Sign in to follow this  
Rolf

Switched my Shares

Recommended Posts

24 minutes ago, Lordbeerus said:

WU was a mistake. Great short-term move but harmful for WO long term. A lot of us have said it since back then. WU servers combined have about 200 people online a considerable amount that if not for WU would be playing (and paying) in WO.

 

You think if WU just poofed tomorrow that all those players would magically just go back to WO? Hardly.

 

I sure wouldn't. And I even have Maple Bacon Pancakes named after me! :D

 

People in WU tend to be far more casual that people in WO. This is not always the case, but it's pretty accurate as a trend. When I played WO, I basically lived in the game, for many hours a day, as many other players I knew did.

WU tends to be more of a play when you feel like it kind of thing, vs a 'Wurm is life' vibe that WO has.

 

Note, that unless I'm mistaken from a comment he gave a few years back, Rolf himself has never actually PLAYED Wurm. But tells us all to 'Keep on Wurming'. lol.

 

He knew the game was a life sink when he made it. Which is why he never played it himself.

 

Not to micturate on anyone's toes here, but  people that don't have a whole lot of time to invest, but who still want to play the game, will play WU. People ho have more time to invest or are maybe retired and financially independent without any other overriding factors, will play Wurm Online.

 

And the gaming climate has changed. Most people aren't willing to put 10-18 hours into a video game daily. That's where WU shines. Your deed is typically not going to poof if you don't live in the game. Unless you're playing one of those crazy 1x servers. Then gods help you! :D

Edited by Belrindor
Typo
  • Like 2
  • Cat 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Lordbeerus said:

WU servers combined have about 200 people online a considerable amount that if not for WU would be playing (and paying) in WO.

That’s a big assumption.  How about at least 50% of those people wouldn’t be playing WO at all because they actually ENJOY the more casual, less grindy, more RL-friendly WU servers.  It seems arrogant to assume that WO is a superior offering.  It wasn’t intended to be that - it serves as another medium for creativity and another style of gameplay.  McDonalds doesn’t sell just one sandwich, and for good reason.  I play on both WO and WU and appreciate both platforms for different reasons.  

 

What WU haters should be doing is asking why 200+ people prefer WU and considering how to leverage it, instead of denying its value.  For all the talk about how horrible WU is, you're just as likely to find yourself alone in WO someday.

 

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Belrindor said:

 

You think if WU just poofed tomorrow that all those players would magically just go back to WO? Hardly.

 

I sure wouldn't. And I even have Maple Bacon Pancakes named after me! :D

 

People in WU tend to be far more casual that people in WO. This is not always the case, but it's pretty accurate as a trend. When I played WO, I basically lived in the game, for many hours a day, as many other players I knew did.

WU tends to be more of a play when you feel like it kind of thing, vs a 'Wurm is life' vibe that WO has.

 

Note, that unless I'm mistaken from a comment he gave a few years back, Rolf himself has never actually PLAYED Wurm. But tells us all to 'Keep on Wurming'. lol.

 

He knew the game was a life sink when he made it. Which is why he never played it himself.

 

Not to micturate on anyone's toes here, but  people that don't have a whole lot of time to invest, but who still want to play the game, will play WU. People ho have more time to invest or are maybe retired and financially independent without any other overriding factors, will play Wurm Online.

 

And the gaming climate has changed. Most people aren't willing to put 10-18 hours into a video game daily. That's where WU shines. Your deed is typically not going to poof if you don't live in the game. Unless you're playing one of those crazy 1x servers. Then gods help you! :D

 

Agreed.  You typed it faster than I could :)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Hawkyn said:

For all the talk about how horrible WU is, you're just as likely to find yourself alone in WO someday.


The truth of it is, WU (and Steam) will exist long after WO.

WO just sold for it's first time, but it's not the last. When this 'Game Chest' company (that no one's ever heard of) goes belly up in a couple of years, another publisher will absorb it. One of these companies will eventually say "no more, the overhead isn't worth the return" and the game will be taken offline. The only Wurm you guys will have left to turn to is WU, because there is no "overhead"; no staff to pay, no servers to maintain, etc. That version will continue to be sold, no matter which publishing company owns it.

  • Like 3
  • Cat 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/26/2019 at 8:58 AM, Belrindor said:

 

Note, that unless I'm mistaken from a comment he gave a few years back, Rolf himself has never actually PLAYED Wurm. But tells us all to 'Keep on Wurming'. lol.

 

He has played the game but never for long enough periods to really get tot he point where you are talking about the few hours a day every day point that he never has so far as i know from all the accounts he has used in the past

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As there are no other games like WurmOnline. I think the potential is there to raise the player base. 

Sadly there is no way to do this except through advertisement.

 

WO players are a unique set of players. They are not the hack and slash or the revving engine kind. WO players are more cerebral they think more about things. Its not enough to kill and be killed one must think long term. They build society's.  

 

I would suggest to any and all that can. Advertise in areas that match the profile of the kind of player that would enjoy Wurm Online.

 

Personally I think these players watch more world news. They watch more science programs. They are interested in history. 

 

Anyone who has the ability should look into spreading WO. It is after all a world we do not wish to see vanish.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wurm is not a single player game . it is not WU were one can play single player or  small group .

It is and always will be about the players they make it what it is .

Dividing it up into sub standards of to many facets of what everyone wants is not a answer it only makes it lonely .

To see the one person who believed in it sell off and then try to reboot it someplace else is sad ..

 

But I wish him well .....

Sometimes one must read the book they have written after to understand it ....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/23/2019 at 7:23 PM, Samool said:

How is that different from content features? Both exclusive content and exclusive client features are additions to the game that are meant to make Wurm Online more appealing compared to WU. It's not a secret that we benefit more from WO being successful than WU right now, as in the end WO is the game that pays our contracts and keeps it all running.

 

This decision really was taken weeks before the new owners situation (as Retrograde mentioned), they are hands off. 

People invest a lot of time in both WO and WU. Running a public server in WU is not without cost. Both MineCraft and Terraria are sandbox games that have no subscription, players pay once and are supported forever with updates. How is that?

 

In what way can we make WU create a better revenue for Code Club? Is it the players' responsibility to develop a business model for the WU product so that it's worth investing with new updates?

 

When it comes to content updates such as Jackal, I doubt many WU players would care less about it, similar content is modded in WU servers. But as Bdew is saying, withholding graphical updates such as distant trees is certainly making the WU client inferior to WO, it is punishing WU players, and no WU players that I know would be motivated by that to move to WO, but instead would rather move to another game such as Conan Exiles, or ARK - neither of which have subscriptions but have the same pay once model as WU.

 

Instead, why not making both products, WO and WU, attractive choices for players, and work out a business model that makes both equally valuable to the company?

 

I'm personally running a public WU server, which I'm paying for privately, and have two WO subscriptions which I'm not playing, because honestly, I don't have time for both running and modding a WU server,  and playing WO. I pay the WO subscriptions only to support Code Club, in the hope that they will also support WU with updates, and I know many WU players who do the same. I prefer WU because of the possibility of adding more custom content, creating new worlds with new narratives and different game play. In what way can we WU players, server hosts and modders support the continued development and updates of WU?

Edited by Tenniel
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While everyone is acting like chicken little and screaming "The Sky is Falling" which I sure the new owners just love how some folks are bashing them before they even had a chance to say hi. So far as I haven't been able to play in 2-3 months now, I am seeing a shift from:

1, development going into WURM Unlimited back to WURM Online

2, Interest in actually developing the game and focusing on new content

3, re-arrangement of some staff

4, WURM Online going onto Steam Access

5, Possible Commercial Support and Advertising

Folks need to give Gamechest a chance and see what they can do and are going to do. Maybe they will look at all the old suggestions for content. Jackal sounds nice though I don't hear folks are working together much. I think WURM needs a lot like Dungeons, better daily quests, maybe actual Island Kingdoms for those quests, more monster variety, more spells, potions, etc. Maybe special portals we can find keys to through Archaeology that lets a group fight its way through a Dungeon for prizes. Maybe, I know I would like to see Professions and maybe more tiers to the Rare, Supreme, Fantastic Item's, increase crafting caps so even thought there are 100 level crafter's maybe tools are capped by a person skill level plus 10? That way old players aren't nuking new and medium crafters. I would also like to see more resources that are rare like maybe a meteor with ore like the unique creatures, maybe more crafting drops from animals, more tree variety's, weapons, armor, etc. heck why not get some Devs that can promote stories and run campaigns like in DnD but based on WURM and the various Deitys and their development and history.

 

Pull together people and give the new Owners a bloody chance before sealing your own coffins. There isn't another game like WURM, and Haven and Hearth just doesn't compare.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, ArthurHawkwing said:

While everyone is acting like chicken little and screaming "The Sky is Falling" which I sure the new owners just love how some folks are bashing them before they even had a chance to say hi. So far as I haven't been able to play in 2-3 months now, I am seeing a shift from:

1, development going into WURM Unlimited back to WURM Online

2, Interest in actually developing the game and focusing on new content

3, re-arrangement of some staff

4, WURM Online going onto Steam Access

5, Possible Commercial Support and Advertising

Folks need to give Gamechest a chance and see what they can do and are going to do. Maybe they will look at all the old suggestions for content. Jackal sounds nice though I don't hear folks are working together much. I think WURM needs a lot like Dungeons, better daily quests, maybe actual Island Kingdoms for those quests, more monster variety, more spells, potions, etc. Maybe special portals we can find keys to through Archaeology that lets a group fight its way through a Dungeon for prizes. Maybe, I know I would like to see Professions and maybe more tiers to the Rare, Supreme, Fantastic Item's, increase crafting caps so even thought there are 100 level crafter's maybe tools are capped by a person skill level plus 10? That way old players aren't nuking new and medium crafters. I would also like to see more resources that are rare like maybe a meteor with ore like the unique creatures, maybe more crafting drops from animals, more tree variety's, weapons, armor, etc. heck why not get some Devs that can promote stories and run campaigns like in DnD but based on WURM and the various Deitys and their development and history.

 

Pull together people and give the new Owners a bloody chance before sealing your own coffins. There isn't another game like WURM, and Haven and Hearth just doesn't compare.

So turn wurm from its "players create everything" to "players create 40% of the game and all "fun" content is created by staff and the world is littered with random crap"?

Even if you added in daily quests(not that that will ever happen) once the shinyness of it wears off they just become a chore just like the new fishing and cooking system, wurm doesnt need new content that the player can only interact with and not create it needs to make current features more engaging which is what the dev team is working on with the ui and combat overhauls

There is no point in putting new paint on a car who's engine is half broken and expecting it to work well you first gotta get that engine fixed or replaced and in this case they are fixing the broken parts(the things that are showing their age the most) in hopes that it will work better

What id like to see though and just currently isnt gonna happen any time soon if ever(due to hardware issues) is a bunch of non deedable servers(and not hey this is a non deed server 2 months later you guys can deed on it) that are islands from small ones to medium sized ones(imagine half of deli for max size) which would feature  untapped resources like volcano's or mountain ranges high in ore or vast grasslands(with trees not slowly eating them up) full of animals to hunt that kinda thing and have these servers reset once every 6 months alongside jackal

Such themed servers for exploration and hunting and resource gathering would be a nice touch after all we are the "freedom isles" so it would make sense for our independent spirits to venture out into the world more and find these uncharted islands full of riches waiting to be exploited and brought back to our homes and towns

But again this is something that a multitude of us have asked over the years time and time again but we all know even if wurm had 20+ staff just working on this to have proper terrain generation and all that it still wont happen any time soon within the next few years :(

  • Cat 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like your small n-n-deedable Islands,

 

Quote from above

"What id like to see though and just currently isnt gonna happen any time soon if ever(due to hardware issues) is a bunch of non deedable servers(and not hey this is a non deed server 2 months later you guys can deed on it) that are islands from small ones to medium sized ones(imagine half of deli for max size) which would feature  untapped resources like volcano's or mountain ranges high in ore or vast grasslands(with trees not slowly eating them up) full of animals to hunt that kinda thing and have these servers reset once every 6 months alongside jackal

Such themed servers for exploration and hunting and resource gathering would be a nice touch after all we are the "freedom isles" so it would make sense for our independent spirits to venture out into the world more and find these uncharted islands full of riches waiting to be exploited and brought back to our homes and towns".

 

I love this idea. And I agree the UI, Combat System and likely game engine do need fixed like you say. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(snip)
On 9/23/2019 at 1:23 PM, Samool said:

How is that different from content features? Both exclusive content and exclusive client features are additions to the game that are meant to make Wurm Online more appealing compared to WU. It's not a secret that we benefit more from WO being successful than WU right now, as in the end WO is the game that pays our contracts and keeps it all running.

 

This decision really was taken weeks before the new owners situation (as Retrograde mentioned), they are hands off. 

 

(end snip)

 

Hmm, if that last sentence is correct and if I am interpreting it correctly then the decision to break a promise made to WU players happened BEFORE the change in ownership which is very, very different from it being a decision caused by merger etc. The whole thing just leaves a bad taste in my mouth and many others it seems. I hate when people say one thing and do another, not a trust building type thing at all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, Nappy said:

Hmm, if that last sentence is correct and if I am interpreting it correctly then the decision to break a promise made to WU players happened BEFORE the change in ownership which is very, very different from it being a decision caused by merger etc. The whole thing just leaves a bad taste in my mouth and many others it seems. I hate when people say one thing and do another, not a trust building type thing at all.

Ultimately our aims with WU 4 years ago don't match the end result. 

 

Games when released have varying lifespans, with a subscription based game it's easier to continue supporting it, but with a game that's a one-time payment it means that when people stop buying it beings in less income. 

 

Supporting WU did cost time and money, and also cost us players leaving WO to it as it was the exact same experience for much less payout. 

 

This isn't about breaking a promise, our goals always were to provide similar experiences, but with the modders taking Wurm Unlimited in new directions we feel it's in a fair situation to accept that and also take Wurm Online in new directions too, by adding our own content. 

 

Four years ago we said our goal was to keep them as similar as possible. After four years of working on it and only a few minor differences, the decision has been made to stop supporting it fully. Modders provide the key positives to Wurm Unlimited and you will still be able to all do the same things there. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

New Player:  "Hmmmm WO Steam... let's try it out... ohgodtheslowgrind... ooo... 'Unlimited' ... faster, more modded... seems like a good purchOOOOOOOO no longer updated, screw this.  What else is in the store?"

 

Edit: 

Re:  "Not as profitable as we wanted".... Wasn't the players' idea to start giving out 25 cent copies all over the place.  Congrats on screwing those of us who paid full price.  Then again, dollars to donuts that most former WO players on WU left OGWO due to CC's bad decisions.  WU didn't cost CC all those players, CC cost CC all those players and once again makes a point of reminding us why.

Edited by Mordraug
  • Like 1
  • Cat 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, Mordraug said:

Re:  "Not as profitable as we wanted".... Wasn't the players' idea to start giving out 25 cent copies all over the place.  Congrats on screwing those of us who paid full price.  Then again, dollars to donuts that most former WO players on WU left OGWO due to CC's bad decisions.  WU didn't cost CC all those players, CC cost CC all those players and once again makes a point of reminding us why.

And therein lies the major issue with key reselling, keys being resold violate Steam TOS and hurt us and the games long term viability in the end. If it were a one off thing that sales thereafter went through the Steam store continuing support of WU would mean continuing to have money flowing in. With key reselling being the major transactions it's meant that that's slowed down massively. 

 

It's not an easy choice and never has been, we're aware many WU players feel greatly disappointed, but again this is one of the benefits of continuing a premium subscription game, ongoing income means we can work on it longer. 

 

Most of the lasting games run on a subscription or heavy microtransaction push, and our current playerbase is not deep enough to exist purely on microtransactions, requiring thousands of euros per month of microtransactions would be insanely taxing and likely fail, which is the leading cause of mmo's failing nowadays too. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wonder how long it will take for the new owners to realize they have a game with less than 500 players spread out on 6 servers and 3 of them servers could support pretty much all of them. So...cost of maintaining 6 servers versus cost of 3....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Talohan said:

Wonder how long it will take for the new owners to realize they have a game with less than 500 players spread out on 6 servers and 3 of them servers could support pretty much all of them. So...cost of maintaining 6 servers versus cost of 3....

Is virtually negligible, server hosting costs are a small fraction of the running costs of the game, with every server more than paying for it's own existance. 

 

Closing servers would not concentrate the playerbase, you'd just wind up with the people on the servers closed leaving and the people on the existing servers just wondering how long until theirs is closed and what's the point of putting work and effort into it. 

  • Like 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Retrograde said:

Four years ago we said our goal was to keep them as similar as possible. After four years of working on it and only a few minor differences, the decision has been made to stop supporting it fully.

 

This narrative paints a confusing picture for the potential future of ogwo if/when steamwo is released.  How will players of ogwo have faith that ogwo wont end up abandoned like wu?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, MrGARY said:

This narrative paints a confusing picture for the potential future of ogwo if/when steamwo is released.  How will players of ogwo have faith that ogwo wont end up abandoned like wu?

How do steam release have faith than all wont be merged in the wurm online later on?

 

Heard an interesting quote today.. 'feelings doesn't tell the future', assumptions probably do not either so, let people decide, if they want to play a game and have fun when they want to or stand in the corner and not try it because gary fears them with feelings for the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Finnn said:

How do steam release have faith than all wont be merged in the wurm online later on?

 

Heard an interesting quote today.. 'feelings doesn't tell the future', assumptions probably do not either so, let people decide, if they want to play a game and have fun when they want to or stand in the corner and not try it because gary fears them with feelings for the future.

 

thats ok but maybe its hard to understand im asking a question about how will the future of ogwo be secured and not end up the same as an actual example and not trying to fear the feelings or whatever your broken words are trying to say.  i pay a premium and upkeeps and i want to know if im wasting my time when the future of wurm might be elsewhere

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, MrGARY said:

 

thats ok but maybe its hard to understand im asking a question about how will the future of ogwo be secured and not end up the same as an actual example and not trying to fear the feelings or whatever your broken words are trying to say.  i pay a premium and upkeeps and i want to know if im wasting my time when the future of wurm might be elsewhere

fear not

It's in everybody's interest that wo succeeds, steam release.. who knows if future really hold a merge of wo and steam server/s, as it was mentioned.. rmt's are about to take a punch within a year to make something like that happen because of steam demands.

Whether anybody actually works on making wo a bit more visible.. than it have been in the past ~10 years... I hope somebody gets a promotion or hired to do some seo and show the game around gaming news/article sites.. to get fresh blood into this release.

I can't give more than 5 cents for steam release, as I do not/plan to/ play it. Actually make it 0.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think our WO and the new Steam one will essentialy be the same software bar some steam related tweaks to connect it to that Steam side properly?

So it should not be as much work to maintain as WU was I "think"?

 

Of course some kind of official statement would be appreciated, they will probably talk more about this once they know it themselfes mh...

 

@Retrogradecould maybe maybe start an FAQ thread where people can write down questions and he sorts it and puts the answers to the questions or if the answer is not certain yet, just a note that its still being discussed/worked on and then edit it later when things become known?

 

I for one am curious if there will be a hassle free way to run multiple chars on the Steam Servers or if I end up hassling with files and stuff like the WU people do now due the ID or just buy 2-3 more laptops and get more Steam accounts. (Hint: the money spent on Hardware could go towards Steam WO if we have an option! 😛 )

If I remember correctly there was something in the works regarding easier handling of accounts and logins or something related to the topic, but I have no idea if that has made any progress or would serve the purpose I would desire.

 

❤️

 

Edited by Milkdrop
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, MrGARY said:

 

This narrative paints a confusing picture for the potential future of ogwo if/when steamwo is released.  How will players of ogwo have faith that ogwo wont end up abandoned like wu?

Your quote misses a lot of the context shared, but essentially the steam launch is just a new cluster. It's not a completely different game. It's the exact same as when we launched pristine and release, just accessible by steam.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, Retrograde said:

This isn't about breaking a promise, our goals always were to provide similar experiences, but with the modders taking Wurm Unlimited in new directions we feel it's in a fair situation to accept that and also take Wurm Online in new directions too, by adding our own content. 

aka modders did better work than official wurm dev team and so dont updating it anymore

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Retrograde said:

Your quote misses a lot of the context shared, but essentially the steam launch is just a new cluster. It's not a completely different game. It's the exact same as when we launched pristine and release, just accessible by steam.

 

Isn't steamwo going to have different features than ogwo that clearly don't apply to ogwo?  I got the impression from Rolf's thread that there would be differences regarding skilling or how skills/premium will work.  I know Samools thread says the aim is to not have many differences for now, but even epic has a totally different skilling system and it is the same exact game and yet we see epic constantly abandoned as well.  So again how do we know that development for steamwo will or will not separate further and further from ogwo a few years from now leaving ogwo abandoned and everyone that stuck with ogwo gets an "oh well, we changed our minds on what we said a few years ago", or that ogwo gets forced into steamwo which could mean removing core elements of wurm like rmt or forcing the skilling system change on a pre-existing system like what was done to epic?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this