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Rudie

Change Shieldskill

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Title is self-explanatory.

 

It is just  too difficult to raise now.

 

 

Edited by Rudie
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Reposting what I said in one of the update threads  

 

On 7/28/2020 at 4:14 PM, RainRain said:

Shield skill gain is way too slow; as far as I understand, shield skill is gained from blocking creatures that are not too easy to block (blocking attacks often in combat) and not too hard (barely blocking in combat), but more importantly, the damage blocked determines the skillgain. Also, you only gain exp for blocking a creature for the first 15m of combat.

So, while that might work at 50+ shield skill where you can tank trolls and whatnot, it makes early skill abysmal, as there are no creatures you can safely block that actually grant a decent amount of skill per tick. Please remove the "damage dealt -> skill amount' as the rest of the system already works fine to prevent pentraining and such. It's extremely silly that i can gain fightskill and weapon skill many times faster than I can shield skill.



So, yes. Absolutely it needs to change.

Currently, the only way to viably raise ANY shield skill is to first hit 70 fs and THEN attmept to block stronger hitting foes- and I mean strong foes. I managed to sit around blocking a spider for a bit and was only getting .03 shield skill or so.

At. 3. Skill.

It's so bad that I just gave up on using a shield entirely and went with a 2h weapon- and if it isn't fixed sooner than later, that's likely what people will do on a whole.

Edited by RainRain

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Well, while I am all for improving shield skill, I cannot say that shields are that bad albeit rising bit slowly. My shield skill is at 35 atm (vs. FS 93 Agr 86), small metal shield, the one I am using, at 51, shield bashing at 33). That is all not exciting, but gives acceptable blocking and at times sending foes to the ground (even uniques and avatars of gods here and then). As I am mainly using a sickle as 1h weapon it would be stupid not to use a shield. And ofc I am also using a 2h weapon, and carry 2 huge axes (1 LT 1 BT 10k) for that purpose.

 

There are still a few stupid restrictions nerfing shield bashing grind on farm animals which should go away. Also the skill curve could be a bit steeper indeed.

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2 minutes ago, Ekcin said:

Well, while I am all for improving shield skill, I cannot say that shields are that bad albeit rising bit slowly. My shield skill is at 35 atm (vs. FS 93 Agr 86), small metal shield, the one I am using, at 51, shield bashing at 33). That is all not exciting, but gives acceptable blocking and at times sending foes to the ground (even uniques and avatars of gods here and then). As I am mainly using a sickle as 1h weapon it would be stupid not to use a shield. And ofc I am also using a 2h weapon, and carry 2 huge axes (1 LT 1 BT 10k) for that purpose.

 

There are still a few stupid restrictions nerfing shield bashing grind on farm animals which should go away. Also the skill curve could be a bit steeper indeed.

 

you're on the old servers though right? it's totally not the same skillgain between the old servers and the new, it feels comically broken or something atm on the steam servers

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2 minutes ago, Firecat said:

 

you're on the old servers though right? it's totally not the same skillgain between the old servers and the new, it feels comically broken or something atm on the steam servers

 

Can't tell about Northern Freedom (they are not steam servers, btw). If there is a difference between starting with shields on the new and the old cluster, an error report would be appropriate. That must not be the case.

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shield skill grinding rate is based mainly on how strong you are, if you can tank trolls for days you can grind it really fast and if you're a newbie that dies to a scorpion it's insanely slow. having access to LT and not being 20 strength helps greatly. its also really slow for the first 15 points or so because you can only get shield skill when you block and you can't block anything until you get skill lol

 

a fun way to cheese this is to have an alt healing you while you fight, go and get the kings robes for infinite cotton 😘

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agreed , even the shield bash level is horrible. PLEASE change it for the better.

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33 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

its also really slow for the first 15 points or so because you can only get shield skill when you block and you can't block anything until you get skill lol



honestly, if they want to prevent pentraining but have this sort of system, just have pentraining only viable to be used until 20 skill similar to how some weaponskills can be grinded until 20 by chopping trees, and then have pentraining not give any gains past 20

sure, it was silly in the past where you'd need to sit afk for a few days until 70/90 shield skill but this in no way is any better.

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just stop complaining.. you all playing on new servers. no 70+ql shields, no coc on them, i bet noone uses sleep bonus while shield training too, so yes, its slow i get that.. however, once you get 70 coc on 70 ql shield, will have the ability to spend sleep, that shield skill from 1 to 20 will go up in an hour training on phesants (as they hit fast = more skill gain per minute)

 

You all wanted a FRESH start on those steam servers, so why the hell are you complaining all the time that this is hard or that is hard.. Like what did you expect in new server? a walk in the park? 

 

Plus, at low skill your main shield skill gain is from shield bashing as you cant block. so keep shield bashing.. train shield actively

Edited by Skatyna

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3 hours ago, Rakki said:

shield skill has allway been hard early on

 

No it hasn't, It was changed 4 years ago and made absolute trash.

 

 

@Skatyna

 

Who are you? lol.

 

Having played this game for 15 years I know how to skill up an account from scratch. This change isn't for my benefit, it is for everyones benefit as the current system is broken and has been since it was changed. If you knew anything about grinding shield skill at all, you'd know you don't want a high quality shield ever to grind it.

Edited by Rudie
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13 minutes ago, Skatyna said:

just stop complaining.. you all playing on new servers. no 70+ql shields, no coc on them, i bet noone uses sleep bonus while shield training too, so yes, its slow i get that.. however, once you get 70 coc on 70 ql shield, will have the ability to spend sleep, that shield skill from 1 to 20 will go up in an hour training on phesants (as they hit fast = more skill gain per minute)

 

You all wanted a FRESH start on those steam servers, so why the hell are you complaining all the time that this is hard or that is hard.. Like what did you expect in new server? a walk in the park? 

 

Plus, at low skill your main shield skill gain is from shield bashing as you cant block. so keep shield bashing.. train shield actively



i don't think you have any idea what you're talking about

even if my skillgain was tripled i wouldn't be gaining much skill at all- and "hit fast = more skill gain per minute" is entirely wrong. The skill tick size is based off the damage dealt by the mob, so if you're fighting some weak ###### like a pheasant or pig or horse etc etc, you aren't going to get any sizeable ticks at all

if we're expected to wait on coc/botd before we gain reasonable skill (both take 51 faith aka 200 days of praying without sermons), then there's a massive damned oversight on skillgain.

fresh start isn't the issue; on Epic release, skillgain might've been higher due to curve+increased gain in general, but even considering that it was significantly better than this in every way. the problem is that the skillgain method was changed ages ago so that farming off of weaker mobs is impossible (including the fact that you can't sit on the same mob for more than 15 minutes every 2-4 hours).

the skillgain seems like it would be fine after 30-40 skill or so where you can reliably try and parry hard hitting mobs like trolls- but right now, it's silly. I can barely block attacks from anything more accurate than a horse and because of that, my skillgain suffers. But even if I block an attack from a horse, i gain next to zero skillgain because the attack is so weak (even blocking a lava spider for a bit barely gave me anything)

edit: bashing also sucks for skillgain and i've been bashing basically every opportunity i get; i don't even know what to say about it other than it's glacial and barely gives shield skill either

Edited by RainRain

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11 minutes ago, RainRain said:

i don't think you have any idea what you're talking about

 

Clearly you have no idea what you are talking to start with yourself lol :D if you think starting shield training on phesants is wrong, we have no more discussion here... L2P is all i can say to you. Im not gonna explain you here 5 pages worth of mechanics of skill gain vs difficulty that wurm is based on. Last thing i will tell you is that i shield-trained 6 accounts from 1 in the last 10 months. That was way passed the shield skill gain update that took place years ago and all those alt priest characters are running around with 70+ shield skill. 

 

End of the day, once again, you wont get any skill with a plain not enchanted 20ql shield without using sleep bonus tanking trolls at skill 1 🤣:D

Edited by Skatyna

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1 minute ago, Skatyna said:

 

Clearly you have no idea what you are talking to start with yourself lol :D if you think starting shield training on phesants is wrong, we have no more discussion here... L2P is all i can say to you. Im not gonna explain you here 5 pages worth of mechanics of skill gain vs difficulty that wurm is based on. Last thing i will tell you is that i shield-trained 6 accounts from 1 in the last 10 months. That was way passed the shield skill gain update that took place years ago and all those alt priest characters are running around with 70+ shield skill. 

  

On 7/18/2020 at 7:52 AM, Skatyna said:

So.. all this thread is so much about what should and what shouldnt be in this new server to balance things etc. I did a small test. So it happened i needed an alt, so i made a new one. Premmed it straight away. It gets 24 hours newbie buffs. Now, i didnt gear that toon up with my main, nor it received any help from other characters. Purely noob toon play in experienced player hands. The outcome is simple - during 24hours of game play, that toon has 50 fighting skill, 60 chosen weapon skill, 35 chosen shield skill, 30 each normal/agrro stance skill, can ride a horse, has above 20.10 mind logic and can craft his own leather armour, shield and weapon up to 50QL gathering all materials himself. I specifically had that 24 hours play time frame as thats how long newbie buffs last giving you a nice buff to choose what to kill and how you farm without aggroing everything and dyeing multiple times. 

 

in comparison, on average it takes 2 weeks if not more for a fresh player to even ride a horse, way, way more to hit 50 fighting skill.. 

 

Now add the fact that experienced players make groups, where fighters dont craft/gather leaving dedicated crafters/gatherers to do that while they just grind fighting. Combine that and you will see that after just 2 days if not less you will see group of 70fs fighters in 70ql gear roaming around whacking newbies that are still "looking for iron to mine". Then add on top this, that the pvp server will be released 1 week later that most state "it does" not affect much lol. that means, those groups will be even able to start their pvp server career already having 70ql gear on them in the first 1-2 hours since server opens. 

 

How do you call this for a BALANCE? lol Do you really think it will make the difference where newbies spawn, how fast foal grow, what meditations allowed/disallowed and other crap? No, it WONT! 




yeah i don't think i need to hear any more of your opinions

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17 minutes ago, RainRain said:

yeah i don't think i need to hear any more of your opinions

 

then dont, heres the tissue, wipe your eyes, complain to your daddy to get a tap on the shoulder and be gone. Plenty of trolls so just keep training. NO PAIN NO GAIN noob

 

EDIT: for others who interested, try shield training in 1st person view, as there really is a bug when you just dont block at all in 3rd person camera..

Edited by Skatyna

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Please update shield skill. I went hunting for 4 hours last night and killed over 100 mobs. Went from 1 in a shield to 2 in a shield. That is dopey.

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one thing i think is important to add is that shield skill gain is specifically slower in starter zones (for some reason?)- but i did most of my grinding outside of the starter zone, so it's not that gimping my gains

for defiance ofc; obviously doesn't apply outside of defiance, but really that's what this thread is made to address anyways

Edited by RainRain

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