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Like i said before removing RMT completly is a big no no for me. I would rather have servers seperated forever in that case so people can choose wheter they want to play with or without it(allow one way transfers at some point ofc for those trapped on wrong side). And i urge everyone who doesn't want them to be removed to raise there voices about it otherwise my voice will be shut by few vocal people who either don't care or want to remove it passionatly.

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 @staff  Have you considered talking with the rmts, or sending a staff member on a mission to collect opinions from them as a group chat/discussion or private one on one talks/questionnaire?

Do you have observations how much gold circulates through rmts, alts and 'whales' in the game, also what they all do with the currency?

Are there alternatives to fill the hole that removing rmts could open?

Are there cons to removing rmts for the game or players? (you'll instantly lose 50-100 or more premiums monthly, whether they pay prem with RL money is another question; is that a positive, could you turn the decreased number to a positive outcome?)

 

Personally I am way more disgusted by uniques situation or trader shenanigans, but that's just me.. I get to pick how to deal with traders of items or silver/gold.. but in the other two situations it's out of my control.

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11 hours ago, Cipacadrinho said:

 

There is a fashion show with Emoo at this one, check events tab.

 

Kind of busy these days.. definitely can't go, xana is a bit not for my taste, but I'll definitely watch a stream recording if I find one after the party.😃

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8 minutes ago, Finnn said:

Are there cons to removing rmts for the game or players? (you'll instantly lose 50-100 or more premiums monthly, whether they pay prem with RL money is another question; is that a positive, could you turn the decreased number to a positive outcome?)

 

This is another part i'm wondering about. While it would probably have to be stated in the rules that RMT is forbidden, does Steam enforce in any way those or push developers to action on them? And where would they get such knowledge from? As long as it's in the game rules /T&C and happens off CC/AB controlled environments (in game, forums, official Discord), would Steam really know if staff turned the blind eye? Would they care as well if WO staff has no control over the hypothetical exchange medium? I could send a text message to my supplier and nobody would know. In game we could rubberstamp a conversation about "borrowing the money" or "birthday gift" or anything at all.

 

I'm not advocating lying to Steam, just a hypothetical question.

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15 minutes ago, Locath said:

 

This is another part i'm wondering about. While it would probably have to be stated in the rules that RMT is forbidden, does Steam enforce in any way those or push developers to action on them? And where would they get such knowledge from? As long as it's in the game rules /T&C and happens off CC/AB controlled environments (in game, forums, official Discord), would Steam really know if staff turned the blind eye? Would they care as well if WO staff has no control over the hypothetical exchange medium? I could send a text message to my supplier and nobody would know. In game we could rubberstamp a conversation about "borrowing the money" or "birthday gift" or anything at all.

 

I'm not advocating lying to Steam, just a hypothetical question.

Could be with an agent, bot, logger and events filtering messages... etc.. or a screenshot of discord/chat/forums.. and offers for rmt deals.. where staff does not enforce a ban being temporary etc... penalty... lack of action on such occasions probably leads to some monetary loss or warnings etc.. after all it's work and a deal with certain rules... 

You wouldn't do business with somebody cheating on the table or below it right?

 

Why blow a win:win cooperation for no reason? :)

Trust goes a long way, also complying to certain rules could be possibly used to get some perk.. promo showing on top of some category for a time, etc.. but that's a stretch..

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6 hours ago, Ecrir said:

... Then there are the few people who actively sell silver. They can now use that silver in other ways, like buying stuff from other players which they otherwise wouldn't, increasing the size of their deeds, etc. So overall a win win.

 

I occasionally sell silvers for real life money. Why do I sell silver you ask? That's easy to answer: I do so because I do not know what else to do with the silver that piles up in my bank. I have no use for it, thus I sell it.

 

The economy in Wurm causes silver to flow mainly to the established crafters and merchants in the game. That's pretty normal, after all players send their priced drake sets rather to an established and well-known crafter for imping, for a good reason even. But there's nothing these established crafters can do with the silver beside selling it. After all nobody needs a 10th drake set or 5 different deeds on every server. :)

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The RMT divide issue is quite easy to solve really, if you wish for the status quo to remain intact. Simply name steam's version of Wurm slightly differently. Say, Perhaps, "Wurm Revisited MMO". They would be two separate games at that point, which is absolutely the truth. 

 

When the day comes that the servers need to by "synced", and you want to allow steam characters to go to OGWO lands, simply add the servers as a personally curated addition. Skills from existing characters would be transfered   rewarded by a "referral" system on a 1:1 basis. A reward, if you will, for playing a prior version of the game. 

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14 minutes ago, Eobersig said:

 

I occasionally sell silvers for real life money. Why do I sell silver you ask? That's easy to answer: I do so because I do not know what else to do with the silver that piles up in my bank. I have no use for it, thus I sell it.

 

The economy in Wurm causes silver to flow mainly to the established crafters and merchants in the game. That's pretty normal, after all players send their priced drake sets rather to an established and well-known crafter for imping, for a good reason even. But there's nothing these established crafters can do with the silver beside selling it. After all nobody needs a 10th drake set or 5 different deeds on every server. :)

 

On a slightly different topic, then, is there anything you *would* want, that would cause you to buy from the less established players? Something that the game doesn't currently have, perhaps, but that might be implemented.

 

I'm thinking of something like sleep powders, which are generated just by being a premium character, but which even established players like to use. Should be easier to trade though.

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17 minutes ago, Lisimba said:

 

On a slightly different topic, then, is there anything you *would* want, that would cause you to buy from the less established players? Something that the game doesn't currently have, perhaps, but that might be implemented.

 

I'm thinking of something like sleep powders, which are generated just by being a premium character, but which even established players like to use. Should be easier to trade though.

 

Awfully sorry, but there's really nothing I could think of. In a way Wurm is like the real world economy: money piles up for a few people at the top of the economy pyramid and the rest has too little of it.

 

As to sleep powders, I already accept sleep powders as payment for my leather wares. I agree, I would wish easier trade of sleep powders. But be aware that it won't help much anyway, I'd just have more sleep powders piling up then.

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I'm largely indifferent on RMT. I've bought from players before, but I wouldn't be particularly bothered if it were gone.

I am however very concerned at Steam/Current servers being totally separate. I've put hundreds of hours into my current account, and I'm by no means a veteran with high skills, but the prospect of starting over to be with the platform actually attracting new players is pretty terrible. Having a hard split is just going to make the current servers stagnate as newbies join the hot new thing instead, I'd very much like to be able to actually play with and potentially recruit/support new players and if that means banning RMT... Fine.

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The servers will still remain initially split, rmt removal would need to be necessary for a full merge later if that is going to happen, but we're looking at the next year of our shift to steam and the steam only platform at the moment. 

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16 hours ago, kochinac said:

Like i said before removing RMT completly is a big no no for me. I would rather have servers seperated forever in that case so people can choose wheter they want to play with or without it(allow one way transfers at some point ofc for those trapped on wrong side). And i urge everyone who doesn't want them to be removed to raise there voices about it otherwise my voice will be shut by few vocal people who either don't care or want to remove it passionatly.

 

But without new blood (new people from Steam will stick with Steam, it's  the platform they know and it's extremely convenient) there eventually won't be anybody left to RMT with anyway.

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15 minutes ago, Retrograde said:

The servers will still remain initially split, rmt removal would need to be necessary for a full merge later if that is going to happen, but we're looking at the next year of our shift to steam and the steam only platform at the moment. 

Knowing all circumstances i would say that's the best solution now. Give some very decent time for servers to be split, we can only make realistic debates after we see how things go with both versions. If both versions have enough people i'm against merging them but in that case people should be allowed to cross to desired version for one time only so folks who want to play on Steam can move their skills and name and vice-versa for people from Steam who maybe want  to play with RMT...

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1 hour ago, kochinac said:

Knowing all circumstances i would say that's the best solution now. Give some very decent time for servers to be split, we can only make realistic debates after we see how things go with both versions. If both versions have enough people i'm against merging them but in that case people should be allowed to cross to desired version for one time only so folks who want to play on Steam can move their skills and name and vice-versa for people from Steam who maybe want  to play with RMT...

 

I'd assume such a move would be a no go, even if it's one time, else you'd get this: Player from steam is done with the game, transfers account to non steam WO and them RMTs the account. Effectively that's a way to RMT your steam character, which probably won't fly. Same reason a one time transfer from non steam to steam probably wouldn't fly either, as you could then first buy an account with RMT and then transfer it to Steam.

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3 hours ago, Ecrir said:

 

I'd assume such a move would be a no go, even if it's one time, else you'd get this: Player from steam is done with the game, transfers account to non steam WO and them RMTs the account. Effectively that's a way to RMT your steam character, which probably won't fly. Same reason a one time transfer from non steam to steam probably wouldn't fly either, as you could then first buy an account with RMT and then transfer it to Steam.

Not quite sure how steam would look at that but might me interesting loophole if possible. 

But even with your example that accounts will get stuck from steam to freedom and can't be returned to steam anymore. I don't see anything bad with that.

Ofc remains a mystery what will Steam say about it if they are asked

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5 hours ago, Ecrir said:

 

I'd assume such a move would be a no go, even if it's one time, else you'd get this: Player from steam is done with the game, transfers account to non steam WO and them RMTs the account. Effectively that's a way to RMT your steam character, which probably won't fly. Same reason a one time transfer from non steam to steam probably wouldn't fly either, as you could then first buy an account with RMT and then transfer it to Steam.

 

Maybe if they make one Steam server as a destination for one-time, one-way transferred WO accounts, (but keep the rest of the Steam WO servers permanently separated), and make it known to anyone starting on that server that it will be populated with older, transferred accounts, it might solve part of that problem. At least that way, people could keep their characters they've worked on for years.  Should def be one-way though. I can see where transferring back to the RMT side would definitely be a problem not easily solved.

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2 hours ago, Amadee said:

 

Maybe if they make one Steam server as a destination for one-time, one-way transferred WO accounts, (but keep the rest of the Steam WO servers permanently separated), and make it known to anyone starting on that server that it will be populated with older, transferred accounts, it might solve part of that problem. At least that way, people could keep their characters they've worked on for years.  Should def be one-way though. I can see where transferring back to the RMT side would definitely be a problem not easily solved.

 

Yes please allow 1 time 1:1 character copies to Steam servers if not right away at least after a couple of months.  I'm all good with no RMT on Steam servers.

 

Also maybe a good idea so the game doesn't seem dead and new people might see extra low server population and not want to try it out.

Edited by nicedreams

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Referring back to Mordraug's post

the difference I see is that although Codeclub gets more money because players have to buy silver from them instead of other players, there will also be a lot more silver in the game.

 

As Eobersig says here

 

it's likely that the coins will accumulate in the bank of established crafters and merchants, even more so than in Wurm currently since they can't sell the silver to other players.

 

What are they to do with all this gold ? Without more ways to take silver out of the economy by spending on trader items (like golden mirrors, cosmetic skins) or selling coins on the Steam market I feel this could lead to inflation.

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11 minutes ago, Explora said:

it's likely that the coins will accumulate in the bank of established crafters and merchants, even more so than in Wurm currently since they can't sell the silver to other players.

 

What are they to do with all this gold ? Without more ways to take silver out of the economy by spending on trader items (like golden mirrors, cosmetic skins) or selling coins on the Steam market I feel this could lead to inflation.

 

Selling on the steam market would work though. Sure, it doesn't give you real money, but you can buy all sorts of other games with it, plus occasionally some hardware like a steam controller (which you can then ebay if you really feel like it). And unlike the current system where you have to trust each other and paypal money around, Steam takes care of the payment details and of escrowing the silver so the barrier of entry to people trading is vastly lower.

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Hitching post can be push/pulled, but not turned.  Didn't know if this is intended or not.

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32 minutes ago, nicedreams said:

Hitching post can be push/pulled, but not turned.  Didn't know if this is intended or not.

Can you "place" it? That + secure option.. should be enough to situate it exactly where you want it..

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9 minutes ago, Finnn said:

Can you "place" it? That + secure option.. should be enough to situate it exactly where you want it..

 

[17:21:21] Sorry, but you are not allowed to place that.

 

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