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Patch Notes 30/APR/20

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Those pvp changes are just a boost to BL, nothing else.  champs with scorns now like platinumteef said, every priest can link favours in the kingdom, since they do not really have any healing spells, but do have damage spells like no others, nerf FO's healing, so thats not an issue no more. Since all priests have tangle, can nerf that, as the only libila doesnt really use it as have better spells to use unlike some priests like vyn.. 

 

Just a great pvp change lol. really balances out a lot and will make more ppl to pvp... well as libilas maybe, but there will be no others to fight lol

 

EDIT: sorry, forgot to mention venom nerf.. that defo had to be added, as poison cant be sponged, BL doesnt have heals and nearly everyone is running with +10 physical tome, making them vulnerable to poison too.. Like acid or frost damages (potions applied) is not an issue, have resistances on those lol but venom was WL pvp weapon really, so obviously had to be added so it glances now 

Edited by Skatyna

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1 minute ago, Skatyna said:

Those pvp changes are just a boost to BL, nothing else.  champs with scorns now like platinumteef said, every priest can link favours in the kingdom, since they do not really have any healing spells, but do have damage spells like no others, nerf FO's healing, so thats not an issue no more. Since all priests have tangle, can nerf that, as the only libila doesnt really use it as have better spells to use unlike some priests like vyn.. 

 

Just a great pvp change lol. really balances out a lot and will make more ppl to pvp... well as libilas maybe, but there will be no others to fight lol

great pvp changes EXCEPT vyn gets blasted just takes away one of her 4 useful spells, being vyn champ im a day away from dechamping just to be mag or FO they just keep making her more worthless casting than she is

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8 minutes ago, Skatyna said:

Those pvp changes are just a boost to BL, nothing else.  champs with scorns now like platinumteef said, every priest can link favours in the kingdom, since they do not really have any healing spells, but do have damage spells like no others, nerf FO's healing, so thats not an issue no more. Since all priests have tangle, can nerf that, as the only libila doesnt really use it as have better spells to use unlike some priests like vyn.. 

 

Just a great pvp change lol. really balances out a lot and will make more ppl to pvp... well as libilas maybe, but there will be no others to fight lol

 

and i am pretty sure that these changes all stem from people that have just as much experience in pvp as you do, well said man

 

just to make it 100% clear, this is supposed to be sarcasm, i dont take chances anymore these days

Edited by Quicktor

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1 minute ago, Quicktor said:

 

and i am pretty sure that these changes all stem from people that have just as much experience in pvp as you do, well said man

 

i was sarcastic saying 

 

10 minutes ago, Skatyna said:

Just a great pvp change lol

 

But i guess if i have to explain that to you we finish talking here

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I just really wish I knew where this came from. No one wanted this, it wasn't discussed, and it simply just doesn't make sense. I really would like to hear some developer or community relations feedback on where this stemmed from. Pvp is just now reviving and I'm loving it. I'd really like it not hit by a shovel if they keep this direction thinking they know better for what the community wants. Really not trying to complain. I just thought Wurm came long way on taking feedback and suggestions. I guess how this is handled will decide that for me.

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Don't want to add too much to the PvP change criticism which seems justified anyway. It would be a good idea to first think, test, discuss with the community, then implement, not the other way round. 

 

Instead, somebody could have worked on the disembark/dismount bug which killed scores of players and harrassed even more during the last weeks. There is not even a status given for.

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The goal of these changes is to remove the reliance on priests and counter the spell-spam meta that is currently dominant. We want to reduce the number of priests needed in a fight to be viable, and as such have reduced the spell-spam effects. 

As we continue to work on the game, make adjustments and correct bugs, there are times in which spells and priests will be affected. While we will always take transfers into account when performing large overhauls, small balances such as these are not going to be viable to receive a transfer option.

Before the priest overhaul, only heal could be cast while on moving vehicles. Unfortunately, the change led to spam-casting cure wounds by multiple people by directly targetting the body. 

Healing resistance is designed to reduce the effectiveness of healing in protracted fights. The current resistance does not increase fast enough to play any tactical role, and as such, we have increased the rate in which it grows. Please note, this change does not increase healing resistance for enchants like Life Transfer but does affect spells like Scorns healing.

 

The lack of a tangible cooldown on Tangleweave further promoted the priest-heavy meta, allowing multiple priests to shut down the enemy team. We have added this cooldown to create a more tactical use of it, but we're going to be seeing how this plays out and adjust if necessary. 

All armour types now have a 20% glance rate against poison damage. This makes poison the only enchant effective against all armour types equally at the lowest rate of other damage types.

We're aware that this limits Vynora's viability in PvP and we're open to looking at her and adjusting if necessary as well. 

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From my testing with a 103 venom weapon, glance rate was around 20%. if i was to use a salved fa/fb weapon instead i'd have 25% glance chance against leather studded leather chain and scale, and 35% glance chance against plate and drake, all the while doing 33% more damage. you've made venom a 100% meme spell and i congratulate you for completely ruining it solely because archaed lost a spar. Literally nobody was using venom in pvp anyway lol

 

1 minute ago, Retrograde said:

Before the priest overhaul, only heal could be cast while on moving vehicles. Unfortunately, the change led to spam-casting cure wounds by multiple people by directly targetting the body. 

You can still use focused will to do the same thing. Mag is now a better healing priest in boat fights then the actual god dam priest dedicated to healing.

Edited by Oblivionnreaver
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3 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

From my testing with a 103 venom weapon, glance rate was around 20%. if i was to use a salved fa/fb weapon instead i'd have 25% glance chance against leather studded leather chain and scale, and 35% glance chance against plate and drake, all the while doing 33% more damage. you've made venom a 100% meme spell and i congratulate you for completely ruining it solely because archaed lost a spar. Literally nobody was using venom in pvp anyway lol

 

I lose lots of fights, even against mobs. 

 

4 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

You can still use focused will to do the same thing. Mag is now a better healing priest in boat fights then the actual god dam priest dedicated to healing.

Thanks for pointing that out, will get it added to work the same as cure light

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The spell spam argument comes from a group of like 10 players that remain in T......panda....sorry all the same nowadays.

If you would have looked at the problem like you described, you would have found focused will like oblivion said and changed that aswell.

 

Boat fights have a far greater problem at the moment, which you should know about due to the numerous complaints.

You can't reliably take boat fights with the new furling system and the fact that you lose stamina while sailing no matter what (apart from drifting), oh and yeah, embark bug is back btw.

We haven't heard a thing from devs if it's getting fixed or being worked on.

 

Venom was okay like it was, but whatever, you saw it once in a spar and deemed it OP, all good.

It did 55% less damage for the fact that it had a 5% glance rate, now with 20% it's just useless all together.

 

Oh and the fact that we don't get another faith change just shows that you don't even know how significant this "minor" update was.

Tangleweave has a 5min cooldown now, 3 MINUTES LONGER than Light of Fo.

 

Real question is, when are the NEEDED changes coming?

Why work on healing, mostly in boat pvp, that no matter what will remain a dumb mechanic since I don't see you changing your praised sailing system?

 

Next time, at least start a discussion thread, jesus.

Edited by Quicktor
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2 minutes ago, Quicktor said:

Venom was okay like it was, but whatever, you saw it once in a spar and deemed it OP, all good.

It did 55% less damage for the fact that it had a 5% glance rate, now with 20% it's just useless all together.

at 100 power it had no reduced damage. 

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dude....

FB has increased damage

 

acid imbue + FB does 55% more than fully casted venom

Edited by Quicktor
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Most people on chaos wear leather, which has 68.76% total DR (58.46% dr, 24.8% glance) at 90ql to acid, and 66.18% resistance to poison ( 64.40% DR, 5% glance). So even with just an imbue vs venom, they're about equal in terms of raw DPS. then you add on 33% from fb/fa, or even 33% + -10% glance chance from BT, 5% from jewelry, the extra stun chance from BT, the fact that you get webbed less with non-venom weapons because you hit less and harder, as web is based on hitting not damage, the fact that you can truestrike harder with fb/fa/bt, the fact that finding a high channeling vyn is 100x easier than finding a high channeling fo. venom was extremely niche in pvp, and now its worse than RT which was before this patch the biggest meme enchant. Venom excelled in killing plate users and scale users without web armor before the change but that's about it.

 

delete acid imbue and cold imbue ty

Edited by Oblivionnreaver
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1 hour ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

From my testing with a 103 venom weapon, glance rate was around 20%. if i was to use a salved fa/fb weapon instead i'd have 25% glance chance against leather studded leather chain and scale, and 35% glance chance against plate and drake, all the while doing 33% more damage. you've made venom a 100% meme spell and i congratulate you for completely ruining it solely because archaed lost a spar. Literally nobody was using venom in pvp anyway lol

I feel like we're forgetting the bugged fight with Emoo where he didn't block at all.

The prompt rematch had us basically both within one hit range of loss for both of us.

 

I think running around saying any loadout we want, and then nerfing one into being worthless is a bit of a weird thing to do. Let's not forget, I'm running a 90ql and 99ql ring to boost my damage output also.

Edited by Madnath
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1 hour ago, Retrograde said:

The goal of these changes is to remove the reliance on priests and counter the spell-spam meta that is currently dominant. We want to reduce the number of priests needed in a fight to be viable, and as such have reduced the spell-spam effects. 

As we continue to work on the game, make adjustments and correct bugs, there are times in which spells and priests will be affected. While we will always take transfers into account when performing large overhauls, small balances such as these are not going to be viable to receive a transfer option.

Before the priest overhaul, only heal could be cast while on moving vehicles. Unfortunately, the change led to spam-casting cure wounds by multiple people by directly targetting the body. 

Healing resistance is designed to reduce the effectiveness of healing in protracted fights. The current resistance does not increase fast enough to play any tactical role, and as such, we have increased the rate in which it grows. Please note, this change does not increase healing resistance for enchants like Life Transfer but does affect spells like Scorns healing.

 

The lack of a tangible cooldown on Tangleweave further promoted the priest-heavy meta, allowing multiple priests to shut down the enemy team. We have added this cooldown to create a more tactical use of it, but we're going to be seeing how this plays out and adjust if necessary. 

All armour types now have a 20% glance rate against poison damage. This makes poison the only enchant effective against all armour types equally at the lowest rate of other damage types.

We're aware that this limits Vynora's viability in PvP and we're open to looking at her and adjusting if necessary as well. 

I'm aware my thoughts will be irrelevant and not taken into account, that's apparent now. I am pretty disappointed in your reply. So I suppose this will be final thoughts on the matter. My original stance is, I'm confused on WHO makes these choices? Does a dev just float over a battle and go, "huh they are casting A LOT I'ma fix that." or what? I don't see a single discussion about this. I never saw it discussed in discord, I know I have no life and stalk it. Is pvp really the pocket dev environment that everyone talks about? I just really would like to understand how the obviously very closed door topics for discussion on updates comes on the table? Once again, I'm not trying to complain I am trying to understand. Mainly because it gets me very worried.

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2 minutes ago, user said:

I'm aware my thoughts will be irrelevant and not taken into account, that's apparent now. I am pretty disappointed in your reply. So I suppose this will be final thoughts on the matter. My original stance is, I'm confused on WHO makes these choices? Does a dev just float over a battle and go, "huh they are casting A LOT I'ma fix that." or what? I don't see a single discussion about this. I never saw it discussed in discord, I know I have no life and stalk it. Is pvp really the pocket dev environment that everyone talks about? I just really would like to understand how the obviously very closed door topics for discussion on updates comes on the table? Once again, I'm not trying to complain I am trying to understand. Mainly because it gets me very worried.

 

You basically just have to look at the venom change and put 1 and 1 together.

This game became one guys playground, sadly.

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Next patch: * spell casting is disabled once your /lotime is greater than 1 minute

 

BOOM! All issues sorted. No more spell metas in any fights. Everyones back to old school banging and sponging. 

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Rest in peace Venom, I really liked having multiple choices. Back to BT meta.

 

Oh wait, I forgot, I don't play anymore because devs keep jerking around people like this, so I don't have to worry about anything. Still, miss Wurm for the memories. Not what the game is now.

Edited by Wiolo
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12 hours ago, DevBlog said:

on PvP servers only

I like the part where he says this.

 

Can we have more updates like this?  Then can we just have two games?  A PvP game and a PvE game?  Then neither will be held back by the other.  Could add all kinds of QoL to PvE and QoW (quality of war) to PvP.  Just a thought.  I know the answer, but I like to dream.

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Okay Retro.... you attempted to explain the changes (albeit poorly), so my questions are as follows:

 

2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

The goal of these changes is to remove the reliance on priests and counter the spell-spam meta that is currently dominant.

 

 

I would like you to elaborate here.  What "spell spam" is a problem?  Pillars?  Healing spells?  Direct damage spells like shard of ice?

 

2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

We want to reduce the number of priests needed in a fight to be viable, and as such have reduced the spell-spam effects. 

 

This is an unobtainable goal.  You could nerf every single spell into the ground, and dedicated PvP accounts will all just become Magranon priests for the 25% damage buff.  This is the reason people go Mag, not for uber powerful spell casts.

 

 

2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

As we continue to work on the game, make adjustments and correct bugs, there are times in which spells and priests will be affected. While we will always take transfers into account when performing large overhauls, small balances such as these are not going to be viable to receive a transfer option.

 

Who is "we"?  What two three people think they know what the entire PvP community wants?  I'd seriously like to know what qualifies you to know what changes are needed for PvP, based on a freedom spar in 1v1.  

 

2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

Before the priest overhaul, only heal could be cast while on moving vehicles. Unfortunately, the change led to spam-casting cure wounds by multiple people by directly targetting the body. 

 

Also before the priest overhaul, a boat captain could take his foot off the gas, regain stamina, then continue sailing.  The resulting change to your precious sailing update is that boat commanders are SUBSTANTIALLY more vulnerable to all attacks (even archery) because their ability to block attacks with a shield are 99% compromised once they have run out of stamina.  Go to the skirmishes thread and watch Ciray's recent video that shows multiple players dying to archery in under 20 seconds on a knarr.

 

 

2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

Healing resistance is designed to reduce the effectiveness of healing in protracted fights. The current resistance does not increase fast enough to play any tactical role, and as such, we have increased the rate in which it grows. Please note, this change does not increase healing resistance for enchants like Life Transfer but does affect spells like Scorns healing.

 

Easily circumvented by rotating personnel.  This does nothing to solve your issue.

 

2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

The lack of a tangible cooldown on Tangleweave further promoted the priest-heavy meta, allowing multiple priests to shut down the enemy team. We have added this cooldown to create a more tactical use of it, but we're going to be seeing how this plays out and adjust if necessary. 

 

So...the answer to spell spam in your mind is to reduce our ability to stop spell spam?  Clear as mud, got it.

 

2 hours ago, Retrograde said:

All armour types now have a 20% glance rate against poison damage. This makes poison the only enchant effective against all armour types equally at the lowest rate of other damage types.

We're aware that this limits Vynora's viability in PvP and we're open to looking at her and adjusting if necessary as well. 

 

Vynora is, and should be, the epitome of "spell spam".  Shard of ice, ice pillar, damage spells.... it's 100% all a Vynora priest can do (that isn't doable by every other priest, that is).  Zero PvP utility spells, no healing spells, and coupled with your recent "unification" of spell damage types, Vynora priests bring NOTHING unique to the PvP table.

 

Your PvP changes, as you can see from the responses in this thread thus far, share little sentiment with the members of the PvP community.  I place no value whatsoever in your opinion of necessary changes for PvP, or even the game as a whole, and it boils my blood to see sweeping changes made to a system that is FINE the way it is.  Stop catering to the needs of your friends and start thinking about the community as a whole.

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my favourite part of spell spam is sitting on top of ice pillars and tentacles and whatnot from 80+ channeling accounts and taking 0.1 damage per second, taking a single shard of ice and then i'm immune to spells for the next 2 years, and my account doesn't even have 50 soul str lol

Edited by Oblivionnreaver

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The overall silence against all counters is a bit...strange.

 

I'd say this is the exact kind of change that really shouldn't have happened until a significant amount of work can be done on PVP mechanics, since as has been said a million times, this has just kinda went the exact opposite way it needs to

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Please keep discussion directly related to the changes at hand.  You're welcome to disagree or offer alternative suggestions, so long as you do so in a respectful manner.  Please take creative endevours to other threads.

 

Pandalet (LFM)

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Allow devs to PVP only if equal number of them are playing in each active kingdom?

That would take off the wind from the sails of suspected inbalance perhaps.

Edited by Jaz
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