Samool

Full Steam Ahead

Recommended Posts

totally flaked out on epic with this jackal crap too bad, you should come out with 10 more projects and spread your selves a bit thinner.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not sure if it's been confirmed somewhere, but are we definitely going to be required to use new usernames? As in, I can't use my current one?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, Jore said:

Not sure if it's been confirmed somewhere, but are we definitely going to be required to use new usernames? As in, I can't use my current one?

 

Yes, new character names will be required.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Warlander said:

 

Yes, new character names will be required.

Muh rep

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wonder why anyone doubted

9 hours ago, Warlander said:

Yes, new character names will be required.

 

From the beginning, the future possibility of an eventual merge or crossing from steam servers to Freedom/Epic has been mentioned, also, that the login server database would be used for all Wurm Online accounts. How should that work without new character names on steam?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/5/2019 at 9:07 AM, Samool said:

Hi everyone, as you’ve probably heard by know, I’ll be taking the role of Product Manager of Wurm in place of Budda. 

 

This should not disrupt development too much, but the direction of our work will change for the months leading to the Steam release - there’ll be more focus on some of the long requested QoL changes (good time to put some more in the suggestions forum!), new UI, combat changes and early game improvements. The majority of mentioned QoL and UI changes is aimed at improving the new player experience and retention, but it should also make for a much less frustrating experience for everyone while playing the game. There’s still some new content features going out soon for you to look ahead to, but that might slow down a bit for a short while.

 

One of the features we’re planning to introduce soon is a new premium loyalty system, which is our way of saying thank you in a better form than yellow potions :)

 

All of those changes will of course go to both current Wurm Online and the Steam version. Right now we aim to keep the differences between the two to a minimum, but that might still change. We’re open to the possibility of a server merge in the future, joining the new servers to the Freedom cluster, but only if it makes sense and doesn’t impact any of the servers negatively. Whatever happens, the original Wurm Online servers will get the same attention and features the Steam ones will.

 

As previously mentioned, the Epic overhaul update that was scheduled to launch late this year is no longer on our radar, due to the work direction shift the Steam launch requires. Instead we’ll be working on incorporating those ideas into a PvP server we intend to launch alongside the Steam PvE server.

 

I hope this clears out some of the confusion. It’s been a very busy couple of weeks here with all the announcements, but it should be smooth sailing from now on.

 

-- EDITED FOR CLARITY --

 

What's the status on Amazon? Are there still plans to move the network/server infrastructure to be hosted on Amazon servers along with the Steam integration? I'm just thinking the one big complaint people always have is lag. If you're anticipating a huge number of new players to the game, the existing infrastructure may not handle it so well at launch. Just wondering what the team's thoughts are around that? Personally for me though, coming from Canada, if I have lag I just connect to a VPN in Germany, then I connect to WO and my lag issues are non-existent. Most of the time it's network lag it seems at least in my case. It doesn't happen too often though.

 

I'm biased because I'm a PVE focused player and I don't see PVP as a priority for me personally. However, others do and those people are selling their accounts and quitting the game now before even seeing the Steam release. I think getting the PVE launch right first and then focusing on the PVP aspect makes sense. Take lessons learned from PVE launch and apply to PVP launch. As for the idea of server merges, I don't think anyone likes the thought of losing their existing characters, deeds, items, skills, etc. so I'm *hoping* regardless of what happens, we don't lose what we've already invested tons of money and time into. A lot of us sunk a lot of EU/silvers into these things. From a player's perspective it's seen as a long-term investment into the game for continued fun and future gameplay so the last thing we want is to see all of that money and time spent go to waste.

 

I noticed since the release of Jackal, it really killed Trade etc. on Xanadu. I'm still playing here on Xanadu but it's more dead now than it's ever been. I'm not into the whole Jackal thing and it bothers me that this seems to have taken away a sizeable portion of the Xanadu population away from playing on the server. Overall, it has had a negative impact it seems. What are the dev team's thoughts on this? Perhaps enabling Jackal for 6 months was too long?

 

Finally, maybe this change in direction won't be such an issue in the future *IF* the game manages to attract more players after being migrated over to Amazon and/or Steam. We all hope it *rebounds* and the markets improve. It adds to the fun of the game. As the current server population is on the decline, existing players are losing interest and very worried about what the future holds. I'm one of those people who is going to try and stick with this through thick and thin but not if I'm going to lose my existing characters, skills and all of their belongings. I'm trying to stay positive and base my decisions on "What IS" instead of "What IFS". The community has become sort of toxic lately (due to "What IF" scenarios) and it's sad to see. Perhaps the dev team is striving for a better foundation moving forward but so far it seems to be at the expense of losing the entire existing customer base. I just hope the staff thinks things through!

 

Cheers.

 

-- EDIT FROM YESTERDAY --

 

I just spoke to someone and they cleared up the reason as to why everyone is selling their accounts. They believe they will all have to *start over* from scratch as there will be two parallel versions of the game (the current one and the steam one). They believe there will be a high possibility of the current one dying. In other words, the reward we get for years of loyalty is to *start over* from scratch regardless if you've been here for 12 years or 3 years, etc. This is my current understanding as to why people are so upset. So it seems to me a merge of the existing data (the current one) must make it into the new one on Steam or this game is going to die a very quick death.

 

***The person I spoke to said you guys need to should do a Q&A on this matter live on stream before it's too late.*** Might not be a bad idea...

 

I started playing 4-5 years ago so naturally this has me pretty concerned I must say.

 

Edited by Neville
As discussion evolves, it was necessary to strikeout the fodder.
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/18/2019 at 6:08 PM, Warlander said:

 

Yes, new character names will be required.


-- EDITED --

Along with new character names, will there be another free religion conversion for priest toons?

 

Edited by Neville
Scratch that, it doesn't apply.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Q&A stream would be great. Nothing good comes out of not knowing what happens next, not in this game when there is a lot of money involved.

 

I really think the steam version will replace current one since its a platform with huge amount of players already and a sandbox only works great if you change the sand sometimes aka start from scratch.

I know this will never happen, but it could be great for the game to make certain amount of skills possible or classes. So not everyone can be everything. Althought alts are invented, but not everyone uses them.

 

Not selling my account in ogwo tho, but im getting ready for steam release. Hopefully its released with thought and care. Dont want to sound dramatic, but you got only one chance to win over players trust and dedication.

Edited by Themystrix

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Neville said:

I just spoke to someone and they cleared up the reason as to why everyone is selling their accounts. They believe they will all have to *start over* from scratch as there will be two parallel versions of the game (the current one and the steam one). They believe there will be a high possibility of the current one dying. In other words, the reward we get for years of loyalty is to *start over* from scratch regardless if you've been here for 12 years or 3 years, etc. This is my current understanding as to why people are so upset. So it seems to me a merge of the existing data (the current one) must make it into the new one on Steam or this game is going to die a very quick death.

A lot of people are also selling accounts due to PvP being dead due to negligence.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Madnath said:

A lot of people are also selling accounts due to PvP being dead due to negligence.

IF only.. pvp had their own section on forums where people could point over the problems with pvp stripped of all drama.. and leave the devs with plain data what needs fixing..

Imagine how things could develop from with such setup..

  • Cat 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Finnn said:

IF only.. pvp had their own section on forums where people could point over the problems with pvp stripped of all drama.. and leave the devs with plain data what needs fixing..

Imagine how things could develop from with such setup..

take it easy finn, the thread about make pvp great again are funny

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Finnn said:

IF only.. pvp had their own section on forums where people could point over the problems with pvp stripped of all drama.. and leave the devs with plain data what needs fixing..

Imagine how things could develop from with such setup..

IF only.. pvp players had spent a very long time saying what they disliked and what they'd love to see improved with countless big posts and such.

IF only.. dev time was actually spent on it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Madnath said:

IF only.. dev time was actually spent on it.

that works for pve and pvp!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Madnath said:

IF only.. pvp players had spent a very long time saying what they disliked and what they'd love to see improved with countless big posts and such.

IF only.. dev time was actually spent on it.

There was a long time of complaining, and then, in the wake of Elevation reset, there were indeed some constructive proposals. Elevation3 has been based on that, as a test for the final Elevation reset.

 

The PvPers who had long complained got many of their proposals reflected. Ok, not all as there was no unanimosity about e.g. full skill reset, or scrapping player gods, and a couple more. Many of those b*tching and moaning in the forums had bragged that hundreds of their friends would flock in. While I was reluctant about, I had at least expected that those complaining so long would at least take the opportunity to build up new deeds and fortifications, and thoroughly test, evaluate, and criticize the newly built server and its properties, to contribute to the final project of new Elevation.

 

Instead, the spoiled brats flocked in at modest numbers, maximum participation I observed was 160 at a time in the third week, doing a couple of PvP brawls, then getting bored about soon. In the fifth week, less than thirty were left, and less then ten in the subsequent weeks, often dropping to zero. If you have a look of the list of changes Darklords published before the reset, you may appraise what all has not even tried to test and evaluate, even the faster breeding of horses, most probably (which I felt quite pathetic), much less siege technologies with the new restrictions on slopes and minedoors.

 

If you compare Jackal, you see that there is not only lasting albeit somewhat lower participation (same to bit lower as Indy), but also ongoing discussion about impressions, critique, proposals for further instances. About Elevation3 and the ashamable failure of PvPers, there was nothing but deafening silence except a deviant if not criminal molestation of a dev by a few resulting in some bans.

 

It is not the devs who did not spend time on PvP changes.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Neville said:

they will all have to *start over* from scratch as there will be two parallel versions of the game (the current one and the steam one). They believe there will be a high possibility of the current one dying. In other words, the reward we get for years of loyalty is to *start over* from scratch regardless if you've been here for 12 years or 3 years, etc. This is my current understanding as to why people are so upset. So it seems to me a merge of the existing data (the current one) must make it into the new one on Steam or this game is going to die a very quick death.

I already pointed out the same thing, earlier in this topic, and I am glad someone else brings it up again.

Why they want Steam is obvious. What's NOT so obvious is why they insist on new, separate Steam servers. It's not just yet more new servers, clearly serving no purpose. It's also servers under the heavy DRM-crap called Steam. Some of us not only refuse to start over, we also refuse to play under a DRM. I already know the answer I might get: "you can still play on Freedom if you don't like Steam". My in-advance response to such an answer is: "hypocritical NONSENSE". That's because with separate Steam servers it is inevitable Freedom servers will be even more deserted, and eventually die; even if they keep them alive for a while, they will be almost empty, so pointless. Maybe that's exactly what they want: to get rid of Freedom and its many servers no matter if existing Freedom servers are more than enough to hold the expected new Steam players. Why they might want to get rid of Freedom? probably to reduce the cost of running 7 PvE servers; or maybe they want new separate Steam servers because Steam demands it.

Whatever the reason, they want new Steam servers so much, and one thing is sure: there is absolutely no need for new Steam servers. Look at the current server status, assume Steam will make the Wurm player base 20 times higher permanently (unrealistic, but let's pretend it will happen). Guess what, even in that scenario you  have the population Wurm had years ago, when it was at its peak, and even then existing Freedom servers were more than enough. So give me a goddamn reason for introducing new servers, under Steam or not. In the unlikely case Steam will bring SOOOOOO many new players that existing 7 servers can't hold them, they could open new servers THEN, not now. But noooooo, they want their new servers NOW, and they want them not connected to Freedom. Do you really see any need for this?

 

In any case, they insist for new Steam servers and whatever I am saying doesn't matter because it will be ignored, or even deleted from this forum (Wurm forum is not exactly famous for freedom of speech). And if I have to play via Steam in the future (which seems inevitable unless they change their mind), I am out. I refuse to play under DRM, and even if I wanted to, I refuse to play via Windows or install useless 32-bit libs on a 64-bit GNU/Linux system, just because Steam is 32-bit only.

So far I was able to play on GNU/Linux and without DRM; Samool himself addressed the problems that occasionally occurred in new Wurm versions, and in general Wurm was running flawlessly, with the freedom not to use DRM and not to use Windows. I see a danger this will change in the near future; I really hope I am wrong, but if I am not, bye-bye Wurm.

Edited by Patreus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Patreus said:

So give me a goddamn reason for introducing new servers, under Steam or not

people like new servers

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

new players want untouched land. Not this overly terraformed lands with old decaying buildings, fences etc. I for one would only start playing WO again if a new server comes up. I don't mind starting anew but I'm not a precious spoilt brat (Elkins words) that cannot see that we are at such a low pop that something big is needed, you put older vets in among st the newbs and the whole thing will fall flat on its face. I don't think they have a choice but to try something drastic...... 

Have a look at this guys filming of Wurm and what he found frustrating t, this is the sort of person we should be encouraging not worrying about older players who are so entrenched in their little houses they can't see the writing on the wall.....

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/21/2019 at 4:51 AM, Rhianna said:

new players want untouched land. Not this overly terraformed lands with old decaying buildings, fences etc. I for one would only start playing WO again if a new server comes up. I don't mind starting anew but I'm not a precious spoilt brat (Elkins words) that cannot see that we are at such a low pop that something big is needed, you put older vets in among st the newbs and the whole thing will fall flat on its face. I don't think they have a choice but to try something drastic...... 

Have a look at this guys filming of Wurm and what he found frustrating t, this is the sort of person we should be encouraging not worrying about older players who are so entrenched in their little houses they can't see the writing on the wall.....


Let's just say for a moment that it's untouched land and that old players come back to WO. They will leave newbs in the dust skill grinding past them in no time. This also means they will have a head start on taking control of various market conditions in the game. I haven't seen this video but if this person found certain things frustrating, and those same things appear in the Steam version, then other new gamers will find the exact same frustrations. Finally, it's easy to say not to worry about older players but it's not starting fresh that hurts as much as the amount of dollars invested in accounts and items that hurts. Are we going to be "compensated" in any way, shape or form? For example, what if someone paid for years worth of upkeep into a deed only to find out that soon the game will move to Steam and that they just spent money on the game for nothing. Do they get that money back? If we have to start over from scratch, how are we going to be compensated for sinking silvers into existing deeds, items, etc. in the game now if it's all just going to go to waste already at this point? If everyone knows sinking silvers into the game right now is already a waste, then why is the Wurm shop still active?

 

Edited by Neville
No longer relevant.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

we aren't starting from scratch though, you are welcome to stay on freedom. You will start a new char if you play the steam version though but that doesn't mean your deed on freedom is destroyed or anything. Can play both you know..... and because you are not being kicked off freedom there is no compensation. They are not closing down the non steam version when the steam one opens.....they may in the future but not till they see how the steam version goes...

 

And what the guy in the video found frustrating was built up areas and no new untouched places to deed or settle - he wanted wilderness and this is what this game is about. Even I find it frustrating that land is so over developed on all servers....

Edited by Rhianna

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/21/2019 at 5:43 AM, Rhianna said:

we aren't starting from scratch though, you are welcome to stay on freedom. You will start a new char if you play the steam version though but that doesn't mean your deed on freedom is destroyed or anything. Can play both you know..... and because you are not being kicked off freedom there is no compensation. They are not closing down the non steam version when the steam one opens.....they may in the future but not till they see how the steam version goes...

 

And what the guy in the video found frustrating was built up areas and no new untouched places to deed or settle - he wanted wilderness and this is what this game is about. Even I find it frustrating that land is so over developed on all servers....

 

That's easy to say but if the population dies on freedom it's still wasted money and time. Luckily, I don't maintain my own deed anymore. I moved in with a friend on Xanadu. We pooled our resources. However, we sunk silvers into upkeep to cover a year and that's before we found out about all the details surrounding this new direction. I really think they should allow character transfers from the existing freedom -> Steam. At least then, our characters, items and skills would be intact. Perhaps not deeds or materials being stored but those can be regained. I'd be OK with losing a deed if I could keep my characters, skills and the items they carry intact. Otherwise, restarting from scratch after all this time, effort and money is really not appealing at all. It took years to get to where I am now. Years, not months or weeks. I sympathize with the new guy in the video but let's look at how huge Xanadu is for instance. It has tons of new untouched places to deed or settle. It has tons of wilderness. Land is not over developed on Xanadu but that's also because it's so huge. Perhaps the other servers are as bad as you say they are. I don't see the same issue on Xanadu though. Especially recently, after all the deeds disbanding due to people either quitting or being on Jackal and not maintaining their existing deeds. Every day, I'm seeing a stream of constant disbands.

 

My thoughts on this entire matter have changed. I understand that the dev team is simply implementing new revenue streams. From my perspective, I no longer care what's going to happen with Steam or WU. As long as the current servers are up and running and I can play my existing characters that invested time and money into, I'm good to go. I'm continuing to play as if nothing happened and will continue to do so going forward.

 

Edited by Neville
My thoughts have changed on the whole situation.
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pvp is an afterthought, if there wasn't a meta then it would be lots more fun for people. You have to add more variety in weapons/armor and make that variety viable for people to gain more interest on that side of the game.

Edited by Jeston

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Ekcin said:

Instead, the spoiled brats flocked in at modest numbers, maximum participation I observed was 160 at a time in the third week, doing a couple of PvP brawls, then getting bored about soon. In the fifth week, less than thirty were left, and less then ten in the subsequent weeks, often dropping to zero. If you have a look of the list of changes Darklords published before the reset, you may appraise what all has not even tried to test and evaluate, even the faster breeding of horses, most probably (which I felt quite pathetic), much less siege technologies with the new restrictions on slopes and minedoors.

It is not the devs who did not spend time on PvP changes.

160 isn't a bad number for the game at all though.  It brought a nice chunk of old players back and people who were interested in PvP. Server died prematurely due to MR civil war lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's another issue a friend brought up. If we move to the Steam client, can we still "multibox", i.e., use more than one character at the same time (e.g., Main and Vyn Priest)? If the answer is no, then why would anyone ever want to move to Steam? After all, part of the fun is the fact that I can run my main character and my priest at the same time and "multitask". If that's taken away and we're forced to only use one character at a time in WO on Steam, forget it...

 

I'm not concerned about moving to Steam at all. My understanding is that this is simply going to be another revenue stream. I will continue to play on the existing servers as-is. This way I can continue to "multibox" at my delight and enjoy what I've invested time and money into for the long-term. My understanding though is that it would NOT be possible to "multibox" on Steam. You'd only be able to login to one character at a time. If people don't like this restriction, they'll come to play the real game, WO on existing servers. That's the way I'm going to look at it. As for WU who knows but considering it's a different game (another revenue stream) and I'm not interested in it, it doesn't apply to me.

 

Edited by Neville
Changes in information and thoughts related to it.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Patreus said:

So give me a goddamn reason for introducing new servers, under Steam or not.

 

Bullet points?  BULLET POINTS! 

 

  • People like the wilderness feel. Unless you go into deep Xanadu, ain't no such thing.  Old terraforms, fences, roads all over.
  • People like coastal.  Good luck on an old server, specially if you wanted a blank slate.
  • Clean rock layer.  If the surface is a wasteland of old deeds, it's no better underground and newbies don't know the first thing about mining warnings.  Don't wanna lose them on day 2.
  • New players can be DESTRUCTIVE in their innocence, which would lead to:
  • Old players hating their guts and making no small secret of it as new players start digging up their perimeters not knowing what a perimeter is.
  • Let them create their own market.  At least with a fresh server, the ones who catch on to mechanics faster will have a shred of a chance at a market spot before the veterans take over.
  • It'll give CC time to figure out how to keep the RMT out of the Steam version and not risk running afoul of Steam policies.
  • QoL which would make loud purists shriek to the heavens can be applied without "ruining" OGWO.  Gives time to figure out how to handle that for when the merge finally happens.
  • If SteW (what I just decided to call Steam Wurm), with the extra QoL and new maps became popular enough, there'd be the option of keeping it separate and calling OGWO "Wurm Classic", a place where the Doctrines of Wurm are followed to the letter while SteW'ers have all the fun.
  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, Mordraug said:

 

Bullet points?  BULLET POINTS! 

All fully or widely agreed

Quote
  • QoL which would make loud purists shriek to the heavens can be applied without "ruining" OGWO.  Gives time to figure out how to handle that for when the merge finally happens.
  • If SteW (what I just decided to call Steam Wurm), with the extra QoL and new maps became popular enough, there'd be the option of keeping it separate and calling OGWO "Wurm Classic", a place where the Doctrines of Wurm are followed to the letter while SteW'ers have all the fun.

Ok, I am a "purist" to a wide extent, and I hope that CC/GC will handle that wisely without ruining the game. There will never be a "QoL" satisfying mainstream gamers used to "play through" in 2-5 weeks without destroying WO. But ok, trying new stuff which already worked to some extent on WU won't be totally wrong. Also I hope that the plans to scrap WU support are reconsidered.

 

Btw. I like Stew, I am inclined to propose Wok (Wurm Online Klassik) :) .

 

Something about the Ele3 drama:

4 hours ago, Madnath said:

160 isn't a bad number for the game at all though.  It brought a nice chunk of old players back and people who were interested in PvP. Server died prematurely due to MR civil war lol.

I estimate that about 60-80 were Chaos (which was empty at those times) and Epic regulars, alts, and casuals, 40-60 from Freedom servers, and at most 50-60 returnees if at all, and practically all of them at best subbed for 1-2 months.

About the "MR civil war" I do not know. Still it demonstrates the immaturity of those crowds. I don't mean internal brawls, that is ok in a PvP environments, and could even be fun to fight it out among mature players, but completely ignoring that Ele3 was sort of an open Beta for the final changes on Epic, and possibly all WO PvP. They had their chance and spoiled it, shame on them. And of course I do not mean those who still hold out on Epic and Chaos.

Edited by Ekcin
addendum
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.