An Idea to help the economy.

[Badvoc 204]

There is discussion on the town square part of the forum about the economy and I was asked to post my suggestion here:-

 

 

I feel there needs to be a kick start to the economy, it feels again that I missed the boat by joining late to carve out a trading skill to make some silvers and find my best bet is to forage for coins or just buy them from the online store. 

 

So I think the suggestion of new items or a second system is quite interesting.

 

So my idea is:-

 

How about a new Kingdom work order system, the starter towns could have a work order message board with jobs that need to be completed for the kingdom , orders from the king that rewards you a new currency "kingdom coins"  these coins can only be traded in the new Kingdom  Shop, that allows you to buy new recipes   the recipes that you buy from there can be traded. This system is already in game with the drop cooking recipes that can only be made if the recipe is learnt.

 

This I think could create the demand for items, a long term player who has his deed finished may want the new recipe for his BS skill, but doesn't want to invest the time making bricks for the current Kingdom work order So would want to buy them, this would create demand that new players could fill, My first wurm job was to make rivets and it was great as it improved my black smith skill while earning a few silver to help pay for a few needed items,  to keep things moving and not going stale, just add new recipes that can be bought. Also due to the time demands of earning kingdom Coins 1 player couldn't just  buy all the recipes, so different new recipes would be spread out among different players giving everyone the chance to make the silver back invested. 

 

The system could be set up sort of like a role-play thing too, So for example The king decides he wants to build a new castle, the work orders would be for the mats needed for said castle + items for the inside. next time it could be to kit out his army, so the orders would be for swords / shields / Armour you get the idea. 

 

I think something like that would help the economy more than forcing people to go and get items imp'ed, what happens if the demand is more than supply, the supplies would maybe help friends first, but the likes of myself who is new would have to pay over the odds to get my items imp'd back up or wait or go back to using and imp'ing my own tools, which defeats the object of the extra damage / decay as I wouldn't be trading, I would be doing it myself.

Edited May 12, 2020 by Badvoc

[kochinac 1,395]

I very much like idea about learnable crafting recepies that can be acquired on different ways. But I think motivation for them should be fun and challenge and not kick starting economy...

[LionIX 354]

Maybe a system where certain crafts (ws, cloth, ships,etc) allow you to activate a special book on a relevant item(ship, tool, weapon) over a certain QL threshold. You get the option to study the object which has a timer over 1 minute. This destroys the object. Add a time delay before next analysis (maybe 20 hours?). Have each item progress you toward a medium to long term goal (high enchants, rarity, higher QL give a bonus on the progress). 
 

Then give some sort of bonus for completion. Title, maybe a special crafting recipe (but be careful not to make it clearly better than normal items, maybe just visual difference and maybe reduced damage) or some bonus to the craft (like imping ql gains or skillgain). 
 

This would add an item sink for an economy. It could also give some flavor to the various trades.  Progress in the goal would need to be carefully balanced to make sure this is a specialization and also give incentive to use nicer items (but avoid some loophole item that’s super easy to make with good gains). Also maybe allow you to only choose 1 craft at a time to work toward (so people don’t get them all at once). 

[Badvoc 204]

12 minutes ago, kochinac said:

I very much like idea about learnable crafting recepies that can be acquired on different ways. But I think motivation for them should be fun and challenge and not kick starting economy...

 

I agree Fun is the most important part of the game but the idea is to make the game more fun for new players let me explain,

 

When I started a couple of months ago now I was excited so many skills, so much to do, even the hard learning curve couldnt dampen my mood, I started to plan my place in the world, it took less than a week to resized I had missed the boat on most skills with regards the trading game which is very important,  so I asked around and was told making bulk for players is a good way to earn your first coins, but the game is old and it seems many people are pretty much finished with deed building and the demand for bulk items are low, never mind the problems in transporting them. So very quickly it seemed I could earn more coins from foraging which takes away some of the MMO trading aspects, it would take months of grinding to get a skill upto a level where I could even compete to sell a crafted item, unless the range gods where kind and I craft a rare, thats not even accounting for the fact I dont have a priest to cast spells on said item so I resigned myself that I have truely missed the boat with the big craft-able trade skills and all thats left is "bulk" or the odd rare.

 

But if there was a consent demand for crafted items, a "item sink" that would mean theres more chance for new players to gain a foothold and generate a new stronger economy, if I could earn silver by supplying a "older" player bulk items so he could hand these items in for kindom coins I could find my basic skills improve while having the chance to earn a few coins, so for example:-

 

The kingdom work order is for bricks, "older player" doesnt want to spend his time making bricks but wants to earn some Kingdom Coins as he has his mind set on a new BS recipe, me as a new player would see this as the perfect chance to

a:- leveling mining for the shards,

b level masonry

c earn a few coins

and I would feel useful and part of the wurm world as they would be demand for low level services. 

 

But lets say I have no interest in making bulk for silver coins, I could use the bricks myself to gain kingdom coins to have the goal to get a new recipe even with lower skill I would have a recipe that could be sort after.

 

This I would hope would get silver moving around, cause say once I saved up 8 silver I would buy a boat or starter tools, or whatever.

 

Its a very basic idea and needs fleshed out, I havent played long enbough to know all the ins and outs, but from what I have seen I think a system like this could be quite fun, more so if new recipes we added quite often.

[ArthurHawkwing 176]

Hmmm interesting was thinking something similar in Alliance chat the other day. Would love to see more missions for the Pantheon where players make tools, weapons, ect to sac. While you gain Karma, sleep for this, would be cool for players to also gain points they could trade in for "Kingdom Currency" then used to buy unique crafting recipes. Make these recipes either new skins with the makers mark and or new and unique items not in the game. Maybe medium quality tools, weapons, armor with decent buffs "New spells or runes not yet seen", that will mainly help new players vs old player who can craft 70 plus quality items.  Maybe set a limit on the number of the items crafted too? Idea sounds cool above, WURM definitely needs a bustling growing economy. Hehe maybe even add a in new mobs that damage and or can destroy a weapon or armor piece on advanced players. 

[Skatyna 432]

ok so if i grinded my weaponsmithing to 90 that took... 4ever and now i want to craft some newly added "warclub" weapon i would need some silly recipe to buy of someone or grind for it? Thanks, no. Wurm never had recipe based crafting and i dont see it even having it now. 

[Badvoc 204]

1 hour ago, Skatyna said:

ok so if i grinded my weaponsmithing to 90 that took... 4ever and now i want to craft some newly added "warclub" weapon i would need some silly recipe to buy of someone or grind for it? Thanks, no. Wurm never had recipe based crafting and i dont see it even having it now. 

 

And that would be your choice,  why should cooking be the only skill that has some recipes locked behind grinding mobs for drops or buying from other players?

 

 

[Finnn 3,302]

What's the point to get new items? are they going to be superior in any way.. 

 

if you can make 2k bricks in an afternoon.. what if I tell you somebody else can do it in 30min and another 8 quests that same day?

 

Do you think you can catch up?

 

Another thing.. what you can not do on your own.. can do with mass producing alts.. some people have bunch of these.. if you get 1 rare recipe.. another will have 20, how do you imagine you'll catch a fraction of the market than?

 

Alts are core part of this game.. and balancing nice things around them is kind of tough job... whoever pays more will have an edge over you every time, only way to compete is spending more time and money.

 

Competition with the mentioned above will work well for the company, while.. anyway; but the game is mostly casual and almost all competing in it is for the pvp fellas, on pve it doesn't matter who you are or what you can, what you have, etc.. you mostly play to enjoy the game.

 

If you think a random new comer can go into a xx year old world and be a 'somebody' on day 1... you're in the wrong world mah dood.

[Skatyna 432]

37 minutes ago, Badvoc said:

 

And that would be your choice,  why should cooking be the only skill that has some recipes locked behind grinding mobs for drops or buying from other players?

 

 

 

because cooking is truly optional. and those recipes that are dropped (aka grinded out) gives nothing really. they are not primary target to have, they do not influence gameplay in any way. You want cookign chores? stay to it, craft some ice cream that fills no bars or so, i cook old school way that is meat+veggie in a pan. both of us arent starving, thats whats cookings all about. Adding recipes for items restricts players from having those items and wurm is free build/crafting items game. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by Skatyna

[Badvoc 204]

1 minute ago, Skatyna said:

 

because cooking is truly optional. and those recipes that are dropped (aka grinded out) gives nothing really. they are nog primary target to have, they do not influence gameplay in any way. You want cookign chores? stay to it, craft some ice cream that filles no bars or so, i cook old school way that is meat+veggie in a pan. both of us arent starving, thats whats cookings all about. Adding recipes for items restricts players from having those items and wurm is free build/crafting items game. 

But so many things are locked in different ways, I know the chances of me crafting my own "dragon" armour are next to zero,  will I ever see the troll king, most likely not, so as a free build crafting game when will I have the option to build all the different guard towers or craft the different colour PMK banners?

 

And thats fine, its ok to have to trade for an item, I want to improve my hammer, but I didnt level my mining I can either level mining or buy a little ore to get the job done. Same if new interesting crafting recipes where in game, you would have choice, trade for it, earn it yourself or not bother, I dont understand the problem with that concept, how would that effect your game play, its not forced on you to get a "new recipe"  if you didn't want it.

 

Anyway was a basic idea to help the economy and give a little more purpose to new players, having a work order in starter towns could lead new players down crafting routes and help them learn the game also, remember most new players are used to "quest" systems, this could serve to also give them reasons to do some basic leveling instead of being told, like I was "ohh you want to build a stone house, build some coffins imp them all day until you reach 30 then you can build your house, yea thats fun. The way I did it was helped on projects for a couple of weeks and before I knew it My little wooden hut was upgraded to stone and was happy as can be without grinding an item I would never use, unless I am mistake about wurm and it is after all just about grinding numbers?

 

 

[Bartiluss 11]

+1

 

[newman330 72]

+1 - needs more thought, but anything to spread the wealth and attract/keep new players is worth considering

[Finnn 3,302]

How do you spread wealth and implement a feature for new content that is not based on skill, effort or account-count based?

[Etherdrifter 2,517]

I can see some very interesting possibilities for priests (buying new spells); though their method of making money would likely be trickier (resource gathering restrictions in place/inability to improve).

 

However, for crafter's, this kind of system would be ideal.

[elentari 2,660]

Missions at least need far better rewards for people to get invested in them. Sleep bonus is nice but to be honest I barely have time to burn the current hours I have so it's moot for a lot of people.

 

Karma? Useful for pvp sure and some situational pve shenanigans but that's about it. At least on Epic missions gave you a chance in the past to become a god, a chance to earn tomes/cherries, or earning moon metal bits. I think entire systems would need to be revamped if the economy would take off again.

 

I'd edit missions in tiers based on starting missions for starter towns as it was suggested. 

 

I think it's a design philosophy thing in Wurm but most things don't give big advantages so people can actively pursue them in game. Perhaps if that changed the economy would change with it.

 

My biggest issue is that there's no real progression to most things like in other games to encourage trade. Aka buy a certain amount of consumables so you can finish a questline in order to get to the next phase of the game. Think dungeon tiers in other games. That provides an economy of its own. But in Wurm things are mostly permanent once bought. In order for the economy to flourish, the items you buy have to have a huge impact in the game in order to justify their price. That plus the fact that 99% of items can be traded means they will never leave the game. A player wants to quit Wurm? He sells his stuff and gets silvers. Said items don't leave the game. And while there is a market for rare/supreme things, most of them provide little to no bonus. They simply aren't worth the trouble outside of quantifiable bonuses such as rare horse gear or a rare pickaxe.

Edited May 13, 2020 by elentari

[Finnn 3,302]

5 hours ago, elentari said:

Missions at least need far better rewards for people to get invested in them. Sleep bonus is nice but to be honest I barely have time to burn the current hours I have so it's moot for a lot of people.

 

Karma? Useful for pvp sure and some situational pve shenanigans but that's about it. At least on Epic missions gave you a chance in the past to become a god, a chance to earn tomes/cherries, or earning moon metal bits. I think entire systems would need to be revamped if the economy would take off again.

 

I'd edit missions in tiers based on starting missions for starter towns as it was suggested. 

 

I think it's a design philosophy thing in Wurm but most things don't give big advantages so people can actively pursue them in game. Perhaps if that changed the economy would change with it.

 

My biggest issue is that there's no real progression to most things like in other games to encourage trade. Aka buy a certain amount of consumables so you can finish a questline in order to get to the next phase of the game. Think dungeon tiers in other games. That provides an economy of its own. But in Wurm things are mostly permanent once bought. In order for the economy to flourish, the items you buy have to have a huge impact in the game in order to justify their price. That plus the fact that 99% of items can be traded means they will never leave the game. A player wants to quit Wurm? He sells his stuff and gets silvers. Said items don't leave the game. And while there is a market for rare/supreme things, most of them provide little to no bonus. They simply aren't worth the trouble outside of quantifiable bonuses such as rare horse gear or a rare pickaxe.

In wurm that's "literally only".. sleep powders.. to make a grind easier.. being a skill or weapon mastery.. etc.

If you were to grind making something that requires a lot of like guy mentioned above.. making rivets or lockpicks, etc... in bulk... as long skill or creation caps creation timer at some high number... to be efficiently moving forward and not wrecking yours .. you're forced to buy from others to progress further in shorter time.

^ seems ok.. hm... but.. wurm have alts... what you can not do on your own.. you can do on your own usually.. for most things... so.. trading is not exactly required in most cases... you buy mostly stuff you're lazy to craft, don't have time to do it or lack the skill/ability for it.. like the usual bulk and special services being crafting or enchants/abilities used etc. 

[Badvoc 204]

57 minutes ago, Finnn said:

In wurm that's "literally only".. sleep powders.. to make a grind easier.. being a skill or weapon mastery.. etc.

If you were to grind making something that requires a lot of like guy mentioned above.. making rivets or lockpicks, etc... in bulk... as long skill or creation caps creation timer at some high number... to be efficiently moving forward and not wrecking yours .. you're forced to buy from others to progress further in shorter time.

^ seems ok.. hm... but.. wurm have alts... what you can not do on your own.. you can do on your own usually.. for most things... so.. trading is not exactly required in most cases... you buy mostly stuff you're lazy to craft, don't have time to do it or lack the skill/ability for it.. like the usual bulk and special services being crafting or enchants/abilities used etc. 

Not everyone has alts, but if you wanted to lock items behind a "time wall" just make it a cap on how much you can hand in each day?

 

You could also have projects that unlocks new items that can be built by everyone,  so for example hand in 100000 milk, planks, ribbons and nails, and it unlocks the milking shed that can be built by everyone that acts a lot like the chicken coop, but you get milk instead of eggs, 

 

So are researching a new tec by supplying the items, the above example was first thing that popped into my head.

 

Like I said at the start its a rough idea that I was asked to post here. 

 

But don't under estimate how powerful the "collection" is for people, some people love to collect things and this sort of system can add a new goal for old and new people alike.

Edited May 13, 2020 by Badvoc