Retrograde

Valrei International. 095 New UI Showcase!

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Malena said:

 

My first reaction was: "That looks like it would work wonderfully!" and I immediately "liked" your post.

 

But then I started to think about it more, and here's the problem: What you see being done in that video is items being "hovered" over with the mouse versus being "clicked".

 

But imagine being in a tight space with lots of functional items in a small area and all you wanted to do was look around (versus actually interacting with any of it). Then as you moved your mouse around, you'd have these big buttons popping up repeatedly all over the place. That could get quite chaotic. Since the original implementation is merely text, it's not too distracting.  

 

Also, how would it technically work with clicking those buttons?  Since they look like buttons, your first reaction would be to click on them. And of course, as soon as you did that, the cursor would have already moved off of the sword and onto the dirt tile. Thus, you'd never get the chance to actually "catch" the buttons to be able to click on them. 

 

I think the only way this could work is by clicking once on them item to bring up the buttons. But then, we already have a tool for that - which is the select bar. 

 

That aside, I think it's really wonderful that you had an idea, worked on visual for how it could work and suggested it! 

 

Hmm, I feel that if the player can use the mouse wheel to scroll through the options, or use arrow keys, or swipe on mobile on a touch screen that could work. It could also be like "highlight" and then "select" and choose the option. Hell, copy the fortnight building menu, it's obviously working for them lol

 

Problem with the select bar is that it's not obvious enough. 

 

Whole idea being that the options appear as soon as you mouse over in some manner. 

 

Most of us would use the tried and true right click, it's just that there needs to be a system that's simpler for new players who don't think like we do. 

Edited by phennexion
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17 hours ago, phennexion said:

That's awesome, I like everything so far but the right click menu needs another option instead of right clicking everything.

 

KIDS THESE DAYS "TLDR;" THE RIGHT CLICK MENU. It's too tedious for them. If you want to win over the mine craft generation and make the big bucks you need to make a super simple UI. Something that pops up in their face with all the options possible whenever they change their view to a new object. Like, auto-right clicking lol. Most of Gen Z is that lazy, yes, I work in technology in a school and see them using computers everyday.

 

To give you an idea, they literally hit Capslock, type their capital, then hit capslock again instead of hitting Shift... they don't think of technology the same way we do. Imagine a whole generation of people raised on Apple devices and they're all used to interacting the way they do on an iPad.

 

I tried to get some of the kids in my school into the game and the right click menu was just too cumbersome and complicated for them.

 


I service(well did before all this virus stuff) a bunch of schools their IT needs and i never saw the kids hit caps but use shift still a lot of kids actually didnt seem to like the over simplified menu's when they are a bit older and keep saying "oh this is the kind of stuff my younger brother likes i like it this way more" when we would talk with kids about what they like and dislike about the games they are allowed to play on the school ipads and pcs(as i would be the one left in charge of deploying it all)

This might again just be because kiwi kids are different then most kids from elsewhere and a lot of the schools also run classes to learn how to type properly(so shift vs caps is something that is taught) and a lot of schools(sadly not all) run "how to efficiently use a pc" class once a month where the more tech savy teacher or IT guy(thankfully not me) sits down with kids trying to teach them how to handle devices and how pcs function and so on and the different OS's(this includes the poor schools too) 

But teaching kids patience goes a long way to making them accept right click vs big buttons that show up in the middle of the screen as well lets face it the developers behind those games are the reason why everyone wants to dumb down everything to make it faster and faster
Id say wurm's right click menu in the way it looks with this update is fast enough as it is and i think a lot of kids would think so too plus i dont think anyone here wants to win over the mc generation of kids as they would not like wurm at all no matter how fast in interacting the wurm dev team makes the ui to be

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1 hour ago, wipeout said:

Id say wurm's right click menu in the way it looks with this update is fast enough as it is and i think a lot of kids would think so too plus i dont think anyone here wants to win over the mc generation of kids as they would not like wurm at all no matter how fast in interacting the wurm dev team makes the ui to be

 

This statement is actually quite important. People, kids or not -since most adults I've met were childish in their own way- who like "fast paced, action games, no patience, give me satisfaction and dopamine now" would never get or stay in Wurm for long. Doesn't matter how Wurm's interface is. The core of the game is 90% grind, that's the basic fact of the game.

 

No amount of polish, UI tweaks or anything will change the reality of spending a big chunk of the game doing repetitive actions. I don't know to what extent the statement "this new generation has a shorter attention span" since from my own work experience, doing support, quality control, revisions, procedure updates, etc. I can say old people can be just as impatient as young ones. From a lot of old people i often get "But I don't want to learn what button does what, I just want to get X information, or Y payment done, etc." 

 

It's more of a personality issue. Wurm is a game targeted at patient people and that's the psychological variable in play, not age. I started Wurm when I was 21-22 or so. I could have played it when I was 15 just as well, but that's because I have a personal fascination with games that offer a complex range of possibilites for creativity.

 

Taking that into account, Wurm still has to showcase itself as a game that requires patience, same as any City building game filles with many factors, or complex-economy-based RTS games (like the old Settlers games). Wurm will never be able to present itself as a fast paced action game. Its main target and this should be delineated in its marketing, is the vast range of in-game possibilities you have but also that they come with effort. It's not p2w. It's play to earn, as it should be.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
On 4/13/2020 at 5:58 PM, phennexion said:

That's awesome, I like everything so far but the right click menu needs another option instead of right clicking everything.

 

KIDS THESE DAYS "TLDR;" THE RIGHT CLICK MENU. It's too tedious for them. If you want to win over the mine craft generation and make the big bucks you need to make a super simple UI. Something that pops up in their face with all the options possible whenever they change their view to a new object. Like, auto-right clicking lol. Most of Gen Z is that lazy, yes, I work in technology in a school and see them using computers everyday.

 

To give you an idea, they literally hit Capslock, type their capital, then hit capslock again instead of hitting Shift... they don't think of technology the same way we do. Imagine a whole generation of people raised on Apple devices and they're all used to interacting the way they do on an iPad.

 

I tried to get some of the kids in my school into the game and the right click menu was just too cumbersome and complicated for them.

 

https://imgur.com/a/oqZzVCV

Your version is not bad either, but I think this would fit far better to a mobile game or a game with an action cam that does not use a mouse at all (take for example Black Desert Online... just came to my mind as it has lots of sandbox elements too).
And isn't the "Default Action Key" shown in the first post exactly doing what you suggest here, just without the button shown on the screen?

To be honest, buttons as big as your suggestion would destroy the "Wurm feeling" for me, haha. I love the new RPG-feeling the UI changes add.

Edited by Cayce

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its that bastard right click menu, newer generations than myself need to be insulted because i am better than them and they are unable to do simple tasks like myself

 

games with right click menus:

-wurm: has 2500 paying customers

-runescape: has 1.1 million paying customers

 

haha that evil right click menu, dang kids

 

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1 hour ago, MrGARY said:

its that bastard right click menu, newer generations than myself need to be insulted because i am better than them and they are unable to do simple tasks like myself

 

games with right click menus:

-wurm: has 2500 paying customers

-runescape: has 1.1 million paying customers

 

haha that evil right click menu, dang kids

 

Out of Touch | Am I Out Of Touch? | Know Your Meme

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On 4/13/2020 at 1:13 AM, Malena said:

Since I've joined the Wurm team for a few months to help out with the marketing assets for the Steam launch, I've had the chance to actually test this stuff out and HOLY MOLY! Not only does it look better, but just you guys wait until you actually start USING it. It really is a huge improvement on so many levels. Now every time I log onto just the normal servers the old UI feels so much less pleasant to use in comparison.

 

Everything about the upgraded UI is just so pleasant and easy on the eye. Everything feels so solid and "right" compared to the old. I think you guys will be blown away once this is released!

 

Also it is a nice surprise to see you on the Art team! I'm sure it was a great thing from both you and the dev team, those horse colours tell the story already.

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23 hours ago, Madnath said:

This is absolutely the best part of the game. The ability to pick and choose what is and isn't on to your own taste and preference. Wink wink, dev team.

 

Choice is out in the 2020s. Forced animations are also in.

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48 minutes ago, CreZ said:

 

Choice is out in the 2020s. Forced animations are also in.

 

What on earth are you talking about?

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23 minutes ago, Jeston said:

 

What on earth are you talking about?

afaik you can not turn off animations anymore

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Posted (edited)
On 4/13/2020 at 5:58 PM, phennexion said:

That's awesome, I like everything so far but the right click menu needs another option instead of right clicking everything.

 

KIDS THESE DAYS "TLDR;" THE RIGHT CLICK MENU. It's too tedious for them. If you want to win over the mine craft generation and make the big bucks you need to make a super simple UI. Something that pops up in their face with all the options possible whenever they change their view to a new object. Like, auto-right clicking lol. Most of Gen Z is that lazy, yes, I work in technology in a school and see them using computers everyday.

 

To give you an idea, they literally hit Capslock, type their capital, then hit capslock again instead of hitting Shift... they don't think of technology the same way we do. Imagine a whole generation of people raised on Apple devices and they're all used to interacting the way they do on an iPad.

 

I tried to get some of the kids in my school into the game and the right click menu was just too cumbersome and complicated for them.

 

JtUmWY3.png

 

https://imgur.com/a/oqZzVCV

 

 

 



 

 

Please NO!

Edited by SweetSusie
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On 4/12/2020 at 3:52 PM, Annyil said:

I hope I'll get used to it. :P
But I love the inventory search! I would like same patch in RL too. :D

For our handbags 😁

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Posted (edited)

Really good job on the UI, its great to have in world text and an option to search in the inventory etc. This is an update with only 100% progress and positive outcome in my point of view!
Hats of to you dev team.

(Although im a wood fanatic I will miss the old woody!)

Edited by Nocturnes

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I'm impressed! Some nice QOL tweaks. I think once these changes are in game we will wonder how we lived without them

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Posted (edited)

My question would be: While the searchable inventory may be nice, will the inventory groups still exist? I already have "searchable inventory" with them, I can open them seperately in windows, sort by name, ql, weight, dmg. If we are deprived of that, the loss will be harder than the gain by the "modern" UI.

 

Edit: And forgive my skepticism. I am widely fine with the existing UI, and fear a bit for fast and effective usability with the upcoming changes.

Edited by Ekcin
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 Great job to everyone that is working on this update! You can tell a lot of time and talent has gone into creating this for us. Thank you!

 

Since it is a complete rebuild, will we be able to also adjust the column widths? Sometimes my text gets jumbled in the weight column, etc and it would be nice to be able to make that clear. (I use the weight column on a stack of unfinished items to keep track).

 

Will item order be changeable by drag and drop? I've noticed that I can currently do this in some containers, with some items. But I honestly haven't explored which one I can and which I can't beyond knowing that sometime I can and sometime I can't currently.

 

As has been mentioned a couple times in this thread, a way to save a window's inventory sorted by how user wants to sort it would be fantastic. It seems now that windows remember the order items are placed in them when they are reopened. Perhaps a way to save windows to be opened as it was last sorted? Then if people wanted it alphabetical, they could open the window, hit the name column and the window would sort items alphabetically, and then they could save and window would open next time with items in alphabetical order. Conversely, people could drag/drop items (or place items in containers in specific order if drag / drop not available) to sort how they want, and then save and window would reopen next time in the order they saved. This would also fix those times when things get all jumbled in a window, since could close window without saving, and reopen to get previous sort setup.

 

Also, it would be great if things like log & logs, sprout and sprouts, etc would be grouped together. A sprout is a sprout whether there is one or 99? Having 2 catagories for same line item creates confusion and easily lets user make mistake sorting inventory and mix items accidentally.

Just my 2 iron on some of the functionality :) Thank you again for all your hard work! Have a great day!

 

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Posted (edited)
On 4/14/2020 at 8:42 AM, MrGARY said:

its that bastard right click menu, newer generations than myself need to be insulted because i am better than them and they are unable to do simple tasks like myself

 

games with right click menus:

-wurm: has 2500 paying customers

-runescape: has 1.1 million paying customers

 

haha that evil right click menu, dang kids

 

 

 

As an avid runescape player since 2003 and now play OSRS, id say runescape has quite bit of right-click menu usage, the difference is runescape doesn't have a right click menu with such vagueness or vastness as wurm does, not to mention having to learn to make custom Binds for most skill actions and not even all actions can be bound fully, Luckily it seems the right click menu in Wurm is going to be at the level runescape has it where it has function but is not bloated and vague about what the options may or may not do, which is very good. Both are great games.

Edited by Jeston

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Posted (edited)

I love the menus. is the crafting menu in the works also?

Edited by Ismira

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On 4/14/2020 at 8:39 PM, Votip said:

afaik you can not turn off animations anymore

Animations can be shut off.

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1 minute ago, Kelody said:

Animations can be shut off.

nope, try it, even when its off you still have animations.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Oblivionnreaver said:

nope, try it, even when its off you still have animations.

That must be new. Last I really looked at my low resources setting the horse tails still stuck out.

 

Back to new UI, please remove the progress bar from locked to the chat window. Especially if people will have multiple cascaded chat windows it will get lost.

Edited by Kelody

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Curious for the new logo. Used here, and also on the steam page. I like it. Will it be the new logo for Wurm as a whole?

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What I felt about the new logo was that someone made it flat and boring.
And I suppose that new logo will make it to every badge etc also, consuming precious hours of devs time.

That time could have been spent on something more productive.

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Posted (edited)
On 4/16/2020 at 9:57 PM, Soluna said:

Also, it would be great if things like log & logs, sprout and sprouts, etc would be grouped together. A sprout is a sprout whether there is one or 99? Having 2 catagories for same line item creates confusion and easily lets user make mistake sorting inventory and mix items accidentally.

 

Hear Hear - takes time finding some things due to category confusions.

 

And yes, please allow animations to be switched off.

 

Also please get the 'reach' sorted - and the error message "you are not allowed to do that" etc - if you are near enough to drop stuff into a container, you should be able to get stuff out as well from the same distance.

Edited by Baloo
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