Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Wilczan said: Second part is misleading, couse shop isn't P2W. It is not P2W, even if you can buy tons of silver and then buy tons of good items from players. You still need develop skills of your toon. "In general a game is considered pay-to-win when a player can gain any gameplay advantage over his or her non-paying peers, which is shown in games such as FIFA." Buy silver, buy sleep powder. That would surely accelerate skill growth, and thus falls under the technical definition offered. However, it would be misleading to assert that it satisfies all parts of the definition, since a non-paying player could still forage/botanist/bury/hunt for silver and thus obtain the same advantages. Also, this is a definition taken from Wikipedia, which may be unreliable. However, it is undeniable that of two players, who play for the same amount of time at the same level and of efficiency, a player who pays more will progress further which is the spirit of what "pay-to-win" (appears to) protest. Edited July 22, 2020 by Etherdrifter -White background for text fix Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 I can go hunting for a few hours get a few silver and buy a few sleep powder from players in the game or i can buy directly from the trader or buy premium time and get a bonus reward of sleep bonus for spending money to buy prem vs ingame silver to buy prem I do not see how that is p2w the only bad thing in the game that can only be bought with real life money is the gift boxes with their silly value's behind it and thats more over a lootbox thing then a p2w mechanic as its no where near cost effective Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 It's P2W-ish, honestly. But unless we're talking PvP, there isn't much to "win" over another, and with little to no content gatekept behind paying real cash to begin with, I find the P2W aspect of Wurm one of the less egregious instances. It also feels a bit muddled up with, and dwarfed by, the P2P aspect; I want to have a large deed to fullfill my projects, but that costs more money. Is that P2P or P2W now? I wouldn't have to deed this large, but as they say, deed it or lose it...so by deeding it, I "win"? I don't know, the whole gripe against P2W feels pretty moot and insignificant. Just my 1,5 cents. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Etherdrifter said: Buy silver, buy sleep powder. That would surely accelerate skill growth, and thus falls under the technical definition offered. However, it would be misleading to assert that it satisfies all parts of the definition, since a non-paying player could still forage/botanist/bury/hunt for silver and thus obtain the same advantages. Also, this is a definition taken from Wikipedia, which may be unreliable. A non paying player can also log off, get 5 hours of sleep bonus and get the same advantage. Sleep powders are only used for massive grind fests that can last from 4-8 hours, or more depending on available playtime. I keep asking the same thing as having an "advantage" versus other players requires a better definition of what an "advantage" actually means. Outside of pvp, so called "advantages" are merely either aesthetic (buying skins, buying scale armours or rare items that offer little bonuses compared to how non-challenging pve generally is. You can just as well hunt in chainmail or iron plate. ) or "small QOL improvements" = aka buying a magic chest using the marks system to prevent decay on useful stuff. Can we say it's a little P2W on the PvP side? Definitely yes. Especially since i could buy 5-10 years of premium, get a boatload of marks and buy tomes with them what will have an influence in pvp. Pve = not pay to win, but rather pay for convenience. Pvp = yes, it can be pay to win but ultimately coordinations, pvp skill and tactics will overcome enemy player advantages. P2W Gated Content? = No. Everyone who buys premium gets the same options. You don't have to pay EUROS to unlock the ability to ride a horse or become a priest. No content is gated under a paywall if you're premium. There aren't any hidden DLCs like in other games where you have to pay money to unlock a weapon or an NPC. Edited July 22, 2020 by elentari 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 1 hour ago, elentari said: A non paying player can also log off, get 5 hours of sleep bonus and get the same advantage. As I said, it is questionable if it satisfies the entire definition. However, it certainly meets the spirit of things (sleep powders are essentially "2x experience cards", which are definitely considered a pay to win mechanic), but the ability to earn them throws this in question. Under reasonable play (<5 hours per 24 hours, which is reasonable) no advantage is really offered. However, under heavy play (8+ hours a day) an advantage is definite.[Disclaimer - I am just exploring this notion, not arguing that wurm should be trashed on reddit, which it definitely should not be] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 theres no pay 2 win in wurm because nobody is a winner when they play it 🤔 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 I wouldn't say wurm online has P2W systems. Yes, you can get an advantage by spending $$$ on Silver, but there are no highscores, not end Bosses/Levels/Dungeons, so there are no mechanics to Highlight that you are better because you paid money. You could spend money to buy a rare rake so you get better crops, but does it really matter? Besides, the items you can buy come from other players. I'd consider Wurm to be P2W if you could buy priest conversion tokens from the shop directly.. Or maybe spend 5€ for a rarity powder, which converts every item into a rare one. I understand the concern of many about real life money and Silver, but I'd say it's a bit different here if you compare Wurm to other games. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 Anyway, so there's an r/MMORPG post that's doing fairly well atm.r/MMORPG Wurm Online post about Friday's launch. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Red said: Anyway, so there's an r/MMORPG post that's doing fairly well atm.r/MMORPG Wurm Online post about Friday's launch. That's a pretty nice response! I think they have always been pretty supportive of the game. PCGamer & RockPaperShotgun also used to be fairly supportive, are they covering the Steam launch at all? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
