Retrograde

The Future of RMT in Wurm and Price Reductions

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4 hours ago, Retrograde said:

Just a rounding, the benefit would be not having to go through the payment system twice 

at the extra cost of 1cent o.0'

I'll try to wrap my mind around the savings on this wogic

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It's already a stupid business practice of appraising something just shy of a full, rounded amount just to appear cheaper than it effectively is. Do you really have to one-up it like that?🙄

Edited by Flubb
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it's actually proven that people 'LOVE' X.99 prices as they for some reason read only the left side of the price... and ignore the right 99, whatever the reasoning behind that was... (you can google about it if you're interested)

 

 

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Can anybody justify to me that people defending the income stream of a video game and enabling reliance on them proves nothing besides you think those people are unable to function without the game?

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1 hour ago, Cornchips said:

Can anybody justify to me that people defending the income stream of a video game and enabling reliance on them proves nothing besides you think those people are unable to function without the game?

 

thats a moot point. or more exactly a non sequitur. that has never been the argument. the argument has been that rmt was part of the game and now its not, with people giving opinions on why they agree or not with the decision. if it will be for the better for the game we all hope so. now you want to argue the reasons behind those arguments which goes beyond the scope. you cant read peoples hearts. edit: and when i say you i mean we.

Edited by Griffith

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3 hours ago, Cornchips said:

Ok so no; nobody can justify it. Gotcha

Some aren't trying to justify it, have just played more years than the current staff and playerbase, not all truly care, just struggling with all the finger pointing nowadays when they spent as much RL money before all the white knights on the forums ever heard of Wurm.

 

 

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It's actually really really big change for the game..

While before your actions in it had some value*.. now you pay to struggle online and do it with other people.. while WU's same thing for free at b2p cost instead of sub model, where content isn't that different.. for new players it doesnt make much sense to join wo if there's no different to your actions.. while WO before offered something unique to it... now it doesn't matter if you play and spend your time on WO official servers or any random WU server with ~stable future.

(* we're not talking about the making of money with rmt.. but the Ex possibility of it and the tie to pixel and irl monetary system)

 

I find it ~hard to believe somebody's going to pay to struggle and level up slowly with the 'normal' skillgain rate of WO.. expecting steam-ers to rage and demand faster actions.. if nothing in the game matters, I'd expect things to escalate with the changes and turn WO into must-faster paced game.. which will later turn into another problem.. burning people out reaching the goals faster and quitting after getting bored.. but you cant have the one without the other.. old coins used to make that struggle worth it.. now.. not really...

Am I wrong cornchips?

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4 minutes ago, Finnn said:

while WU's same thing for free at b2p cost instead of sub model, where content isn't that different..

 

Don't forget they dropped the content updates to WU.

 

Too many changes, too fast, or how to create a lovecraftian nightmarish monster.

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wayback machine

 

On 4/19/2013 at 10:11 PM, Griffith said:

im not very good at math. with that out of the way i think trader draining does affect the economy.

especially when it gets abused to the point of some players dominating the economy and not

only playing for free but amassing gold and deeds, and new players have no chance of getting

more than 5 coppers or are always asking where to find free land.

 

That said i wouldnt like to see them removed either. it gives a nice incentive if you want to complement

your expenses with some silver made in game.

 

basically, the only thing i can think of is Wurm should become a middleman in the selling of

gold, characters, drake, scale, spyglasses, etc. those shouldnt be allowed to be sold out of

game for a profit to external players. Wurm could sell them for players in some sort of auction house

and get a percentage of the sale ( for silvers). A new thread in the forum for this would suffice, and each trader should

be owned by a premium player.

 

Maybe that would help or maybe not. im not a good businessman, just my humble opinion.

 

ps. when a player spends a year in game, spends 200euro, and leaves with 1000euro, its a ponzi scheme.

i dont mean that in the legal term but to enphasize that its unsustainable, even if the silver stays in game.

you would need exponentially more players to sustain the ones on top of the piramid. you would need

5 players spending 200euro to pay for that player who left and sold for cash just to be even. They all use

the server resources and bandwith and land,etc, and wurm hasnt made any profit yet off of them.

6 players play for a year and wurm doesnt see a profit. because one left with 1000euro. hmmm

I think i just figured out why games dont allow players to sell their stuff for cash. i mean, maybe you

knew the reason but i didnt, until now.

Edited by Griffith

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I won’t go into it too much and I am not about to read 20 pages - somehow I missed all of this happening.

 

I think it shows poor faith to change RMT after so many were told Wurm believed in it, but it hardly affects me as I don’t plan on selling my accounts anyways and I have gone from selling silver to buying it 

 

But not allowing account sharing has serious implications for PvP serves, notably writ/deed holder accounts but most importantly priests

 

I own one of the best priests in the game, it basically has maxed out stats - even then it’s borderline useless, there is no way a single person could keep up with enchants for a large village EVEN IF THEY MADE WURM A FULL TIME JOB. I hope account sharing is reconsidered because I just can’t see how priests will functionally work

 

If you ever wonder why PvP servers are dead it’s stuff like this

Edited by Gavin
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@OdynnI kno' that's irrelevant, it still applies pretty well.

 

@GriffithNot really.. you generate stuff from thin air(investing your time into the game)..

and that is a new item with some value(work, time, solving other's problem, worths something in return)...

IRL money people generate IRL and there's a separate pool that brought more or less money into the system with game-shop and rmts into the game's system

(ignore what rmts made by selling stuff and hoarded to resell @IRL, that was just another "bank").. eventually some of the silver sinks in upkeep other in premium.. and parts of it goes to the coffers and back in circulation.. other probably vanish from existence(char prem at token?)..

problem is with old system you had incentive to do stuff and play for one or another reason.. there are only a few rmts that did a lot of the selling, but for others the idea to play something more than a 'game' was a thing that was a + to be a part of it..

 

New system.. will choke on coin pretty fast.. and there's not much reason to make coins in it... so even if people eventually get richer... there wont be much reason to have any for other than spare coins to toss at upkeep/prem at token, unless you all love to participate in the market.. which I do not believe is the case.. as trade chat mostly had certain few names in it...

 

What does the future hold after this change, we'll see soon enough.

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2 minutes ago, Gavin said:

I won’t go into it too much and I am not about to read 20 pages - somehow I missed all of this happening.

 

I think it shows poor faith to change RMT after so many were told Wurm believed in it, but it hardly affects me as I don’t plan on selling my accounts anyways and I have gone from selling silver to buying it 

 

But not allowing account sharing has serious implications for PvP serves, notably writ/deed holder accounts but most importantly priests

 

I own one of the best priests in the game, it basically has maxed out stats - even then it’s borderline useless, there is no way a single person could keep up with enchants for a large village EVEN IF THEY MADE WURM A FULL TIME JOB. I hope account sharing is reconsidered.

 

If you ever wonder why PvP servers are dead it’s stuff like this

People will still share accounts.. there are too many ways to go around certain limitations(being wording or technical knowledge and implementation)... and what pvp.. there's for 1 no pvp.. and pvp used to also be a thing to play with wealth.. now there's no wealth at all in there.. will there be pvp-ing without irl return to money or buying accounts, do you imagine somebody's going to play 6/+ months just to be barely ready to be a new bunny on the pvp map? Compared to old system with trading few bucks to get a starter character with minimum body stats or weaponset grinded already...

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On ‎1‎/‎31‎/‎2020 at 3:34 PM, Retrograde said:

More than one or two. 

 

If you login to a friends account to take care of their deed that is fine. If multiple people login to run a weaponsmith or priest for a village, alliance, or kingdom then we will take action on that account. 

 

I have been looking at some of the changes in Wurm, and what is to come, and a lot of it looks good to me.  I couldn't care less about RMT changing.  I bought and sold one character, years ago, and it was a mistake.  A fun mistake, but still a mistake.

 

However, the sharing accounts thing, well, that might be a severe issue for me.  Even though I don't share an account with anyone.

 

Here's why:

 

I now drive a truck for a living in the US.  For six weeks or so at a time, I live mostly in my truck.  I have a cellphone that I connect with, using a data tether.  I have two different nationwide truck stop internet access accounts.  I stay in different hotels at least a score or so times a year.  I do not even have a landline data connection in my own name.

 

If Wurm is going to be looking at access data from my connections, it's going to look like my account is being run by a LOT of different people all across the US from Maine to California, and Washington State to Florida.

 

I hope that's not going to be a problem.

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8 hours ago, Farmerbob said:

 

I have been looking at some of the changes in Wurm, and what is to come, and a lot of it looks good to me.  I couldn't care less about RMT changing.  I bought and sold one character, years ago, and it was a mistake.  A fun mistake, but still a mistake.

 

However, the sharing accounts thing, well, that might be a severe issue for me.  Even though I don't share an account with anyone.

 

Here's why:

 

I now drive a truck for a living in the US.  For six weeks or so at a time, I live mostly in my truck.  I have a cellphone that I connect with, using a data tether.  I have two different nationwide truck stop internet access accounts.  I stay in different hotels at least a score or so times a year.  I do not even have a landline data connection in my own name.

 

If Wurm is going to be looking at access data from my connections, it's going to look like my account is being run by a LOT of different people all across the US from Maine to California, and Washington State to Florida.

 

I hope that's not going to be a problem.

 

You should be fine, for example this quote:

 

17 hours ago, Samool said:

We've stated multiple times already that travel or dynamic home ips are not an issue. The system will not be solely based on IP addresses.

 

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Sounds to me like they're going to be checking Steam IDs / Hardware IDs.

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35 minutes ago, Asciana said:

Sounds to me like they're going to be checking Steam IDs / Hardware IDs.

It's likely going to be a combination of things; daily hours of play, sudden login location changes, hardware ids, etc. People thinking they'll be able to cheat the system easily are mistaken. While it may take a bit of time for account sharing to be noticed or proven in some cases, you will eventually be caught on to. People just need to accept that it's no longer allowed and start playing normally again.

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So, I was daydreaming while driving a forklift as I often do through the day at my work, cause you know, it's boring.  Anyway, I had an epiphamy, how can I stay premium after the RMT changes?   Buying from the Wurm Shop is RMT.  Seems a bit hypocritical, and I try to be as genuine a person as I can.  I lead by example, except when I say screw it, and I feel banning RMT is a sad hypocracy when buying wurmshop currency or premium is RMT.  Some people think best when on the toilet, I found my best moments in life are accomplished when absent minded driving a vehicle that weighs as much as 3-4 automobiles.  To each their own I suppose, I won't judge.  Have a fantastic and wonderful hypocritical day!  Mine's not over yet, I'll keep daydreaming, let's hope Bob watches where he's walking, cause I'm surely not.

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5 hours ago, Nomadikhan said:

So, I was daydreaming while driving a forklift as I often do through the day at my work, cause you know, it's boring.  Anyway, I had an epiphamy, how can I stay premium after the RMT changes?   Buying from the Wurm Shop is RMT.  Seems a bit hypocritical, and I try to be as genuine a person as I can.  I lead by example, except when I say screw it, and I feel banning RMT is a sad hypocracy when buying wurmshop currency or premium is RMT.  Some people think best when on the toilet, I found my best moments in life are accomplished when absent minded driving a vehicle that weighs as much as 3-4 automobiles.  To each their own I suppose, I won't judge.  Have a fantastic and wonderful hypocritical day!  Mine's not over yet, I'll keep daydreaming, let's hope Bob watches where he's walking, cause I'm surely not.

 

There are a fair few games on steam already where you can purchase coins/credits through steam no biggie IMO.

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8 hours ago, Nomadikhan said:

  Some people think best when on the toilet, I found my best moments in life are accomplished when absent minded driving a vehicle that weighs as much as 3-4 automobiles. 

 

Heh.  I also tend to think creatively while I drive, but I do have to pay a bit more attention.  My truck weighs 40 tons loaded, and goes 67 MPH.  😁

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19 hours ago, Nomadikhan said:

Buying from the Wurm Shop is RMT.

 

RMT restrictions are for Player to Player transactions, not Player to Publisher.  There absolutely is a difference.

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19 hours ago, Nomadikhan said:

So, I was daydreaming while driving a forklift as I often do through the day at my work, cause you know, it's boring.  Anyway, I had an epiphamy, how can I stay premium after the RMT changes?   Buying from the Wurm Shop is RMT.  Seems a bit hypocritical, and I try to be as genuine a person as I can.  I lead by example, except when I say screw it, and I feel banning RMT is a sad hypocracy when buying wurmshop currency or premium is RMT.  Some people think best when on the toilet, I found my best moments in life are accomplished when absent minded driving a vehicle that weighs as much as 3-4 automobiles.  To each their own I suppose, I won't judge.  Have a fantastic and wonderful hypocritical day!  Mine's not over yet, I'll keep daydreaming, let's hope Bob watches where he's walking, cause I'm surely not.

 

I'm not permitted to point put how dumb this paragraph is, so I won't.

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personally as far as as those fighting the good fight for people who travel and log into their accounts in different areas, and countries, steam has a 2 step authenticator that is very easy to opperate so theres an option. wurm can impliment an authenticator

 

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The problem with RMT, is that the act of depositing money within a game (buying coins from player/system), then withdrawing it (selling coins to players[/system]), effectively turns it into a bank. Criminals funding their cartels from the proceeds of in-game sales, or cleaning money through the game itself, are now the responsibility of the Game Developers who're facilitating it, thus legal action can be taken should they ignore it due to a) thinking it's fine by ignorance & b) not having satisfactory prevention systems in place. Obviously, the levels are presently marginal so no one cares, but Steam care. And if Wurm joins Steam for marketing/exposure, we have to care because they need to fulfil their regulatory obligations.

 

So although I don't really care about this, & black markets will exist anyway (how stringently cracked down on is a different matter guys... unless you're literally slapping it in their face, an UO/EA blind eye will probably occur...), the rationale makes sense. A game developer is more likely to lose money from the fines incurred from allowing a criminal exploit to fester as opposed to the lost revnue from RMT itself - it's primarily a legal concern. At the end of the day, the move to Steam is to increase Wurm enjoyability (& revenue) by increasing the player base (alone, hence the Silver price reductions) - surely that's the real appeal of a game over making pocket change. The same as a kid throwing a few punches gets a scolding, but as an adult gets prison time for the same act, Wurm is no longer able to get away with being a kid - it has Adult responsibilities now, joining the big league with Steam.

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