Visible player skills

[Locath 533]

Just now, brattygirl said:

So if I am digging, or mining and someone decides to walk up to me, I should stop what I am doing to run away and keep the 3-4 tiles distance?

Yes and it's not creepy at all to have this one bloke chasing you all over the place to look up your skills...

[Darnok 208]

4 minutes ago, GroeneAppel said:

That's not how this should work and you know it.

There is no way to realisticly always keep that distance from another, unless you forever sit on deed.

And you should not expect others to keep '3-4 tiles away' from another. Please do that irl, but not ingame.

 

Again a community variant for this exists, and if it were ever to make it ingame it would be opt-in and not opt-out.

 

Players deserve their privacy.

 

You have privacy as player, but your pixels in game are not only yours. And I don't like the fact that lack of skill information is used to deceive other players. Why do you have problem if the PvE community in Wurm would be honest? Are you deceiving your neighbors hidding your skills?

[Tpikol 1,057]

come on , this has to be a parody, you cant really mean this nonsense.

[Darnok 208]

2 minutes ago, brattygirl said:

So if I am digging, or mining and someone decides to walk up to me, I should stop what I am doing to run away and keep the 3-4 tiles distance?

 

Well it is your choice. I don't see reason why people would like to hide their skills in PvE other than to harm people near by. I like to be honest with everybody, why you are not? In the real world, you claim to be an employee of Company X, if you are really working for Company Y? Probably not, so why is it allowed here?

[Locath 533]

Just now, Darnok said:

You have privacy as player, but your pixels in game are not only yours. And I don't like the fact that lack of skill information is used to deceive other players. Why do you have problem if the PvE community in Wurm would be honest? Are you deceiving your neighbors hidding your skills?

<sarcasm>

Yes, i lie to them about my skills constantly and it's none of anyone's business.

Not a day goes by when i tell all my neighbours that i reached at 100WS again.

Not a day goes by when they reply with "i don't care"

</sarcasm>

 

Why do you insist on this being a good idea if you know full well this would be an optional thing, just like with the death tab in PvE and you would have to run around for weeks to find a single person with it enabled?

Might as well look it up on niarja.

[Darnok 208]

I pay for premium with real money, why don't I have the right to know what skills the player living nearby has?

[Brattygirl 919]

Just now, Darnok said:

 

Well it is your choice. I don't see reason why people would like to hide their skills in PvE other than to harm people near by. I like to be honest with everybody, why you are not? In the real world, you claim to be an employee of Company X, if you are really working for Company Y? Probably not, so why is it allowed here?

I am honest with the people who I am friends with. But I don't see why random people need to know my business. If we are talking about real world here, does your boss know everything that happens in your home life??? No that would just be stupid. But that doesn't mean you are deceiving your boss. It's just not relevant information that they need to know. 

[atazs 965]

If it is optional then yes

 

Otherwise -1 

[Locath 533]

13 minutes ago, Darnok said:

I pay for premium with real money, why don't I have the right to know what skills the player living nearby has?

Because they don't want you to!

 

Nobody else pays money for playing btw.

[Chakron 1,025]

People should be able to show their skills in game and through an external site, opt-out by default. Anyone who wants to can opt-in.

[Nekojin 197]

1 hour ago, Darnok said:

I pay for premium with real money, why don't I have the right to know what skills the player living nearby has?

Now you're just doing it on purpose. That other person is paying for premium (and it doesn't matter how they pay for it!), why don't they have a right to not have you staring at their skills/stats sheet? 

 

Seriously, your suggestions have this wild split between reality and broad, grotesque unreality, and the only connecting factor between them is "because Darnok wants it that way." If I ran into three people in town in a realistic MMO, would I be able to know, to a decimal point, which one's the best Smith, Cook, and Lockpicker? HOW? 

 

Darnok is just a PvP'er who enjoys ganking, and wants to have certain information on just how tough someone else is before he tries to gank them, so he doesn't get killed when he guesses wrong. 

 

-1 with intensity. 

[Antony 280]

I've played MMOs where players were able to easily lookup one another or send chat commands to display their skills overhead. It enabled players to be valued by their skills and introduced unnecessary competition.

There's a WU leaderboard mod that ranks players in skills. If new players join and see how far behind they are, they might feel discouraged.

[armyskin 930]

-1

[Nekojin 197]

3 hours ago, Antony said:

I've played MMOs where players were able to easily lookup one another or send chat commands to display their skills overhead. It enabled players to be valued by their skills and introduced unnecessary competition.

Those are usually MMOs that have raids, where you need to be sure that everyone who joins a raid will be pulling their own weight, not just being carried by the rest of the raid. It's a LOT different when you're talking about 25+ people spending hours together doing a group-related activity, where having a few slackers can be the difference between success and wasting everyone's time. 

 

There is no such pressure in Wurm; on the PvE side, any community actions (like, say, building an enormous bridge) are limited by whether you can do it or not - people generally don't care if you're failing 90% of your attempts to add that brick, as long as you're actually participating. And there's no bling-y rewards in these, just the personal satisfaction of making something that improves the area. A guy who has 30.01 Masonry and ends up adding just one brick out of the 10,000 needed is still a valued contribution that assisted in the success. 

Edited September 17, 2020 by Nekojin

[Darnok 208]

52 minutes ago, Antony said:

I've played MMOs where players were able to easily lookup one another or send chat commands to display their skills overhead. It enabled players to be valued by their skills and introduced unnecessary competition.

There's a WU leaderboard mod that ranks players in skills. If new players join and see how far behind they are, they might feel discouraged.

 

And? Just because you don't know it it doesn't change fact you are far behind and you are going to fail, you just prefer to know the truth after few weeks.

[Nekojin 197]

16 minutes ago, Darnok said:

 

And? Just because you don't know it it doesn't change fact you are far behind and you are going to fail, you just prefer to know the truth after few weeks.

"Fail" what? 

 

Rules changes need to have a reason beyond "I want this." What problem does this solve? How is this a net benefit to the entire player base? 

[Darnok 208]

1 hour ago, Nekojin said:

"Fail" what? 

 

Rules changes need to have a reason beyond "I want this." What problem does this solve? How is this a net benefit to the entire player base? 

 

The problem with games like Wurm is that if you join the map too late, you have no chance of getting a good place in the lead. The ability to check the skills of other players would allow new players to judge whether it makes sense to join a given server or not, because if they are too late it's a waste of time and they will always be second-class players.

[Brattygirl 919]

17 minutes ago, Darnok said:

 

The problem with games like Wurm is that if you join the map too late, you have no chance of getting a good place in the lead. The ability to check the skills of other players would allow new players to judge whether it makes sense to join a given server or not, because if they are too late it's a waste of time and they will always be second-class players.

 

The thing is there is no real "lead" once you get to 100 in a skill that's it. You are at the top for that skill. And you can see via the wiki what skills have had players reached 100 in. So how does knowing if some player has x in a skill really help anyone?

[Nekojin 197]

41 minutes ago, Darnok said:

 

The problem with games like Wurm is that if you join the map too late, you have no chance of getting a good place in the lead. The ability to check the skills of other players would allow new players to judge whether it makes sense to join a given server or not, because if they are too late it's a waste of time and they will always be second-class players.

Your entire claim is simplistic to the point of being useless. Who is "in the lead" - the guy with 100 Blacksmithing who sells one item a week, or the guy with 60 Blacksmithing who sells a dozen items every day? 

 

If you really see things in such an absolute "1 winner, everyone else is losers" way, no wonder all of your suggestions are horrible. 

 

Edit: A better example. I've just passed 30 Masonry this past weekend. There are dozens of players on my server who are "ahead" of me. But I've made a point to talk about bridges, show some knowledge about bridgework, and demonstrated what I'm already doing with bridges. As a result, I've already got people discussing hiring me to make bridges for them, even though there are other people who are unquestionably more capable of it than I am. 

 

Am I losing? I don't think so. 

Edited September 17, 2020 by Nekojin

[Caduryn 129]

6 hours ago, Darnok said:

I pay for premium with real money, why don't I have the right to know what skills the player living nearby has?

What outstanding stupid reason is that.....?

[Darnok 208]

The fact that so many of you are practically attacking me because of this idea best captures the community mentality and explains why in this form Wurm is a discouraging for most normal people. Not everyone wants to play games, if skills are important, and they are, they should be visible to anyone who comes close enough to my character.

[Nekojin 197]

Your argument continues to be nonsensical. PvE is not a competition. How important skills are varies on a personal level. The fact that you see someone having a higher skill rank than you in something as a potentially rage-quitting (or never-starting) problem is a problem of your own creation, residing completely in your head, not a problem with the game's systems. 

 

And for the record, I'm not attacking you, I'm attacking your horrible ideas. There's a difference there, and the difference is not trivial. 

Edit: And having read through the rest of the thread, I don't see anyone else making personal attacks on you, either. Just your abominable suggestions. 

 

If you want other people to know what skills you have, make a screenshot and link it to them. 

Edited September 17, 2020 by Nekojin

[Darnok 208]

8 minutes ago, Nekojin said:

Your argument continues to be nonsensical. PvE is not a competition. How important skills are varies on a personal level. The fact that you see someone having a higher skill rank than you in something as a potentially rage-quitting (or never-starting) problem is a problem of your own creation, residing completely in your head, not a problem with the game's systems. 

 

And for the record, I'm not attacking you, I'm attacking your horrible ideas. There's a difference there, and the difference is not trivial. 

 

Tell that to the people who put up an empty deed in the west of Cadence with just a horse pen. They stuffed so many animals there that they are dying, but the fact that other players won't get those colored horses for them will probably be profitable.

Tell this to the people who came to Cadence by ships with their entire villages in their holds they took even crafting stations. I think we play two different games, because I see people riding wagons and murdering everything they can to advance faster and get more resources.
Being able to see their statistics would tell you a few things about the map in question. In fact, it should be the official leaderboard showing the top 10 players for each skill.

[Oblivionnreaver 5,175]

7 hours ago, Darnok said:

In the real world, you claim to be an employee of Company X, if you are really working for Company Y? Probably not, so why is it allowed here?

if i sacrifice a random cat i find ingame i get favor but when i sacrifice random cats irl i get the police called on me why this happen??????????????????????

[Nekojin 197]

Quote

 

Tell that to the people who put up an empty deed in the west of Cadence with just a horse pen. They stuffed so many animals there that they are dying, but the fact that other players won't get those colored horses for them will probably be profitable.

Tell this to the people who came to Cadence by ships with their entire villages in their holds they took even crafting stations. I think we play two different games, because I see people riding wagons and murdering everything they can to advance faster and get more resources.
Being able to see their statistics would tell you a few things about the map in question. In fact, it should be the official leaderboard showing the top 10 players for each skill.

 

 

There's a difference between players' actions, and your perceptions on it. You see people grabbing as many beasts as they can, and see them winning and you losing. This is your perception on the matter. You see their actions as competitive, and you extend that logic out to the entire game - you think that because some players are visibly competitive, that the whole game is competitive. This is a failure of logic, a logical fallacy called the Association Fallacy. Players can be competitive in a completely social game. Some people cannot play games without having some form of competitive activities. That does not make the entire game competitive. 

 

Other people have mentioned player-run ranking setups. They have every right to do that, because it's an opt-in system - people who are involved are choosing to be in that. All of your suggestions in this thread would be different, because it would not be opt-in - nobody would have any choice on that, and that would inherently make the game much more competitive than it already is. 

 

You make so many suggestions to create more conflict and competition in the game, it makes me think that maybe Wurm isn't the game for you. Perhaps Black Desert Online, EVE Online, or Albion Online would suit you better? 

Edited September 18, 2020 by Nekojin
Fixing borked quotes