to have been one that was probably unintended (c), and the general feeling of "the dev team hate priests" is somewhat justified.

Edited by Etherdrifter
-Corrections!
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Devs, could you please inform us of the intention of the new saccing for favor update. I agree with many of the above sentiments and I think Etherdrifter's point is quite valid. If the intent was to make it better for pvp priest (can sac much faster to get more spells off in a fight) or possibly priests at rifts (can get more healing done), then perfect. Seems to have solved that.

 

But the problem is, the intention stated in the feedback thread was to help with channel grinding (although it was not stated why it was felt that channel grinding needs to be buffed and I feel it needs the opposite) then I think this solution falls short for the reasons already stated.

 

Normally, I am sympathetic to you, the devs, as you roll out changes, especially the controversial ones. I try my best to see both sides of the coin. But this time, the way this change has been communicated throughout the development process right up to release leaves me feeling that there is some ulterior motive for this change. Can you please explain the issue that this update is supposed to fix, and as well, how this change fixes the issue?

 

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1 minute ago, McGarnicle said:

Can you please explain the issue that this update is supposed to fix, and as well, how this change fixes the issue?

 

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16 minutes ago, Etherdrifter said:

c)  What about sacrificing as a tactic for PvP?  Well yes, you can do it faster and the residual favour will enable you to cast even more spells at the cost of more materials being consumed.  Though, I am not sure this is something they intended to buff...

 

It's not really useful for PvP. Gems are far more superior, because you waste nothing and do not have to prepare much. Furthermore, PvP interactions typically take a long time to even happen, so you'd waste a lot of saccing mats. There are only some edge cases where it may be a bit useful.

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Just make the potential favor start decaying after 1 min of normal favor being maxed.

That way people can keep grinding without annoyances since a failed cast remove a tiny bit of favor and thus give time to cast again without efficiency losses.

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I really don't think people need to worry about people saccing things for PvP. Even for the defender I don't think it will be able to be used to much effect.

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Can we change the pending favor degeneration if you above max favor to basedecay*(1/faithbonus)? Would make it for enchanting still effektiv and would tie into a allredy existing mecanic that is quit logical (you loose lesser faith in a stonger influance of your god)

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just did a test with 481 favor in the pool and 100 faith priest, only managed to chain 9 CoC casts  to be left with 20 favor and 17 in the pool in the end, that adds up to a total loss of 94 favor .

   the casts were done back to back right after sacrificing not a single second wasted. 

 

    i hope the dev's go with the 1 min timer after cast before pending favor goes to waste after the main favor bar is full.

 

 

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Regarding the "pending favor" change:

  • Natural favor regeneration has not been changed with this update. Due to some lag compensation related issues in the code, there may have been a temporary period where people on some servers were actually experiencing higher than normal Favor regeneration, so some people seem to have gotten the impression that the natural Favor gain rate was lowered at some point. It was not; there was just a short period recently, for maybe 2 or 3 days, when it was too fast on some servers.
  • We'll be making some tweaks to how Favor in the overflow pool decays when your Favor is full. This mechanic is intended to prevent people using it for long-term storage or as an alternative to gems, but we agree that currently it is far too harsh a penalty and makes it difficult to use for its intended purpose. We introduced the feature knowing that some tweaks may be necessary to get it to a point where it feels right, and will be making changes to that effect.
    • The pool will drain significantly more slowly when Favor is full.
    • There will be a delay between adding pending Favor to the pool and the pool decaying, so you will no longer start losing Favor from the overflow pool immediately. This delay will not apply to actually adding Favor from the pool, only to the decay applied when your Favor is already full.
  • Overflowing your Favor by sacrificing animals will also add to the pending Favor pool, in addition to sacrificing items at altars.
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2 minutes ago, Ostentatio said:

or using vesseled gems will also add to the pending Favor pool

why? if you wanted more favor from a gem after using it and maxing out you'd just use it again after spending favor, that's not a good change lol

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5 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

why? if you wanted more favor from a gem after using it and maxing out you'd just use it again after spending favor, that's not a good change lol

 

         i suspect this is because sacrificing animals uses the vesseled gem mechanic and it would take a bit more work to fix...

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New priests are still at a disadvantage in channeling skillgain due to the linking changes. This update doesn't seem to address that, is there more coming?

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